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Date: 12/17/12 07:19 PM

46 Responses to Little We Can Do To Prevent Another Shooting

  1. Profile photo of 5Cats
    5Cats Male 50-59
    33117 posts
    December 17, 2012 at 7:16 pm
    Link: Little We Can Do To Prevent Another Shooting - A well-reasoned article on how a deranged killer cannot ``be prevented`` from his crime.
  2. Profile photo of mikelae18
    mikelae18 Male 18-29
    79 posts
    December 17, 2012 at 7:45 pm
    Yet again we are given an opportunity to discuss the social stigmas of psychological disorders and how we treat mental illness in society, but politicians squander the opportunity by trying to score political points with their bases over wedge issues such as gun control.
  3. Profile photo of klaxor
    klaxor Male 18-29
    646 posts
    December 17, 2012 at 7:54 pm
    Yea....no. Little things would help to stem the tide of mass murders. Our mental health system needs some serious overhaul, since it mainly consists of drugging up patients, then letting them out, and hoping that they stay on their meds and not hurt anyone. Just b/c it would be expensive to fix, this doesn`t mean that you just forget about it. The US budget needs to be reworked to set aside the necessary funds.

    And while rifles kill people just as well as shorter barrel rifles, they are also more difficult to use inside the cramped confines of a building.

    There are things that can be done, and teaching children to run at the attacker isn`t one of them. This guy is a dippoo.
  4. Profile photo of klaxor
    klaxor Male 18-29
    646 posts
    December 17, 2012 at 8:05 pm
    Where Criminals get their guns
  5. Profile photo of Draculya
    Draculya Male 40-49
    14652 posts
    December 17, 2012 at 8:15 pm
    How about make everyone involved in the chain of ownership of a gun jointly and severally liable for the liability of crimes committed with that gun?

    Or make the minimum legal barrel length 14 feet?

    Nope. I think this sums it up. Nothing will stop it now.
  6. Profile photo of OldOllie
    OldOllie Male 60-69
    15841 posts
    December 17, 2012 at 8:23 pm
    There were five theaters in Aurora, CO, showing the Batman movie. Which one did James Holmes choose for his massacre?

    1. The largest theater,
    2. The theater closest to his apartment, or
    3. The ONLY one of the five that was a gun-free zone?

    There is absolutely NOTHING that we could possibly do that would be more effective at deterring or reducing the casualties from multiple-victim public shootings than eliminating gun-free zones.

    To paraphrase Golda Meir, we can stop these school shootings when liberals decide that they love children more than they hate conservatives.
  7. Profile photo of FoolsPrussia
    FoolsPrussia Male 30-39
    3446 posts
    December 17, 2012 at 8:25 pm
    Ollie, you are an ass.
  8. Profile photo of klaxor
    klaxor Male 18-29
    646 posts
    December 17, 2012 at 8:35 pm
    "How about make everyone involved in the chain of ownership of a gun jointly and severally liable for the liability of crimes committed with that gun? "

    Why blame drug suppliers in that case. It`s the dealers who are selling the drugs and committing most of the violence.
  9. Profile photo of mentott510
    mentott510 Male 60-69
    210 posts
    December 17, 2012 at 9:12 pm
    This all seems to come down to more public awareness concerning mental health problems and what to do if you suspect a family member, friend, co-worker etc. is starting to loose their grip on reality. I work in a prison. From what the inmates have told me, aquiring weapons is not a difficult task.
  10. Profile photo of bliznik
    bliznik Male 30-39
    867 posts
    December 17, 2012 at 9:39 pm
    All very true, but that doesn`t mean we can`t put more roadblocks in his/her way. Sure, there`s no 100% full-proof way, and massively deranged people will always do massively deranged things. But every little effort reduces the number of gun-related deaths by a small percentage.
  11. Profile photo of swiftkeys
    swiftkeys Male 18-29
    500 posts
    December 17, 2012 at 10:17 pm
    Meh. -___-
  12. Profile photo of CrakrJak
    CrakrJak Male 40-49
    17514 posts
    December 17, 2012 at 11:05 pm
    OldOllie is correct, Ever since Rahm Emanuel set-up `gun-free zones` in Chicago the crime rate has skyrocketed in those areas. Chicago has the most murders than any other city, this year, a rise of 38%.
  13. Profile photo of CrakrJak
    CrakrJak Male 40-49
    17514 posts
    December 17, 2012 at 11:08 pm
    Also, Even if you take away the guns, the ammo, and the magazines, Adam Lanza was still a ticking time bomb.

