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Date: 03/07/14 06:46 AM

85 Responses to Dear USA, Keep Your Hands In Your Pocket [Pic]

  1. Profile photo of CreamK
    CreamK Male 40-49
    1423 posts
    March 7, 2014 at 6:11 am
    Link: Dear USA, Keep Your Hands In Your Pocket - You are NOT the World Police.
  2. Profile photo of BoredFrank
    BoredFrank Male 40-49
    2340 posts
    March 7, 2014 at 6:49 am
    All the Americans I know actually agree with this.
  3. Profile photo of Andrew155
    Andrew155 Male 18-29
    2579 posts
    March 7, 2014 at 6:55 am
    That`s fine. But if it didn`t happen, then Serbia would be much bigger and Bosniaks wouldn`t exist. And we`re already living in a world where Russia can just invade other European countries and chop of pieces off of them without any repercussions. By 2020, China`s military budget will be larger than ours. They`ll be able to do wtf they want.

    Also - British and Canadian foreign policy is pretty joined at the hip with us.
  4. Profile photo of Gerry1of1
    Gerry1of1 Male 50-59
    36689 posts
    March 7, 2014 at 6:55 am

    The citizens of USA agree. It`s the evil Seth Lords that have taken over the Republic that want to dominate the galax.... the world.
  5. Profile photo of Andrew155
    Andrew155 Male 18-29
    2579 posts
    March 7, 2014 at 6:56 am
    Just read up on the Democratic Peace Theory and Pax Americana guys. Because that era is coming to an end.
  6. Profile photo of dang007
    dang007 Male 30-39
    596 posts
    March 7, 2014 at 7:19 am
    That why you all speak German in Europe right?
  7. Profile photo of HolyGod
    HolyGod Male 30-39
    6776 posts
    March 7, 2014 at 7:32 am
    Have you watched FOX News lately? If you haven`t, let me give you a recap. Our president is the biggest p.ussy in the history of the world because he isn`t nuking moscow right now.
  8. Profile photo of Andrew155
    Andrew155 Male 18-29
    2579 posts
    March 7, 2014 at 7:38 am
    They`re not really saying that, HolyGod. Actually, CNN has been hammering him pretty damn badly. Stop having the Fox hernia, that`s a Jon Stewart thing. The issue is about Crimea, not some cable news station.
  9. Profile photo of kitteh9lives
    kitteh9lives Female 70 & Over
    8044 posts
    March 7, 2014 at 7:41 am
    Gerry, which `Seth` lord do you mean?






    Drinking already? Pour me one.
  10. Profile photo of HolyGod
    HolyGod Male 30-39
    6776 posts
    March 7, 2014 at 7:46 am
    Andrew155

    "They`re not really saying that, HolyGod. Actually, CNN has been hammering him pretty damn badly. Stop having the Fox hernia, that`s a Jon Stewart thing. The issue is about Crimea, not some cable news station."

    BULLS.HIT.

    I`ve watched them. They`ve played clips of McConnel, McCain, Graham condemning him nonstop interspersed with round table discussions about how weak and indecisive he is and how the rest of the world has lost respect for us.
  11. Profile photo of Darkalen
    Darkalen Male 40-49
    411 posts
    March 7, 2014 at 8:05 am
    Ok...Rest of World: please stop asking (and then begging and then demanding) the US (taxpayers) for money every time a natural disaster or self-imposed famine happens. Then you can call it even. The US could take out all the international McDonalds as an added bonus.
  12. Profile photo of QueenZira
    QueenZira Female 18-29
    2228 posts
    March 7, 2014 at 8:22 am
    Don`t get me wrong, I`m no Neocon thug, I don`t believe in "Preemptive war" or any other such inanity but then something global happens and our input is actually needed- "Why`d you take your eye off the ball big guy? Little help here?!"

    Damned if you do, damned if you don`t. Lose lose situation.
  13. Profile photo of Smoothjc1
    Smoothjc1 Male 50-59
    260 posts
    March 7, 2014 at 8:51 am
    Well stated.
  14. Profile photo of Musuko42
    Musuko42 Male 18-29
    2850 posts
    March 7, 2014 at 8:55 am
    @Darkalen

    "Ok...Rest of World: please stop asking (and then begging and then demanding) the US (taxpayers) for money every time a natural disaster or self-imposed famine happens."

    Begging I can see, because when a hurricane has smashed your country or a faminine is starving your people, you`ll beg.

    But demanding?

