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Electronic Musicians Are Talentless?

Hits: 3926 | Rating: (2.6) | Category: Funny | Added by: Corydoras87
Page: 1 2 3 Next >   Jump to: Bottom    Last Post
5Cats
Male, 50-59, Canada
 25760 Posts
Wednesday, June 12, 2013 1:21:48 PM
@jimbobsthebe: It's a fine name! I thought: "the BEE"? then I figured out that you ran out of characters. That happens a LOT at IAB...

@CreamK: *nod nod* Tangerine Dream!

Perhaps I'm mistakenly confusing synthesizer groups with "electronic hip-hop" ?? idk... I lump them all together in the same "meta-category".

CreamK
Male, 40-49, Europe
 1145 Posts
Wednesday, June 12, 2013 7:10:57 AM
I've done few gigs where it was me basically fiddling with knobs and improvising on top of a backing track.. those gigs took a whole 2 hours to put together.. It was way too easy and i missed the emotional content that i couldn't deliver. Haven't done solo gigs after those few, i need about 6 people and ton of arsenal to get to the "real" level of communication thru music...

If you don't have the talent or willingness to train hard to perform live, keep it indoors. You DON'T have to be an excellent performing artist to be a good composer. Most of these successful artists that press "play" have enough resources and money to hire the capable musicians. They just choose the easy way..

CreamK
Male, 40-49, Europe
 1145 Posts
Wednesday, June 12, 2013 7:05:00 AM
Most of the disrespect towards eletronic artists (lol, not ea...) comes from the live performances that are not so much performance than pressing "play" and wiggling few knobs. Note, i've used syntheziser and sequencers from circa 1988 so i might have some insight on this.

Personally, i feel that all the parts that are suppose to get an emotional reaction, should be played live. There's a sense of danger and the performer can react to audience, make those small details that make you feel. It's a question of skill, good planning and balls. You play the wrong note: everyone knows it. You adjust filter cutoff 30% wrong: maybe 1 from 100 can catch that... Timbre is way "safer" than tones.

Skrillex is one those who does primarily DJ gigs and it is BS to say he is performing his own music, he's a DJ (not dissing real DJs, it's a different artform). Orbital, Kraftwerk, those kinds of artists really have their hands full on stage, using techniques that ARE

jimbobsthebe
Male, 18-29, Europe
 642 Posts
Wednesday, June 12, 2013 5:59:20 AM
It's one of those topics that can be very frustrating for producers. The truth of the matter is most people have no idea the level of work that it takes to create a decent sounding electronic song. People assume it's easy because they have downloaded 'fruity loops' and chucked some pre-made loops together. Trust me, that isn't fooling anyone and certainly won't land you a record deal.

For me a good analogy is to ask someone how to build a computer. Many people will say, 'oh this is easy. You just buy the parts and slot them together.' Whilst some of us appreciate that these parts themselves are extremely intricately produced, others will refuse to recognise this and assume that they just magically appeared in a cardboard box at the electronics shop.

jimbobsthebe
Male, 18-29, Europe
 642 Posts
Wednesday, June 12, 2013 5:51:06 AM
@CrakrJak - I assume you are just trolling here or being sarcastic in order to prove the ignorance of those who don't believe electronic artists have talent.

However, if not, I fully welcome you to post some of the 'half decent' music you've made for us all to judge.

@5cats - Yes, regretably that is my nickname 0.o Also, I didn't want to discredit the skill of the violinist. It takes a great deal of talent and practice to play an instrument well. It just should be noted that people take this for granted when listening to something electronic. However, all of these notes/chords/sounds have been engineered to sound the way the artist wants them to. Staccato, crescendo... whatever, it's something that a musician will play, but a producer must create.

jaysingrimm
Male, 30-39, Canada
 411 Posts
Wednesday, June 12, 2013 5:09:29 AM
Wednesday, June 12, 2013 5:03:46 AM
Edit*@crackerjack

Not all electronic musicians sample other people's work or use presets...As I explained below, I use a sampler, but I sample myself playing a piece, or banging on something. Even still there is nothing necessarily wrong with sampling something from another work. I miss the good old days before all the legalities got in the way, and musicians could readily sample lines of dialogue from movies or TV, creating a sort of soundtrack.

The truth of the matter is that ANY sample cannot be used in music today without the expressed permission of its "owner".