    We should be talking about better mental health care right now, not more useless gun bans/laws.
  14. Profile photo of ferdyfred
    ferdyfred Male 40-49
    13631 posts
    December 18, 2012 at 12:12 am
    mentott510
    Dont know about the US - well I guess its easier mostly, but if you have £200 or so in the UK and are prepared to acquaint some rough dives, you can get pistols, £400 - something bigger etc..
    There is no real answer to this.
    Adam Lanza`s mother (according to the British press had several high powered weapons, which to be fair if you had a son with his problems, you wouldn`t have. I don`t believe you should ban weapons. doesn`t work - look at the UK. If the nutter is going to do it, he will. You will not stop him, unless you either like CrakrJak says provide a lot better mental heath care, or at least have some sort of warning system that said patient is a risk
  15. Profile photo of OldOllie
    OldOllie Male 60-69
    15841 posts
    December 18, 2012 at 12:19 am
    Ollie, you are an ass.
    Wow, Prussia`sFool, you really don`t take it too well when someone proves that what you believe is pure bull$#!+.
  16. Profile photo of Tiredofnicks
    Tiredofnicks Male 30-39
    5097 posts
    December 18, 2012 at 1:53 am
    Too long; will read later.
  17. Profile photo of CrakrJak
    CrakrJak Male 40-49
    17514 posts
    December 18, 2012 at 4:10 am


  18. Profile photo of CrakrJak
    CrakrJak Male 40-49
    17514 posts
    December 18, 2012 at 4:31 am
  19. Profile photo of Finker
    Finker Male 40-49
    505 posts
    December 18, 2012 at 5:45 am
    Crakr, why would you shoot fish other than to eat them, are you saying a gun ban would promote canibalism? I have mixed views on gun law but equally people carrying guns doesn`t stop shootings either. There is evidence both ways - if people are determined to commit crime and know their victim is armed how do you think they would you go about robbing them?
  20. Profile photo of dm2754
    dm2754 Male 40-49
    3351 posts
    December 18, 2012 at 6:39 am
    Laws don`t stop anything; they only punish you after you did something.
    The fact that it is illegal to kill doesn`t keep anyone from being killed.
  21. Profile photo of dm2754
    dm2754 Male 40-49
    3351 posts
    December 18, 2012 at 6:43 am
    @Draculya
    >>Or make the minimum legal barrel length 14 feet?

    Are you nuts? Pun guns are very dangerous. :-P
  22. Profile photo of Wundt
    Wundt Male 40-49
    410 posts
    December 18, 2012 at 6:55 am
    It is a well written article. However, we have evidence that tighter gun control DOES work.

    - Areas in the USA with laxer gun control laws tend to have more gun violence. Granted, this is correlation, but significant none the less.

    - Australia implemented strict gun control after a similar event 15 years ago. They have seen a significant drop of in gun crime and haven`t had an incident like it since.

    - States that have closed the `gun show loophole` have seen significant drop in gun crime.

    - China has a comparable rate of these sorts of `lone crazy man` events. However, because of the gun laws, those crimes are done with knives or other weapons, meaning the death toll is usually small.

    - Over 70% of NRA members approve of reasonable gun laws, it is only a vocal minority who fight them.

    Like it or not, gun control laws DO have a significant and measurable effect on violent crime. Easier access means more guns. And, more guns
  23. Profile photo of 5Cats
    5Cats Male 50-59
    33117 posts
    December 18, 2012 at 7:50 am
    @wundt: No, in Virginia the number of guns has soared over the past decade and gun crimes have DROPPED 24%... just one example.

    Australia is an island nation, with a tiny population (compared to the USA). Currently the USA cannot keep drugs or `illegal aliens` out, how would guns be any different?

    China is a totalitarian nation where people have little cash and NO freedom. It`s been their tradition to "ban weapons" for centuries. WHY do you think those Monks developed Kung-Fu? Because owning a sword in ancient times = death penalty. (unless you had a permit, very expensive, only the wealthy had swords).