    Can you provide evidence of one occurance of a country demanding the USA help them? Because that`s a pretty big accusation you`re making if it`s just being pulled out of your arse.
  15. Profile photo of Smoothjc1
    Smoothjc1 Male 50-59
    260 posts
    March 7, 2014 at 8:59 am
    @holygod, You are not actually saying the U.S. should use nukes, Do you? what kind of moron would set off a nuke in this day and age ? Forget it I already know! You bible thumpers just don`t know when to quit.
  16. Profile photo of drawman61
    drawman61 Male 50-59
    7740 posts
    March 7, 2014 at 9:30 am
    Andrew155-By 2020, China`s military budget will be larger than ours. They`ll be able to do wtf they want.

    Like you, you mean?
  17. Profile photo of QueenZira
    QueenZira Female 18-29
    2228 posts
    March 7, 2014 at 9:33 am
    Smoothjc, dude HG`s an atheist number 1. Not even in the ballpark.

    Musuko, from what era? Germany (or at least the Western half of it) was pretty adamant about US help against the Soviets.
  18. Profile photo of HolyGod
    HolyGod Male 30-39
    6776 posts
    March 7, 2014 at 9:35 am
    smoothjc1

    "@holygod, You are not actually saying the U.S. should use nukes, Do you?"

    Well the hyperbole went over your head, so I will clarify. No. I was insinuating what the hawks at FOX News are saying.

    "You bible thumpers"

    I`m actually the opposite. That is a picture of my lord and savior Zeus.
  19. Profile photo of DavidXJ
    DavidXJ Male 30-39
    1106 posts
    March 7, 2014 at 9:35 am
    Ok, then dear rest of the world: Then never, ever chide us about how much/little we donate to the rest of the world. Never ask us to help with anything, ever again. And for the love of Christ, get your God forsake FEMA and Article 21 "one world government" crap out of the USA.

    If this is how you feel, please go suck it,

    Sincerely,

    The USA.
  20. Profile photo of pmarren
    pmarren Male 40-49
    4575 posts
    March 7, 2014 at 9:40 am
    Dear Rest of the World,

    We are sorry. We don`t like it either. It`s our government; which rarely does anything the working people of the United States wants. They pull this sh*t all the time. Oh yes, I know, we elected them. That`s because the smart people of this country are too busy working at real jobs, therefore the government jobs, like president, secretary of state, etc.. are left to filled with the stupidest people in the country. McDonald`s didn`t need another fry guy, so we made him president. Sorry about that.

    - The People of the United States
  21. Profile photo of pmarren
    pmarren Male 40-49
    4575 posts
    March 7, 2014 at 9:44 am
    I should apologize to the fry guy at McDonald`s... I didn`t mean to belittle you, Mr. Fry Guy, by comparing you to the president. We definitely value you and your work over his.
  22. Profile photo of QueenZira
    QueenZira Female 18-29
    2228 posts
    March 7, 2014 at 9:45 am
    Welp, with Davidxj`s entry into the conversation I guess we`re gonna hafta start passing out the galvanized tin foil. *Facepalm heard round the world*
  23. Profile photo of LandoGriffin
    LandoGriffin Male 30-39
    3844 posts
    March 7, 2014 at 10:11 am
    @Musuko42 Can you provide evidence of one occurance of a country demanding the USA help them?

    Colombia.

    The FARC (Fuerzas Armadas Revolucionarias de Colombia), funded by drug lords, has more manpower, more weapons, more training, more money, etc than the actual Colombian government. They also kidnap anyone wealthy and demand huge ransoms, and kill a lot of people, especially elected government officials and police officers.

    The law-abiding Colombian people and their lawfully elected government were VERY glad to receive the U.S. military support that they requested. And, in case you are one of those conspiracy nuts who think the CIA assassinated Pablo Escobar, it was the Colombian National Police who shot him.
  24. Profile photo of CreamK
    CreamK Male 40-49
    1423 posts
    March 7, 2014 at 10:28 am
    Don`t think for one second that USA is the only country giving out help to other nations. I think that`s just one part of our modern idea of humanism. You can`t pay anything with that, it`s good will. If you are giving out help only so you can gain from that, it`s not free anymore, it`s a form of business contract.

    I don`t have to thank you forever for WWII do i? You didn`t do it alone, you`re influence turned the tides more firmly towards allied. Or i should say: you had nothing to do with it, your grandparents did. Or their parents.. See how old that thing in history was?

