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Date: 11/14/12 09:40 PM

56 Responses to Ron Paul`s Farewell Speech

  1. Profile photo of Andrew155
    Andrew155 Male 18-29
    2579 posts
    November 14, 2012 at 9:42 pm
    Link: Ron Paul`s Farewell Speech - A speech worth watching.
  2. Profile photo of 5Cats
    5Cats Male 50-59
    33070 posts
    November 14, 2012 at 9:58 pm
    NOTE: No one is there to see this, it`s a SHAMEFUL day for American politics...

    It`s too bad that he alone these days speaks the truth, because he`s a certified nut-job. Why can`t ANY politican either tell the truth OR do good these days?
    Not that the "good old days" were much better, eh? LOLZ!
    But the numbers now are HUGE! And there is NO relief in sight...
  3. Profile photo of Cherrybawls
    Cherrybawls Male 18-29
    167 posts
    November 14, 2012 at 10:10 pm
    Its a damn shame he didn`t get the republican nomination
  4. Profile photo of ledzeppeloyd
    ledzeppeloyd Male 18-29
    2385 posts
    November 14, 2012 at 10:18 pm
    he`s so right
  5. Profile photo of DinVen
    DinVen Male 30-39
    390 posts
    November 14, 2012 at 10:57 pm
    A typical seasoned politician move.

    You do not get to define yourself as a peace promoter in your last speech on the Congress floor if your name is Ron Paul. Unless of course he means "Promoting peace" through voting for increased proliferation of guns in American society, which is the result of his voting record.

    But it does makes a lot of sense if you are paranoid and ignorant ie. believe peace is being promoted by equipping everyone with weapons.

    The most peaceful societies in the world all have strict gun control laws. Read a history book or look into statistics. People are just horny for guns and scared of their neighbors and government. Nothing to do with peace. What an absolute reprehensible thing to state that he has worked for peace the entire time. Disgusting.
  6. Profile photo of dazedflea
    dazedflea Male 40-49
    5 posts
    November 14, 2012 at 11:01 pm
    Thanks to Andrew155 for this post. It was very insightful and inspiring.
  7. Profile photo of Andrew155
    Andrew155 Male 18-29
    2579 posts
    November 14, 2012 at 11:47 pm
    DinVen, you clearly didn`t watch the video.

    I don`t think you understand actual liberty, the idea that we are individuals and not a collective. While you consider it "disgusting", many would consider it disgusting that you would take people`s right to self-defense away, forcing them to depend on somebody else. Most of the violence that does exist in this country is a result of the drug war - something that Ron Paul is against. The drug war literally accounts for almost all of the excess violence.

    Despite our gun laws and the ensuing drug war, European crime rates are not exactly much to envy. The country with the strictest laws is not "peaceful", as you put it.

    UK is violent crime capital of Europe

    Plus I`m pretty happy America doesn`t have a problem
  8. Profile photo of Andrew155
    Andrew155 Male 18-29
    2579 posts
    November 14, 2012 at 11:51 pm
    ....with rioting, looting, vandalism, and hooliganism. People are able to defend their property. I would recall the LA riots when the Koreans actually stood up for themselves instead of being victims.


    By the way, in case you`re afraid to open up that link, it basically says America`s violent crime rate is 466/100k. UK - 2,000/100k. Austria - 1,600/100k. France - 500/100k. Done.
  9. Profile photo of 5Cats
    5Cats Male 50-59
    33070 posts
    November 15, 2012 at 12:09 am
    Keep in mind @Andrew155: UK doesn`t consider many things a "crime" anymore!

    If I walk up to a complete stranger in the UK, and SLAP her right in the face? Provided her SKIN colour is the same as mine it`s NOT A CRIME!
    It`s a "misdomener" and doesn`t get counter in the statistics!