    Those "reasonable gun laws" are ALREADY in place: no need for further restrictions. They`d be a useless waste of money, which could be better spent on ACTUALLY HELPFUL things...

    Now for the rest of the comments...
  24. Profile photo of 5Cats
    5Cats Male 50-59
    33117 posts
    December 18, 2012 at 8:03 am
    Thanks to @FancyLad or @The Mods for cleaning up my crappy description! You guys are great :-)

    Ollie, you are an ass.
    @FoolsPrussia: That is a typical "liberal" arguement! Very typical.

    @mikelae18: Yes, the bodies weren`t even cold when the Democrats started shouting "Gun Control! More Gun Control!"

    @klaxor @Draculya: The typical "Saturday Night Special" is a revolver pistol (NOT semi-automatic!) .38 caliber. Even the latest cries for `gun banning` would never get rid of THAT type of gun.

    #2 What if a criminal uses a TELEPHONE to plan a crime? Arrest the phone company? That was an actual case way back when, iirc...

    @bliznick: Those `roadblocks` are ALREADY in place and DID prevent him from buying a gun. What good would MORE laws do?

    @crakrJak: Nice pics! lolz!
  25. Profile photo of FoolsPrussia
    FoolsPrussia Male 30-39
    3446 posts
    December 18, 2012 at 8:12 am
    "To paraphrase Golda Meir, we can stop these school shootings when liberals decide that they love children more than they hate conservatives."

    Do I really need to explain why I said he`s an ass? This is one of the most hateful, divisive statements I`ve read here in the last few days.
  26. Profile photo of Ozmose
    Ozmose Male 30-39
    448 posts
    December 18, 2012 at 8:21 am
    Gun laws are idiotic. Where there`s a will there`s a way. The fact of the matter is, anyone with half a brain can kill a **** load of people pretty easily. Here`s 2 off the top of my head.

    Chlorine gas, the materials are readily available and cheap. Find an enclosed space with a lot of people (like a movie theater), mix to start the reaction, and chain the doors shut. VOILA! you`ve just killed a 100 people in a matter of minutes.

    Or lets get even more simple. Rent a huge ******* moving truck. Find some kind of street festival, and put the pedal to the metal. No worries, I`m sure those wooden sawhorse barricades will stop the 4 ton baby semi bearing down on you at 85 mph.

    Did you get the point? Or shall I go on.
  27. Profile photo of klaxor
    klaxor Male 18-29
    646 posts
    December 18, 2012 at 8:56 am
    Australia is an island nation, with a tiny population (compared to the USA). Currently the USA cannot keep drugs or `illegal aliens` out, how would guns be any different?

    - The problem is that most of the guns used in violent crimes are bought legally, but then distributed illegally, with about 8% of gun dealers selling a majority of the handguns. These aren`t being illegally imported, they`re just being "lost", and b/c of loose regulations here in the US, it keeps happening.

    Hell, most states don`t even require a license to buy a gun. The US requires you to have more paperwork and practice to drive a car than to own a gun.
  28. Profile photo of papajon0s1
    papajon0s1 Male 40-49
    579 posts
    December 18, 2012 at 9:19 am
    Here`s my idea. We stop spending tax dolalrs on so many ridiculous awful programs (of allkinds) that don`t work and we spend that money on having military vets added to school security allacross the USA. Yes, all across the USA. And no, no need foe them to be walkign aroudn the hallways in cammo weapons ablazing! No, just post signs that there are trained pros here and you nutbags won`t know who! Then, have the willing also work with so much other problems in our shcools. How many stories of fights and other weaons, and drugs and you name it. Perhaps the willing can assist with mentoring the troubled teens, miltary style! Don`t even begin to argue that there are many kids that need a good solid mentor that won`t take their crap. I`d much rather see my taxes go for something like that than so many useless programs tha do nothing but hurt people like the stimulus or Obamacare.
  29. Profile photo of patchgrabber
    patchgrabber Male 30-39
    5812 posts
    December 18, 2012 at 9:33 am
    @Ozmose: Well that`s simply conjecture, but do tell, if it`s so easy to do it that way, then why don`t more crazy mass murderers do that instead of guns? You`d definitely kill more with a bomb than you are ever likely to with guns, so why then do they so consistently forego the bombs, gas etc. and use guns instead?