    NATO is not USA, allthou it almost could be. Again, you weren`t in Serbia alone, were you? It`s like USA is the only carrying it`s responsibility and thus can do what it wants and everyone has to listen. Oh, now i hope you`ll ratify TPP, it almost sounds like justice at this point. Actually, not, since we have to also pay for your mistakes in the form of global recessions when you mess up.
  25. Profile photo of CreamK
    CreamK Male 40-49
    1423 posts
    March 7, 2014 at 10:31 am
    To recap: USA is not the planet. It has a decent portion of it in it`s control.
  26. Profile photo of Musuko42
    Musuko42 Male 18-29
    2850 posts
    March 7, 2014 at 10:36 am
    @QueenZira

    "Germany (or at least the Western half of it) was pretty adamant about US help against the Soviets."

    But did they ask, or demand? Darkalen is accusing the rest of the world of demanding the US help, which is a pretty big accusation, and very different from saying the world asks for the US`s help.
  27. Profile photo of Musuko42
    Musuko42 Male 18-29
    2850 posts
    March 7, 2014 at 10:37 am
    @LandoGriffin

    "The law-abiding Colombian people and their lawfully elected government were VERY glad to receive the U.S. military support that they requested."

    "Requested" is not "demanded". I asked for evidence of situations where countries have demanded, not requested, US help. "Demanded" was the word Darkalen used.
  28. Profile photo of Fwoggie2
    Fwoggie2 Male 30-39
    1803 posts
    March 7, 2014 at 10:49 am

  29. Profile photo of auburnjunky
    auburnjunky Male 30-39
    10339 posts
    March 7, 2014 at 10:50 am
    Rest of world: Please help us defeat this maniacal tyrant bent on destroying our way of life!

    USA: Nope. Not until you say please.
  30. Profile photo of QueenZira
    QueenZira Female 18-29
    2228 posts
    March 7, 2014 at 11:02 am
    Well considering they didn`t want to become a Soviet satellite and lose their democracy and human rights, yes they demanded. But lets not dwell on semantics shall we?

    Fact of the matter is we`re the last Superpower, and it`s both unrealistic and impractical for us to totally withdraw from global concerns in what is a very small, interconnected and interdependent world. Permanent place on the UN security council has great weight. Now I`ll grant you we should use our influence responsibly and justly and we haven`t always done that, but whining and crying because we have such influence in the first place just because, isn`t going to get you anywhere meaningful.
  31. Profile photo of HolyGod
    HolyGod Male 30-39
    6776 posts
    March 7, 2014 at 11:06 am
    AJ

    "USA: Nope. Not until you say please."

    Wait. In your example they DID say "please".
  32. Profile photo of HolyGod
    HolyGod Male 30-39
    6776 posts
    March 7, 2014 at 11:09 am
    pmarren

    "therefore the government jobs, like president, secretary of state, etc.. are left to filled with the stupidest people in the country."

    Yes. The guy who graduated Magna Cum Laude from Harvard Law School is one of the stupidest people in the country.

    *eye roll*
  33. Profile photo of Gerry1of1
    Gerry1of1 Male 50-59
    36689 posts
    March 7, 2014 at 11:19 am

    I`m not sure we want to take on Russia.

  34. Profile photo of LordJim
    LordJim Male 60-69
    6961 posts
    March 7, 2014 at 12:01 pm
    American isolationism was and is a terrible idea. Unfortunately, pretty much since 9/11 US foreign policy has been mostly crisis management.

  35. Profile photo of turdburglar
    turdburglar Male 30-39
    4896 posts
    March 7, 2014 at 2:28 pm

    Rest of the world - Make us.

    Creamk - Last time we left you arrogant pricks alone you started ww1 and 2. I know you like to pretend like you had it under control, but that`s b.s.
    If it weren`t for us, you would be goose-stepping your way to the nearest gas chamber.

    Besides, we would love to leave you all to your arrogance. Our govt. has a mind of its own.
  36. Profile photo of xCANDACEx
    xCANDACEx Female 30-39
    283 posts
    March 7, 2014 at 2:40 pm
    I prefer think of us as the super heroes of the world.
  37. Profile photo of piperfawn
    piperfawn Male 30-39
    4911 posts
    March 7, 2014 at 3:12 pm
    turdburglar i would like to remember you that Nazists were defeated by Russians,when Americans armies enterd Berlin that city was allready conquered by Russians and Hitler was allready dead, nazism was allready finished.
  38. Profile photo of Grendel
    Grendel Male 40-49
    6171 posts
    March 7, 2014 at 3:36 pm
    HolyGod-about how weak and indecisive he is and how the rest of the world has lost respect for us.
    Soooo...basically telling it like it is....

