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Unintelligent Design: Could've Been A Bug Planet

Hits: 9523 | Rating: (2.2) | Category: Community & Lifestyle | Added by: bex753
Page: 1 2 3 Next >   Jump to: Bottom    Last Post
davymid
Male, 30-39, Europe
 12051 Posts
Wednesday, October 05, 2011 9:48:29 PM
Davymid: From your own link, "It is possible for wolves and coyotes to interbreed and produce fertile offspring, but wolves usually kill coyotes, a fact which displaces questions of their status as two separate species." Which means Coyotes and Wolves might not be separate species and are possibly misclassified.

You really need to read you own links before you add them to your comments.


Hold on, just caught that one. Meaning, Crakrjak, that even though they can interbreed, as one species predates on the other, "displaces questions of their status as two separate species" means that it "removes questions as to their being two different species". Displaces = removes, right?

They are clearly different species, as one species usually doesn't predate on it's own species but on others.

Jeez man, you know to twist facts and statements like a pro. You shoulda been in politics.

davymid
Male, 30-39, Europe
 12051 Posts
Wednesday, October 05, 2011 7:59:21 PM
When I argue science, it's science vs. science. When I argue theology, it's theology vs. theology

Interesting you put it that way, as Intelligent Design (i.e. Creationism) *IS* theology and is *NOT* science. It is untestable, unverifiable, experiments cannot be performed to test its validity, and it makes no predictions whatsoever, four of the cornerstones of science. Evolution on the other hand, is the very cornerstone of modern biology.

If I seem to "immediately defend the status quo, in knee-jerk fashion", I do so in the same way that I would attack a so-called chemist who spoke of the four elements of air, earth, fire and water in favour of the periodic table, or a medical practioniner who spoke of the four homours in favours of modern anatomy. Evolution is a fact, if you want to deny it to yourself and others, then that's up to you. Doesn't make it any less true.

SumRandom1
Male, 18-29, Eastern US
 795 Posts
Wednesday, October 05, 2011 10:52:53 AM
we are the only proven creature to have imagination and learning from others experience by reading something or listening to someone else story, thats why we imagined god all through history of time, and will continue to do so, from the egyptians to the scientologists, imagination will always drive the unexplained, while in reality earth will go on with or without our species......that is all

CrakrJak
Male, 40-49, Midwest US
 16906 Posts
Tuesday, October 04, 2011 11:03:56 PM
iceblack: Viruses can't 'evolve', first off viruses don't even have complete DNA, they need other cells DNA and mechanisms to replicate. Viruses may adapt, but they don't speciate, Please learn some biology before you continue to try to 'educate' someone smarter than you.

Davy: I do not 'see punctuated equilibrium as evidence of God's Creation...', As I've said before science does not limit God, who's omnipotent. When I argue science, it's science vs. science. When I argue theology, it's theology vs. theology. Problem is you see any challenge to Darwin's theory, any mention of possible intelligent design and you immediately defend the status quo, in knee-jerk fashion, as a creationist plot to somehow kill science. Scientific research should be open, free and transparent enough that it allows challenges to all it's theories, but unfortunately science only seems to advance one coffin at a time.

davymid
Male, 30-39, Europe
 12051 Posts
Monday, October 03, 2011 10:48:27 PM
iceblack, save your breath. You're trying to educate the fundamentally (pun intended) uneducatable. CJ sees punctuated equilibrium as evidence of God's Creation, Intelligent Design, Irreducible Complexity, whatever. When in fact, it's just hard evidence of evolution. Let him be.

