 itzazoom
Male, 18-29, Europe
 176 Posts
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Saturday, March 24, 2012 3:54:40 PM
how many people run around with guns here and how many in the states? |
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 HiEv
Male, 40-49, Eastern US
384 Posts
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Thursday, March 22, 2012 12:34:45 AM
@McGovern1981: Yes, yes history does speak for itself.
Sadly, you aren't listening to what history really says. |
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 McGovern1981
Male, 30-39, Eastern US
10540 Posts
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Wednesday, March 21, 2012 10:36:27 AM
@piperfawn
History speaks for itself. |
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 piperfawn
Male, 30-39, Europe
3202 Posts
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Wednesday, March 21, 2012 10:16:39 AM
CrakrJak so are you suggesting me that your politicians don't establish a tyranny just cause they fear civils weapons?
What a sad way of thinking about world and humanity. |
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 Gerry1of1
Male, 50-59, Western US
26248 Posts
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Wednesday, March 21, 2012 9:59:00 AM
Our drug laws suck, but a 50 point difference in homicides does not come from crappy drug laws.
And what are all the gangs fighting over? Turf, which is cntrol of drug trade in their area. Why do people know over 7-11s? Cash for drugs made expensive by prohibition laws. etc etc etc |
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 TKD_Master
Male, 18-29, Midwest US
4827 Posts
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Wednesday, March 21, 2012 4:55:42 AM
No it definitely wasn't a gun. You see, they control their guns there, so nobody has them. Thus, it is impossible that a bad person that does not care about laws whatsoever went ahead and broke the law to acquire a gun and use it to kill people. That is absolutely impossible. |
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 CrakrJak
Male, 40-49, Midwest US
14459 Posts
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Tuesday, March 20, 2012 10:04:42 AM
Piper: If you have a gun control you have less weapons around...
Which in turn allows government tyranny to go unabated. Every dictator in the last 80 years has instituted gun control, not for public safety, but to suppress the populace.
Gun control has nothing to do with controlling crime, it's about power and who has it, the government or it's people. CCW laws have lowered crime statistics in every state, except Illinois because they've yet to abide by the Supreme Court's ruling and allow concealed carry. |
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 patchgrabber
Male, 30-39, Canada
5329 Posts
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Tuesday, March 20, 2012 8:40:18 AM
The problem is that criminals still get guns no matter how many anti-gun laws there are
Not necessarily, in my city, there are virtually no gun deaths ever. The majority of murders here are stabbings, and if a gun IS involved it's usually some rifle a kid got from his parent's farm or something. |
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 Buiadh
Male, 18-29, Europe
6651 Posts
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Tuesday, March 20, 2012 6:20:14 AM
"The problem is that criminals still get guns no matter how many anti-gun laws there are."
Not wholly true, that fact, is it? :P |
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piperfawn
Male, 30-39, Europe
3202 Posts
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Tuesday, March 20, 2012 6:10:29 AM
CrakrJak "The problem is that criminals still get guns no matter how many anti-gun laws there are."
Well so let the guns invades your country so for criminals will be a lot easier to find one.
If you have a gun control you have less weapons around = less probability for criminals to obtain one. |
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CrakrJak
Male, 40-49, Midwest US
14459 Posts
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Tuesday, March 20, 2012 4:37:39 AM
Extra: It's not a 'causal link', it's backed up by fact. Link
Be sure to look at the tables provided, It's were I got my stats. |
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 ExtraCredit
Male, 50-59, Midwest US
435 Posts
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Tuesday, March 20, 2012 2:40:00 AM
Only the NRA and their adherents have successfully established an exclusive causal link between concealed carry and reduced crime rates.
Why don't you give us the details of your statistical analysis? |
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CrakrJak
Male, 40-49, Midwest US
14459 Posts
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Tuesday, March 20, 2012 1:19:17 AM
Only one state, Illinois, does not have a concealed carry law and our crime rate here is much higher than neighboring states. Those states that have adopted concealed carry laws have seen their crime rates drop up to 50% or more after they were enacted. |
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CrakrJak
Male, 40-49, Midwest US
14459 Posts
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Tuesday, March 20, 2012 1:17:46 AM
Baal: The problem is that criminals still get guns no matter how many anti-gun laws there are.
All gun laws do is take guns away from lawful citizens and make them defenseless to burglars, rapists, thieves, kidnappers and terrorists.
Law-abiding citizens use guns to defend themselves against criminals as many as 2.5 million times every year, the overwhelming majority merely brandish their gun or fire a warning shot to scare off their attackers. Less than 8% of the time, a citizen will kill or wound his/her attacker(s).
Armed citizens kill more crooks than do the police. Citizens shoot and kill at least twice as many criminals as police do every year. Only 2 percent of civilian shootings involved an innocent person mistakenly identified as a criminal. The 'error rate' for the police, however, is 11 percent. |
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HiEv
Male, 40-49, Eastern US
384 Posts
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Monday, March 19, 2012 11:38:43 PM
@5Cats: Wow. You're still blaming the French for what happened while they were under Nazi rule around 70 years ago?!? And acting like it's still true today!?!?!? By that absurd logic, then I suppose you believe Americans are OK with Japanese internment camps?