    piperfawn-Nazists were defeated by Russians,when Americans armies enterd Berlin that city was allready conquered by Russians
    Except that the WEE fact that the Russians were ALLOWED into Berlin first as part an agreement between Roosevelt, Churchill & Stalin at Yalta. The American forces were actually ready to take Berlin, but had to halt and let the Red Army THROUGH it`s ranks so it could get there first for political reasons.
  39. Profile photo of richanddead
    richanddead Male 18-29
    3489 posts
    March 7, 2014 at 3:45 pm
    @MeGrendel: to add to what you said, we also had to lend Russia the supplies necessary on an industrial scale just to make it possible for the Russians to be effective.
  40. Profile photo of piperfawn
    piperfawn Male 30-39
    4911 posts
    March 7, 2014 at 3:53 pm
    MeGrendel Oh really? Do you know that Roosvelt died the 12 of April! And the Russians have entered the city the 2 of May. Can you explain how is possible that a dead man have done an agreement since he was...DEAD!
  41. Profile photo of HolyGod
    HolyGod Male 30-39
    6776 posts
    March 7, 2014 at 4:02 pm
    MeGrendel

    "Soooo...basically telling it like it is.... "

    You know how f.ucked he is though right?

    When it is NSA wiretapping, or syria, or drone strikes, or anything else Bush did you guys complain.

    However, if he tries diplomacy or avoids action he`s a p.ussy.

    What EXACTLY is it that would make you guys happy? Oh ya, absolutely NOTHING.
  42. Profile photo of piperfawn
    piperfawn Male 30-39
    4911 posts
    March 7, 2014 at 4:06 pm
    Oh and the fact that Red Army is passed through the american forces is pure B.S. Rusians have entered berlin from East,North East and South while american armies were far and still aproaching from west,south west.
  43. Profile photo of Grendel
    Grendel Male 40-49
    6171 posts
    March 7, 2014 at 4:16 pm
    piperfawn-Do you know that Roosvelt died the 12 of April! And the Russians have entered the city the 2 of May
    *sigh*
    Please note; I said an agreement between Roosevelt, Churchill & Stalin at Yalta
    Yalta Conference: February 4-11, 1945.

    piperfawn-Can you explain how is possible that a dead man have done an agreement
    At a conference that he attended 2 months before he died, maybe?

    Does he look dead here?
  44. Profile photo of piperfawn
    piperfawn Male 30-39
    4911 posts
    March 7, 2014 at 4:19 pm
    Nearly dead i would say, anyway you have the text in wich they delivered what you are presuming?
  45. Profile photo of piperfawn
    piperfawn Male 30-39
    4911 posts
    March 7, 2014 at 4:24 pm
    Reading the points of Yalta agreements i can`t find any decision about the invasion of Berlin. I can only read decisions about what to do after the end of war.
  46. Profile photo of piperfawn
    piperfawn Male 30-39
    4911 posts
    March 7, 2014 at 4:30 pm
    Yalta Conference. No sign of your presumption.
  47. Profile photo of Grendel
    Grendel Male 40-49
    6171 posts
    March 7, 2014 at 4:30 pm
    Here`s the conclusion of Forrest C. Pogue, Director, George C. Marshall Research Center. Ph.D. in history, Clark University, author of The Supreme Command: United Staes Army in World War II.

    Chapter 22: The Decision To Halt at the Elbe

    The decision to halt Allied troops short of Berlin and Prague had been severely criticized both in Europe and the United States on political grounds. It is argued that Churchill was right in suggesting that we proceed as far as possible into Germany in order to strengthen our hands for later negotiations with the Russians.
  48. Profile photo of piperfawn
    piperfawn Male 30-39
    4911 posts
    March 7, 2014 at 4:35 pm
    Your last post don`t tell in any way that this decision was maded at Yalta. The english and americans can have decided that before Yalta without the presence of Stalin. Anyway this don`t change the truth, Russian Armies have conquered Berlin and have defeated the Nazism.
  49. Profile photo of Grendel
    Grendel Male 40-49
    6171 posts
    March 7, 2014 at 4:41 pm
    piperfawn-Yalta Conference. No sign of your presumption.
    Could I suggest for you a course in Reading Comprehension.

    I didn`t say it was THE agreement at the Yalta Conference. I said it was AN agreement between Roosevelt, Churchill & Stalin at Yalta.

