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Date: 07/27/12 08:26 AM

107 Responses to Obama Campaign Riding The Romney Gaffes

  1. Profile photo of madest
    madest Male 40-49
    7378 posts
    July 27, 2012 at 8:27 am
    Link: Obama Campaign Riding The Romney Gaffes - Romney`s trip to showcase his foreign policy cred is not going smoothly. Turns out the Brits hate him too.
  2. Profile photo of sosueme1966
    sosueme1966 Male 40-49
    439 posts
    July 27, 2012 at 8:37 am
    I despise Mitt Romney but he`s dead on about London`s handling of the olympics. Anyone who has been following the preparations there, particularly the security arrangements, knows what a cluster F it`s been.
  3. Profile photo of Andrew155
    Andrew155 Male 18-29
    2579 posts
    July 27, 2012 at 8:37 am
    ...but the olympics are disorganized and have all these problems with security guards and workers threatening to go on strike?

    Be mad at Romney for other stuff.
  4. Profile photo of panth753
    panth753 Female 18-29
    9237 posts
    July 27, 2012 at 8:40 am
    Nice hole you got there Romney.
  5. Profile photo of HumanAction
    HumanAction Male 18-29
    2357 posts
    July 27, 2012 at 8:43 am
    Since all of the liberal stations seem to forget to put the action words of Romney in their absurdity, here goes:

    "There are a few things that were disconcerting, the stories about the private security firm not having enough people, supposed strike of the immigration and customs officials, that obviously is not something which is encouraging. Because there are three parts that makes Games successful."

    I don`t see why this is a big deal. All of the things he mentioned are both true and disconcerting? Ill-advised and ill-timed - yes; but true.
  6. Profile photo of jtrebowski
    jtrebowski Male 40-49
    3359 posts
    July 27, 2012 at 8:53 am
    It`s funny now, but not so much when he gaffes it up over in Israel.
  7. Profile photo of unmercyfuldu
    unmercyfuldu Male 18-29
    762 posts
    July 27, 2012 at 8:53 am
    He should know though. His only accomplishment is a gold medal in Patting Himself On the Back regarding his involvement in the Salt Lake City winter olympics.
  8. Profile photo of HolyGod
    HolyGod Male 30-39
    6754 posts
    July 27, 2012 at 8:54 am
    Human Action

    "liberal stations"

    Jesus H Christ must EVERYTHING be liberal / conservative? That wasn`t biased. It wasn`t punditry. It was straight forward reporting of British reaction. I`m sure those stations put up the Romney quote. This video is just a collection of the reaction to it.
  9. Profile photo of DromEd
    DromEd Male 40-49
    1927 posts
    July 27, 2012 at 8:56 am
    Weak sauce madest. One...the report didn`t even include Mitt`s comments, just the reaction of toffy nosed Brits. And Mitt knows what it takes to run a successful games...he`s got the track record. I`d like a President that isn`t afraid to tell it like it is thank you.
  10. Profile photo of LordJim
    LordJim Male 60-69
    6952 posts
    July 27, 2012 at 8:57 am
    I despise Cameron but `It`s much easier to hold an Olympic Games in the middle of nowhere.` Heh, not bad.

    And as for being better for the UK than Obama because of your `Anglo-saxon heritage`; you can shove that, pal.



  11. Profile photo of AvatarJohn
    AvatarJohn Male 30-39
    1059 posts
    July 27, 2012 at 8:59 am
    At least he didn`t say something incredibly insulting and bordering on totalitarian marxism such as:

    "Look, if you`ve been successful, you didn`t get there on your own. You didn`t get there on your own. I`m always struck by people who think, well, it must be because I was just so smart. There are a lot of smart people out there. It must be because I worked harder than everybody else. Let me tell you something - there are a whole bunch of hardworking people out there. If you were successful, somebody along the line gave you some help. There was a great teacher somewhere in your life. Somebody helped to create this unbelievable American system that we have that allowed you to thrive. Somebody invested in roads and bridges. If you`ve got a business, you didn`t build that. Somebody else made that happen."
    --Joseph Stalin
    Oops! I meant:
    --Barack Hussein Obama ("The One")
  12. Profile photo of sosueme1966
    sosueme1966 Male 40-49
    439 posts
    July 27, 2012 at 9:00 am
    Aren`t we always saying we wish politicians would tell the truth? Now you can see why they usually don`t.
  13. Profile photo of LordJim
    LordJim Male 60-69
    6952 posts
    July 27, 2012 at 9:03 am
    Romney wanted to show how good he was at foreign relations. Within minutes he pissed of America`s closest ally and got slapped down by a conservative PM and a conservative mayor.