    Well done Europe! Defending the RIGHTS of CRIMINALS is soooo much more important than.. well anything else!
  10. Profile photo of onoffonoffon
    onoffonoffon Male 30-39
    2375 posts
    November 15, 2012 at 12:23 am
    I am always baffled that what he says seems so obvious yet just about everyone I talk to doesn`t seem to get the magnitude of what is being said and they all ultimately waffle and avoid the good sense.
  11. Profile photo of ferdyfred
    ferdyfred Male 40-49
    13631 posts
    November 15, 2012 at 12:39 am
    Tis true UK is the soppy assed country were you can bleat human rights and get away with.. well murder
    Give me the US slap you down and scare the pants off you justice anyday
  12. Profile photo of Ripper398
    Ripper398 Male 18-29
    1310 posts
    November 15, 2012 at 2:08 am
    It is a sad day indeed. Ron Paul would have been an excellent choice as president. He`s honest, cares about the people, and has a lot of heart. I think out of the two baboons, he really could have saved us.
  13. Profile photo of Modwain
    Modwain Male 40-49
    336 posts
    November 15, 2012 at 2:31 am
    ok 5cats, so giving someone a slap. not beating them up?

    cause giving a slap isnt really a crime, its annoyance, beating someone up is still a crime.

    so maybe our revalueing our crminal system may be a good thing. Smoking a bit of weed is a missdemeaner, not a crime, punisheble by a ticket, like trafic violations.
    This would mean that a lot of small crimes would be steered away from the crime system. That doesnt mean that certain misbehaviours should be accepted, but well, fining peeps works too. then again, only if it is actually inforced. so jo more jaywalking without getting fined, etc etc.

    What you want is a society that sees that certain behaviour is contemptable. To get this, i guess, we need to educate the people, and in a way, condition them. now, rewwarding is harder then punishing, but if nothing else, we need to be concistant.
  14. Profile photo of CrakrJak
    CrakrJak Male 40-49
    17514 posts
    November 15, 2012 at 4:47 am
    DinVen: The most peaceful societies in the world all have strict gun control laws.

    O`Rly? The UK has some of the most strict gun laws of any democracy in the world and has a rather large crime rate. So that blows your `gun control` theory right out of the water.

    Gun control laws are not about `controlling guns`, because criminals don`t care about the law and they`ll still get guns regardless. Gun control is about the government being able to run roughshod over it`s constituents without fear of reprisal or revolution.

    When the people fear their government, there is tyranny; when the government fears the people, there is liberty. - Thomas Jefferson
  15. Profile photo of CreamK
    CreamK Male 40-49
    1423 posts
    November 15, 2012 at 5:23 am
    Do you seriously believe that citizens with guns have any chance of stopping government if it really wants to do something? The government doesn`t give a crap about personal guns ownership nor does it fear you.. If you got some artillery, few jets and couple of tanks.. But your 9mm? it`s a peashooter.
  16. Profile photo of McGovern1981
    McGovern1981 Male 30-39
    14268 posts
    November 15, 2012 at 6:41 am
    Ban guns for saftey.
    Ban knives, swords and ect for saftey.
    Put cameras everywhere for saftey.

    Hmmm seem like someone in the UK think the public isn`t very safe. I`ll take not living in a bubble for saftey thanks.
  17. Profile photo of McGovern1981
    McGovern1981 Male 30-39
    14268 posts
    November 15, 2012 at 6:51 am
    @CreamK

    I`ve got more than a 9mm.

    You should really look at history more.
  18. Profile photo of HumanAction
    HumanAction Male 18-29
    2357 posts
    November 15, 2012 at 7:04 am
    @CreamK:

    Do you seriously believe that citizens with guns have any chance of stopping government if it really wants to do something?
    Though I am certain you will not listen, I assure you that the individual elements within the military would overwhelmingly side with the citizens.
  19. Profile photo of CynicalGamer
    CynicalGamer Male 40-49
    450 posts
    November 15, 2012 at 7:20 am
    Love him or hate him we need people like Mr. Paul. At the very least he went after a lot of entities that should have been accountable from day one. To bad he was a bit of a nutjob. I still would have voted for him as one of the lesser evils over the 2 idiots we had forced on us last week.
  20. Profile photo of madest
    madest Male 40-49
    7378 posts
    November 15, 2012 at 7:23 am
    The second amendment doesn`t have to be revoked to put some sanity in our gun laws McGovern. There can and should be limits to ownership of high capacity magazines and assault weapons. Crazy people shouldn`t be allowed to buy weapons and those who go crazy should lose the weapons they have. The NRA got a 0.82% return on their $12,000,000 investment on candidates this election. Times they are a changin`.
  21. Profile photo of antagonizer
    antagonizer Male 18-29
    508 posts
    November 15, 2012 at 7:25 am
    Why the hell didn`t you americans elect this guy? He`s neither a giant douche or a turd sandwich and seems to actually give a damn.
  22. Profile photo of HumanAction
    HumanAction Male 18-29
    2357 posts
    November 15, 2012 at 7:39 am
    There can and should be limits to ownership of high capacity magazines and assault weapons. Crazy people shouldn`t be allowed to buy weapons and those who go crazy should lose the weapons they have.
    While I disagree with the notion, I would be fine with the individual states implementing these laws. However, it is not the business of the federal government.

