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A Horrifying Thing Happened In Ohio

Hits: 15137 | Rating: (3.0) | Category: News & Politics | Added by: CaptKangaroo
Page: 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 Next >   Jump to: Bottom    Last Post
SPrinkZ
Male, 18-29, Eastern US
 2251 Posts
Sunday, January 13, 2013 10:34:15 AM
" agree that rape is wrong but it's a reality and won't go away."

Why? Why is it a reality that 'won't go away'? Are you saying this is normal? Because it really SOUNDS like it. It can go away. There is a way to fix any problem. People said that blacks will never vote, and women won't, and indians, and etc. You can't say that things won't happen, or should until you really actually make an effort at it. If this is the way our species is--then I don't want to be a part of the human race. We're disgusting and deserve anything bad that happens to us. We can't even prevent raping our own.

SPrinkZ
Male, 18-29, Eastern US
 2251 Posts
Sunday, January 13, 2013 10:29:48 AM
Swimming is a choice. Does no one seem to understand that rape is very hard to draw an analogy to? Here is a good analogy for rape:

It's like you see everyone as a sandwich and you just so happen to be hungry. It's no problem to eat a sandwich when you're hungry. But if you replace sandwich with woman, and hungry with wanting to rape, then you see how the analogy works.

But it doesn't because a woman isn't a fuc*ing sandwich.

Tell your daughter how to swim so she won't drown because she'll CHOOSE TO GO INTO WATER.

But telling your daughter not to walk alone at night, and all this other crap is just telling of the bastards that live in our world--not of what to really do to protect yourself: owning a gun, or having ridiculous martial arts skills. What do women really have to do to avoid rape? Stop the rape culture all together. It's ubiquitous for a reason!

spanerbulb
Male, 30-39, Europe
 1247 Posts
Sunday, January 13, 2013 10:21:57 AM
There are steps people can take to reduce the chances of being raped, we all (most of us at any rate) agree that rape is wrong but it's a reality and won't go away. The next best thing is to make sure you reduce the chances of becoming a victim.

MeGrendel
Male, 40-49, Southern US
 4448 Posts
Sunday, January 13, 2013 10:21:01 AM
madduck-"you tell her not to drive or go near roads in case a drunk driver is about?"

No, but I do tell how to stay safe in case there are drunks on the road. Wear a seatbelt. Always be aware of your surroundings.

When it's dark and you're on a multi-lane highway, ALWAY stay in the right lane as much as possible. Virtually every Head on collision by a drunk driver on the interstate is in the left lane, because the drunk driver THINKS he's in HIS right lane.

madduck-"but every time we give that advice we are also telling her that IF she gets assaulted then at some level she is to blame."

Okay, besides having zero reading comprehension skills, you're an idiot to boot.

Good to know for future reference.

Based on your 'logic', I should not teach my daughter to swim, so that when she drowns she will not feel it's her fault.

SPrinkZ
Male, 18-29, Eastern US
 2251 Posts
Sunday, January 13, 2013 10:01:11 AM
Don't you love being a rape apologist? You've never even seen a bad day in your life probably and you're going to act like your little soap bubble is a microcosm of reality. I've seen some pretty awful crap happen to girls just because someone wanted a thrill that night and she happened to be in a vulnerable position.

Men get raped too--and we don't ask them what they were wearing, or if their ass crack was hanging out or something. It's absurd. Rape is wrong. Nothing will prevent it from happening beside our society weeding them out, and not teaching this stuff as part of normality.

SPrinkZ
Male, 18-29, Eastern US
 2251 Posts
Sunday, January 13, 2013 9:58:51 AM
The only people who will understand what I am saying are people who have been raped/know someone who has, or can truly sympathize with the victims of spiritual murder. It's not to be taken lightly. I never met a girl who was the 'same' after being raped.

Gerry1of1
Male, 50-59, Western US
 33910 Posts
Sunday, January 13, 2013 9:42:53 AM

Don't yah just love extremist mentalities.

madduck
Female, 50-59, Europe
 5575 Posts
Sunday, January 13, 2013 9:24:22 AM
so- India? Egypt? Pakistan? The one thing all these countries have in common is an entrenched view that women (or those with other genders- the Q T end of things) exist as things to serve men. This guy makes a decent and valid point...McGrendel- again- what you did was say you would try to keep your daughter safe by education as to things SHE should do. Do you tell her not to drive or go near roads in case a drunk driver is about? No- we tell our kids to never drink and drive, not to get in the car with someone who has been drinking etc.. that drinking and driving is something that THEY should never do. Honestly- it sounds sensible- all that advice we give to girls- but every time we give that advice we are also telling her that IF she gets assaulted then at some level she is to blame- wrong place, wrong time, wrong clothes.

Gerry1of1
Male, 50-59, Western US
 33910 Posts
Sunday, January 13, 2013 9:24:07 AM

"Steubenville rape culture" aren't we getting a bit carried away here? Some kids got drunk and committed a crime. That's hardly a "culture".

