Coffee Shop Refuses To Serve Uniformed Cops

Submitted by: Gerry1of1 9 months ago in News & Politics


If you have sworn an oath to protect and serve, then you better go elsewhere for your cup of coffee. That's the message to uniformed police officers from an Oakland coffee shop that's getting backlash over its controversial stance.



There are 79 comments:
Male 724
the 10 commandments says "Thou shalt not kill" not "thou shalt not kill unless you take an oath to kill"
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Female 480
These dolts would be the first on the phone with the unserviced men/women when they were in need of help. Hope this coffee shop closes....So they can riot and blame the cops and trash the neighborhood.
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Male 6,320
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Male 2,755
I understand that there is no law that protects them per-say, but there were no laws protecting anyone at one time and maybe its time to make a blanket law that does not alow you to discriminate for any reason, if you do not give service, you may be forced to have to prove that that person, is some how going to cause a problem like steal, start fights, smell real bad etc. the blatant discrimination against any class of people just because they are one of these people is against the basic foundation of the United States Declaration of Independence,     "All men are created equal and there are certain unalienable rights that governments should never violate. These rights include the right to life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness" And this covers going in to a store or restaurant and getting your cup of Joe and paying for it, no problems. Of course religion can and does throw everything in to a new can of worms. But this does not seam to be religion based. 
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Male 781
Well, I hope some police supporting criminal robs them!
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Male 4,069
I believe it was in California that a gay couple successfully sued a bakery that would not bake a cake for a gay wedding - right?
Well, mebbe a cop will sue this coffee shop.
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Male 13,279
captkangaroo yay. This argument again. Do you guys all get your talking points from a central location? It's kinda astounding.
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Male 4,069
holygod
Who guys? You're not judging me by what I said, are ya?
The concept of a fluid definition for bigotry is, well, hogwash. If one is going to be a bigot, act like a bigot, chances are a bigot is who they are. 
Whether ya aims it at a black person, a gay person or a cop person.
Do you think that cops are one dimensional, that being a cop is all they are? 
Or do you believe that every cop is fair game for discrimination based on what other cops have done?
Within certain limits, a business owner can refuse service to pretty much anyone - and the business in question, I believe, is within the law. What I ask myself is, What is the business owners reasoning, their agenda, what do they gain? Are these petty or noble things?
I gotta tell you, I believe the business owner in question is being petty. One more gesture for the feels. One more way to be divisive.  
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Male 13,279
captkangaroo "guys" who bring up the gay cake thing in EVERY post relating to discrimination.
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Male 4,069
holygod 
So, bringing up legal precedent cases is, what? A microaggression? In and of itself discriminatory?
Refusing to bake a cake for gay people is not my belief, but it should not be a criminal or civil offense. Refusing housing, jobs, medical care or government services - sure.
But if someone wants the - wait for the word - FREEDOM to \refuse to bake a cake, sell some jewelry, clothing, or provide whatever service their business - wait for it again - OFFERS, that is their right.
Just as it is the right of anyone to refuse to do trade with a business that is run by such miscreants.
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Male 13,279
captkangaroo Ok. So extrapolate that out.

You're saying if I own a bakery I should be bale to refuse to serve black people?

What about if I own the only gas station along a long stretch of road, can I refuse to sell gas to black people?

If I own an apartment complex can I refuse to rent to black people?

If I own a private college can I refuse to admit black people?

Obviously if I own any business I can refuse to hire black people right? 

Those are all my - wait for the word - FREEDOMS?

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Male 4,069
holygod 
Sure, why not? Freedom does not negate consequences.
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Male 13,279
captkangaroo So it should be legal for me to do those things or illegal?