    This was an easy one and he blew it. Next stop Israel.
  14. Profile photo of tedgp
    tedgp Male 30-39
    3287 posts
    July 27, 2012 at 9:04 am
    Dont get your hopes up america. We hate all politicians equally.
  15. Profile photo of tedgp
    tedgp Male 30-39
    3287 posts
    July 27, 2012 at 9:05 am
    @sosueme1966 We didnt want the olympics over here in the first place. It was the politicans that decided it would happen. The Uk just cant afford to run them, and we dont have the infrastructure to support it. Especially since its focused around london.
  16. Profile photo of Andrew155
    Andrew155 Male 18-29
    2579 posts
    July 27, 2012 at 9:05 am
    He told the truth, whether or not people liked it or not. Of course the conservative mayor and PM would get mad at him for criticizing their gross mismanagement of the olympics. They feel offended because he pointed out their incompetence.

    What`s REFRESHING is that here we have a politician telling the truth for once. If Romney does his usual political thing, people get mad. If he tells the truth, people get mad.

    Weird issue this is to have come up.
  17. Profile photo of SilverThread
    SilverThread Male 30-39
    3431 posts
    July 27, 2012 at 9:07 am
    Uh... what did he actually?

    This video looks like a useless sensationalism of some innocuous comment by Romney, but in light of the conflagration created by Obama`s statement regarding Small Businesses, this sort of retaliatory upstepping is to be expected.
  18. Profile photo of LordJim
    LordJim Male 60-69
    6952 posts
    July 27, 2012 at 9:09 am
    `And Mitt knows what it takes to run a successful games...he`s got the track record.`

    A Winter Olympics in the middle of nowhere basically bought by bribery? OK, Romney was involved post-bribery but SLC only got it through corruption.
  19. Profile photo of HumanAction
    HumanAction Male 18-29
    2357 posts
    July 27, 2012 at 9:11 am
    @HolyGod: "Jesus H Christ must EVERYTHING be liberal / conservative?"

    You are correct; there are libertarians also }-). In all reality, I have a hard time as seeing the as being unbiased. Typically an unbiased claim will include the actual quote.

    I only point out the liberal stations because I heard nothing about Obama`s massive gaffe regarding the "Polish death camps"... Fox probably reported it, but c`mon - it`s Fox.

    I`ll revise my statement when news stations begin vetting candidates equally regardless of their political agendas.

    @jtrebowski: Jim, having a hard time taking you seriously after seeing you @1:29 in The Ghost of Garganta: The Giantess Rises!...

    "It`s possible I could make contact!"
  20. Profile photo of HolyGod
    HolyGod Male 30-39
    6754 posts
    July 27, 2012 at 9:14 am
    AvatarJohn

    How could you possibly disagree with that statement? How is that Marxism?
  21. Profile photo of HolyGod
    HolyGod Male 30-39
    6754 posts
    July 27, 2012 at 9:18 am
    HumanAction

    You can feel free to say whoever cut and edited this video is liberally biased since they left it out. But just because this video only shows snippets of a news cast doesn`t imply the newscast left out the full story.

    Highly educated and highly informed people tend to be liberal. Highly educated and highly informed people tend to work in News and broadcasting. So I`m not going to deny they probably have a personal bias to some degree. But this had no bias whatsoever.
  22. Profile photo of HumanAction
    HumanAction Male 18-29
    2357 posts
    July 27, 2012 at 9:30 am
    @HolyGod: OK, so let us then compromise. While I intended to point out that this clip was biased (while certainly suggesting that the associated news stations are also liberally biased), the news snippets included don`t actually convey this (thought the overall clip certainly does).

    However, you`re paragraph about education terribly fails logically. First and foremost, education does not beget intelligence. In fact, there are many studies that suggest conservatives tend to occupy both extreme ranges of the intelligence scale (for different reasons), while liberals tend to occupy the median area (education presents differently).

    Second, the statement that "Highly educated and highly informed people tend to work in News and broadcasting" is logically fallacious. I believe you meant that News and broadcasting people tend to be highly educated and highly informed - which is still debatable.
  23. Profile photo of madduck
    madduck Female 50-59
    7560 posts
    July 27, 2012 at 9:47 am
    We are allowed to be pissed off- we have a massive corporate event which will not benefit us much ( if at all)- cause huge inconvenience to most of London and has problems- which big event doesn`t have snafus . We have a media which will pick up on this and report it- we are not good at glossy shiney lets pretend stuff. It does not mean it will be a balls up- and if Romney doesn`t understand that he will not do very well at foreign relations.
  24. Profile photo of patchgrabber
    patchgrabber Male 30-39
    5812 posts
    July 27, 2012 at 9:50 am
    I just heard that Romney retroactively prevented himself from saying that comment, so crisis averted.
  25. Profile photo of sosueme1966
    sosueme1966 Male 40-49
    439 posts
    July 27, 2012 at 9:54 am
    @Tedgp: I`m with you. The Olympics are nothing but a money wasting boondoggle. Has any city ever received long term benefit from hosting them. Just saying the Brits don`t need to jump all over Romney (although since I despise politicians equally I have enjoyed watching him squirm) because he pointed out something everyone already knew.
  26. Profile photo of SmagBoy1
    SmagBoy1 Male 40-49
    4432 posts
    July 27, 2012 at 9:59 am
    AvatarJohn, you have no effing clue what Marxism is. Too, is there any POSSIBLE way to disagree what that statement?! At all?! You were popped out of the womb already a CEO?

