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Romney Releases 20 Years Of Tax Returns

Hits: 6365 | Rating: (1.8) | Category: News & Politics | Added by: 5Cats
Page: 1 2 3 4 Next >   Jump to: Bottom    Last Post
AvatarJohn
Male, 30-39, Southern US
 979 Posts
Sunday, September 23, 2012 2:54:59 PM
Hmmm, now if we just get Obama's college transcripts and a real birth certificate (check the hospitals in Kenya), we'd be all set!

CrakrJak
Male, 40-49, Midwest US
 16866 Posts
Saturday, September 22, 2012 3:18:45 PM
HG: Actually 15% would sustain the government. Forbes did a study and figured it out. Of course he was talking about eliminating income tax completely and instituting the 'flat tax' as a federal sales tax (with an exception for foodstuffs).


HolyGod
Male, 30-39, Western US
 4960 Posts
Saturday, September 22, 2012 3:05:24 PM
Cajun247

"I was thinking between 6%-10%"

Well that could never sustain the operating cost of the government. Obviously you want to lower the operating cost, as do I, but that is a separate conversation and something that takes time.

HolyGod
Male, 30-39, Western US
 4960 Posts
Saturday, September 22, 2012 3:00:49 PM
CrakrJak

"Look up 'capital gains' on wikipedia to learn more."

I know how capital gains works. My family was relatively wealthy. But I don't see how that changes my statement.

I think there should be a set tax rate for the amount of money you take in whether it is investment, payroll, or lemonade stands.

If you make under $50,000 you pay no income taxes. If you make over $30 million you pay 30%. In between it is on a sliding scale.

That would vastly lower the tax burden on the lower and middle class while sustaining the operating of the government, eliminating budget deficits, and paying down the national debt.

I think getting to pay taxes should be a privilege that people strive for because it means you have reached a level of success where you can take care of your family, assist your country, and still have plenty left over.

SmagBoy1
Male, 40-49, Southern US
 4159 Posts
Saturday, September 22, 2012 2:19:11 PM
@CrakrJak: I hear ya, that's why there should be a flat tax. everyone (except the poor) paying the same rate regardless of the source of that income.

Damn, it's a banner day--I agree with that entirely (although I'd add a caveat about no loopholes, no exemptions)! I do think there should be one exception, as you say, too, for those making less than whatever minimum is decided (i.e. the minimum required to survive plus 10%, or something like that), but, otherwise, I'm all for it, CrakrJak.

Cajun247
Male, 18-29, Southern US
 10224 Posts
Saturday, September 22, 2012 1:27:44 PM
I'll be damned, did I just agree with Cajun?


One of the few issues we agree on my friend.

Also HumanAction that's what I meant really a flat rate. Though I guess I really didn't word it well though.

Why do you think I'd say 20% HG? Really I was thinking between 6%-10% but I'm also good with a minimum taxable wage so long as there's a flat tax rate.

CrakrJak
Male, 40-49, Midwest US
 16866 Posts
Saturday, September 22, 2012 1:16:09 PM
HG: I don't think you're factoring in the source that income comes from. Because the (long-term) capital gains rate is 15% is much less than the 33% or 35% they'd pay for short term investments or payroll income, most rich people are basically just sitting on their hands letting their money do the earning for them.

The Bush tax cuts are expiring though, which means next year taxes are going up, regardless of who becomes president.

Look up 'capital gains' on wikipedia to learn more.

CrakrJak
Male, 40-49, Midwest US
 16866 Posts
Saturday, September 22, 2012 1:03:09 PM
I'll be damned, did I just agree with Cajun?

CrakrJak
Male, 40-49, Midwest US
 16866 Posts
Saturday, September 22, 2012 1:02:11 PM
Smagboy1: it bugs the poo out of me that I pay a higher percentage than Romney


I hear ya, that's why there should be a flat tax. everyone (except the poor) paying the same rate regardless of the source of that income.