    Why the hell didn`t you americans elect this guy?
    Because as a collective, we are complete idiots. The American Idles out there far outnumber the American Idols. Dr. Ron Paul`s treatment during his campaign was shameful.
  23. Profile photo of Reignblazer
    Reignblazer Male 18-29
    2334 posts
    November 15, 2012 at 8:29 am
    Funny how some people keep saying they need their guns to stand up to their government.

    Tell me then, how goes your heroic struggle against the powers that be? Oh right..
  24. Profile photo of McGovern1981
    McGovern1981 Male 30-39
    14268 posts
    November 15, 2012 at 8:34 am
    There can and should be limits to ownership of high capacity magazines and assault weapons. Crazy people shouldn`t be allowed to buy weapons and those who go crazy should lose the weapons they have


    That was attempted and failed because criminals don`t obey laws and everything made before the law is enacted is grandfathered. How about have people who know and own guns make gun laws?
  25. Profile photo of McGovern1981
    McGovern1981 Male 30-39
    14268 posts
    November 15, 2012 at 8:35 am
    @Reignblazer

    When was it stated we wanted a revolution? That`s ironic coming from a person in a country that pays taxes to a royal family.
  26. Profile photo of CodeJockey
    CodeJockey Male 40-49
    5611 posts
    November 15, 2012 at 8:59 am
    "Why the hell didn`t you americans elect this guy? He`s neither a giant douche or a turd sandwich and seems to actually give a damn."
    "Because as a collective, we are complete idiots."
    Neither of you seem to have watched him during the primaries this run, where he had difficulty putting complete sentences together when cornered, or listened to him speak historically:
    He is a well-meaning JACKASS.

    Here is an example. See in yellow.
    I remember seeing that speech. Seeing as the guy was a practicing physician, I hope that wasn`t an honest confession...
  27. Profile photo of HumanAction
    HumanAction Male 18-29
    2357 posts
    November 15, 2012 at 9:13 am
    @CodeJockey

    where he had difficulty putting complete sentences together when cornered,
    So let me get this straight, you would prefer to vote for someone who you completely disagree though speaks elegantly than a man with a fundamentally sound ideology who has trouble finding words under pressure. Let me guess, you voted for Obama, right? This is a foolish way to elect politicians.

    See in yellow.
    As I stated on that same thread, I see absolutely nothing wrong with the distiction between a false rape and an honest rape. He is not excusing rape, nor it he trying to discredit it. In this example, he is merely stating that he is only referring to situations where a rape has occurred rather than an allegation only.

    Consider the Duke lacrosse team if you are having trouble understanding this.
  28. Profile photo of SunnyNphilly
    SunnyNphilly Male 18-29
    645 posts
    November 15, 2012 at 9:13 am
    "Do you seriously believe that citizens with guns have any chance of stopping government if it really wants to do something? "

    The government can come to my home, ill give them all my bullets, none of my guns.
  29. Profile photo of CodeJockey
    CodeJockey Male 40-49
    5611 posts
    November 15, 2012 at 9:28 am
    "So let me get this straight, you would prefer to vote for someone who you completely disagree though speaks elegantly"
    No however, convincing me you have a better idea partially consists of your being able to express it. Another part is my perception of the person`s sincerity.

    I believed he believed what he was saying (when he f*cking said something.) His stammering pointed out that he didn`t get `being turned away` isn`t the issue in healthcare, it`s the life crushing debt.
  30. Profile photo of HumanAction
    HumanAction Male 18-29
    2357 posts
    November 15, 2012 at 9:43 am
    s stammering pointed out that he didn`t get `being turned away` isn`t the issue in healthcare, it`s the life crushing debt.
    If this is what you believe about him, then you should consider researching more. He is primarily concerned about the financial cost of healthcare (when referring to healthcare).