Seriously, pull your head out of your butt. Almost all of the people to blame for that are dead today.
France is nothing like that now.
What you're spouting about the French being OK with Jew and child murder today isn't "the truth", it's bigotry. Blaming existing people for the sins of their ancestors is nonsense of the highest degree.
You should be ashamed of yourself. |
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 Draculya
Male, 30-39, Asia
6686 Posts
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Monday, March 19, 2012 10:23:22 PM
Not a big deal compared to the dying going on in Africa, but white jewish kids are worth 100,000 Africans in media gold.
Still sad though. |
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 Baalthazaq
Male, 18-29, Asia
4753 Posts
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Monday, March 19, 2012 9:06:42 PM
US gun homicide rate: 4.1
US gun suicide rate: 5.71
US gun accident rate: 0.23
France gun homicide: 0.44
France gun suicide: 5.14
France gun accident: 0.11
So... less of all 3.
Overall murder rate: US 5.0, France 1.1.
However, if you're swayed by anecdotes instead of stats:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/School_shooting#United_States">List of US shootings.
then lets look at the weapon and how they were stopped:
1: Legal gun. Police Shot.
2: Legal gun. Police caught.
3/4: No info.
5: Legal gun. Police caught.
6: Legal gun. Police caught.
7: Legal gun. Unarmed Teachers caught.
8: N/A. Suicide.
Etc.
Your ideas don't seem to be working very well. |
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 LillianDulci
Female, 18-29, Eastern US
2696 Posts
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Monday, March 19, 2012 8:33:04 PM
DS, no. Strict gun control laws may still allow really badass criminals to get guns, sure. In places with tons of crime (like Mexico due to anti-drug laws) this is going to be a huge problem. But in the USA, we have random kids who have super easy access to guns because of their parents and steal them to shoot up their schools (when otherwise they probably wouldn't have the means to get their hands on a gun). We have convicted criminals who are easily able to obtain guns. Pretty much anyone who wants a gun can get ahold of one without problem, and that does not make us safer. You might want to check out the stats some people have already posted. |
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LillianDulci
Female, 18-29, Eastern US
2696 Posts
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Monday, March 19, 2012 8:29:40 PM
aj, if there is even a single French person on this site, then I think my argument's valid. And I wouldn't be surprised if that's the case. But you still have to see the hypocrisy of whining over name calling when you go and do it yourself, even if it's to people who aren't here right now. |
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 DShephard
Male, 18-29, Midwest US
1589 Posts
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Monday, March 19, 2012 8:07:33 PM
Well, I guess this is a lesson to anti-NRA people.
Strict Gun-control Policies do not keep bad people from getting guns.
They keep Good people from getting them to defend themselves and others from the bad people who have the guns illegally. |
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 auburnjunky
Male, 30-39, Southern US
8769 Posts
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Monday, March 19, 2012 7:35:33 PM
Damnit Lillian!
Calling one person a name is PERSONAL!
Calling a whole country of people is NOT PERSONAL!
If the ENTIRE POPULATION OF FRANCE WAS ON IAB, then your point would have merit, but THEY AREN'T so IT DOESN'T!
Geez! lol |
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LillianDulci
Female, 18-29, Eastern US
2696 Posts
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Monday, March 19, 2012 7:28:15 PM
aj, I don't think it's nit picking when you had JUST said that, and contradicted yourself only a few minutes later. |
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auburnjunky
Male, 30-39, Southern US
8769 Posts
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Monday, March 19, 2012 6:47:38 PM
LillianDulci: I guess if there is a nit to pick, you'll be the one to pick it. |
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 5Cats
Male, 40-49, Canada
17458 Posts
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Monday, March 19, 2012 6:14:33 PM
@HiEv Well the truth hurts don't it?
Franc AND Vichy eagerly shipped their Jews to the death camps, didn't they?
To be fair, even the British did in the occupied Channel Islands.
In fact I think the ONLY country that didn't was Denmark... |
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HiEv
Male, 40-49, Eastern US
384 Posts
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Monday, March 19, 2012 6:00:53 PM
@5Cats: "The shooter is in real trouble! Oh not for killing Jewish children, that's OK in France! For having an unregistered firearm!!!"
Wow. You're really a horrible person.
No, killing Jews and/or children is not OK in France.
@McGovern1981: The facts prove you wrong, since France's gun control laws have demonstrate a clear improvement over the US' gun laws by their far lower per capita rate of gun violence.
Furthermore, this post demonstrates your ignorance of the worthlessness of anecdotal evidence in proving such a claim.
If you want to prove such a claim you need to use scientific evidence, not cherry-picked examples that aren't representative of the overall case.
You can't do this here though, since the facts are against you. |
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