And I would remind you as well that Band/Rock music is not immune to "stealing" riffs, or copying a song. There have been many court cases that have made just those accusations.

jaysingrimm
Male, 30-39, Canada
 411 Posts
Wednesday, June 12, 2013 4:39:16 AM
Music is music. It takes time to write, record and produce no matter what genre. I fancy myself a musician and I write mostly electronic music...I use a lot of electronic gear like synths, sequencers and samplers (I like to sample myself hitting random stuff with some drumsticks for percussion), but I also play guitar, bass, drums, a little harmonica and plan to take up violin next. It's been my experience that many electronic musicians are multi talented. To finish any song requires: writing, performing, recording and producing. An electronic musician tends to do all this themself! And believe me, there's a reason that most bands bring in a producer and/or sound engineer to help record and produce their albums. Production work requires a creative mind that is able to work analytically. While I admit that not all electronic musicians find their way out from a computer often enough, it can still take time, and talent to finish a song...I've spent hours composing pieces on just my iPad!

CrakrJak
Male, 40-49, Midwest US
 17175 Posts
Wednesday, June 12, 2013 4:15:36 AM
Electronic music sucks because they steal samples of other people's talented playing. I've played around with several music programs, midi files, wav editors, etc. You can download millions of pre-cut, pre-tuned wav files and make a decent song in about an hour, assuming you have any creativity at all.

The learning curve on the software does stifle and confuse the uninitiated, and sure most people would give up after 15 minutes, but that's not a measure of talent, that's a measure of patience.

Are electronic musicians creative? Yes. Talented? No, not so much.

I have far more respect for musicians that actually play an instrument and do it well. Playing 4-8 notes on an instrument and pressing the repeat button is not talent.

5Cats
Male, 50-59, Canada
 25760 Posts
Tuesday, June 11, 2013 11:43:26 PM
@jimbobsthebest: (I assume that's your full name!)
You make an excellent point: A violinist who plays a Mozart tune? Is he talented or just a robot?

Creating music and playing music are, indeed, TWO separate things! At least for most humans.

You two examples are highly appropriate! One is "meh" and the other is "pretty darn good"

jimbobsthebe
Male, 18-29, Europe
 642 Posts
Tuesday, June 11, 2013 11:04:05 PM
Writing electronic music is a bit like writing classical music. Expect you also have to create/modify every single instrument in the orchestra. Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying it's more difficult then writing classical music, I'm just saying it also requires talent.

Now you have those that will compare a band to an electronic artist. Well, again this is different. That would be like me saying, who has more talent? The classical composer or the musicians in the orchestra?

Strumming come chords on a guitar is easy. But then you have your Jimmy Hendrixes. Producing this is easy... producing this on the other hand is not.

5Cats
Male, 50-59, Canada
 25760 Posts
Tuesday, June 11, 2013 7:31:27 PM
6 Seconds!
Click "free download"
Select "Save... save as" from the pop-up at the bottom of your screen
Save & listen!

Any "recorded" sound isn't "real", right? It has to "lose something" when transferred from medium to medium to medium. It's just a fact. BUT that doesn't make recorded music LESS musical, eh?

(It's 6X mediums actually: Origional Sound, Microphone, Recording Device, Physical Record, Playback Device, Speakers)

The Medium IS the Message! Massage? Whatevers!

(Note: Digital recordings still have a "physical record" made of ROM, eh?)

5Cats
Male, 50-59, Canada
 25760 Posts
Tuesday, June 11, 2013 7:10:06 PM
@Dead_Kittens: May I present: Mike Oldfield Hergest Ridge Part 1 (My personal favorite of his works!)

An instrumentalist who plays everything you hear (except when his sister helps out...)
You might know him better from the movie theme The Exorcist.

Tubular Bells I (part 1) It's also brilliant!

Enya also does all her own instrumentation and back-up singing too...

Orinoco Flow

Why do I belabor this point? Because without the modern recording technology? These would be impossible. Same for "electronic music" eh?

Now: Go download Embersreich! It takes 6 secon

Dead-Kittens
Male, 30-39, Canada
 985 Posts
Tuesday, June 11, 2013 6:50:32 PM
Ok lets be real here, Can he truly say every sample he uses in his method is completely original and crafted from nothing more than his own imagination? I am willing to bet he's downloaded a clip or two. No different than picking up a Metallica song book, riffing out and then calling yourself an'artist'... 2nd it is still music but when I say it lacks soul I mean its one guy controlling every instrument...not the same as ten guys all putting in a portion and working together to create something badass. the music is fine...its the douchy 'artists' that give them a bad name.... 3rd.. because 1 guy synthes' it all from 1 station its cost efficient running traditional musicians out of business..

BlankTom
Male, 30-39, Eastern US
 6560 Posts
Tuesday, June 11, 2013 6:11:56 PM
where can i find the built in tutorial on my guitar?

