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Retired Bishop John Shelby Spong Speaks The Truth

Hits: 27751 | Rating: (3.5) | Category: Community & Lifestyle | Added by: Pooptart19
Page: 1 24 5 Next >   Jump to: Bottom    Last Post
CrakrJak
Male, 40-49, Midwest US
 16948 Posts
Thursday, September 09, 2010 12:05:00 AM
osmandias: A church is not the building, It's not the preacher, And it's not some 'big brother' control mechanism. A church is it's congregation gathering together to commune with one another.

Again, It's not about control, It's Hope, Faith, and Love. The 'control' accusation fails, Because churches have survived repression where Christianity is deemed illegal by the state.

osmandias
Male, 40-49, Europe
 206 Posts
Wednesday, September 08, 2010 11:52:35 PM
@CrakrJak: Sure, there is more than one aspect to a church. But most churches, not only the catholic in the middle ages, are more about power and control than about anything else.
Faith, hope and love are part of the christian faith.
Faith != church.

WRNKLDTITFUZ
Male, 18-29, Western US
 316 Posts
Wednesday, September 08, 2010 11:50:49 PM
A religion related post on IAB and only three pages of comments? What is going on?

AtheistAlien
Male, 30-39, Western US
 809 Posts
Wednesday, September 08, 2010 11:46:02 PM
F.U.C.K... He almost had it...

Lolboy
Male, 70 & Over, Africa
 797 Posts
Wednesday, September 08, 2010 11:34:29 PM
"I'm not their judge, We'll all have to stand before the Lord and explain ourselves one day. Only God knows what's in a person's heart, No one is pure and we've all come short of the glory of God."

QUESTION: AVOIDED

Phew, that was a close one.

entwife
Female, 18-29, Western US
 537 Posts
Wednesday, September 08, 2010 11:28:58 PM
wow. Loved the part when he said "people don't need to be 'born again'; they need to grow up." Couldn't have said it better myself.

davymid
Male, 30-39, Europe
 12071 Posts
Wednesday, September 08, 2010 11:22:12 PM
Crakr, thank you for your honest answer. As I promised, no hidden attack. Just trying to understand you more.

CrakrJak
Male, 40-49, Midwest US
 16948 Posts
Wednesday, September 08, 2010 11:19:55 PM
davymid: I believe that your question was answered with the example I gave. No one is clairvoyant and no one can look into someone's heart, But God.

What I think about a person's salvation status doesn't count. I can only testify for myself.

I believe you were 'fishing' for some kind insight into my 'thinking'. If the answer wasn't satisfying then perhaps you worded your question wrong.

If you had asked me which of them I believed to be preaching more sound 'Christian' principles, I'd have answered Cindy Jacobs.

Calderis
Male, 18-29, Western US
 328 Posts
Wednesday, September 08, 2010 11:11:41 PM
Wow, this man speaks my mind far better than I could ever try.

I'll have to look up some of his stuff.

OldSmelly
Male, 30-39, Europe
 22 Posts
Wednesday, September 08, 2010 11:06:38 PM
The idea of Hell, modern terms, came from Dantes Inferno and then became common place in Christianity. Hell, from what I can work out, means "grave"- Sheol in Hebrew and Hades in "Greek".

http://freetruth.50webs.org/B1a.htm

davymid
Male, 30-39, Europe
 12071 Posts
Wednesday, September 08, 2010 10:50:54 PM
davymid: I'm not their judge, We'll all have to stand before the Lord and explain ourselves one day.

Yeah, figured you would resort to that. Still, worth the effort of asking what YOU thought. Never mind, maybe next time. Disappointing.

CrakrJak
Male, 40-49, Midwest US
 16948 Posts
Wednesday, September 08, 2010 10:46:54 PM
davymid: I'm not their judge, We'll all have to stand before the Lord and explain ourselves one day. Only God knows what's in a person's heart, No one is pure and we've all come short of the glory of God.

This is akin to the question of, "If Hitler was a saved 'Christian', Would he go to heaven?".