Theyoyoguy
Male, 18-29, Western US
 463 Posts
Monday, October 03, 2011 1:26:22 PM
well that's one way to look at life. It's a good thing we humans have EMOTION and can perceive life as much more than an existence of merely reproducing and finding food. dumb ass only shows clips of animals because theyre the ones who exemplify the crude nature of life. humans are on the threshold of surpassing this and he has no decency to even acknowledge it. this man is a total pessimist/realist/atheist douchebag who is trivializing life while he yet breathes and continues to thrive and survive in our modern world where he has the drating time to sit down and have these thoughts instead of constantly worrying about being someone else's prey or not having dinner to eat

iceblack
Male, 18-29, S. America
 546 Posts
Monday, October 03, 2011 11:37:47 AM
@CrakrJak
And OMG! PLEASE UNDERSTAND what you read before you come here and say
all that nonsense! "Punctuated Speciation" or "Punctuated equilibrium",
like the Cambrian explosion, are in fact strong evidence for Darwin's
theory

It states that species evolve to adapt to their habitat, what you don't
seem to understand is that Punctuated equilibrium says species remain
non-evolutionary because the geological aspect is the same

Mutation happens, but the species is now adapted to that geological state
and that's why new mutations die and "normal" species keep living and passing
their almost-non-changing genes to the next generations

Only when there's a geological extreme event, there's a major change in
species. Like high levels of Oxygen in the Cambrian Explosion, that allowed
organisms to develop and be bigger, now that they could take much more
oxygen from the atmosphere... Really, thi

iceblack
Male, 18-29, S. America
 546 Posts
Monday, October 03, 2011 11:31:06 AM
@CrakrJak
OMFG!!!
You see it all the time! What are you talking about? Don't
you see on the news, CONSTANTLY, that viruses EVOLVE and become
immune to vaccines? That's evolution!!!

Did you know that the human skull is 10% bigger than it should
be for the baby to born naturally and not be a potential death
to the mother? That's because we now have artificial ways to get
babies to born, like caesarean section. a procedure that allows
those babies to live and pass their big-headed genes to their
offsprings

ukulelemike
Male, 40-49, Western US
 129 Posts
Monday, October 03, 2011 5:40:37 AM
These guys really sound like a couple guys having some beer at a bar talking about stuff they really don't know much about. Might as well be talking about football scores for all the sense they make.

CrakrJak
Male, 40-49, Midwest US
 16906 Posts
Monday, October 03, 2011 1:18:46 AM
iceblack: And I'm saying that speciation is not a gradual thing, if it was we would've seen it within mankind's time here on the planet.

In fact according to the fossil record speciation happens in the 'blink of an eye' geologically speaking, then slows nothing for a long time. The theory is called 'Punctuated Speciation'.

Of course this begs hundreds questions as to how and why this 'Punctuated Speciation' occurs and what triggers this through most of earth's fauna all at the same time. Look up 'Cambrian explosion' and 'Mammal explosion', they really put Darwin's gradual evolution theory in doubt.

iceblack
Male, 18-29, S. America
 546 Posts
Monday, October 03, 2011 12:18:08 AM
CrakrJak
Didn't I say that?
I just made it clear that mutations are not
big enough to make new species from one generation
to the other

Also, "Breed" is a term used for artificial breeding,
(Redundant much?), which means that it isn't used
for natural mutations-evolution, it's used for
domestic and controlled interbreeding

CrakrJak
Male, 40-49, Midwest US
 16906 Posts
Monday, October 03, 2011 12:10:07 AM
iceblack: Still at some point,adaptation or not, a gene mutation must occur to form a new species.

Without new species you do not have evolution, you just have different breeds of the same species. like the different breeds of dogs.

CrakrJak
Male, 40-49, Midwest US
 16906 Posts
Monday, October 03, 2011 12:06:51 AM
Davymid: From your own link, "It is possible for wolves and coyotes to interbreed and produce fertile offspring, but wolves usually kill coyotes, a fact which displaces questions of their status as two separate species." Which means Coyotes and Wolves might not be separate species and are possibly misclassified.

You really need to read you own links before you add them to your comments.

magoo22
Male, 30-39, Australia
 663 Posts
Sunday, October 02, 2011 8:15:42 PM
"You won't see a major mutation coming from parent to offspring in one generation only."

Yes you could, but it is highly unlikely.The reason why we're each slightly different from our parents is because we're a mixture of their DNA, and a mutation can happen in any generation.

iceblack
Male, 18-29, S. America
 546 Posts
Sunday, October 02, 2011 6:07:35 PM
@CrakrJak
Last post, because this is getting really frustrating

A new "species", which is something kinda subjective, is an animal
with a considerable mutation that can be categorized differently
from other species, even their relatives

But, for that to happen, there has to be maybe hundreds of generations
between the "first" offspring with that mutation (At a genetical and
minor level) and the specimen that has that same mutation but now slightly
visible to make a real difference

You won't see a major mutation coming from parent to offspring in one
generation only.