    Roosevelt wanted Russia to capture Berlin for political purposes. Churchill went alone because he thought the cost in British lives would be too high. General Eisenhower agreed, but the British Commanders wanted to go ahead and attack Berlin. They were unhappy letting Russia have Berlin.
  50. Profile photo of piperfawn
    piperfawn Male 30-39
    4911 posts
    March 7, 2014 at 4:53 pm
    Being unhappy of something don`t mean they have leaved as a gift to russians to enter Berlin. Facts are more effective than wishes or discussions during a war. And the facts tell us that Berlin was conquered by Russians and Nazism was defeated by Russians, i don`t think that Hitler was defeated by the wishes of some British Commander. And what about the b.s you say of Russians Armies passing through Americans Armies?
  51. Profile photo of Grendel
    Grendel Male 40-49
    6171 posts
    March 7, 2014 at 4:58 pm
    piperfawn-Russian Armies have conquered Berlin
    I didn`t say the didn`t. I just demonstrated that they were allowed to.

    piperfawn-and have defeated the Nazism.
    Yes, all by their widdle lonesome.

    You probably think the Russians decision to declare war on Japan 3 days after the bombing of Hiroshima (which was on the day of the bombing of Nagasaki and less than a week before Japan`s surrender) means the Russians defeated the Japanese single-handedly, Right?
  52. Profile photo of piperfawn
    piperfawn Male 30-39
    4911 posts
    March 7, 2014 at 5:02 pm
    I never said that.
    In fact i am sayng that Americans didn`t win anything in Europe during the WW2. They have won in Asia with the use of nuclear bombs.
  53. Profile photo of QueenZira
    QueenZira Female 18-29
    2228 posts
    March 7, 2014 at 5:06 pm
    Piper for someone who lives so close to where all the action actually happened you`re awfully clueless about that history.

    Allied forces let Russia fight for Berlin because we`d already decided to split control of it afterwards and Russia had the biggest hate on for their *former ally* than anybody else. They also had more bullet catchers than anybody else, and they took it at great cost too.

    Don`t kid yourself that Russia was a forgiving finisher or a merciful governor afterwards either...
  54. Profile photo of piperfawn
    piperfawn Male 30-39
    4911 posts
    March 7, 2014 at 5:07 pm
    Anyway all this discussion start cause turdburglar says "If it weren`t for us, you would be goose-stepping your way to the nearest gas chamber." I just pointed the fact that history is maded by real facts not by opinions.
  55. Profile photo of QueenZira
    QueenZira Female 18-29
    2228 posts
    March 7, 2014 at 5:12 pm
    As for Americans not "winning anything in Europe" I beg to differ, D Day was kinda of a HUGE deal, the Battle of the Bulge was kindova BIG deal too. Pity I can`t say the same for Italia eh? AKA "The Soft Underbelly"...
  56. Profile photo of piperfawn
    piperfawn Male 30-39
    4911 posts
    March 7, 2014 at 5:16 pm
    QueenZira maybe this is the history that you study in USA (were seems that your country was so kind to let the others conquer the capital of the principal enemy), maybe you should care to study the history that is studied in Russia or in other parts of the world. At the end of all what really matters in history are the real actions and the real facts, not the partisans deductions or some biased lucubrations.Everyone want to bring grist to his mill,you know?
  57. Profile photo of QueenZira
    QueenZira Female 18-29
    2228 posts
    March 7, 2014 at 5:18 pm
    Coming from someone who treats Yalta as though it were it some opium dream and not settled history, that warning rings a little hollow...
  58. Profile photo of CaptKangaroo
    CaptKangaroo Male 50-59
    2343 posts
    March 7, 2014 at 5:19 pm
    The world hates us when we interfere, the world hates us when we don`t- In the long run, we can save a lot of American lives, money and effort if we just mind our own business.
  59. Profile photo of piperfawn
    piperfawn Male 30-39
    4911 posts
    March 7, 2014 at 5:28 pm
    QueenZira is so hard to talk with you cause you seem to don`t read. I never sayd that Yalta was an opium dream,i just stated that what MeGrendel says was decided in Yalta is not true. What was decided in Yalta is a fact and is a real document,what MeGredel says cannot be found in that document and it`s only his idea.
  60. Profile photo of JadesDitoyr
    JadesDitoyr Male 18-29
    841 posts
    March 7, 2014 at 5:44 pm
    Piper, is it your contention that - without US involvement in Europe - Hitler would have been defeated?
  61. Profile photo of piperfawn
    piperfawn Male 30-39
    4911 posts
    March 7, 2014 at 5:48 pm
    JadesDitoyr history is not maded by assumptions. I can`t answer sorry.
  62. Profile photo of Gypsybard
    Gypsybard Male 40-49
    97 posts
    March 7, 2014 at 6:03 pm
    "Piper, is it your contention that - without US involvement in Europe - Hitler would have been defeated?"

