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American Flag Art Controversy

Hits: 11044 | Rating: (2.3) | Category: News & Politics | Added by: fancylad
Page: 1 2 3 4 5 Next >   Jump to: Bottom    Last Post
PrKitty
Female, 18-29, Eastern US
 371 Posts
Wednesday, April 23, 2008 7:15:05 PM
It's actually against the law to disgrace the flag in any manner. I hate disrespectful pieces of sh*t, we call tomorrow...

shadow43
Female, 18-29, Midwest US
 42 Posts
Tuesday, April 22, 2008 1:45:05 PM
You're one of those "violence is the answer" people, aren't you?

BikerTeen
Male, 13-17, Southern US
 4280 Posts
Tuesday, April 22, 2008 6:13:44 AM
anyone who would give desecration to the American flag needs a bullet in the heart and then bullet in the head and god bless America

shadow43
Female, 18-29, Midwest US
 42 Posts
Monday, April 21, 2008 5:00:33 PM
and patthebaker, its more like, say someone you loved saved the life of someone else and the mother of the saved victim drew a picture symbolizing what that event meant to her and then her grandkids laid it on the floor. Not that offensive really.

shadow43
Female, 18-29, Midwest US
 42 Posts
Monday, April 21, 2008 4:57:03 PM
petie-well said. I understand where the vet is coming from, and of course respect his opinion, but I would've been one of those people stepping on the flags. If I had to meet him, I would have told him simply that I was sorry that he had to be in the war.

I don't care about the american flag at all. While I understand why it is designed the way it is, it has no meaning personally to me. It is not something that I associate myself with or want to, even though I am American. If tomorrow they wanted to change the design or get rid of the flag altogether, I'd be fine with that.

Sparks, I suppose your poop exhibit would be art if it was actually OKed to be done.
Although the student's art did seem to blatantly show off the fact that it was violating a social construct, I think it was more of a statement of "why can't *this* piece of cloth touch the ground?" and making a statement about how the flag is somewhat overrated and does not mean to some as it does others.


sparks235
Male, 18-29, Eastern US
 5 Posts
Saturday, April 19, 2008 7:44:41 PM
Before I start catching too much fire for the last sentence of my post, I ought to clarify that when I reference American news channels, I mean the actual content.

As an American, it makes me both laugh and cry that there's just as much or more focus on the lives of celebrities as there is on actual news. Admittedly, I don't know the extent for which this is true in other countries, but just the same, I don't agree with it. If we ought to have fluff, we should at least highlight actual role models, someone to look up to. Sure, it might be easy to say that we don't necessarily want to be like, for instance, Britney Spears, and our problems aren't so bad after looking at hers. However, it does nothing to say that we can and should work towards making our lives better; it says we're fine where we are and should work towards not ending up worse.


sparks235
Male, 18-29, Eastern US
 5 Posts
Saturday, April 19, 2008 7:26:09 PM
Arasheht, iamboredtooo, would you consider it a work of art if I were to either defecate or leave a pile of excrement squarely in the middle of, say, an elegantly designed, very well maintained public library? How about, as a more prominent and sensitive example, the National Cathedral?

I could contend that its purpose would be to stimulate debate as to whether, in the midst of humanity's perceived mastery of nature and humanity's claim of being intellectually and spiritually superior to all other beings, there still lies at the center of it an animalistic baseness. Further, the duality of the scene could suggest how that kind of intrusion is perhaps unsightly and unwanted, that it permeates a stench throughout this orderly aspect of our lives. After all, look at the duality of the recent church molestation scandals.

Would it be art?

Discussion and debate are good, but if you're looking for shock value, look at the economy, the Second Gulf War and most American news channels.