    As for this link, I wish they would have included his quote, but, fact it, it isn`t insulting American liberals, only folks from the UK (both conservative and liberal folks from the UK). It`s not the Americans that are up in arms, they`re just covering it--poorly (if this link is any indication). It`s the Brits. And, to me, they have a right to be. A foreign politician comes in and says true but insulting things. He mentioned the view from the "back side" of Downing Street. Shouldn`t be a problem, right? Except, back side is more strongly slang for "ass" there. Still not terribly, but just gaffe-ish. Why can`t that just be accepted and move on? Liberals here aren`t up in arms over it.
  27. Profile photo of DromEd
    DromEd Male 40-49
    1927 posts
    July 27, 2012 at 10:06 am
    Highly educated and highly informed people tend to work in News and broadcasting.

    Haaa haaaa haaaaa ROTFLMFAO!!!!
  28. Profile photo of HolyGod
    HolyGod Male 30-39
    6754 posts
    July 27, 2012 at 10:19 am
    HumanAction

    "However, you`re paragraph about education terribly fails logically. First and foremost, education does not beget intelligence."

    No it doesn`t. Studies repeatedly show that people with advanced degrees heavily skew liberal. Studies also show that viewers and listeners of conservative news and radio are the least informed people. However I completely agree that knowledge and intelligence are completely separate issues. I never said anything about intelligence. However highly intelligent people are typically more likely to seek out higher education. But there are lots of highly intelligent conservatives, especially in the leadership. They are able to consistently get poor and middle class people to vote against their own interests and manipulate their opinions to benefit themselves and their billionaire friends. That kind of control takes high intelligence.
  29. Profile photo of HolyGod
    HolyGod Male 30-39
    6754 posts
    July 27, 2012 at 10:20 am
    HumanAction

    "
    "I believe you meant that News and broadcasting people tend to be highly educated and highly informed"

    Yes. That is exactly what I meant. While I don`t have any statements or facts to back it up it tends to reason that people who make their living finding and disseminating information are typically highly informed themselves.
  30. Profile photo of HolyGod
    HolyGod Male 30-39
    6754 posts
    July 27, 2012 at 10:23 am
    DromEd

    You can ROTFLMFAO all you want. I can pretty much guarantee that the people in that video know a lot more about what is going on in the world than you do. That is their job.
  31. Profile photo of madest
    madest Male 40-49
    7378 posts
    July 27, 2012 at 10:43 am
    Yeah it`s funny that a guy named DromEd mocks the intelligence of the people who bring him his news. Dromed, you can`t believe the crap you`re watching on Fox man. They have you brainwashed. Snap out of it bro!
  32. Profile photo of FoolsPrussia
    FoolsPrussia Male 30-39
    3446 posts
    July 27, 2012 at 10:47 am
    `It`s funny now, but not so much when he gaffes it up over in Israel.`

    He did that today, claiming that the Arab Spring could have been avovided if we`d continued the Bush doctrine in the Middle East.
  33. Profile photo of DromEd
    DromEd Male 40-49
    1927 posts
    July 27, 2012 at 10:48 am
    You guys have clearly never worked in broadcasting and brought people the news. I have M`Kay. They`re just average people like any other profession. What I question is your intelligence for making such an idiotic blanket statement. You two are two of the biggest know-it-all clowns on this site.
  34. Profile photo of madest
    madest Male 40-49
    7378 posts
    July 27, 2012 at 11:00 am
    Well Dromed, My right-wing-Rush-Limbaugh-wannabe-friend. We`re just realists. What ideas are coming out of your party that will benefit anybody other than the top earners? If I understand the republican platform as it exists today they want to go to war with Iran, repeal DADT, stop funding planned parenthood, cut government employee salaries, round up illegals and force them to self deport, increase oil subsidies, let Wall street do as they please by lifting restrictions (whatever that means), cut taxes for the rich, repeal national healthcare and replace medicare with vouchers. And I`m pretty sure they have an eye on ending social security. So what is it about them you like so much? I don`t see the appeal there, go ahead call me crazy..
  35. Profile photo of BoredFrank
    BoredFrank Male 40-49
    2328 posts
    July 27, 2012 at 11:11 am
    Romney is clearly an idiot. Nice to see him proving it in front of so many cameras.

    Oh, and all you Romney-bots kissing his ass?

    He`ll still throw you under the train if he gets the chance. Dumbasses.
  36. Profile photo of HolyGod
    HolyGod Male 30-39
    6754 posts
    July 27, 2012 at 11:21 am
    DromEd

    I never said anything about intelligence. I said knowledgeable. You almost certainly can`t name the syrian ambassador to israel`s name. I can`t. But the guy who interviewed him can.