    No one is saying that. No one could possibly say one way or another what possible outcome would have surfaced. The US did a great deal in WWII...from jungle campaigns to European fighting to the A-Bomb...

    Remember, though, that Hitler`s turn for the worse came in Russia.

    Additionally, there is a difference between allying ones` country in a World War conflict and attempting to police the world and force your values and ideals on other cultures whilst reaping economic benefits.
  63. Profile photo of richanddead
    richanddead Male 18-29
    3489 posts
    March 7, 2014 at 6:43 pm
    @piperfawn: I`ve had teachers from the USA, Africa and Europe who taught my foreign military intervention classes. None of them would agree with you, it isn`t a US only view.

    We allowed the Russians to take Berlin so that we could use their support against Japan. When it was purely the germans vs. the russians the germans smacked the russians all the way back to moscow, if it wasn`t for the winter and Hitler not sending coats, there might not even be a russia today.

    Despite that, the russians didn`t have the trains or trucks to continue their war effort. The US had to supply the red army with the 2000 trains since russia only had 92 outdated barely running trains with a massive shortage of rail cars and bombed out railroads. We also sent thousands of trucks to move their troops, supplies, and enable them to continue manufacturing their arms. At the end of the war, 2/3rds of the truck strength of the Red Army was entirely U.S. built.
  64. Profile photo of richanddead
    richanddead Male 18-29
    3489 posts
    March 7, 2014 at 6:44 pm
    Dear Europe,

    We`ll stop policing the world when the world stops asking for our money, our military power, our resources, and our influence.

    Until then, he who pays the piper calls the tune.
  65. Profile photo of JadesDitoyr
    JadesDitoyr Male 18-29
    841 posts
    March 7, 2014 at 7:35 pm
    @Gypsebard
    Piper said that the US won nothing in Europe, and he *appears* to be arguing that it was all Russia.

    While I am willing to admit that, without Russia`s involvement, it would have taken much longer, with much more death on both sides, for WWII to end in favor of the Allies. (Without Russia, we probably would have just dropped a bomb or two on Germany.)

    Without US involvement, I do not see the victory condition. Russia had infantry - which does peachy against machine guns and planes. Germany could not take land from Russian hands easily, too much blood mixed in the snow to pay for each inch. But defending against the horde... that is a different story.

    When your troops aren`t divided.

    Russia took out the Germans. The US made it drastically easier - if not possible.
  66. Profile photo of Angilion
    Angilion Male 40-49
    12387 posts
    March 7, 2014 at 7:42 pm
    As for Americans not "winning anything in Europe" I beg to differ, D Day was kinda of a HUGE deal

    Less than half of the Allied soldiers who fought in D-Day were from the USA.

    More generally:

    There`s too much tendency towards "everything bad is the USA`s fault" or "everything good/noble/heroic/etc is due to the USA, which does everything alone and saves the world every day and twice on Saturdays, purely out of superhuman altruism."

    As for the OP, a country`s job is itself but that is not limited to its own borders. Absolute isolationism is impossible.
  67. Profile photo of QueenZira
    QueenZira Female 18-29
    2228 posts
    March 7, 2014 at 7:50 pm
    V Why yes, I`ve heard quite a few of them were even (whispers) *Canadian*. *Finger to lips* Shush or we`ll awaken their weaponized congeniality and pleasantness...
  68. Profile photo of Angilion
    Angilion Male 40-49
    12387 posts
    March 7, 2014 at 7:52 pm
    And the facts tell us that Berlin was conquered by Russians and Nazism was defeated by Russians

    No, they don`t. They tell us that Nazism was defeated by an alliance. I doubt if any 2 of the big 3 allies would have defeated Nazism and I`m almost certain none of them could have done it alone.

    I`m talking about after Nazism became so powerful, obviously. France could have defeated Nazism by itself if it had gone to war at what was in retrospect the right time - the remilitarisation of the Rhineland.
  69. Profile photo of Gypsybard
    Gypsybard Male 40-49
    97 posts
    March 7, 2014 at 7:52 pm
    Yes, D-Day was a huge, multi-national deal and far too many Americans paid the ultimate price so that we may enjoy the freedoms we do today. That is without question.