Are the laws and corresponding punishments the consequences you are referring to?
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Male 4,069
holygod 
Yes, yes and no.
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Male 417
holygod It is a valid point though. Discrimination is discrimination the object of it shouldn't matter.
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Male 13,279
taxidriver No. Not really. It makes a difference. Judging people based on the things they do or say is not the same as judging people based on who they are.
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Male 417
holygod I agree in part but how is this different than refusing to bake a cake for a gay wedding?
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Male 13,279
taxidriver Judging someone for being a cop is judging them for their actions and choices, judging someone for being gay is judging them for who they are.
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Male 6,502
I have two friends who are black. Well, one now since my friend died Tuesday morning. But their stories are the same. They both would be pulled over at least ten times more than I was. There is a bias that needs to be addressed. I fully understand and support Black Lives Matters. I don’t support in any way refusing to serve all cops, though. Growing up I lived across the street from a good cop. Supporting BLM to me does not mean not supporting cops. It just means you want change for the better. At the same time I don’t know what the owners of this shop have gone through. What brought them to such a point? I hope they take the sign down and use this as a conversation starter between the community and the police that are assigned to serve them.
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Male 7,281
markust123 If you don't mind me asking, how did the one friend die?  
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Male 6,502
daegog Cancer. I saw him six days before he passed. He was so thin he had trouble closing his eyes. It was so sad seeing such a warm, chill guy be taken down so hard. 
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Male 13,279
There are racist assholes in every occupation. There are racist asshole teachers, there are racist asshole plumbers, there are racist asshole phlebotomists.

However, the racist assholes that are cops are the only ones we give guns and unquestioned authority to.

The problem is when they get caught seemingly all other cops, the justice system, and half the country bend over backwards to support and defend them.

If a police officer shoots and kills a man who is seated, in car with his girlfriend and young child, and not holding a weapon or being threatening in any way then the whole country should demand that that officer receive justice. When he gets acquitted it taints all cops.
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Male 45,619
holygod   That police officer you refer to in the last paragraph, he was acquitted by a jury of people just like you. The only difference is they have ALL of the facts and all we have is the hype, exaggerations, and lies of media and activists.
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827
Gerry1of1 They don't have "ALL" of the facts. They have the facts presented to them by the prosecution and defense, both of whom are also going to have hype, exaggeration, and lies. Yes, they are more informed than us, but let's not pretend that every jury is impartial or gets it right.

The spark that lit the LA Riots was a jury letting four policemen go despite video evidence of the continued beating of Rodney King even when he was on the ground and not resisting.

Remember that juries are not 'your peers', they're generally people not smart enough to a) get out of jury duty; and b) not be rejected during selection. They're not professionals or business managers (folks with good analytics skills), but people we as a society generally think are less successful in life.
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Male 7,281
Gerry1of1 Sounds like OJ
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Male 45,619
daegog      OJ was framed by The Man !
               :)
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Male 13,279
Gerry1of1  "ALL of the facts"

You saying he had a gun and tried to point it towards the officer? If not then there is no fact that would matter.
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251
Deleted comment.
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Male 13,279
christopher_bourne Mmmm. I don't recall any proof that he was reaching for a gun. I heard he was reaching for his ID.
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Male 45,619
holygod I'm not saying anything except You and I do not know the whole story.
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6,909
holygod you actually said something intelligent thought provoking for a change will wonders never cease.
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Male 13,279
dm2754 Never miss an opportunity to be a dick, even when you're complimenting, well done.
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6,909
holygod what can I say; you bring out the best in me
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Male 18,342
What if the owner and staff have gotten shaken down or beat by cops in the past? 
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6,909
I believe it's a very old story or at least similar to an old story.

It is most likely that the people who run the place have had a lot of bad experience regarding the police. There's a lot of Injustice in every legal system around the world and a lot of corruption. Therefore sediments like this are very understandable.

If you can understand their point of view you should at least respect the fact that they have their reasons and ultimately it's their choice.
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Male 9,342
dm2754 True.  Also their customers might feel uncomfortable if they walk in and see a uniformed cop checking them out . Is this about coffee or about cops establishing dominance?  
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Male 1,156
California law:
All persons within the jurisdiction of this state are free and equal, and no matter what their sex, race, color, religion, ancestry, national origin, disability, medical condition, genetic information, marital status, sexual orientation, citizenship, primary language, or immigration status are entitled to the full and equal accommodations, advantages, facilities, privileges, or services in all business establishments of every kind whatsoever.