Shaboobalah
Male, 18-29, Canada
 329 Posts
Friday, April 18, 2008 9:26:49 PM
... independence from her former masters. We too lost men and women, brothers, sisters, wives, fathers to be free, much like our neighbors to the south. They paid the ultimate sacrifice so their children, grandchildren, and other anticendants would not have to face another Nazi Germany. This is how Canada gained her place in the world, and why the maple leaf flies. It's also why the stars and stripes fly. To show the price Americans paid to attain true freedom and become their own nation. Though it is symbolized in the flag, the flag in itself is not freedom, and people need to see that. They need to see that the flag on the floor is not desecration, but the people standing on it is (the standing on it part is merely my opinion, for some reason, I feel that's pushing it too far). Then they may call themselves patriots.

Shaboobalah
Male, 18-29, Canada
 329 Posts
Friday, April 18, 2008 9:20:49 PM
I can see why people would be so against the project. I can understand the patriotism, but how many of the people against the project truly understand what the flag means? I do admire the Americans in this. They are taught what the flag stands for and why they should respect it. In Canada, we aren't. Not enough schools have the students stand and sing the anthem in the morning. When we do sing it (At assemblies and such), the students act like it's a hockey game. Half the students don't even know the words to our anthem. That makes me sick. But another thing makes me sick, and that is when people go on pseudo patriotic rants about something as simple as an art project. They worship the flag, thinking that it lying on the floor is a desecration of all things [insert nationality here] when really, that flag is a bit of cloth and dye. It was mentioned earlier that what we should be concerned about is the flag's *meaning*. Ours is Canada's sovereignty from England. Of our country gaining

violingirl77
Female, 13-17, Eastern US
 7145 Posts
Friday, April 18, 2008 8:18:48 PM
That song drove me crazy... I could barely get through the video.

Those weren't even real flags.


petle_13
Female, 13-17, Eastern US
 202 Posts
Friday, April 18, 2008 7:47:36 PM
Hm... rather controversial indeed. I see both sides, mildly clear.

I see those who interpret literally, "It's just cloth."

I see the defenders of their teachers, "It's more than a symbol."

I see the logics, "It's just a symbol, yes, but it's also respect."

Then, I see those who tend to disagree, "It's all stupid."


Is it right to say who is the better? I think it would all be nice if we respected each other, but that's almost impossible now. The Vet, yes, he protected everything he knew and loved, even the Girl who made this art....

How odd, them meeting face to face....
"Hello, meet the person who has no idea who or what you are." Same for both sides, naturally.


Groogle
Male, 30-39, Canada
 2180 Posts
Friday, April 18, 2008 6:58:46 PM
Those who say that this is disgrace are so wrapped in their own self importance that they forgot the very meaning of the word.

Disgrace: The loss of respect, honor, or esteem; ignominy; shame.

If that veteran fought for his flag and for the symbol of freedom that it represent then he should give all the money he earned fighting for the US army back and apologize to everyone who are currently suffering all over the world because he defended a selfish system that he used as a blanket all his life.

"None are more hopelessly enslaved than those who falsely believe they are free."
-- Johann Wolfgang von Goethe


Valark
Male, 13-17, Western US
 77 Posts
Friday, April 18, 2008 4:22:35 PM
Yes, it's a symbol. But it's a powerful one, at that. A symbol of pride that stands for everything the Americans have fought for and defended over the past 200 years. The Shed Blood of our Soldiers (Red), Purity (White), and Courage (Blue).

I used to like to think that even though we've shed more blood than we've lost, become corrupt in multiple aspects of life, and become cowards standing behind a nuclear wall 300 worlds thick, that we still had the flag and its principles to look up to and respect. While I won't say it's not the "artist's" right to disgrase our principles like that, it's truly sickening that political correctness has run off far enough to let them do such a thing.

What happened?