As for Hollywood, I'm not aware of any movies that make rape an okay thing to do.

SPrinkZ
Male, 18-29, Eastern US
 2251 Posts
Sunday, January 13, 2013 8:58:04 AM
The difference here is this crackrjack: movies/media is often called 'fake' or 'fantasy'. Real life circumstances trump what our normal morals might tell us. In some places it is perfectly all right to make fun of someone for having a disability, and is frequently encouraged by other students, and ignored by teachers. I've seen it firsthand. I imagine things could be more insidious, or more friendly, but it starts with education, and controlling behavior through some sort of modeling. If kids think that movies are real, then we're screwed.

CrakrJak
Male, 40-49, Midwest US
 16941 Posts
Sunday, January 13, 2013 8:55:55 AM
This isn't 'Steubenville Rape Culture', That is Hollywood and TV 'Rape Culture'. Blame the coaches and parents for letting their kids watch those movies and videos, and listening to the pop culture lyrics, and likely pornography as well. But who is selling that crap? Who is making Billions of dollars off implanting this disgusting sh|t into their minds? Hollywood and TV media moguls are the pimps to these atrocities and it's time that they be held accountable.

If rape victims were allowed to sue the TV, Film, and Record industries for the subornation of rape, murder and molestation, they would quit making that smut and we'd get a better society for it.

MeGrendel
Male, 40-49, Southern US
 4448 Posts
Sunday, January 13, 2013 8:28:19 AM
madduck-"you need to look at what you just said- a more moderate version of the argument for rape "

You need to work on your reading comprehension. NOTHING I said, in any way, argue for rape or for blaming the victim.

I personally think that any violent rapist should automatically recieve the death penalty. He's proven he doesn't belong in society.

But, just as the threat of penalty does not deter murderers, it will not deter all rapist.

I believe a woman should be able to dress (or undress) anywhere, any how she likes, and not be harrassed.

There are those who don't care what I, or the woman, believe.

You're dealing with what 'should' be, I teach my daughter reality.

But, because facing reality does not mesh with your ideal of how it 'should' be, you prefer to claim I'm 'blaming the victim'.

I, on the other hand, will blame the aggressor, and instruct my daughter on the best ways not to become a victim

Gerry1of1
Male, 50-59, Western US
 33910 Posts
Sunday, January 13, 2013 8:27:58 AM

No, not trolling. I just don't think the schools can replace parenting. Schools can't make a bad kid good. That does not mean I think schools should be places where bullies run free. I don't understand why people blame the coach and not all the other teachers as well. Why is the coach more responsible than the kids counselor or home room teacher?

Teaching morality is the business of parents, not the Gov'ment.

LordJim
Male, 50-59, Europe
 4424 Posts
Sunday, January 13, 2013 7:56:17 AM
Gerry,

'Schools are there to teach reading and math.'

No. If a school is aware that among its student body rape is seen as a joke, queer-bashing as high jinks and the disabled as fair game then that school would be grossly negligent if it did not address that.

Schools exist to teach and part of teaching is creating and maintaining a place where people feel safe and able to learn. If you have an ethos where being on a sports team means that a few rapes should be winked at then you have a messed up school. And a messed up society.

SPrinkZ
Male, 18-29, Eastern US
 2251 Posts
Sunday, January 13, 2013 7:28:21 AM
Gerry, you must be a troll. You must be forgetting that a mother can still love a son who murders someone. If all parents were the arbiters of justice we'd have rapists on the streets everywhere. It's up to our society as a collective to deal out justice when it's appropriate. It's not up to mommy and daddy. It's only up to the courts.

SPrinkZ
Male, 18-29, Eastern US
 2251 Posts
Sunday, January 13, 2013 7:25:53 AM
Individuals aren't very good at raising individuals anyway--it takes a village to raise a child. Clearly you're oblivious to the fact that kids at that age spend most of their time at, or thinking about school until they are 18. They rebel against their parents because they usually don't relate, and they are hormonal, and because they are in a learning process that affects the rest of their decisions for the rest of their lives, and some kids end up killing themselves because of bullying, and being slut-shamed, or harassed over being gay. Are you denying that this happens? And if parents are at fault here--why aren't we doing something about the 'parents' that are raising monsters? Or we could take the easy route, and just get our schools to start teaching philosophy and morals at a young age instead of assuming they'll be figured out at some point. People often don't think, and most don't even have a little voice in their head saying a damn thing.

Gerry1of1
Male, 50-59, Western US
 33910 Posts
Sunday, January 13, 2013 7:18:56 AM

"Isn't one of the purposes of government, and our schools is to develop a class of people who are good natured, honest, kind, caring, and most importantly compassionate/ empathetic?"

No, that would be a parent's job. Schools are there to teach reading and math.