Profession is not a protected status, and it's worthy to note in CA neither is age.
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Male 9,342
nettech98 Good point.  
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Male 10,133
Wonder how loud they'd scream (and file suit) if the cops reciprocated and refused to server their 911 calls?

And someone tell me how this is 'different' than refusing to serve a gay couple?
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827
megrendel The cafe doesn't serve uniformed cops. What uniform do gay people wear?
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Male 2,755
barry9a Does not matter what they wear one is gay and the other is a cop. Same thing as far as the intent goes.
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Male 1,867
barry9a spandex
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Male 13,279
megrendel dude. Why do we have to have this debate every time? Sexual orientation is protected from discrimination. Occupation is not. It is incredibly simple.
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Male 2,835
holygod Federal law:  Although federal laws protect people from workplace discrimination on the basis of sex, race, national origin, religion, age, and disability, there is no federal law that specifically outlaws workplace discrimination on the basis of sexual orientation in the private sector. (Federal government workers are protected from such discrimination.)  so no protection other than in employment matters. 
State laws:    There is more definitive protection offered at the state level. Almost half the states and the District of Columbia have laws that currently prohibit sexual orientation discrimination in both government and private jobs: California, Colorado, Connecticut, Hawaii, Illinois, Iowa, Maine, Maryland, Massachusetts, Minnesota, Nevada, New Hampshire, New Jersey, New Mexico, New York, Oregon, Rhode Island, Vermont, Washington, and Wisconsin. In addition, a few states have laws prohibiting sexual orientation discrimination in public workplaces only. So  states give more protection which is good.
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Male 13,279
scheckydamon Thanks for the info.

Interesting that those are all traditionally blue / blueish states except for Iowa. Clearly the red states think it is important to be able to discriminate against gay people and their representatives in DC are probably the reason it isn't part of federal law.
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Male 10,133
holygod discrimination is discrimination.  It is incredibly simple.

You either allow it, or you don't.
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Male 13,279
megrendel So you are telling me that you literally see no difference between a restaurant having a sign up that says:

We will not serve blacks

or a business having a sign up that says:

We will not serve clowns

?

That is the same thing?
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Male 10,133
holygod Same thing in degree?  No.

Same thing in making laws? Yes.

How about the below sign?  It's based entirely on the voluntary way some dress...but places have been blasted because they're discriminating based on race.

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Male 7,281
megrendel Personally, I have no problem with that sign.

Most kids who wear sagging pants do not understand the origin of that particular style (it basically means you are ready and willing to take it up the ass as a jail house bitch) and I personally think its pretty damned unsanitary to walk around like that.
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Male 13,279
megrendel I have no problem with that sign. I see way more white people and mexicans with sagging pants than I do black people. Ghetto is a lifestyle, not a race.
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Male 2,755
holygod   Wow where do you live? I see almost no whites like this, not that I don,t see them some times.
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Male 13,279
casaledana Well I live in Phoenix. There are basically no black people in Phoenix for whatever reason. We have lots of white trash though.
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6,909
megrendel so you're implying that you choose to be gay just as you choose to be a police officer.

And you also believe cops to be very Petty. Which makes them no difference then the people in this video; thus is justifying the people in this videos response that is saying that the neighbor should should handle its own problems.
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Male 10,133
dm2754 so you're implying that you choose to be gay just as you choose to be a police officer.

No, I stating categorically that discrimination is discrimination.  Seems to be a double-standard. 

dm2754 And you also believe cops to be very Petty.

I said no such thing (look into a reading comprehension class).  I stated how they would scream IF the cops reciprocated. I did not state that I thought the cops would.  

I was pointing out that it would be hypocritical of the coffee shop to expect the cops to serve them when they refuse to serve the cops.  At no point do I believe the cops would fail in their job.  I DO believe the coffee shop WOULD be such hypocrites.

