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Elections Have Consequences--Indeed, They Do

Hits: 3001 | Rating: (2.4) | Category: News & Politics | Added by: Squrlz4Sale
Page: 13 Next >   Jump to: Bottom    Last Post
HolyGod
Male, 30-39, Western US
 4453 Posts
Tuesday, October 08, 2013 12:07:53 AM
gypsybard

"Also, part of the negotiations were that Congress, the Senate and the White House staff would have to also enroll in ObamaCare. They are citizens just like us. "Of the people, by the people, for the people," you know what I mean? The President refused to negotiate unless that was taken off the table. Congress has a "Gold Plan" health insurance system that costs them, out of pocket, a total of $670 a year. The average American's deductible is higher than that."

Jesus Mother F.ucking Christ

This is why we can't even debate. You guys are so misinformed you don't know what we are debating.

THERE IS NO EXEMPTION FOR CONGRESS FROM OBAMACARE.

HolyGod
Male, 30-39, Western US
 4453 Posts
Monday, October 07, 2013 11:59:58 PM
OldOllie

"Romney actually carried independents by a wide margin."

You aren't taking into account the psychology of self-identifying as an "independent".

From business insider:

Jim Williams, an analyst at Public Policy Polling, explained that a voter's choice to identify as an Independent can change by the day. Republicans who were disenchanted with Romney might have been more apt to identify as Independent, as Democrats were in 2004 when they were dissatisfied with Kerry.

In 2012, a much more reliable indicator of success — and a better example of the "swing" vote — came from voters who identified as "moderate." In every critical battleground state, Obama won the moderate vote. In Iowa, he captured more than 60% of it. Overall, Obama beat Romney by 15 points among moderates."

Gypsybard
Male, 40-49, Western US
 68 Posts
Monday, October 07, 2013 11:59:16 PM
HG:

Point taken on the bill's passage. However, since its passing, the President has altered it on numerous occasions...a right that the Chief Executive simply does not have. They are attempting to defund this because it is not what was agreed upon prior to the vote.

Also, part of the negotiations were that Congress, the Senate and the White House staff would have to also enroll in ObamaCare. They are citizens just like us. "Of the people, by the people, for the people," you know what I mean? The President refused to negotiate unless that was taken off the table. Congress has a "Gold Plan" health insurance system that costs them, out of pocket, a total of $670 a year. The average American's deductible is higher than that.

This elitist nonsense is reminiscent of France under Louis XVI. This "let them eat cake" mentality has got to stop. If it doesn't, it will destroy us for sure.

HolyGod
Male, 30-39, Western US
 4453 Posts
Monday, October 07, 2013 11:53:22 PM
OldOllie

" I suggest you read Article I, Section 8 of the constitution."

Uh Huh. I've read it. Just read it again to humor you.

What is your point?

That it is unconstitutional for the government to do ANYTHING not specifically mentioned on that list? Because that is a metric f.uck ton of things, not just healthcare reform.

OldOllie
Male, 60-69, Midwest US
 11707 Posts
Monday, October 07, 2013 11:34:08 PM
When Romney lost last year, you were shocked, weren't you?

Well, I was surprised and disappointed. However, after learning the scope of the IRS scandal, I can certainly understand now how it happened.

I've come to learn that you can tell what kind of shenanigans the Democrats are up to by what they accuse Republicans of doing. When they were all whining about "voter suppression," they were the ones who really doing it -- BIG TIME, and it worked. Romney actually carried independents by a wide margin. He lost because the Republican base didn't turn out for him. That's how voter suppression REALLY works.

And HG, if you want to know what "right" the Republicans have to oppose implimentation of Obamacare, I suggest you read Article I, Section 8 of the constitution.

HolyGod
Male, 30-39, Western US
 4453 Posts
Monday, October 07, 2013 11:19:21 PM
OldOllie

"First, you give me EVERYTHING that I want"

What the house passed.
What the senate passed.
What the president signed into law.
What the supreme court upheld.
That?

What right do they have to NOT give it to him at this point? It went through the proper channels. However now when it is time to fund it they are refusing since they couldn't stop it through the proper means.

Squrlz4Sale
Male, 40-49, Eastern US
 5968 Posts
Monday, October 07, 2013 11:19:09 PM
@ OldOllie: I've got news for you, Ollie: Your side is going to lose this one and lose it in a big way. It will take a lot of 1,000-char posts to explain and I rather doubt you'll be able to accept it anyway. So I'm not sure I'm up for it.

But tell me this: When Romney lost last year, you were shocked, weren't you? I'm quite confident that, like Romney himself, you thought the Republicans had the election in the bag and were more than a little stunned at his defeat. Yes?