    He consistently is asked to defend his stance that healthcare is not the concern of the federal government, and I believe you are referring to his reponses. He consistently has responded to the allegations that "his system" would leave people on the streets to die (which is complete and udder bull). Sounds familiar?
  31. Profile photo of CodeJockey
    CodeJockey Male 40-49
    5611 posts
    November 15, 2012 at 10:13 am
    "Sounds familiar?"
    The context of his response, yes.

    "his stance that healthcare is not the concern of the federal government"
    Is that what he was trying to say?!
    Very well expressed. I disagree.

    I have paid cash for healthcare. It appears to be unregulated where it needs to be.
  32. Profile photo of HumanAction
    HumanAction Male 18-29
    2357 posts
    November 15, 2012 at 10:25 am
    @CodeJockey

    Very well expressed. I disagree.
    Really? It seems to me that every other phrase he says is "free market". Here seems to be an accurate portrayal of his beliefs: RonPaul.com

    It appears to be unregulated where it needs to be.
    In my opinion, it appears to be far too regulated.
  33. Profile photo of HumanAction
    HumanAction Male 18-29
    2357 posts
    November 15, 2012 at 10:30 am
    Whoops - link didn`t work: RonPaul.com
  34. Profile photo of CodeJockey
    CodeJockey Male 40-49
    5611 posts
    November 15, 2012 at 10:49 am
    "In my opinion, it appears to be far too regulated."
    Exactly what current regulations cause a hospital to charge $21K for 2 nights in a bed and 2 sandwiches?
    I know: The chick that I repeatedly told I do not take pain relievers, who finally just fluffed the pillow was at least 18-G`s.
    F*cking dry assed, tasteless half-a-club sandwich? A G each, right?

    The hospital itself should not be a for-profit business.
  35. Profile photo of HumanAction
    HumanAction Male 18-29
    2357 posts
    November 15, 2012 at 10:57 am
    Exactly what current regulations cause a hospital to charge $21K for 2 nights in a bed and 2 sandwiches?
    Off the top of my head, tort laws and mal-practice requirements; there are many more though.

    The hospital itself should not be a for-profit business.
    What then is the incentive to excel? Profit alone drives the desire to out-perform the competition. Without profit, how would a hospital afford specialists? Without exceptional pay, why would someone devote nearly two decades of their life to becoming a neurosurgeon?

    Again, profit is the driver. The answer is not to limit or abolish profit, but to remove barriers that decrease profit.
  36. Profile photo of CodeJockey
    CodeJockey Male 40-49
    5611 posts
    November 15, 2012 at 11:12 am
    "Off the top of my head, tort laws and mal-practice requirements"
    Father was a physician.
    The doctors` fees weren`t in that post, just the hospital and it did not cost 21 G`s to have me share a room with a guy who was ringing for help that didn`t come until I got up, hopped over (broken ankle) and helped him myself.

    Profit may be motive to act but, alone, it is not incentive to improve or even perform well.
  37. Profile photo of HumanAction
    HumanAction Male 18-29
    2357 posts
    November 15, 2012 at 11:13 am
    ... Unless of course you mean they should file as a non-profit corporation (I`m not sure if you are arguing this or arguing for "wage caps" etc.)...

    Even in this case though, it doesn`t really change anything. There are many non-profit hospitals out there and they still cost the same amount. If this was truely an answer, and your hypothesis that regulations are too few, wouldn`t reason stand to show the opposte?

    Afterall, if there is too little regulation, then simple market factors will have greater effects. Given this, wouldn`t a non-profit hospital have a significant cost advantage over others?

    But they don`t. If they did, more people would go to them, and they would slowly take over the for profit systems. This is evidence that I am correct that the market is over-regulated.
  38. Profile photo of QueenZira
    QueenZira Female 18-29
    2228 posts
    November 15, 2012 at 11:15 am
    So he`s leaving for good? No more wheezing, rambling speeches full of half baked policies and vague appeals to "liberty" to justify them? No more black ops, doomed to fail convention shenanigans?




    Why didn`t somebody tell me sooner?
  39. Profile photo of HumanAction
    HumanAction Male 18-29
    2357 posts
    November 15, 2012 at 11:19 am
    Father was a physician.
    Coincidentally, mine was too. My mother (and sister) are also nurses. I`m not sure what we gained from this insight.

    just the hospital and it did not cost 21 G`s to have me share a room with a guy who was ringing for help that didn`t come until I got up
    Ah, but you are discussing something else here. This is not a market factor, it is a social factor.