5Cats
Male, 50-59, Canada
 25760 Posts
Tuesday, June 11, 2013 5:51:11 PM
Ooo! Lookie what I found!

Embersreich Free Download!
Movement #1 is (IMHO) easily their BEST song! Download and listen! It's not on YouTube or anywhere else I looked, but it's here.
Movement #3 is also good, everything I've heard them do is good...

5Cats
Male, 50-59, Canada
 25760 Posts
Tuesday, June 11, 2013 5:24:12 PM
@patchouly: Yo! What was your band's name? I'm ever so curious! My ex- was into the "Canadian Music Scene" (sort of) around that time.

Sure, anyone can sit at a computer and "make a song" but will it be any good? I could learn how to write sheet music for piano but that wouldn't make me Mozart, eh?

I constantly "think up" songs, tunes, riffs & etc but lack ANY talent on instrument, PC or writing
I have lots of respect for anyone who can play any instrument. Sing and play at the same time? :gasp: :faint:

erikthevikin
Male, 30-39, Canada
 722 Posts
Tuesday, June 11, 2013 5:21:35 PM
The more he talks he is swaying me in a direction. Electronica needs a different spokesman. I'm still indifferent for now, but the whole thing seems pretty flat to me. All talent aside.

5Cats
Male, 50-59, Canada
 25760 Posts
Tuesday, June 11, 2013 5:12:04 PM
@Corydoras: WOW! Excellent video!

He makes sense is fun & funny, and there's a cat!

Plus it's true: playing "electronic music" is just the same as ANY other instrument. One could argue more successfully that any instrument not played live is crappy too. ie: ANY form of recording.

Embersreich Not their best song, or the best sound quality, but it reflects their "work"

Synergy 1976. Larry Fast's "S-Scape"

Jean Michell Jarre "Les Chants Magnetiques" (Magnetic Fields)

keith2
Male, 18-29, Midwest US
 2566 Posts
Tuesday, June 11, 2013 5:08:20 PM
If it's like a video game.. I've played it for 14 years or more and haven't beaten it yet.

rickwhite
Male, 30-39, Canada
 151 Posts
Tuesday, June 11, 2013 4:33:42 PM
This place is awesome.

1) Give an opinion.
2) Someone troll on that muthafudgeka
3) Contrarian flame activate!
4) Meme meme meme
5) youtube video
6) if you don't like what I like, you are dumb.
7) No! You are dumb.
8) Ha ha ha! I bet you voted for Obama!
9) Tinfoil hat!
10) My snarky quips are smarter than yours.

Fin.



Corydoras87
Male, 18-29, Europe
 638 Posts
Tuesday, June 11, 2013 3:40:31 PM
additionally:

Yes you can learn how to use the program within some hours..
Yes you can learn how to hold a guitar and how to pluck a sting within a few minutes!

but actually learning how to do it WELL takes a lot of practice and patience.

Unfortunately your arguments are just full of prejudice and governed by your musical machism (i.e. "what I don't like can't be good", belief in the superiority of your own kind)

Corydoras87
Male, 18-29, Europe
 638 Posts
Tuesday, June 11, 2013 3:32:28 PM
patchouly, clearly you have no idea what you are talking about if you dismiss it as "stringing sound effects together"... I could say the same thing about a guitar or piano player.. everybody can string together musical notes.. when I was 8 in school I scribbled some random notes on music paper and my music teacher played them on the piano and it sounded half way ok.
This is not what producing electronic music is about.

It is about bringing the harmonics together, bringing your own style into it and putting emotion into it. You can do this in electronic music by changing all the kinds of different sliders and manipulating how the "sound effect" as you call it actually sounds in the end.

As a Piano player you do this by, I don't know, drating around with the pedals or as a guitar player you do this by wobbling the string when playing a note or whatever.

Being a musicial in either case is not just arranging musical notes.

godthaab
Male, 18-29, Canada
 220 Posts
Tuesday, June 11, 2013 3:16:32 PM
Arguement #1. If it does take you years to produce a track, you ain't no musician. You are wanking "until it sounds good".

BritInvasion
Male, 18-29, Eastern US
 310 Posts
Tuesday, June 11, 2013 2:51:24 PM
What now? Cat plays fetch

CynicalGamer
Male, 40-49, Midwest US
 450 Posts
Tuesday, June 11, 2013 2:51:04 PM
His position is electronic based "musicians" actually have talent because a laymen can't use the program. Let's sit him in front of real instruments and see how far he gets. The argument that A is right because of B isn't correct in this respect.

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