OldOllie
Male, 60-69, Midwest US
 11707 Posts
Monday, October 07, 2013 11:14:16 PM
@S4S
ABSOLUTELY NO NEGOTIATIONS should occur as long as the Republicans are trying to hold the country hostage.

So, what Obama is saying is, "First, you give me EVERYTHING that I want; then we'll negotiate about what YOU want."

Who in their right mind would agree to that deal?

Squrlz4Sale
Male, 40-49, Eastern US
 5968 Posts
Monday, October 07, 2013 11:10:25 PM
@ 5Cats: Sheesh, this is why I had the clear sense somethng was off upstairs. The same points have been explained repeatedly, and yet somehow... they just evaporate and you come back obsessed over some points that have already been addressed.

ABSOLUTELY NO NEGOTIATIONS should occur as long as the Republicans are trying to hold the country hostage. Once this Tea Party hissy fit is over, if Boehner then wants to lead his 43rd (or 44th or 45th--honestly, I lose count) attempt at repealing the ACA law, HAVE AT IT, HOSS!

I agree regarding my question; it should have been asked, if asked at all, via email. I apologize. As for myself, I have an underactive thyroid and take a tiny Synthroid pill every morning. Not very exciting, I'm afraid. BP is 102/68, with a resting pulse of 58; total cholesterol is 146--thanks to running and a vegan diet. If I can just avoid being hit by a car, I'm planning on being around for awhile.

5Cats
Male, 50-59, Canada
 21804 Posts
Monday, October 07, 2013 10:41:29 PM
...says he hopes to work through the legislative process to make adjustments.


EXACTLY! And WHO says NO NEGOTIATIONS???
Is it... Boehner? HECK NO!
It's OABMA!

So legally doing what he was elected to do is "terrorism" in your eyes? Anarchy? Arson? THAT is what the Dems have called this, and YOU support them.

Personal questions are best left to private e-mails, don't you think?

I'm not "schizophrenic" I have:
Agoraphobia (it's bad!)
Unipolar Depression
Irritable Bowel Syndrome
Dissociative Disorder (nasty stuff!)

Among other things.

So? What have YOU got @Squrlz4? You asked it? It's only fair that you "own up" also...

OldOllie
Male, 60-69, Midwest US
 11707 Posts
Monday, October 07, 2013 10:38:25 PM
He can't repeal it. He might, however, be able to delay it long enough for people to figure out what a huge clusterf*** it really is before it destroys our entire economy.

I hope he has the stones to hang tough.

Squrlz4Sale
Male, 40-49, Eastern US
 5968 Posts
Monday, October 07, 2013 10:19:22 PM
@ 5Cats: I watched your longer clip, 5Cats, the one you say "shows (the shorter version) to be UTTER bullshiite."

And what does Boehner say? He acknowledges that ACA is "the Law of the Land" and says he hopes to work through the legislative process to make adjustments. Awesome. Problem is, when he FAILED to repeal Obamacare 42 TIMES, I guess he decided to listen to the Tea Partiers and execute his extortion plan.

Serious question: Are you schizophrenic? Do you take meds? Have they been adjusted somehow lately? Because what I see more and more from you is a lot of disordered thinking and obsession.

5Cats
Male, 50-59, Canada
 21804 Posts
Monday, October 07, 2013 10:05:53 PM
@Squrlz4: Ignores my comment about his 20 second clip...
Ignores my posting of a LONGER clip which shows his to be UTTER bullshiite...

@FoolsPrussia: Ignores my comment about his 23 second clip...
Ignores my posting of a longer clip which UTTERLY disproves his clip...

Oh YES! The IAB Liberal Brigade is doing what they do best!

Lie!
Insult!
Ignore!

You Go Girls! Because if that's ALL you got? It's pathetic...

5Cats
Male, 50-59, Canada
 21804 Posts
Monday, October 07, 2013 10:00:40 PM
Every single one of those defunded Obamacare.

THAT is a LIE!

LINK or STFU!

YOU KNOW NOTHING @HolyGod! I've even put up links to these bills, and NOT ONE SINGLE ONE has "ObamaCare" in them. I have proven this beyond ANY doubt!

FACTS! Please associate yourself with them!

Your LIES are disgusting and despicable...

Squrlz4Sale
Male, 40-49, Eastern US
 5968 Posts
Monday, October 07, 2013 6:47:56 PM
@ RoboPatton: You know what, RoboPatton? My 80-yr-old mother, who holds a doctorate and taught U.S. History for many years, texted me the following regarding the Tea Partiers and the government shutdown today (yes, my 80-yr-old mother has an iPhone and sends text messages):

"It is very scary. The issues are beyond the average person's understanding."

She's always been sharp as a tack. And reading the comments of you, CrakrJak, and 5Cats today--boy, did she get that one right.

God help us.