    The doctors` fees weren`t in that post
    The hospital still needs mal-practice insurance regardless of if you were visited by the doctor. Again, I`m not sure what this has to do with the argument at hand?

    Profit may be motive to act but, alone, it is not incentive to improve or even perform well.
    Why then, does Samsung and Apple continue to create new smartphones? Why do they invest so much money into outperforming each other?
  40. Profile photo of CodeJockey
    CodeJockey Male 40-49
    5611 posts
    November 15, 2012 at 11:42 am
    "Why then, does Samsung and Apple continue to create new smartphones? Why do they invest so much money into outperforming each other?"
    Botsford and Oakwood are not competing in an industry that fears "loss of interest in product line."
    When does a person think "This hospital is using brand-x sutures. Those are itchy. That other hospital has brand-y which dissolve. Let`s go there."

    When a person is on the way to a hospital, often they are thinking "JESUS!!! I CAN`T FEEL MY LEGS!!! AAAAARRRRRGGGHHH!!! I CAN SEE MY RIBS!!!" or some such thing as two people take them to a place they did not specifically ask to go.

  41. Profile photo of CodeJockey
    CodeJockey Male 40-49
    5611 posts
    November 15, 2012 at 11:45 am
    Does the hospital say: "That person has been here for two years. Time to replace them."
    Are we testing surgeons for reduced operation duration? Continuous improvement there?
    "This guy can do 20 of those in a day."
    "This other guy can do 24 of those."

    It hospital care was looked at like normal retail product, it`d be the cell service you received a bill for because someone accidentally handed you a phone.
  42. Profile photo of HumanAction
    HumanAction Male 18-29
    2357 posts
    November 15, 2012 at 11:49 am
    Botsford and Oakwood are not competing in an industry that fears "loss of interest in product line."
    I disagree. When I lived in Buffalo, NY (before I had the good sense to move), it was well-known that you should go to ECMC instead of Buffalo General (or Mercy). Buffalo General was on the verge of closing and was untimately "gobbled up" by Kaleida Health. The hospital has since improved from my understanding.

    Hospitals still have competition, and still need to compete with others. The only exception I can think of is in cities with only 1 hospital.
  43. Profile photo of HumanAction
    HumanAction Male 18-29
    2357 posts
    November 15, 2012 at 11:52 am
    It hospital care was looked at like normal retail product, it`d be the cell service you received a bill for because someone accidentally handed you a phone.
    In which case you would never go there again. Similarly, many others would end up going to the competitors. In time, the "bad" hospital will lose profits and fail (as long as the government doesn`t foolishly bail them out).

    What then will happen to all of those jobs and equipment??? Oh no`s!

    They will be consumed by another, better (successful) company. This series of events will continue to unfold over time, resulting in the best possible hospitals.
  44. Profile photo of CodeJockey
    CodeJockey Male 40-49
    5611 posts
    November 15, 2012 at 11:53 am
    "I disagree. When I lived in Buffalo, NY..."
    Oh. Well in SE Michigan, it`s a much more level field to the point people not noticing a difference.

    "Don`t go there!! That place only employs people that didn`t get hired elsewhere because they have cold hands!!"
  45. Profile photo of CodeJockey
    CodeJockey Male 40-49
    5611 posts
    November 15, 2012 at 11:59 am
    "as long as the government doesn`t foolishly bail them out"
    Foolishly depends on why they`d get bailed out.
    It`d be fairly unwise to the only hospital org in a city die. Same time, you`d like proof that the conditions that led to the failure were addressed.
  46. Profile photo of HumanAction
    HumanAction Male 18-29
    2357 posts
    November 15, 2012 at 12:00 pm
    Oh. Well in SE Michigan, it`s a much more level field to the point people not noticing a difference.
    Hmm... I wonder if they excel in different fields then? For instance: Hospital A has a fantastic open-heart unit; Hospital B has a world-class burn center; so on and so forth.