You seem to be reading these statements with a tad bit of bias.  
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6,909
megrendel okay let's go with your standard that discrimination is wrong in any instance..
So let's assume you have a restaurant is it okay if the KKK wants to come in and full uniform and have a nice birthday party celebration in your restaurant. 
 after all anything less would be violating their freedoms and be discriminatory.
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Male 10,133
dm2754 My point that if you refuse to do so, then yes you are discriminating.  (But, it's not a 'freedom' to force someone to serve you.)

My point is also that each business owner should be able to reserve the right to refuse service to anyone they want. 

BUT, if you're going to force someone to serve someone under the penalty of law, you must force someone to server EVERYONE under the penalty of law. 

I have no problem with a Islamic-owned restaurant discriminating against people who want to eat pork bar-b-q. Likewise I have no problem with a baker not being forced to make a cake that goes against his beliefs.  There's plenty of Bar-B-Q places around (hungry for Dreamland all of a sudden), and plenty of bakers.
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Male 2,755
megrendel   They are not discriminating against people that eat pork BBQ if you do not serve pork BBQ at any time. That,s like saying you have to feed me meat in a vegetarian restaurant.
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Male 10,133
casaledana They are not discriminating against people that eat pork BBQ if you do not serve pork BBQ at any time. 

Unfortunately, some people argue just that in similar situations.
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6,909
megrendel I see what you're saying but we can't be so absolute all the time I would just be silly.
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Female 6,692
megrendel amazing to me that 'its ok to ban cops because they're all tainted" but the same people say "only cops should have guns"
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Male 7,281
megrendel   I think you are trolling at this point.  A Jewish Baker would not be forced to make a Nazi birthday cake, but they would probably be forced to make a gay birthday cake (by law, i mean).

Why?  Because no one is a Nazi at birth. 

If you refuse service to Asians, that is discrimination.

If you refuse service to Asians that are in the Yakuza, that is not discrimination.

The Police are not and never have been there to serve people.  it's silly to believe that just because they have bumper stickers saying so.
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Male 10,133
daegog So, discrimination is 'okay' as long as it's against people the left don't agree with.  Got it. 

I personally believe (and have stated quite a number of times) that any business should have the right to refuse service to anyone they want. Across the board.

You will find that soon any business that does so in a bigoted way will soon be out of business. 

But, seeing as some businesses are being forced to serve others under penalty of law, it's hypocrisy to allow discrimination of service to any.   And that's what I'm pointing out.
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Male 6,502
megrendel I was agreeing with you but you just lost me.
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Male 7,281
megrendel If you are correct, that business will soon fail for being bigots against cops right?
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Male 10,133
daegog Of course, it depends on the clientele.  

I just wouldn't expect the police to go out of their way to make their presence felt to the establishment...and a corresponding rise in robbery attempts may result.

They may make it, but as a business owner I wouldn't want to alienate any particular clique.
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Male 7,281
megrendel Here in Detroit, we have the exact OPPOSITE situation, if you are a small business owner you have to pay for police presence.


It's called the Green Light Project, in which smaller, family owned stores can "join" the green light project and receive immediate response to in store situations.  If you are a member you get this little flashing green light that gets attached to the outside of your store.  You have to pay about 5K to become a member, they refer to it as "equipment costs" and then pay several hundred per month as "upkeep" for data storage.

The Detroit Police are literally shaking down small business owners for "protection".

In Detroit, Police presence costs money.  Perhaps those folks should just open up a shop in detroit, if you aren't paying the cops off they for damned sure will not come to your workplace.


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Male 946
megrendel I hope you realize statements like this do not help build the case in favor of cops. Served in uniform or not the store still is in the community and contributes with taxes, the idea that you think that the police are capable of behavior like this in itself depicts a huge flaw in the police system that I would hope you would want addressed. 

Are people who don't like their working circumstances now all of the sudden exempt from doing their jobs properly if they disagree or do you only extend this concept to LEO?
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Male 10,133
mischeif954 Who said about them not doing their job?

But there's 'doing your job', and then there's 'going out of your way to give exceptional service'. 

That's the difference between a waitress that bitches about tips and one who makes a very good living waiting tables. 

The police in my community know me.  If not by name then at least recognize me as the guy who shakes their hands and says 'thank you', asks them how they are doing and who will buy their lunches when I run into them.

