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What's In President Obamas Gun Control Package?

Hits: 6117 | Rating: (1.9) | Category: News & Politics | Added by: fancylad
Page: 1 24 5 6 7 Next >   Jump to: Bottom    Last Post
markust123
Male, 40-49, Western US
 3785 Posts
Thursday, January 17, 2013 1:19:03 PM
@5Cats, "ANY gun can be used "by the military" but the AR-15 is not the same as the M-16, ok? Your Chevrolet is NOT a Sherman Tank"

Christ, your spin is getting so predictable. You know I am not talking about any guns. The AR-15 was designed for the military to be used to be able to kill as many people in the shortest amount of time. In the design process is was turned into the M16. Then Colt after buying the Design went back to the AR-15 name when they release a semi-automatic version for the public. It is insane that a gun designed for the military to be used to be able to kill as many people in the shortest amount of time was ever allowed to be sold to civilians.

markust123
Male, 40-49, Western US
 3785 Posts
Thursday, January 17, 2013 1:18:17 PM
From one of the police recordings of a 911 call from inside the Aurora theater that jackass got off 30 shots in 27 seconds. Call it a semi-automatic but that is automatic to me. It shoots as fast as you can pull the trigger. At least at the minimum what is wrong with limiting the magazines to 10 cartridges? The shooter has to detach himself from what he is doing. That could cause him to think about his actions. Also this gives a chance for the shooter to be tackled when he reloads. If you want 30 for target practice make a law where you check out cartridges from the shooting range.

MeGrendel
Male, 40-49, Southern US
 4861 Posts
Thursday, January 17, 2013 1:08:50 PM
Musuko42-"No, it's more like the congressman has cancer, and I do not have cancer"

So, you're saying that there is absolutely no chance of your kids being involved in violence. (and thus, a fool).

I'm sure at least a few of the parents at Sandy Hook had that mistaken impression, too.

Sorry, but you DO have the cancer (i.e. have the possiblity of violence being commited o you).


Musuko42-"the person most likely to kill me is INSIDE the house: me."

One day, you may just realize how ignorant you are, and consider it further. (I take it you're not married...if you were, YOU wouldn't be the person most likely to kill you...)

Musuko42-"It is better for my survival to keep weapons away from that person."

Believe me, We're ALL glad you don't have access to weapons. But that does not mean we are worried about reasonable, rational and SANE people owning them.

Musuko42
Male, 18-29, Europe
 2850 Posts
Thursday, January 17, 2013 1:07:33 PM
@MeGrendel

"You asanine statments just demonstrate that you have an irrational fear of an inanimate object"

Yet you're not irrational for fearing the murderous attentions of a criminal breaking into your home that you'll seek to put a deadly weapon into the hands of the person statistically most likely to kill you?

You're like those people who think it's safer to wear a seatbelt so you don't get trapped in a wreck, you really are.

And if you think that the ease of access to a quick, easy, and painless death doesn't factor into suicides, then I wonder about your mental capacity, and would perhaps invite you to visit Beachy Head and ask potential jumpers why they have chosen the instant death of hitting the rocks at the bottom of a huge cliff rather than suffer the agony of slit wrists or overdose.

Musuko42
Male, 18-29, Europe
 2850 Posts
Thursday, January 17, 2013 1:03:05 PM
@MeGrendel

"No easier than slitting your wrist, overdosing on drugs, hanging youself or jumping off a building."

So why do you care so much about having a gun to protect from criminals if it's just as easy to slit their wrists, overdose them, or throw them off a building?

Check and bloody mate.

Musuko42
Male, 18-29, Europe
 2850 Posts
Thursday, January 17, 2013 1:02:07 PM
@5Cats

"I've demonstrated (with Wiki) that gun availability does NOT alter suicide rates."

If a gun makes it easier to be a threat to an intruder, then it must also make it easier for you to be a threat to yourself, should that urge strike you.

And I've pointed out that you're more of a threat to yourself than others are to you.

So again...why assist and arm your most likely killer?

MeGrendel
Male, 40-49, Southern US
 4861 Posts
Thursday, January 17, 2013 1:01:14 PM
Musuko42-"The gun makes it easier."

No easier than slitting your wrist, overdosing on drugs, hanging youself or jumping off a building.

You think it's easier? I can should you an imate of guy who tried to commit suicide with a shotgun, and failed. He lived, and missing his head from the eyeballs down.

Musuko42-"So again, why should I make things easier for the person most likely to kill me: myself?"