RoboPatton
Male, 30-39, Western US
 2374 Posts
Monday, October 07, 2013 6:32:01 PM
Really Nutz4Sale?? You accuse of him of exactly what you've done yourself! lol

Squrlz4Sale
Male, 40-49, Eastern US
 5968 Posts
Monday, October 07, 2013 6:26:30 PM
~Now we all pause while CrakrJak Googles "Republican talking points about gerrymandering"~

One can almost smell the smoke from the cogs whirring in Crakr's brain, such as it is: "Surely there must be some talking points to address the fact that Democrats won the popular vote in the 2010 elections! Something to do with vote fraud, perhaps?"

Keep looking, CrakrJak. I'm sure that one of the Tea Party think tanks will provide some good material for you. Heaven knows, they spend enough money coming up with that crap.

Squrlz4Sale
Male, 40-49, Eastern US
 5968 Posts
Monday, October 07, 2013 5:24:08 PM
@ CrakrJak: Gerrymandering has been done by both Republicans and Democrats to the detriment of our government. What's needed is a constitutional amendment to forbid it on the basis of equal representation.

That said, Republicans have raised gerrymandering to a Machiavellian artform. Want proof? More Americans voted for Democrats than Republicans in the 2010 elections--1.4 million more--yet the Republicans gained the most seats.

Nice trick!

In my state, Pennsylvania, here's how it went down:
Votes for Democrats: 2,794,078 = 5 seats
Votes for Republicans: 2,710,070 = 13 seats!

In Michigan:
Votes for Democrats: 2,327,985 = 5 seats
Votes for Republicans: 2,086,804 = 9 seats!

In Wisconsin:
Votes for Democrats: 1,443,190 = 3 seats
Votes for Republicans: 1,399,871 = 5 seats!

Et cetera.

What's going on with the Tea Party right now is a direct result of this kind of monkeying around with democracy.

whodat6484
Male, 30-39, Eastern US
 3340 Posts
Monday, October 07, 2013 5:12:18 PM
I see you fell for the Harry Reid kid with cancer misquote too, hahaha!

Twinklestein
Male, 30-39, Eastern US
 275 Posts
Monday, October 07, 2013 5:10:23 PM
Republicans and Democrats in Washington. The only difference between them is the WAY they want to destroy the country.

CrakrJak
Male, 40-49, Midwest US
 16129 Posts
Monday, October 07, 2013 4:44:12 PM
"..districts were gerrymandered to create bizarre, far-right districts"

The most gerrymandered districts in America were created by democrats for democrats. Link

Unfortunately for the democrats some of their gerrymandering went out on a limb and they lost several districts due, in 2010, due to their scribbley hubris.

Andrew155
Male, 18-29, Eastern US
 2443 Posts
Monday, October 07, 2013 4:35:55 PM
Out of curiosity (I don't want to take part in this cesspool of a debate), can someone answer this:

I've always wondered how far-right is used to describe Hitler, Tea Partiers, and people like Ron Paul. The latter two being considered proto-anarchists (though I would argue half of tea-partiers are just Conservative social engineers in disguise) It just doesn't make sense how they can all be far-right.

If "right" means less government, then Hitler has to be far-left. If "right" means more government, then Ron Paul is a leftist, which I don't think Jon Stewart would agree with. So which is it? National Socialist?

It's a stupid conversation, all of this though. It's a circular argument in the lamest partisan terms possible. The answer to the whole debate is, "Yes, Democrats and Republicans are ruining the country. You can take a situation here or there where it's mostly one or the other, but add it all up and it's both."

Squrlz4Sale
Male, 40-49, Eastern US
 5968 Posts
Monday, October 07, 2013 4:28:10 PM



"The End Times are coming! The End Times are coming!"

Squrlz4Sale
Male, 40-49, Eastern US
 5968 Posts
Monday, October 07, 2013 4:18:48 PM
@ HolyGod: Regarding that Bachmann clip: horrifying. For any Europeans, New Zealanders, or Australians wondering why America seems to have gone into SELF-DESTRUCT mode, that 10-minute clip should help explain a lot.

In short: Republican congressional districts were gerrymandered to create bizarre, far-right districts unrepresentative of the American public at large--imagine a congressional district, for example, composed of 5Cats, CrakrJak, and OldOllie. Those districts were then used to elect Tea Partiers. Since their constituents are virtually all far-far-right, the elected representatives have absolutely ZERO incentive to compromise on anything, lest another Tea Partier take their seat. The end result is a party being run by Michelle Bachmannesque ideologues who are willing to throw the American economy off the cliff to get what they want, majority rule be damned.

CrakrJak
Male, 40-49, Midwest US
 16129 Posts
Monday, October 07, 2013 4:13:57 PM

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