SPrinkZ
Male, 18-29, Eastern US
 2251 Posts
Sunday, January 13, 2013 7:14:23 AM
These 'dangerous situations' shouldn't exist, and are the product of our culture. If we didn't promote it with implicit permission, then it wouldn't be seen as implicit language of 'rape me'. People can read between the lines, but what lines are we giving them to read in the first place? Rules are meant to be broken so long as it's possible, and morally we permit men to do it so long as they

A) Don't get caught
B) Are in a place where it is acceptable
C) She is ashamed to tell anyone

This is fun, amirite? I am a strong believer that we're socially programmed, and some of us have intrinsic behaviors that are fairly 'wrong' and can be seen nearly immediately if we had a uniform culture that didn't promote this kind of crap. They would be seen, identified, and hopefully rehabilitated into expressing themselves in a way that is healthy. Or something else.

SPrinkZ
Male, 18-29, Eastern US
 2251 Posts
Sunday, January 13, 2013 7:10:34 AM
Asking for it is deserved it in some circles. A shrug and an awkward silence might come out of it, but it's still the same in the victim's mind. It means that there was a way to prevent it and they failed to do it. You're missing the reality of it. You're missing the sympathy of it. You're missing the victim, and the total stupidity of sympathizing with anyone who thinks there is a way to 'ask' for anything implicitly without language. We are not mind-readers, and people are not objects. Those who are that sexually deviant shouldn't be allowed to reproduce, or something.

SPrinkZ
Male, 18-29, Eastern US
 2251 Posts
Sunday, January 13, 2013 7:08:51 AM
Isn't one of the purposes of government, and our schools is to develop a class of people who are good natured, honest, kind, caring, and most importantly--compassionate/empathetic? I know it's not 100% possible, but if we promoted a society that respected people's rights fiercely instead of talking about it maybe people wouldn't feel not only victimized, but also tortured with guilt about being victimized in the first place.

Gerry1of1
Male, 50-59, Western US
 33910 Posts
Sunday, January 13, 2013 6:07:29 AM

Terminology is key.
So many people are confusing "asking for it" with "deserved it".
Example, if my behavior led me into dangerous situations and I got shot, some people might say I was asking for trouble. That doesn't mean I deserved to get shot. It doesn't let the shooter off the hook, it just implies some culpability on my part.

That can't be applied to every crime victim, most were just minding their business. But sometimes the victim is guilty of foolish behavior that lead them into a dangerous situation.

SPrinkZ
Male, 18-29, Eastern US
 2251 Posts
Sunday, January 13, 2013 5:06:26 AM
No offense, but fuzzysheep has a very similar mentality to many rapists. They objectify women, or even think that viewing women that way is relevant. Women are a cosmos. So are men--so is every living thing. When you neglect that and merely see the parts and not the entire operation you'll abandon yourself to wanton needs instead of seeing reality.

SPrinkZ
Male, 18-29, Eastern US
 2251 Posts
Sunday, January 13, 2013 5:04:49 AM
No one here seems to get the point: a soul annihilating event cannot be after the fact said to be "well, you could have done X to prevent it." Nothing would have prevented that. They wanted you--so they took you. They are wrong 100%. You are right 100%. No matter if a woman is butt ass naked fingering herself in the street does she deserve to be raped. If you really believe that, then you're probably a rapist yourself. No girl is 'asking for it' unless she literally is 'asking for it'.

SPrinkZ
Male, 18-29, Eastern US
 2251 Posts
Sunday, January 13, 2013 5:02:01 AM
I'd like that analogy too if women were objects...I think you've missed the point entirely. The point is this: why do men find it necessary to rape women, and why do we tend to blame the victim, or make them feel 'stupid' for exposing themselves in particular circumstances. Not every woman is SCARED FOR HER LIFE of being raped--and sometimes people are non-nice individuals and PUT them in those situations out of spite. Plus, most rapists are friends/family members/clergy, etc. I don't think there is any way to fix this until we either kill every rapist and their offspring (since it is a highly heritable and adaptive trait) or find a way to segregate them. Most of these men only get sexual satisfaction out of hurting women or controlling them. We don't need them in our society and never did. They make strippers and prostitutes--not doctors and engineers out of women.

fuzzysheep
Male, 18-29, Europe
 175 Posts
Sunday, January 13, 2013 4:33:58 AM
"@Listypoos
Its not quite that black and white is it?
Common sense is one thing, but blaming the rapee for being assaulted...? "

He didn't blame the rapee at all. Saying there are ways to reduce the chances of something happening is not the same as saying it was your fault if it does happen. I like the valuables in a car analogy, if you left your laptop on display on your front seat it wouldn't make it right for a thief to break in and steal it, it wouldn't mean you were asking for it and it wouldn't mean it was your fault but it would make it more likely that it would happen and people rightly advise against it. You might as well be marching around with placards saying "don"t tell me to lock my front door tell thieves not to steal".

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