    Not that I really care what you think, but I worked for the largest Newspaper publisher in the country for 5 years.

    By the way, when people say things like "ROTFLMFAO" and "M`kay" I find it incredibly hard to take them in any way seriously. It certainly cripples whatever point you seem to think you are making. You`re almost 50, put on your big boy pants and talk like an adult if you`d like to have an adult conversation.

  37. Profile photo of HumanAction
    HumanAction Male 18-29
    2357 posts
    July 27, 2012 at 11:45 am
    @HolyGod: Ah, perhaps I was not specific enough then. Let`s divide Conservatives into two groups for the sake of argument: Social Conservatives (typically religious ones) and Fiscal Conservatives (typically the smart ones).

    Many studies show that people with fiscally conservative viewpoints are, in fact, more intelligent that they`re liberally-minded counterparts. On the other hand, studies also show that the social conservatives tend to be less intelligent.

    Unfortunately, a large percentage of the conservative base is conservative for religious or social reasons, and this skews the overall group statistic.

    The answer is quite simple really - libertarians are smarter than liberals AND conservatives }-)!
  38. Profile photo of HolyGod
    HolyGod Male 30-39
    6754 posts
    July 27, 2012 at 11:53 am
    HumanAction

    I voted for Bush the first time. I grew up conservative and identified as one. "Fiscal conservatives" don`t exist. I agree that it used to be a platform, but it is only a talking point now. conservatives are only fiscally conservative when a democrat is in the white house. Look at government spending and federal deficit when republicans are president.

    I consider myself a libertarian.
  39. Profile photo of LordJim
    LordJim Male 60-69
    6952 posts
    July 27, 2012 at 11:56 am
    If you have ever used the term `m`kay` then you should punch ourself in the face repeatedly. And don`t hold back, give it some welly. If you have used it while thinking it makes you sound like Bill Hicks, then take something pointed and jab it into somewhere soft and painful until you understand.
  40. Profile photo of Grendel
    Grendel Male 40-49
    6171 posts
    July 27, 2012 at 11:58 am
    HolyGod-"Highly educated and highly informed people tend to be liberal."

    Nope, they are just under the delusion that they are `enlightened`. The entire `liberals are more intelligent` bull has been debunked repeatedly.

    HolyGod-"Highly educated and highly informed people tend to work in News and broadcasting."

    Annnd you heard that on a News report...right? ("Hey! WE`RE SMART!!! Film at eleven.")

    Highly educated people tend to work in REAL jobs. People with barely the ability to read a teleprompter work in News and broadcasting.
  41. Profile photo of HumanAction
    HumanAction Male 18-29
    2357 posts
    July 27, 2012 at 12:44 pm
    @HolyGod: That`s fair enough - I too consider myself a libertarian; I suppose it would be rather unrealistic to have someone who opposes large government spending (fiscal), but supports morally/religiously-motivated national laws.

    Perhaps this is partially to blame for the recent emergence of the libertarian party?

    That being said, I did clearly state "fiscally conservative viewpoints" instead of fiscal conservative in my last argument.

    @madest: Ask and you shall receive - Intellectual Elite Are Fiscally Conservative. This society allows only those who score in the top 0.1% of IQs.
  42. Profile photo of madest
    madest Male 40-49
    7378 posts
    July 27, 2012 at 2:05 pm
    Please. That`s not a study. That`s what 9 intelligent people think. In fact they fall more in line with my ideals than any conservative ideals. They are pro weed legalization, pro prostitution legalization. How did you expect to impart that as empirical evidence of fiscal conservative genius?
  43. Profile photo of HumanAction
    HumanAction Male 18-29
    2357 posts
    July 27, 2012 at 2:17 pm
    @madest: "pro weed legalization, pro prostitution legalization"

    Not a single one of those has any thing to do with anything fiscal. Do you know what fiscal means? Or are you purposefully being stupid?
  44. Profile photo of HumanAction
    HumanAction Male 18-29
    2357 posts
    July 27, 2012 at 2:29 pm
    @madest: Actually, you`re comment was so ridiculous that I have to keep going. There`s no other option here.

    There are approximately 980 people in this society. They represent the intellectual elite (top 0.1% of IQs). This is statistically significant.

    As for you comment, let`s see...

    Weed Legalization, fiscal in nature? Nope.
    Prostitution Legalization, fiscal in nature? No again...

    So let`s define the word fiscal for all the madest`s out there:

    Fiscal - adjective
    1. of or pertaining to the public treasury or revenues: fiscal policies.
    2. of or pertaining to financial matters in general.

    You`re not helping your liberal friends. Best to leave the conversation to adults.
  45. Profile photo of HolyGod
    HolyGod Male 30-39
    6754 posts
    July 27, 2012 at 3:24 pm
    Megrendel

    "The entire `liberals are more intelligent` bull has been debunked repeatedly"

    For the 4th (I think) time on this thread I will say: Educated and Informed does not mean intelligent. I never made a statement that liberals are smarter.

