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The Mother Of All Trojan Horses: The 2012 NDAA

Hits: 11309 | Rating: (2.8) | Category: News & Politics | Added by: Squrlz4Sale
Page: 1 2 3 Next >   Jump to: Bottom    Last Post
Male, 18-29, Southern US
 11 Posts
Sunday, January 08, 2012 12:58:15 AM
I say this stuff is overblown. The president can still remove those additions later on, right? I don't like either party but let's be straight here. This time it's the republicans who screwed us, tacking those lines in the first place.

Male, 18-29, Europe
 4278 Posts
Friday, January 06, 2012 7:22:25 AM
This and SOPA all at once. Goddamn.

Male, 40-49, Eastern US
 6018 Posts
Friday, January 06, 2012 6:28:55 AM
@Gerry: Very good point about how Obama could have used the opportunity to have ensured an election win. But I suppose (I guess?) the offending provisions might not have been in the bill in the first place if he and his administration weren't pushing for it. Then again, Lindsey Graham (the R senator from SC) seems to have really wanted to be able to take away the rights of due process from U.S. citizens accused of terrorism. So, yes, I think you're right: If Obama had been a different (and better) president, this could have been a HUGE opportunity to distinguish himself.

Male, 30-39, Europe
 649 Posts
Friday, January 06, 2012 2:43:11 AM
This is much ado about nothing. The NDAA is being completely misrepresented by paranoids and wingnuts.

Male, 13-17, Southern US
 631 Posts
Thursday, January 05, 2012 7:13:57 PM
Hopefully I can flee the country before they ban emigration. I imagine taking a raft to Cuba wouldn't be very fun.

Male, 50-59, Western US
 34670 Posts
Thursday, January 05, 2012 5:48:30 PM

The point is he did sign it. He could have veto'd it and sent Congress back to make a new one without those passages. If he spoke to the people and said "This bill burns the constitution up" He'd have guaranteed a win in November. As it is I have one word of advice for you...Emigrate.

Male, 30-39, Australia
 232 Posts
Thursday, January 05, 2012 1:53:31 PM
"It was attached to a military spending bill which forced Obama to sign it or stop the military budget, which is why he specifically said when he signed the bill that he rejected the clause about indefinite detention and he pledged his administration to it's rejection. "

That's funny, considering that his veto threat was actually that he was demanding it applies to American citizens at home, before he signs it.
Look it up.

Male, 50-59, Western US
 34670 Posts
Thursday, January 05, 2012 11:50:40 AM

I guess the'll have to reopen those interment camps americans were kept in during WWII.

There are frightening paralells between what is going on now, and 1930's Europe.

Male, 30-39, Canada
 5753 Posts
Thursday, January 05, 2012 11:28:50 AM
@5cats: I'm not debating you on this. When I said "kind of like" I was only really referring to the signing of laws, but perhaps you're correct that my comparison was a cursory one.

And the Harper gov't is no stranger to illegal tactics, especially where matters of campaign financing are concerned.

Male, 50-59, Canada
 29227 Posts
Thursday, January 05, 2012 10:36:53 AM
All he does is sign the laws, it's just a formality, kind of like your president signing laws.

Actually @Patchy: If the Governer doesn't sign a bill, he gets fired! If the US President doesn't sign, it's not law! BUT the Congress can try to pass it again with a 2/3 majority, then it IS LAW regardless of the President.

So yes, our GG is a token of respect to the past, but the PotUS has actual powers, which Obama is expanding and exploiting (illegally I might add).

Male, 50-59, Western US
 34670 Posts
Thursday, January 05, 2012 8:55:54 AM

nettech98 -
Plus you have to get "Royal Assent" for your laws. The Queen. Yup. Nice democracy you have going there....

They have a Constitutional Monarchy, not a democracy.
You do know you don't live in a democracy, don't you? ...it's a Republic. Always has been.

Now, go get a book and learn something.

Male, 40-49, Eastern US
 2078 Posts
Thursday, January 05, 2012 8:16:39 AM
somehow you morons believe this is a free country.

Male, 18-29, Europe
 812 Posts
Thursday, January 05, 2012 7:48:31 AM
What will voting do exactly if every single one of those mofo's are traitors to human rights? I don't get it.

Male, 30-39, Canada
 5753 Posts
Thursday, January 05, 2012 7:37:34 AM
Plus you have to get "Royal Assent" for your laws. The Queen. Yup. Nice democracy you have going there....