    Even here is Eau Claire, WI, we have two hospitals and we know to go to Mayo if something serious has happened. Sacrad Heart is fine for minor or routine things, but let`s not kid ourselves that they are Mayo.
  47. Profile photo of HumanAction
    HumanAction Male 18-29
    2357 posts
    November 15, 2012 at 12:03 pm
    It`d be fairly unwise to the only hospital org in a city die
    Agreed, you would need to know the circumstances. Under normal circumstances, I would actually try to encourage another hospital system to come in.

    If they closed because the town is too small to support a hospital, then I would suggest reducing it to a clinic. Kind of like the Post Office, it`d be nice to have them everywhere, but we need to draw the line at some point.
  48. Profile photo of CodeJockey
    CodeJockey Male 40-49
    5611 posts
    November 15, 2012 at 12:10 pm
    "...if they excel in different fields..."
    Yes:
    -Ford, open heart.
    -"Go Blue" experimental techniques.
  49. Profile photo of HumanAction
    HumanAction Male 18-29
    2357 posts
    November 15, 2012 at 12:27 pm
    ... how far we`ve come from the initial conversation. And yet, the conversation has not yet devolved into simple name-calling.

    This marks a new high point in the world of IAB.
  50. Profile photo of insane_ai
    insane_ai Male 30-39
    817 posts
    November 15, 2012 at 2:49 pm
    Ron Paul`s message promotes personal freedom balanced by personal responsibility.

    Why is this idea being ridiculed instead of being adopted?
  51. Profile photo of TheGuySmiley
    TheGuySmiley Male 18-29
    1243 posts
    November 15, 2012 at 3:35 pm
    So many people in the world are wondering why this man wasn`t elected the leader of that nation. Truly, the old saying holds true in that poor nation: "those who trade freedom for security deserve neither". Reason has been traded for madness.
  52. Profile photo of CodeJockey
    CodeJockey Male 40-49
    5611 posts
    November 16, 2012 at 5:49 am
    "So many people in the world are wondering why this man wasn`t elected"
    "Why is this idea being ridiculed instead of being adopted?"
    Even in this speech, there was a fair amount of shortsightedness up through cracked-pottery mixed in with Grandpa`s wisdom.

    1) Perfectly free markets lead to monopolies and fixed prices.
    2) People protested like hell against a middle-eastern war. They were ignored.
    3) "Why...restrict the drinking of raw milk?"
    Because people used to die from it. Regulations on handling led to higher quality food.
    4) "Why...regulate commodes in our homes?"
    Municipal water conservation, D!ckweed...
    5) "...can`t take care of own needs...do it for them?"
    Shanty town children better solution then?
  53. Profile photo of Cajun247
    Cajun247 Male 18-29
    10742 posts
    November 16, 2012 at 9:07 am
    1) Perfectly free markets lead to monopolies and fixed prices. No that`s corporatism

    Because people used to die from it. Regulations on handling led to higher quality food.People have a right to be stupid, govt have no responsibility to restrict them.
    Shanty town children better solution then?Societies, as in a group of people that provides for each of their members` needs, are formed voluntarily. Government is an outgrowth of that.
  54. Profile photo of CodeJockey
    CodeJockey Male 40-49
    5611 posts
    November 16, 2012 at 12:54 pm
    People have a right to be stupid, govt have no responsibility to restrict them.
    When it was an issue, it didn`t have so much to do with stupidity as much as
    -Sick animals
    -Lack of pasteurization
    -Lack of refrigeration before distribution
    The dairy industry as it stands may be expensive to get into because of required equipment but, it grew into being that way in response to sickness and death.
    It was regulated into improvement.

    Not so different but, different enough to notice: Try living in Mexico for a week.
    First thing I notice infrastructural was how homes had water tanks on their roofs and then, the >>decreased use of refrigerated trucking.<<
    Food is hella saltier in the US, too.
  55. Profile photo of CodeJockey
    CodeJockey Male 40-49
    5611 posts
    November 16, 2012 at 1:03 pm
    ...Societies, as in a group of people that provides for each of their members` needs, are formed voluntarily...
    You believe you will find a friendly neighbor in time of need.
    I know, because I have been in need where there were not friendly neighbors, that there needs to be a protocol in place to help a person bridge the periods between self reliability.
  56. Profile photo of InTheNameOf
    InTheNameOf Male 30-39
    335 posts
    November 20, 2012 at 5:06 pm
    48 minutes - damn, thats a long fairwell....

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