    You argue the highly educated thing?

    "A Pew Research Center study found that liberals were the most educated ideological demographic and were tied with the conservative sub-group, the "Enterprisers", for the most affluent group. Of those who identified as liberal, 49% were college graduates and 41% had household incomes exceeding $75,000, compared to 27% and 28% as the national average, respectively. Liberalism has become the dominant political ideology in academia, with 44-62% identifying as liberal"

    "Highly educated people tend to work in REAL jobs."

    What is a "real" job? What do you do?
  46. Profile photo of Grendel
    Grendel Male 40-49
    6171 posts
    July 27, 2012 at 7:38 pm
    HolyGod-"A Pew Research Center study found.."

    The National Election Studies (NES) database demonstrates that Republicans are more likely to have a 4-year college degree (for males 35% vs. 22%, females 27% vs 20%).

    The same database found the Republicans tend to be more successful.

    A democrat is twice as likely to be receiving food stamps (10.4% vs. 5.1%) and more than twice as likely to receive food stamps (23% vs. 10%).

    Source: Democrats and Republicans--rhetoric and reality. By Joseph Fried.

    HolyGod-"What is a "real" job?"

    A job that provides a real service, product or advancement. Not one that presents opinion as `fact`.

    HolyGod-"What do you do?"

    Research Chemist. Along with some graphic design and desktop publishing on the side. (need a logo?)
  47. Profile photo of OldOllie
    OldOllie Male 60-69
    15841 posts
    July 27, 2012 at 11:01 pm
    Obama`s gaffes were mush worse than Romney`s, but the socialist British press deliberately downplayed Obama`s insults and have played Romney`s statements to the max. For instance, when Obama returned the bust of Chirchill, when he gave the Queen an iPod with his speeches, when he gave the prime minister a set of DVDs that can`t be played on a British DVD player, when Michelle put her hand on the Queen, etc. In all these cases, the British press made excuses for Obama, but when Romney questions whether the Brits are fully prepared for the Olympics -- something he knows just a little bit about, and something MANY other Brits have questioned as well -- the left-wing @$$holes start flinging their turds like disgruntled chimps.
  48. Profile photo of furrything
    furrything Male 50-59
    1340 posts
    July 28, 2012 at 12:38 am
    I don`t think the average Brit even KNOWS who Mitt Romney is!
  49. Profile photo of Solvent
    Solvent Male 18-29
    2842 posts
    July 28, 2012 at 2:13 am
    Those tea drinking surrender monkeys will find any excuse to hate the greatest country on the planet.
  50. Profile photo of madest
    madest Male 40-49
    7378 posts
    July 28, 2012 at 5:22 am
    OK well "Fiscal conservatism" doesn`t represent any republicans in our government. You`re guild of genius`s are libertarian not conservative. They would eliminate subsidies. The house voted along party lines to keep subsidies for oil companies. Perhaps they`re democrat or you`re democrat and you think yourself too smart to know it. Here`s proof about the intelligence of your social conservative couterparts. The dumb people like your party. Be proud.
  51. Profile photo of sutra46
    sutra46 Female 40-49
    2550 posts
    July 28, 2012 at 6:20 am
    He caught the foot in mouth disease :-)
  52. Profile photo of FredSpudman
    FredSpudman Male 18-29
    653 posts
    July 28, 2012 at 6:43 am
    @sosueme1966
    "Has any city ever received long term benefit from hosting them."

    Lillehammer and Barcelona did just fine. Where the Olympic site is in London was an industrial wasteland surrounded by marsh. It now has a massive shopping centre, great venues, good infrastructure and better transport.
  53. Profile photo of FredSpudman
    FredSpudman Male 18-29
    653 posts
    July 28, 2012 at 6:46 am
    @DromEd "Weak sauce madest. One...the report didn`t even include Mitt`s comments, just the reaction of toffy nosed Brits."

    Your spelling belies the fact you are somewhat lacking on the cogent political debate front. If our Leader of the Opposition had gone over to Alanta and said "Ooh, I don`t know if this is going to be a decent Games" there`d have been an excremental storm. I think calling the reaction toffy (sic) nose is an act of gross ignorance, or at best gross distortion.
  54. Profile photo of FredSpudman
    FredSpudman Male 18-29
    653 posts
    July 28, 2012 at 6:48 am
    @Solvent It`s depressing that you`re too simple to get even racial stereotypes correct. The British aren`t renowned for giving up the ghost.
  55. Profile photo of HumanAction
    HumanAction Male 18-29
    2357 posts
    July 28, 2012 at 7:16 am
    @madest: I`m a libertarian you fool; I`ve stated it many times.

    Also, I never said anything about Republicans or Democrats - merely conservative beliefs and liberal beliefs.

    In addition, the link you`ve provided is evidence, not proof, although I have already agreed with it`s findings when I said this: "Many studies show that people with fiscally conservative viewpoints are, in fact, more intelligent that they`re liberally-minded counterparts. On the other hand, studies also show that the social conservatives tend to be less intelligent." This would be one of those "many studies" I`ve alluded to.