46885
Female, 18-29, Midwest US
 45 Posts
Friday, April 18, 2008 4:17:21 PM
It just shows that some things have far more meaning to some people than others. Had there been bible pages strewn everywhere, would anyone have noticed?

willem199
Male, 13-17, Eastern US
 268 Posts
Friday, April 18, 2008 3:18:15 PM
Dear Europeans, feel free to flame the poo out of any blind-patriots you come across on the internet. I fully support it.

infearno
Male, 70 & Over, Europe
 562 Posts
Friday, April 18, 2008 9:13:53 AM
Dettox I'm not dissing the artist but I think Vertias21 is right. I just don't get WHY it is such an issue, has the American flag reached the point of a religious icon for people to react that strongly?

Veritas21
Male, 18-29, Eastern US
 2 Posts
Friday, April 18, 2008 9:03:12 AM
Dettox, That was the whole point. It was made to be stepped on. That was apart of the the whole social experiment. it was all designed to see who would step on it and who wouldnt.

dettox
Male, 18-29, Europe
 2 Posts
Friday, April 18, 2008 4:13:35 AM
It doesn't matter what it is that is lying on the ground. Pay respekt to the artist and don't step on it! If I had painted a picture and sum1 stepped on it, I would be pissed off!!!

But even that war veteran should have calmed down and realised that this is ART! Analyse it. Ask questions about it! Get upset. But don't blindly rush in and pick it up of the ground.


infearno
Male, 70 & Over, Europe
 562 Posts
Friday, April 18, 2008 12:00:00 AM
There are flags on the floor, whats so bad about that? its just a flag

BigWaFuu
Male, 18-29, Western US
 1165 Posts
Thursday, April 17, 2008 10:37:20 PM
Well... when you kill hundreds and risk your life thousands of miles away from home, lets see you act calm aver disrespect of the flag.

Veritas21
Male, 18-29, Eastern US
 2 Posts
Thursday, April 17, 2008 9:20:46 PM
Alright, First off I will say I am a student at U Maine Farmington and I was slightly offended by the project. But I was also glad someone did it.Pre 9/11 america you rarely saw anyone flying the ol stars and stripes outside of military families and such. Post 9/11 everyone was just following the band wagon acting all patriotic. It made me SICK. She, in my opinion made a very good statement to see who would walk around or not. Yes, that vet had his right to protest. But he also had no right to try and rip up her experiement. The America he fought for then has not changed, its still currupted. I believe in our country but the sad fact is freedom has never been free. the Idea of true freedom is a joke and very much impossible. This work was supposed to spark conversation and its gone out of hand. This video is extremely biased.

FYI - the "goths" werent even apart of that piece of work. they were merely caught in the crossfire. gotta love symposium day.


patthebaker
Male, 18-29, Western US
 1850 Posts
Thursday, April 17, 2008 8:00:57 PM
lets put it like this, say someone who's life was saved by someone else you loved say a mother take a picture of here and burned it in front of you and show no remorse that is what it is essentially

TacoKing
Male, 18-29, Western US
 3 Posts
Thursday, April 17, 2008 4:51:19 PM
This is crap.
First of all if an american veteran asks you to do anything regarding a flag. Do it.
To him (and to me and the rest of the soldiers I know) that flag is a symbol of everything he/we fight for.
I don't care if you're trying to be artsy or controvesial, there are boundries. You were given the right to free speech by people like that man, at least try to show some respect instead of essentially spitting in his face

gennale
Female, 30-39, Western US
 2 Posts
Thursday, April 17, 2008 4:49:04 PM
My ten year old daughter (full Girl Scout, Color bearer for her GS council ect...) said it all best.

"What's wrong with those people? Didn't their parents teach them anything? It isn't the flag that is important. It's the respect you give it."


Beamquake
Male, 18-29, Canada
 3 Posts
Thursday, April 17, 2008 4:48:59 PM
Why the hell is he flipping out so much over a flag? Is that flag in specific important? No, it's a piece of paper on the ground depicting an image representing a country. For all I cared, they could have defecated and spit on it. It doesn't mean they were doing that to the United States- he'd be doing it to a piece of paper. People like that guy need to stop taking everything so seriously.

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