HolyGod
Male, 30-39, Western US
 4960 Posts
Saturday, September 22, 2012 12:32:52 PM
Cajun 247

"Why not everyone pay the same tax rate? That way the liberals can quit whining about the ridiculous privileges rich folk get."

Because someone who makes $20,000 a year needs every penny to survive. If you tax everyone 20%, they have to live off of $16,000 when they could barely make it on $20,000.

Now someone who makes $20 Million, when taxed at 20%, keeps $16 Million. Now if they were taxed at 30% they'd still get to keep $14 Million AND that one person's extra tax would make it so 500 people making $20,000 and barely surviving wouldn't have to pay any taxes.

We are talking about someone who is working and contributing to society. Someone that is providing a service. They shouldn't struggle to survive.

Anybody should be thrilled to pay 30% that means you have been lucky and successful enough to make that much money.

Dead-Kittens
Male, 30-39, Canada
 982 Posts
Saturday, September 22, 2012 11:00:15 AM
"Why not everyone pay the same tax rate? That way the liberals can quit whining about the ridiculous privileges rich folk get."

why not a proggressive tax rate? first 50k of earnings pays 10%, next 30k is 20% and next 20k is 25 (for example a total of 16k on 100k income)... past the basic priveledge for the standard of comfortable living..pay more to earn more.

HumanAction
Male, 18-29, Midwest US
 2353 Posts
Saturday, September 22, 2012 10:58:01 AM
@Cajun247: I think the Romney camp realized that, at some point, they were going to get into "big trouble" and decided to hang onto the returns as a safety net. Now that "big trouble" has arrived, he can use the tax returns to "level the playing field" by attacking liberals for being hate-mongerers running a baseless slander campaign (rather than promoting their own agenda). I expect to see such propaganda showing up soon...

Also, if not a flat tax, then a flat tax rate would be best (on spending instead of income). Actually, reverting to the old system when only states collect individual taxes (and directly pay the federal government) would be best in my opinion. In that way, states would be free to collect taxes as they see fit.

Dead-Kittens
Male, 30-39, Canada
 982 Posts
Saturday, September 22, 2012 10:49:44 AM
Well no poo...I have no doubt that the 'investors' in the Romney administration would have a hard time letting something like that slip by. Im slightly more curious as to what charities he invested in and where the dividing line between campaign funding and personal contributions/income is drawn.

Maybe its just the media im subjected to but I see more and more scandalous behavior around the republicans but almost none about the democrats. I dont get a vote but so far ive been given more reasons not to vote for the republicans than I have reasons to vote for either. Messed up politics.

Cajun247
Male, 18-29, Southern US
 10224 Posts
Saturday, September 22, 2012 10:38:04 AM
Why not everyone pay the same tax rate? That way the liberals can quit whining about the ridiculous privileges rich folk get.

Cajun247
Male, 18-29, Southern US
 10224 Posts
Saturday, September 22, 2012 10:34:19 AM
So it takes a leaked video for Romney to reveal some run-of-the-mill tax returns? Real integrity in this election.

markust123
Male, 40-49, Western US
 3784 Posts
Saturday, September 22, 2012 10:16:06 AM
The lowest rate of 13% the Romney's have paid in income tax in the last 10 years was against adjusted gross income, which is how taxes work but they didn't list what their adjusted gross income was. Loopholes and off shore accounts could have brought their adjusted gross income down to $100, which 13% would be $13. Yes that number is ridiculously low but I did it for the ease of math and to prove a point - if you don't show what the adjusted gross income was the percentages are meaningless. I'm just pointing out that this debate is far from over. The 1000 foot report they offered of overall percentage totals for the last 20 years raises more questions than answers. Still Harry Reid needs to apologize.

SmagBoy1
Male, 40-49, Southern US
 4159 Posts
Saturday, September 22, 2012 9:40:05 AM
5Cats, I'm not arguing with you, either. I realize that it's supposedly against the law. That's just not the reality, though.