    I can tell you`re a liberal, because once your point in dissolved, you simply latch onto something else.
  56. Profile photo of HumanAction
    HumanAction Male 18-29
    2357 posts
    July 28, 2012 at 7:18 am
    @madest: "They would eliminate subsidies"

    This is known as fiscal conservatism.
  57. Profile photo of madest
    madest Male 40-49
    7378 posts
    July 28, 2012 at 7:39 am
    Libertarian has both conservative and democratic principals all wrapped up in one sweet little package. Sadly no true libertarian exists. Ron Paul turned out to be a religious kook who`s libertarian streak got muddied by what he thinks his God approves of. Your group of intelligent people are all for taxes of some sort, national healthcare and they`d like to see generous subsidies in science and drug research so how libertarian are they? That link was posted in 2000 and an election was near and they ranked the candidates by who they thought was smartest. Their top 4 (not named were eliminated from the race) and the 5th was Al Gore. Dead last was obviously that retard George Bush who I doubt they voted for.
  58. Profile photo of HumanAction
    HumanAction Male 18-29
    2357 posts
    July 28, 2012 at 7:50 am
    @madest: Liberal does not mean Democrat, and Conservative does not mean Republican. There are Liberal Republicans (George Bush) and Conservative Democrats. Trying to mix the two does nothing more than blur the message.

    As for Ron Paul, I think it`s a pretty radical stretch to call him a religious kook. He consistently states that he is religious, but that it is a private matter and has no bearing on his political beliefs. Here is one of his many quotes on the subject:

    "My faith is a deeply private issue to me, and I don’t speak on it in great detail during my speeches because I want to avoid any appearance of exploiting it for political gain."

    As for taxation, libertarians understand that there must be some for the purposes stated in the Constitution (national defense, etc.) These libertarians suggest a national flat tax or a flat-rate income tax. These concepts are fiscally conservative.
  59. Profile photo of madest
    madest Male 40-49
    7378 posts
    July 28, 2012 at 8:10 am
    Anybody who places science behind a 2000 year old book written by uneducated nomads is a religious kook. He`s a friggin Doctor who denies evolution. Come on with the pass you and other Paullites give him.
  60. Profile photo of HumanAction
    HumanAction Male 18-29
    2357 posts
    July 28, 2012 at 8:22 am
    @madest: I`ve noticed that you haven`t defended any of your debunked points. Instead, you always migrate to a more granular, albeit insignificant "point".

    If you don`t like Ron Paul because he is religious (even though he clearly states that he would never let his religion impact political decisions), then you are simply a bigot; an anti-religion bigot.

    This would be the same line of reasoning as the social conservatives - many of which did not support Obama because he is black. There were/are, in fact, much better reasons not to support Obama.

    Unfortunately, it seems to be an ever-increasing concept that it is fine to discriminate for some reasons, and not others.

    So, let me ask you this: do you dislike Ron Paul because he is privately religious (as you`ve indicated), or is there another reason? If so, please tell me that reason so I can debunk that one also.
  61. Profile photo of madest
    madest Male 40-49
    7378 posts
    July 28, 2012 at 8:39 am
    You haven`t debunked anything. You`re claiming that intelligent people are fiscally conservative when the link you provided does not prove anything. A study might, but a group of highly intelligent people who share ideas that seem to me more "liberal" than conservative or libertarian doesn`t prove a thing. No more so than a group of billionaires who support conservatism prove that rich people are conservative. I know you think you won some internet argument with your link but I don`t think you did.
  62. Profile photo of HumanAction
    HumanAction Male 18-29
    2357 posts
    July 28, 2012 at 8:54 am
    @madest: Oh no, you`re mistaken; it wasn`t the link that won the argument. The argument was won via logic.

    "seem to me more "liberal" than conservative or libertarian"

    Let`s review the poll`s summary.

    "The TNS opinions sampled here show a clear preference for minimal government involvement in personal lifestyle matters (drugs, alcohol, tobacco, firearms, pornography, gambling) and commercial business (subsidies, genetic engineering, Internet commerce, trade with China)."

    Now, lets just dump the first definition I find for libertarian in here and see how it compares...