    My point is simply this:
    No one can, with any degree of certainty, say what would have happened one way or another. Each country, each person was as important as the rest.

    However, irrespective of what was done during the crisis of a World War, it does not translate in to a country, any country, being entitled to force their agenda on any other country, let alone the rest of the world.
  70. Profile photo of Draculya
    Draculya Male 40-49
    14626 posts
    March 7, 2014 at 8:37 pm
    Amen to OP
  71. Profile photo of JadesDitoyr
    JadesDitoyr Male 18-29
    841 posts
    March 7, 2014 at 8:51 pm
    While we are not entitled to be the policemen of the world - we are often looked at to do the job. Without the US` overzealous willingness to leap into battle, the UN has no teeth - and thus no nation need fear its sanctions.

    Somebody has to be able to sound the drums of war when evil rises up. I pray that we never have to, but I pray that when we do we will have the strength.
  72. Profile photo of piratefish
    piratefish Male 40-49
    675 posts
    March 7, 2014 at 9:09 pm
    The US funded the Allies and the USSR long before it actually entered the war; it was the "Arsenal of Democracy" that allowed the UK to stay in the fight until the US entered it. At the end of the war, the US was the only super power, and it literally kept the world`s economy from complete collapse.

    We can speculate about the outcome without the US, but one fact is remarkably clear (if not in hindsight only): Hitler sabotaged Germany`s success on multiple occasions by 1) stopping the battle for Britain literally a couple of weeks too early 2) starting Barbarossa later than intended (to bail out Italy, again) 3) diverting Army Group Center from Moscow to help take the Caucasus, and 4) opening a war on 2 fronts by declaring war on the US.

    Many historians agree it was a combination of the US entry into the war, and a series of blunders by Hitler that cost Germany the war. Still, the US entry pretty much sealed Germany`s fate, regardless.
  73. Profile photo of Gypsybard
    Gypsybard Male 40-49
    97 posts
    March 7, 2014 at 9:12 pm
    Piratefish:

    True. Absolutely.

    Again, though, WWII was only brought into conversation because it was used as an argument as to why the US feels entitled to be the world`s police force.

    And Jades:
    Though it is a nice sentiment, most of the rest of the world does, indeed NOT look to the US to be the mighty hero that saves the day.
    If it were true that we simply went out to right injustice where injustice is being done, we would have troops in Haiti, the Congo, Cambodia, Burma, Angola...the list goes on.

    Where it may be that the U.N. has no teeth, the U.S. has made it a policy to never to bare their teeth unless there is a clear line of profit for doing so.
  74. Profile photo of OldOllie
    OldOllie Male 60-69
    15841 posts
    March 7, 2014 at 10:26 pm
    Here`s a short quiz for all you non-Anerican I-A-B`ers.

    If the United States had decided 100 years ago to keep our hands to ourselves and not get involved in other people`s problems, what language would you be speaking today?

    A. German
    B. Russian
    C. Japanese

    (Sorry, but those are your only choices.)
  75. Profile photo of Gypsybard
    Gypsybard Male 40-49
    97 posts
    March 7, 2014 at 11:03 pm
    Seriously...

    Are the the Americans commenting here so wrapped up in the past history of wars...world wars, cold wars, police actions...wars that a good deal of the rest of the world were also involved in that you are actually standing behind current foreign policy?

    Why is it that the current incarnation of this superman-hero-policeman is only interested in lending a hand in places that are rich in gold or oil or strategic shipping lanes? If there is so very much good emanating from the US foreign policy and defense departments, why are atrocities still being allowed in countries where there is no treasure to plunder?

    Celebrate the past...it is well earned. But, question the present. For pity`s sake, question the present, as it is embarrassing and it is wrong.
  76. Profile photo of Sleepyhallow
    Sleepyhallow Male 50-59
    1983 posts
    March 8, 2014 at 1:31 am
    It`s one thing to respond when requested and a completely *other* thing when we stick our noses in uninvited.