You obviously have no idea how things work in a constitutional monarchy. The Governor General is basically the Queen's representative in government, but is basically just a figurehead. All he does is sign the laws, it's just a formality, kind of like your president signing laws.

Plus, the ATA was a response to 9/11 and YOUR country's Patriot Act. So how's about you swing your judgemental pendulum the other way to find that our government, for the sake of continued good relations, takes its cues from YOUR government. So, yeah, nice democracy YOU'VE got there.

Male, 30-39, Midwest US
 126 Posts
Thursday, January 05, 2012 6:57:22 AM
Bradley Manning = traitor

Male, 40-49, Eastern US
 6465 Posts
Thursday, January 05, 2012 6:14:51 AM
Would we ever heard of Bradley Manning if NDAA was in effect at the time?

Male, 30-39, Eastern US
 932 Posts
Thursday, January 05, 2012 3:25:14 AM
@pigsnout5 Your lack of intellect astounds me yet again.

Not voting means you accept whatever you get and if that means indefinitely detained without trial to bad for you.

I will vote. Against every individual who supports this type of action. Get them out and get those who will repair the damage in.

Male, 30-39, Western US
 403 Posts
Thursday, January 05, 2012 12:38:01 AM
This kind of stuff has been happening for years.
The ruling class has always hated democracy and the constitution. It just seems that they're really coming out of the closet about it and using fear of terrorism as an excuse. kinda like locking up Japanese U.S. citizens. Many of them were born here and no one cared about they're civil liberties as us citizens because of the big pearl harbor scare. just lining up comparisons that this is kinda nothing new yet it surely is brazenly corrupt and sketchy.

Female, 18-29, Western US
 548 Posts
Thursday, January 05, 2012 12:18:04 AM
f*ck republicans. f*ck democrats. i'm not voting this year cause it doesn't matter anyways. we're all gonna blow up on 12/21/12 so who cares who becomes president!

Male, 30-39, Western US
 1406 Posts
Wednesday, January 04, 2012 11:26:22 PM
Unfortunately Congress has failed to exorcise there responsibility to deliberate over several persons clearly chargeable and most likely guilty of treason. The NDAA although technically does not remove this Constitutional responsibility from Congress it does allow them to an excuses not to act. Bottom line this is bad law and the President and Congressman who allowed this to pass are well versed in Constitutional law and knew what they were apart of and do not deserve your vote regardless of party affiliation.

Male, 60-69, Midwest US
 15860 Posts
Wednesday, January 04, 2012 10:56:54 PM
Republicans are just as bad at looking after your rights as democrats.

I never said they weren't, but at least they're not hypocritical about it.

Male, 40-49, Eastern US
 6018 Posts
Wednesday, January 04, 2012 10:19:18 PM
@Net: I think I missed the point of your last post, which is, fundamentally, appreciation for the laws and governing structure this country has. Cheers to that. It's a great system and I'm grateful for it every day. That said, I've been increasingly worried that we're moving further and further away from democracy and closer and closer toward corporatocracy, per the flag Gerry's posted.


Male, 40-49, Eastern US
 6018 Posts
Wednesday, January 04, 2012 10:08:54 PM

Mmmmmmf! ~Squrlz pries at door with a jimmy bar~

C'mon, man, open up! Stop hogging all that national health care!

Male, 40-49, Eastern US
 6018 Posts
Wednesday, January 04, 2012 9:14:19 PM
@Net: I certainly agree laws aren't perfect. Any product of man, laws included, is bound to have errors. But the provisions in the 2012 NDAA go beyond minor details, here or there; they assault the very heart of the kind of democracy that this nation likes to see itself as promoting around the world.

Or in other words: Legally, Constitutionally, this is a VERY big deal.

Frankly, this country has gone wildly out of kilter in response to 9/11. Until this mad charade of "The War on Terror" is put behind us, I don't see this country regaining equilibrium. Problem is, the War on Terror serves the ends of both politicians and war profiteers, and so they are loathe to end it.

Male, 50-59, Eastern US
 1005 Posts
Wednesday, January 04, 2012 9:03:26 PM
@poop: So just to be clear, if a US citizen left this country, joined al-Qaida, and was caught abroad and put in 'indefinite detention', you would stand up and say "That's illegal! I demand you release him from military custody, try him in a Federal Court for treason, and sentence him to death in accordance with our laws!"

OK! I'm down with that!

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