    1. One who believes that the only legitimate purpose of a government is to protect the rights of its citizens. (check)
    2. Anyone who supports civil liberties to a greater-than-average degree. (check)
    3. Anyone who believes in minimal, decentralized government. (check)
  63. Profile photo of HumanAction
    HumanAction Male 18-29
    2357 posts
    July 28, 2012 at 8:55 am
    @madest: Yep... they`re libertarians.
  64. Profile photo of madest
    madest Male 40-49
    7378 posts
    July 28, 2012 at 9:32 am
    You haven`t provided any factual evidence that proves your thesis that the more intelligent you are the more libertarian you are. On the other hand I provided a link to a study that both you and I agree with that dumb people are socially conservative. I don`t think there is a study that proves your point but if you ever find one you`ll know where to find me.
    I donated to the Ron Paul campaign the first time around. Back then he trusted in evolution and I know that because he was not one of the 3 candidates who raised their when questioned on it. Someone got a hold of him after that run and made him bow to social conservatives this time around. Turns out he`s a pussy and not someone I could vote for much less respect. If you`re a libertarian who supports Ron Paul you`re either not a libertarian or not paying attention.
  65. Profile photo of HumanAction
    HumanAction Male 18-29
    2357 posts
    July 28, 2012 at 9:58 am
    @madest: Whoa there, don`t put words in my mouth - that is not my thesis. I`m am merely pointing out that those with socially liberal viewpoints, and fiscally conservatives viewpoints tend to be more intelligent.

    As for proof, neither of us haven given any "proof". We are merely presenting evidence that aligns with our points (See: How a Debate Works). Your study is irrelevant as a debate item, because I`ve agreed with the findings - there`s nothing to debate there.

    As for Ron Paul, I am fairly certain I`m more informed than the average; I am aware of what he has said; I`ve also attended some of his speeches. With that in mind, Ron Paul is lightyears ahead of Obama or Romney as a libertarian. Also, libertarians don`t assume anyone has a particular personal belief nor do we discriminate against them for it. It only matters if it affects the individual liberties of others (which this doesn`t).
  66. Profile photo of madest
    madest Male 40-49
    7378 posts
    July 28, 2012 at 10:30 am
    That`s the problem with Ron Paul. His freedom and liberty mantra ends where his religion begins. He`s against abortion. Not that I really care because I`m a guy, but as a guy I know that if men gave birth abortions would be government provided and available at your local 7-11. Forcing somebody against their will to give birth to a baby they don`t want is not anywhere near libertarian. He`s also stated that marriage rights should be decided by the states and clearly that`s another nod to the religious freaks. The 14th amendment is nationwide not on a "if states agree" basis. Another thing, because you`ve seen Ron Paul does not mean you understand his positions better than those who haven`t, there`s this crazy website called Youtube that has endless hours of the guy speaking.
  67. Profile photo of HumanAction
    HumanAction Male 18-29
    2357 posts
    July 28, 2012 at 10:47 am
    @madest: While he is strongly against abortion, he has consistently and firmly stated that it is a matter of states` rights. This is libertarian, as in, we agree with limited government and state sovereignty.

    There is a very important concept that is commonly overlooked in this type of debate - personal beliefs vs. political agenda. Ron Paul certainly has some personal beliefs that I don`t agree with, but his political agenda is that of limited federal government and states` rights.

    I mean, you wouldn`t turn away a plumber because he is pro-life (even though that has no impact on his ability to perform his work), or would you?
  68. Profile photo of madest
    madest Male 40-49
    7378 posts
    July 28, 2012 at 10:59 am
    Ron Paul could fix my toilet any day. I don`t agree with the states-rights crowd either because I think ones constitutional rights should follow them nationwide.
  69. Profile photo of HumanAction
    HumanAction Male 18-29
    2357 posts
    July 28, 2012 at 11:06 am
    @madest: Well, states` rights are provided in the Constitution; agree or disagree with them - they are there.

    I believe that there is a much more fundamental way to categorize political beliefs. There are those who want to control others (liberals and conservatives), and those who have no such desire (libertarians).

    Let me propose this example of various mindsets regarding gay rights:

    A liberal suggests we should make legislation to allow gays to marry.
    A conservative suggests we should make legislation to prevent gays from marrying.
    A libertarian suggests we REMOVE the current illegal legislation preventing gays from marrying.

    So, for healthcare:

    A liberal asks, "how can you oppose saving lives?"
    A conservative asks, "how can you support raising taxes?"
    A libertarian asks, "what business is this of the government?"
  70. Profile photo of HumanAction
    HumanAction Male 18-29
    2357 posts
    July 28, 2012 at 11:08 am
    @madest: "I think ones constitutional rights should follow them nationwide."

    ... your Constitutional rights do follow you nationwide ... That`s why they are Constitutional rights.
  71. Profile photo of madest
    madest Male 40-49
    7378 posts
    July 28, 2012 at 11:46 am
    I can answer the libertarians question. Healthcare professionals are required by oath to care for the infirmed. We tried not caring and the end result was increased costs for taxpayers and those who were insured. If they`re not willing to protect themselves with insurance why should the burden be placed on the responsible citizen? That`s certainly not fair. National healthcare isn`t a tax increase. It`s a deadbeat stopper.
  72. Profile photo of HumanAction
    HumanAction Male 18-29
    2357 posts
    July 28, 2012 at 12:03 pm
    "We tried not caring"
    No we didn`t. Hopsitals MUST provide emergency care (since 1986 - see EMTALA). That`s forced caring, not the other way around. We also have medicare/medicaid, which are certainly not "not caring."