It's called respect. They know I respect them and they respect me. 

So, when the alarm goes off at my house or at my business, I get a response that may be a little faster or a little more involved than the guy who lives in the corner crack-house with a 'I hate cops' bumper sticker.  (Or, he may get a faster response, but for different reasons.)

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Male 946
megrendel That is not called respect, that's called corruption... the response from emergency responders should always be as soon as possible. 

The difference between a bartender that complains about tips and one that makes a very good living by over pouring and giving out free drinks at the owners expense.
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Male 7,281
megrendel shaking hands.. well ok, thats whatever.  Buying them lunch?   Now that is just flat out ass kissing.

What criminal activity are you involved in where you need to keep the cops that friendly lol.

And I wouldn't think of that as respect, that is more like obsequiousness or sycophancy if you prefer.

Now lets take your example for a moment, IF they do show up to your house faster than they would normally, that is total bullshit.

Who gives a fuck if you bought them lunch, you are no more deserving of any police service (such as it is) than anyone else.

This is the kinda shit that leads to corruption.  You buy them lunch today, maybe they ignore that minor crime you do tomorrow, right? 
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Male 10,133
daegog Buying them lunch?   Now that is just flat out ass kissing.

No, it's respect.  I appreciate the job they do and they don't get paid a lot doing it. I tend to buy lunch/dinner for quite a few emergency responders or service-man I run across.

I'm also a hell of a tipper. 

daegog What criminal activity are you involved in where you need to keep the cops that friendly lol.

I own a house, property and a family business. 

daegog You buy them lunch today, maybe they ignore that minor crime you do tomorrow, right? 

Didn't seem to work with the last one who gave me a ticket for illegal lane change and speeding.

Of course, there WERE extenuating circumstances. I was on the way home to take my wife to the ER.  I DID NOT discuss that with the cop. But I DID have a conversation with the chief of police, where I laid out my circumstance, complimented the officer and he tore up the ticket. 

That's not corruption. That's respect.
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3,657
megrendel I was kinda thinking the same thing. Wondering how this would play out if a bakery refused to serve planned parenthood workers. Pretty sure the 'their business, their choice' attitude would go out the window pretty fast.   
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6,909
skypirate if they refuse to serve Planned Parenthood workers I'm sure they would get a lot of increased business of like-minded individuals
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Male 919
skypirate megrendel 

Agreed on the religous bakery serving gay customers point. That being said in essence neither should be forced to serve those they dont want to. In reality long seated societal differences probably needs to force mixing to resolve differences. 

Wonder how loud they'd scream (and file suit) if the cops reciprocated and refused to server their 911 calls?

Different issue. They are paying business and personal taxes for 911 assistance. They dont appear to want it anyway with the " speak to your neighbours" poster.
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Male 9,342
Personally I get on fine with the local cops, but then I am a straight,  white,  middle aged,  middle class bloke in a prosperous small town with a very low crime rate.  If a bicycle is stolen it makes the local paper.

If I had had a radically different life experience I might have a different perception of the police. 
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Male 1,856
at this very moment, shoplifters and thieves are heading their way!  This is BETTER than a gun-free-zone.  Its an ALL DEFENDERS FREE ZONE!
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Male 13,279
spanz Yes. Because every time I go to starbucks it is swarming with cops.
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Male 845
Stupid. I know I mentioned I got robbed the other night, but I didn't even mention the followup. First responder was there in 2 minutes. They had a sniffer dog out in 6. Two detectives out within 20. They found the girl right away. Arrested him the next night.

Those cops they're refusing service to will still come to their rescue if they need it. Treat them with respect and they will do the same for you.
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Male 3,364
profworm In a perfect world, I'd agree with you.  The cops are there to do a job, and they'll do it.  But cops aren't perfect.  I think that if the cops are needed at this location, it will be a much different experience than you had.  I don't see a real fast response, I don't see them working really hard to find the perp.  I see cops standing outside the store and making the owner come out to talk to them because they aren't allowed inside.
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