A few points:
If you're going to kill yourself, any means will do. A gun is not required.
If you DON'T want to kill yourself, having a gun on hand will not suddenly make it more attractive.
If it does, YOU are the problem, not the gun.
You asanine statments just demonstrate that you have an irrational fear of an inanimate object.

Musuko42
Male, 18-29, Europe
 2850 Posts
Thursday, January 17, 2013 12:58:25 PM
@MeGrendel

"Actually, it's more like you and a congressman have cancer, but only the congressman is allowed to get treatment."

No, it's more like the congressman has cancer, and I do not have cancer...so he needs and gets the treatment, and I don't need it nor want it.

I do not need a gun nor armed guards because I am not under constant daily threat from nutjobs. The royal family and others like them are.

And as I've pointed out before, the person most likely to kill me is INSIDE the house: me. It is better for my survival to keep weapons away from that person.

Remember, 8.86 times more likely to kill myself than someone else is to kill me, as shown by the real world figures of my country (roughly hashed together by me).

Musuko42
Male, 18-29, Europe
 2850 Posts
Thursday, January 17, 2013 12:55:59 PM
@McGovern1981

"Cause you can't kill yourself without a gun? They call that a choice."

The gun makes it easier. So again, why should I make things easier for the person most likely to kill me: myself?

Musuko42
Male, 18-29, Europe
 2850 Posts
Thursday, January 17, 2013 12:54:11 PM
@VikingGuy

1: Why aren't you fighting for better police, then?
2: Would having a gun for defence have helped you in that situation? Would you have had it there with you in the bathroom?
3: Why on earth did you have a knife in the bathroom?

MeGrendel
Male, 40-49, Southern US
 4861 Posts
Thursday, January 17, 2013 12:32:01 PM
FoolsPrussia-"Why don't you move somewhere without laws and enforcement?"

I never cared for Chicago.

FoolsPrussia
Male, 30-39, Western US
 3402 Posts
Thursday, January 17, 2013 12:29:17 PM
@HalfPintRoo:

I suggest that you watch the opening segment from The Daily Show last night. There Goes the Boom Parts 1 and 2

There are reasons criminals are getting guns, and Jon Stewart does a good job of showing why and who is responsible. Many of the actions initiated by Obama yesterday are meant to fix these problems.

5Cats
Male, 50-59, Canada
 26662 Posts
Thursday, January 17, 2013 12:20:00 PM
@Musuko42: I've demonstrated (with Wiki) that gun availability does NOT alter suicide rates. Canada and Australia, they still use guns or other methods at the (overall) same rate.
#2 Shouldn't "doing something" about suicide be MORE important then? Will Obama's "points" help those people? Doubtful.

Well said @VikingGuy!

You too @HalfPintRoo!

@papajon0s1: lolz! More spending! Moar I say!

HalfPintRoo
Female, 18-29, Eastern US
 2475 Posts
Thursday, January 17, 2013 12:12:18 PM
"Why don't you move somewhere without laws and enforcement? I hear Somalia is lovely this time of year."

You keep saying that.

We aren't against having laws. We want to be able to punish those who kill other people. But we aren't so naive to think those laws will STOP murder.

Making laws do not stop crime, especially when someone gets it in their head to KILL.

Taking guns out of the hands of those who do abide the law isn't going to KEEP the guns out of those who don't plan on abiding by the law.

Get it?

5Cats
Male, 50-59, Canada
 26662 Posts
Thursday, January 17, 2013 12:11:14 PM
5cats can't find a good reason to attack any of these reasonable proposals so he claims they're too expensive and cumbersome.

@Palfas: I've put up many posts with MANY good reasons why these "points" are useless. #1 being the money is utterly wasted. #2 being that these "points" are probably counter-productive.

If you'd bother to READ previous posts you'd know this.

@Finker: You've completely ignored my point. "The Left" wants TWO sets of laws: one for "them" and one for "others". I used midevil Royalty as an example of how that works, but there's 100's of others in history.

@markust: ANY gun can be used "by the military" but the AR-15 is not the same as the M-16, ok? Your Chevrolet is NOT a "Sherman Tank"...

Why a civilian needs anything larger...

When seconds count? The police are 10 minutes away!

FoolsPrussia
Male, 30-39, Western US
 3402 Posts
Thursday, January 17, 2013 11:54:51 AM
"There's laws against murdering your mom, stealing cars, bringing guns on school ground and murdering teachers and kids, amoung others.

How'd THOSE work out?"