    There is a HUGE difference between "Helping" and "Dictating Terms" and only a myopic, single digit IQ, Imperial capitalist would not see that.
  77. Profile photo of CrakrJak
    CrakrJak Male 40-49
    17514 posts
    March 8, 2014 at 3:50 am
    These people complaining about US interventions should bite their tongue. Because when Russia, China or some other tyrant decides to invade their country, who do they come begging to? That`s right, America.
  78. Profile photo of piperfawn
    piperfawn Male 30-39
    4911 posts
    March 8, 2014 at 4:51 am
    CrakrJak when what you suppose will happen be sure that USA will be allready invaded.
  79. Profile photo of drawman61
    drawman61 Male 50-59
    7740 posts
    March 8, 2014 at 7:14 am
    And don`t forget the Bush family`s involvement in financing those same Nazis that we all had to fight. The same Bush family you were still happy enough to vote as your president twice...with a possible third on the way. Nothing like turning the other cheek, is there?
  80. Profile photo of JadesDitoyr
    JadesDitoyr Male 18-29
    841 posts
    March 8, 2014 at 9:08 am
    @Gypsebard
    I came in to defend historic fact, not comment on the current policies. But here`s the deal.

    I supported Iraq. Twelve UN Resolutions condemning Iraq but no UN action. Hussein kept breaking the treaty - so the war was back on. *I* never built my case on WMDs. Most Republicans I know didn`t base their case on WMD`s. The Media framed our case around WMDs.

    The Ukraine is part of NATO and should be defended by NATO forces - a large part of which are US Forces. We cannot build a fence and hope Russia stays on their side, sorry. Some sort of action must be done. I am not smart enough to devise it, but I know that doing nothing is the wrong move.

    Doing nothing is always the wrong move.

    I just remember Romney and Palin both being torn apart because they said Russia was still contender.
  81. Profile photo of Angilion
    Angilion Male 40-49
    12387 posts
    March 8, 2014 at 6:11 pm
    The US funded the Allies and the USSR long before it actually entered the war; it was the "Arsenal of Democracy" that allowed the UK to stay in the fight until the US entered it.

    And the UK paid a LOT for that. Cash, resources, land and patents for massively important technology. Which continued after the war in some areas, most notably controllable supersonic aircraft.

    At the end of the war, the US was the only super power, and it literally kept the world`s economy from complete collapse.

    The UK repaid their loan from the USA, with interest.

    The USA is hugely powerful and is generally beneficial to the world, but it is not a superhero acting only on altruism. It serves its own interests, as any country does.
  82. Profile photo of Angilion
    Angilion Male 40-49
    12387 posts
    March 8, 2014 at 6:19 pm
    If the United States had decided 100 years ago to keep our hands to ourselves and not get involved in other people`s problems, what language would you be speaking today?

    A. German
    B. Russian
    C. Japanese

    Same choices for you in the USA. Most likely German.

    When things go international, there are no "other people`s problems".

    It`s unlikely that the allies would have defeated Nazi Germany and Japan if the USA had remained completely isolationist. So Nazi Germany would have ruled Europe, Africa and most of Asia. With huge resources and no effective resistance, they would have advanced their weapons technology much faster and much further. Which would have left an unprepared USA facing Nazis with nukes and ICBMs by ~1950. Game over.
  83. Profile photo of Angilion
    Angilion Male 40-49
    12387 posts
    March 8, 2014 at 6:28 pm
    Going back a bit further, here`s another "other people`s problems" example:

    If France had decided 250 years ago to keep its hands to itself and not get involved in other people`s problems, the USA wouldn`t exist. Not in its current form, anyway. As part of Greater Canada, maybe. Without France, the loyalists would have won that civil war/revolution, if it happened at all.

    We could do this all day, for different times and different parts of the world.
  84. Profile photo of Grendel
    Grendel Male 40-49
    6171 posts
    March 9, 2014 at 9:11 am
    piperfawn- what MeGredel says cannot be found in that document and it`s only his idea.
    As it was not part of the main reasoning behind the Yalta Conference, it is not in the official documents that was the result of the Yalta Conference.

    It is documented in other records that Roosevelt (or are you still claiming he was dead at Yalta) and Churchhill agreed to let Russia take Berlin,and Stalin agreed when it was put to him.

    I will correct one thing I said: I went back and researched my statement based on something I read 25 years ago. Russian troops DID NOT advance through US troops. The passage basically read that the US was stopped short of Berlin (which they were). In the same paragraph it states `The Russian Army was allowed through to Berlin`. At the time I interpreted it to be `through the US Army`. In reality it `through to Berlin` was just a way of saying they were allowed to take Berlin. My apologies.
  85. Profile photo of vonKaiser
    vonKaiser Male 18-29
    108 posts
    March 10, 2014 at 6:04 am

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