    Did you get the point, or shall I go on?
  30. Profile photo of CrakrJak
    CrakrJak Male 40-49
    17514 posts
    December 18, 2012 at 10:19 am
    patchgrabber: Adam Lanza violated at least 15 gun control laws before he started shooting inside Sandy Hook elementary school. I don`t believe one or two more extra laws would`ve stopped him.
  31. Profile photo of patchgrabber
    patchgrabber Male 30-39
    5812 posts
    December 18, 2012 at 10:34 am
    I don`t believe one or two more extra laws would`ve stopped him.
    Conjecture. I can just as easily say they could have. I`m still waiting to hear why more people don`t blow up schools instead of shooting them up though, so feel free to answer that one.
  32. Profile photo of turdburglar
    turdburglar Male 30-39
    4896 posts
    December 18, 2012 at 10:40 am

    Poo post
  33. Profile photo of chalket
    chalket Male 50-59
    2712 posts
    December 18, 2012 at 10:41 am
    I don`t believe one or two more extra laws would`ve stopped him.

    Fun fact: Laws do not stop crime. They never have and we`ve never expected them to, so stop using that flawed argument already! Laws have two primary functions: 1) to punish the guilty AFTER a crime (thereby offering some very slight deterrent factor, but not much. A deranged mind just doesn`t think that way, especially if your goal is to die in the commission of your crime) and 2) to do whatever possible to make the crime more difficult to commit. No one thinks any gun law of any kind is going to magically stop nutjobs from committing crimes. But is it really necessary to make assault weapons so freaking easy to get? I`m all for private ownership of a handgun for personal safety, or a rifle for sport hunting and target play. (Guns can be fun!) But if you need a rapid-fire, 100-shot carbine for hunting YOU`RE DOING IT WRONG.
  34. Profile photo of chalket
    chalket Male 50-59
    2712 posts
    December 18, 2012 at 10:58 am
    It has been argued several times in the recent threads that "Cars kill lots of people, why don`t we ban cars?"

    My reply is "You`re right, if misused cars can kill. But guns are designed solely to kill, so why do we regulate our cars so much more than we regulate guns?"

    To own and operate a car you must:
    - Title and license at EVERY point of sale
    - Undergo training (Driver`s Ed)
    - Pass a written test
    - Pass a practical test
    - Qualify for health requirements (age, eyesight, hearing, etc.)
    - Purchase and maintain liability insurance on each and every vehicle
    - Pass periodic inspections and license renewals.

    Why don`t we treat guns as at least as dangerous as cars?
  35. Profile photo of furryblob
    furryblob Male 18-29
    574 posts
    December 18, 2012 at 11:01 am
    Less guns = less gun crime
  36. Profile photo of Ozmose
    Ozmose Male 30-39
    448 posts
    December 18, 2012 at 11:17 am
    @patchgrabber

    It`s called the path of least resistance.
    The guns were readily available to the kid. That`s why.

    Why don`t people do other things you ask?
    Like . . .
    Flying pales into buildings
    Fertilizer bomb federal buildings
    Release serin gas in a Tokyo subway
    or send out Anthrax filled envelopes

    I don`t know.
    In the grand scheme of things. Crazy people have done crazy **** since the dawn of time, and not a single ban, law, or stern talking to, is ever going to change that.
    We tried banning alcohol, and all it did was make a giant murderous criminal enterprise. You think it`ll be any different with guns?
  37. Profile photo of Ozmose
    Ozmose Male 30-39
    448 posts
    December 18, 2012 at 11:25 am
    @chalket

    I`ve got no problem with requirements like that to own a gun. You can tack IQ test onto that list too.
    It`s when people start talking about banning guns that I get pissed.
    I`m pretty much a lefty on everything BUT gun control. I imagine some people might find it confusing.
  38. Profile photo of patchgrabber
    patchgrabber Male 30-39
    5812 posts
    December 18, 2012 at 11:35 am
    @Ozmose: Those examples are isolated, at least in comparison to mass shootings. But when you say path of least resistance it makes a good point, that it is too easy to access guns.