Steelgrid
Male, 30-39, Midwest US
 2704 Posts
Sunday, October 02, 2011 2:34:22 PM
LOL I choose you Crackr!!

Crackr uses struggle, it has no effect.

Crackr retreats into the ghost ball.

Steelgrid
Male, 30-39, Midwest US
 2704 Posts
Sunday, October 02, 2011 2:26:58 PM
"iceblack: You need to look at speciation again, once something becomes a new species through mutation it can't breed with it's former species and have offspring that are fertile.

A good example of this is that you can mate a horse and donkey to get a mule, the mule is sterile and can't breed."

And yet you can cross breed dogs all day. Through cross breeding the dogs take on the traits of the other species thus eventually creating a new offshoot species of dog.

Or did your book fail to give you that answer?

Steelgrid
Male, 30-39, Midwest US
 2704 Posts
Sunday, October 02, 2011 2:25:18 PM
"zzzzzzzzzzzz, shut up, hopefully americans will die out and do us all a fcukin favour"

Wow next time germany decides to knock on your door, we will sit back and laugh while they rape you......

Douchebag

slimofswiv
Male, 30-39, Europe
 116 Posts
Sunday, October 02, 2011 12:16:31 PM
zzzzzzzzzzzz, shut up, hopefully americans will die out and do us all a fcukin favour

davymid
Male, 30-39, Europe
 12051 Posts
Sunday, October 02, 2011 9:53:53 AM
"A good example of this is that you can mate a horse and donkey to get a mule, the mule is sterile and can't breed."

And yet, as one simple counter-example that springs immediately to mind (because I saw one last night), coyotes and wolves can interbreed despite being two entirely different species. Crakrjak, here's the Coywolf....

cola3
Male, 18-29, Eastern US
 54 Posts
Sunday, October 02, 2011 8:01:14 AM
this guy is such a douche. sure he is entitled to his opinion but everything is dumb to him. everything is beautiful. everything we have ever seen and touched and loved and lived was made from the dust of a star. you can look into the sky at night and see everything that ever was and ever will be. a predator eating a prey is beautiful. this is the only life anywhere that we know of and he writes it off as a "dumb molecule" replicating itself. and sure humans are full of hate, but humans are also full of love. he can sit in his wet diaper and whine about stupid everything is, but i dont think he really understands. we are the cosmos. the cosmos became self aware when we did. now it is time for the cosmos to appreciate and discover itself.

madduck
Female, 50-59, Europe
 5408 Posts
Sunday, October 02, 2011 7:48:29 AM
Why are we argueing evolution again. Can we just leave the ignorant idiots who are incapable of working it out alone. Most of the educated world accepts evolution- just bone heads and religious nuts who won't. They honestly are a minority- we should not give them air space except to laugh and point. Oh yes- we do....

PinkRhoid
Male, 18-29, Eastern US
 1205 Posts
Sunday, October 02, 2011 7:31:59 AM
Mutations are typically subtle changes. Most are, as you say, detrimental but as such cause the carrier to die out before the trait can be spread. Only the very rare strong mutation leaves the host better able to survive and therefore procreate thus spreading the trait. Inter-species breeding has nothing to do with genetic mutation and spreading the mutation. Only by repeated mutations and many many years are there enough changes to distinguish two blatantly separate species like horses and donkeys to which your logic would apply.

PinkRhoid
Male, 18-29, Eastern US
 1205 Posts
Sunday, October 02, 2011 7:23:59 AM
Mules aren't a mutation. They are the offspring of horses and donkeys....

PinkRhoid
Male, 18-29, Eastern US
 1205 Posts
Sunday, October 02, 2011 7:21:46 AM
Assuming the mutation occurs with a dominant gene trait it only takes passing that dominant gene to carry the mutation on and that's a 50% chance per offspring. Sorry Crakr but you're off a bit.

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