If you believe that Jesus' death paid the debt for everyone's sins, If only they believe, Then you have to say Yes, Even though it seems abhorrent. BTW, I don't believe Hitler was a Christian, So don't go bashing me. It was just a theoretical question.

hi2pi
Male, 30-39, Canada
 738 Posts
Wednesday, September 08, 2010 10:43:03 PM
A Deist, to be accurate.
Spong has always rocked.
Bravo!

EdiMesic
Male, 18-29, Europe
 599 Posts
Wednesday, September 08, 2010 10:32:10 PM
Whoa. This is exactly how I view life and religion.
Can't believe a..priest? Would ever share the same
opinion/way of thinking.

skine
Male, 18-29, Eastern US
 724 Posts
Wednesday, September 08, 2010 10:28:38 PM
I'll fully admit that not all theists are crazy, fundamental and literalist. In fact, most are reasonable people.

However, that doesn't make me believe theism holds any water.

PhantasmFork
Male, 18-29, Midwest US
 169 Posts
Wednesday, September 08, 2010 10:16:22 PM
Eh, I'm hungry.

sleepyjoey
Male, 18-29, Western US
 123 Posts
Wednesday, September 08, 2010 10:01:04 PM
Loved it

davymid
Male, 30-39, Europe
 12071 Posts
Wednesday, September 08, 2010 10:00:01 PM
davymid: After doing a little research on Spong, I've found he's been a radical since the 1960's , He's ordained homosexual priests

Really now? Wow. Ordaining homosexual priests.

Let me ask you a blunt black-and-white question Crakr, though I don't expect an actual direct black-and-white response.

Who do you think is the more likely to go to Heaven? Spong here or Cindy Jacobs further down this first page of links? I'd be very interested in your answer (not a loaded question, no ambush, just looking for an honest answer).

Ogen
Male, 18-29, Western US
 445 Posts
Wednesday, September 08, 2010 9:54:01 PM
@dax2009 he isn't a hypocrite... you just don't understand his beliefs.

CrakrJak
Male, 40-49, Midwest US
 16948 Posts
Wednesday, September 08, 2010 9:46:31 PM
davymid: After doing a little research on Spong, I've found he's been a radical since the 1960's , He's ordained homosexual priests and been a 'pain in the rear' to the Episcopal church for decades.
He has said that Mary was raped, Jesus never rose, and there are no miracles, That's not Christian at all. To even call him a 'theist' is a spurious claim at best.

CrakrJak
Male, 40-49, Midwest US
 16948 Posts
Wednesday, September 08, 2010 9:40:07 PM
Siyanor: Please go troll elsewhere, Your vapidness won't score you points here.

davymid
Male, 30-39, Europe
 12071 Posts
Wednesday, September 08, 2010 9:38:16 PM
Ah well, nice try pooptart with this submitted post. I for one was hopeful that it might reconcile the atheists and theists on this site, to find some middle ground. I guess I was too optimistic.

Also interesting to note that the some are calling Crakrjak (a Christian) a hypocrite, while the Christians are calling Dr. Spong a hypocrite. Just as in religion, you can't ALL be right...

And finally;

Crakrjak said: Most posts here exhibit the extremes when it comes to religion, Spong being one of them, The WBC being the other.

Dude, this man appears to be many things. Thought-provoking, innovative in his world-view as a theist, humble, tolerant... I would hardly use the word "extremist" in any description for this guy. Just saying.

raikun12
Male, 18-29, Midwest US
 580 Posts
Wednesday, September 08, 2010 9:34:41 PM
hypocrite.

dax2009
Female, 50-59, Midwest US
 322 Posts
Wednesday, September 08, 2010 8:59:06 PM
What I don't understand is why someone stays as a leader or member of a church when they don't believe what the church teaches. He falls under "hyphocrit".* (tried spelling that 12 different ways, finally gave up)

Wizard77
Male, 40-49, Western US
 582 Posts
Wednesday, September 08, 2010 8:50:37 PM
CJ isn't "full of hate" and I find it funny that those bashing him are all about "tolerance" of others.

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