    You think it`ll be any different with guns?
    It`s much easier for joe schmuck to make alcohol than guns, so they don`t really compare. The types of homemade guns you`d likely see would be air-propelled.
  39. Profile photo of Ozmose
    Ozmose Male 30-39
    448 posts
    December 18, 2012 at 11:58 am
    Yes they do compare.
    A massive amount of illegal alcohol obtained during the depression was smuggled in to the country. They`ll do the same thing with guns, but they won`t be toned down civilian models, I assure you.

    Drugs are already illegal. Where do you think they`re coming from? Do I need to get into drug related violence? Take a trip down to the border. Ask around about how neighborly the cartels are.
  40. Profile photo of 5Cats
    5Cats Male 50-59
    33117 posts
    December 18, 2012 at 3:43 pm
    "I`m still waiting to hear why more people don`t blow up schools instead of shooting them up"
    @Patchy: What is the worst school killing in US history?
    Bath School Disaster: 1927
    On May 18 a guy set fire to his own farm (to draw firemen away from the school), then detonated explosives, then drove his car-bomb into the crowd and detonated that too, killing himself. More un-exploded bombs were found under the school too.
    38 children, 2 teachers, 4 other adults and him all died.

    Oklahoma City was a bomb too. Children in that daycare died.

    There`s two for you! The fact is that it`s hard work making a bomb, guns are simple. Columbine had bombs too, but the BIG one they`d planted didn`t go off, saving dozens of lives.

    Even simpler? Arson. A pack of matches and Presto!
  41. Profile photo of 5Cats
    5Cats Male 50-59
    33117 posts
    December 18, 2012 at 3:50 pm
    But is it really necessary to make assault weapons so freaking easy to get?
    @chalket: Please learn the difference: "assault weapons" are FULL automatic. It`s nearly impossible to buy one in the USA since 1980. Criminals still have them of course.
    You`re just `parroting` what the MSM says, an AR-15 is NOT an "assault weapon" OK?

    Make life more difficult for the criminals? wtf are you talking about? Laws, rules and regulations ONLY AFFECT law-abiding citizens! Look at the cocain trade: going on 5 decades of it. Heroine`s been illegal since before WW1 ffs!

    There is only ONE thing the anti-gun lobby wants and that is to confiscate ALL the guns.
  42. Profile photo of ginger5010
    ginger5010 Male 30-39
    6 posts
    December 18, 2012 at 4:56 pm
    Jasmine. I just agree... Adam`s postlng is impossible, on sunday I bought a new Volkswagen Golf GTI from bringing in $5589 this past five weeks and-a little over, 10/k this past month. it`s realy the most financially rewarding I have ever had. I began this eight months/ago and pretty much immediately startad earning over $81.. per hour. I use this website, Great70.c om

  43. Profile photo of 8BitHero
    8BitHero Male 18-29
    5414 posts
    December 18, 2012 at 4:58 pm
    This article uses one of the points
    "Lanza seems to have been fond of violent video games, and spent hours playing them."
    LOOOOOOOOOOL
  44. Profile photo of Zeegrr60
    Zeegrr60 Male 40-49
    2106 posts
    December 18, 2012 at 6:19 pm
    Written with all the intelligence of a first-year psych student. Someone call a proffesional.
  45. Profile photo of OldOllie
    OldOllie Male 60-69
    15841 posts
    December 19, 2012 at 12:08 am
    "Less guns = less gun crime"

    furryblob, that has unequivocally been proven wrong.

    Clicky * Clicky
  46. Profile photo of synaw
    synaw Male 18-29
    58 posts
    December 19, 2012 at 5:59 pm
    @5cats not taking sides, just showing you that you`re wrong. assault weapons are not always fully automatic. during the assault weapons ban in 1994, my .22 caliber rifle (semi automatic) was on consider an assault weapon because it had an 18 round clip. you are also wrong in saying it`s nearly impossible to buy fully automatic weapons in the us, because right across the river from me is pennsylvania, where i have shot many automatic rifles at ranges, seen many for sale, and seen people purchase them. maybe you should learn some differences, eh?

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