Why don't you move somewhere without laws and enforcement? I hear Somalia is lovely this time of year.

papajon0s1
Male, 40-49, Midwest US
 579 Posts
Thursday, January 17, 2013 11:33:58 AM
What's another 500 million on top of the 16 trillion we already have burying us?! Pile it on I say! Pile it on!

MeGrendel
Male, 40-49, Southern US
 4861 Posts
Thursday, January 17, 2013 11:17:40 AM
Musuko42-"If someone with cancer gets radiotherapy, and cancer-free you doesn't, do you feel less valuable?"

Actually, it's more like you and a congressman have cancer, but only the congressman is allowed to get treatment.

FoolsPrussia-"First of all, there are no laws yet."

There's laws against murdering your mom, stealing cars, bringing guns on school ground and murdering teachers and kids, amoung others.

How'd THOSE work out?

McGovern1981
Male, 30-39, Eastern US
 13611 Posts
Thursday, January 17, 2013 10:18:38 AM
So if the person most likely to kill me is myself...why on earth would I want to arm my most likely killer?


Cause you can't kill yourself without a gun? They call that a choice.

FoolsPrussia
Male, 30-39, Western US
 3402 Posts
Thursday, January 17, 2013 10:17:06 AM
"These laws are not going to stop school shootings. Period.

These laws were pushed through because of a horrible school shooting, giving people the idea that these laws will stop these school shootings. "

First of all, there are no laws yet. Obama recommended that Congress pass several laws, but that hasn't happened yet, and many may not happen at all.

Secondly, the things described as "executive orders" are really just a mix of recommendations and appointments, as you can see from this article.

HalfPintRoo
Female, 18-29, Eastern US
 2475 Posts
Thursday, January 17, 2013 9:56:26 AM
These laws are not going to stop school shootings. Period.

These laws were pushed through because of a horrible school shooting, giving people the idea that these laws will stop these school shootings.

That's my problem with it. We will be no more safer after these laws pass. But, lets waste our time and resources making sure these guns are not available to the majority of people who will never use them to kill/hurt another person.

Because these laws will ensure that the FEW who do will never ever get their hands on them!

VikingGuy
Male, 18-29, Europe
 2416 Posts
Thursday, January 17, 2013 9:52:49 AM
*be realistic. also i´m a gun owner but as i´m responsible i had my weapons locked away in a cabinet, which was beyond their ability to damage or steal. i do believe that they saw me with my knife in hand did play a part in not booting my bathroom door in however. none the less the moral is the cops are human also and not a magic spell. crimes will always happen regardless of your proximity to law enforcement or ownership of weapons, and words on paper do not stop you from taking an action should you wish to do so, they're an honor system.

VikingGuy
Male, 18-29, Europe
 2416 Posts
Thursday, January 17, 2013 9:47:37 AM
for all this "the police will save me" stuff, little story. i live in berlin, the german capital, and 2 minutes walk from a police station. in my appartment complex the walls are pretty soundproof yet a man who lives here beat his wife constantly to where i could hear it as if it was in the next room, 3 floors up. i called the cops of course and their response time was on average 30 to 40 minutes. i also had people break into my home illegally and loot the place, it took the cops 45 minutes to show up while i was stuck in my own bathroom with soaked hair, a knife, my phone and nothing but my skivvies on while they trashed my place. they took 45 minutes to arrive by which time those people had looted and left. why i didnt use the knife, while trained and qualified on it, is 3 on one with no idea what theyre carrying themselves, because criminals do not give a flying drat about licenses or laws.
criminals do not wait while you phone the cops, and cops cannot teleport. be re

Musuko42
Male, 18-29, Europe
 2850 Posts
Thursday, January 17, 2013 9:36:32 AM
@MeGrendel

"So you actually feel they are more important than you, and more valuable than you."

They are not more important. They are just more threatened than I am and are in need of more defence.

If someone with cancer gets radiotherapy, and cancer-free you doesn't, do you feel less valuable?

Musuko42
Male, 18-29, Europe
 2850 Posts
Thursday, January 17, 2013 9:32:01 AM
@McGovern1981

In 2012 there were 636 murders in the UK, and the population is currently 62,641,000. That means the chance of me being murdered last year was 0.001015309%.

In 2010 (I can't find figures for 2012), there were 5,608 suicides, out of a population of (aprox) 62,300,000. That means the chance of me killing myself in 2010 was 0.009001605%

That means the statistics suggest I am 8.86 times more likely to kill myself than I am to be killed by someone else.

So if the person most likely to kill me is myself...why on earth would I want to arm my most likely killer?

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