As for Obama encouraging blacks to get out and vote, last I heard, blacks aren't a specific religious group. Too, he also encourages Latinos to get out and vote. And Autoworkers, and miners, and college students. Pretty sure they'r not a religion, either. Again, not arguing with you, just pointing out that, sure, he asks lots of voting groups to vote for him! And, too, I'm sure that some churches encourage their members to vote for him, too! I'm just as against that as I am churches encouraging votes for Romney.

SmagBoy1
Male, 40-49, Southern US
 4159 Posts
Saturday, September 22, 2012 9:36:45 AM
AntEconomist, please understand that I hear you. And understand the law, but, that's not the reality. That link is just one of the dozens of similar stories, with specific information. I'm not anti-Mormon, or anti-Mitt, but, I *do* know some of what they do with their money.

Further, in an unrelated issue, see "Pulpit Freedom Sunday" which priests and preachers have been doing for at least eight years now, about a month before the election, where hundreds of them tell their congregations exactly how they're expected to vote. Just google that term--far too many stories to link to here.

Again, not challenging you, just explaining reality versus the written law.

5Cats
Male, 50-59, Canada
 24392 Posts
Saturday, September 22, 2012 9:32:19 AM
@AntEconomist is correct.
ZoNation Explains Why
Of course when Obama commands Blacks to rally and support him, that's OK, eh? But heaven forbid any group should support Romney, ever!

AntEconomist
Male, 40-49, Eastern US
 254 Posts
Saturday, September 22, 2012 9:26:52 AM
@SmagBoy: That's not correct. As with any non-profit church, LDS is prohibited from using its money in support of political candidates. If they were to do so, they'd lose their tax exempt status and then donations to them would not be tax deductible.

SmagBoy1
Male, 40-49, Southern US
 4159 Posts
Saturday, September 22, 2012 8:56:51 AM
Well, AntEconomist, that depends *entirely* on to whom/what you're donating. If, for example, you're donating to the church of LDS, you can rest assured that they're going to be spending bucket loads of money and mobilizing truckloads of people to help you run for president. So, not *all* altruism is equal--some has a considerable ROI when compared to other types.

AntEconomist
Male, 40-49, Eastern US
 254 Posts
Saturday, September 22, 2012 7:32:08 AM
WRT donations being tax deductable, remember that this isn't a scheme that makes the donor better off. If I donate $100 to charity and deduct it from my taxes, I pay (for example) $25 less taxes. I'm not better off by $25. I'm worse off by $75. IOW, if I were greedy I wouldn't be donating at all.

SmagBoy1
Male, 40-49, Southern US
 4159 Posts
Saturday, September 22, 2012 7:24:57 AM
As for effective tax rate, it bugs the poo out of me that I pay a higher percentage than Romney (note: I make far, far, far less than he does), but, too, that's not his fault, and I can't fault him for that.

SmagBoy1
Male, 40-49, Southern US
 4159 Posts
Saturday, September 22, 2012 7:23:32 AM
CrakrJak: The auditor addressed your concern by saying the lowest rate he ever paid was still over "13% in income taxes in each of the last 10 years".

You are right, Good Sir. I stand corrected. I still don't understand why the guy can't just release the returns. You want to be in public office, that's what you do. But, I'm not going to freak out over it. As I noted in my last post, provided it was legal (and I'm sure it was), I don't care what he paid. And, to be sure, though I didn't like it because no one else had been asked to do it, I didn't understand why Obama didn't immediately release his birth certificate. You want to serve in public life these days, you need to make that stuff public, right or wrong. So, I don't understand why he won't release his forms (except that they likely show that he's worth a HUGE boatload of money, but that shouldn't matter), but that's his right.

AntEconomist
Male, 40-49, Eastern US
 254 Posts
Saturday, September 22, 2012 7:13:30 AM
"I suppose we'll just have to disagree there. I can't make you be right."

We aren't disagreeing. You and the Congressional Budget Office are disagreeing. Including all taxes paid to the federal government, the middle quintile of Americans pay an effective rate of 14%.

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