    "the end result was increased costs for taxpayers and those who were insured"
    This was the result of caring. See above.

    "If they`re not willing to protect themselves with insurance why should the burden be placed on the responsible citizen?"
    This is a libertarian stance. I agree 100%.

    "National healthcare isn`t a tax increase."
    Yes it is; the Supreme Court has stated so.

    The problem with your argument is that you assume that national healthcare will provide care for the "deadbeats" at no increased cost to the rest of us. Logically, this doesn`t make sense. The money must come from somewhere, and since it`s a governmental program, it will come from raising taxe
  73. Profile photo of madest
    madest Male 40-49
    7378 posts
    July 28, 2012 at 12:11 pm
    OK It`s a tax increase on the uninsured. The deadbeats of society. I`ve been insured my whole life. National healthcare won`t be a tax increase on me. In fact my insurance company will probably be sending me a check later this summer. Booya!
  74. Profile photo of HumanAction
    HumanAction Male 18-29
    2357 posts
    July 28, 2012 at 12:14 pm
    @madest: "OK It`s a tax increase on the uninsured. The deadbeats of society." I am uninsured because I own a business, and save 20% of my income. If something tragic were to happen to my health, I could pay for it out of pocket.

    Do NOT tell me that I am a deadbeat because I have been responsible with my decisions and savings and refuse to take part in a scheme that statistically will cost me more over the span of my life than paying out of pocket will.

    Enjoy your check. You stole it from me.
  75. Profile photo of madest
    madest Male 40-49
    7378 posts
    July 28, 2012 at 12:22 pm
    There was an uninsured victim in the Aurora shooting. He`s facing medical costs upward of $2,000,000. Don`t be a deadbeat, join society and get insurance. Your genius`s would approve.
  76. Profile photo of HumanAction
    HumanAction Male 18-29
    2357 posts
    July 28, 2012 at 12:29 pm
    @madest: Don`t be a deadbeat and try to justify your theiving ways. Wake up and realize that small businesses provide your income through economic stimulation (and provides your health care).

    Also, even if that person were insured, he would eat most of that cost.

    In addition, this is the role of private charity, not government you tyrant.
  77. Profile photo of HumanAction
    HumanAction Male 18-29
    2357 posts
    July 28, 2012 at 12:37 pm
    @madest: Allow me to ask you this - how much have you saved for retirement? Will it be enough, or will you depend on milking the social security teet of society? No, perhaps you have a state/federal pension and will continue to draw from society well after retirement.

    I have a business, and savings. I won`t need any of that. You`re the deadbeat here, don`t be confused.
  78. Profile photo of madest
    madest Male 40-49
    7378 posts
    July 28, 2012 at 12:39 pm
    Look man. You`re way too high minded. Your small business doesn`t provide me with jack. You`re trying to give off this vibe that you`re so damn smart that you`re uninsured so therefore it must be what smart people do, and if anything goes wrong you`ll be fine because you saved up for such an event. I think you`re fulla crap. You talk up these genius`s and how libertarian they are but they support national healthcare so please get a ladder and climb down off that horse and realize that you are not onto the secrets of life anymore than the authors of the Bible were.
  79. Profile photo of HumanAction
    HumanAction Male 18-29
    2357 posts
    July 28, 2012 at 12:44 pm
    Look man - you`re way too small minded. You act as if you know some inside secrets about economics and that you`re intelligence will spare you specifically from the affects of devaluing liberty.

    I think you`re probably of average intelligence.

    My libertarian friends said this:

    "The preference in public health care policy is for a system that provides care and medical supplies to the poor and the elderly (favored by 67% to 74%), but not necessarily to all people"

    This is not Obamacare, which extends to everyone. All of your attacks thus far have been mis-quotes and subjective reasoning.

    So please, grab a ladder, climb off that horse, and realize that you are just another sheep lacking any real knowledge of your preachings.
  80. Profile photo of madest
    madest Male 40-49
    7378 posts
    July 28, 2012 at 12:50 pm
    Yeah I`m going to "milk" my entitlement called Social security, I work in the private sector for a small business owner and I`ve been paying into it since I was 16 and according to all the mailers I`ve received I`ve been entitled to the maximum payout since my mid 20`s. I also have a supplemental 401k and a mutual fund. Sadly, both of those have lost half their value twice in my career. But don`t you worry, I`ll be just fine thanks to my entitlement.
  81. Profile photo of HumanAction
    HumanAction Male 18-29
    2357 posts
    July 28, 2012 at 12:56 pm
    @madest: "Sadly, both of those have lost half their value twice in my career."

    If this be the case, then they were mismanaged; you are, at very least, partially responsible for this (since you likely chose the manager). We must accept the consequences of our actions and decisions.

    Allow me to offer you this:

    If you have been voting for politicians who promise to give you goodies at someone else`s expense, then you have no right to complain when they take your money and give it to someone else, including themselves. – Thomas Sowell (1992)

    My argument is, and always will be, that we must (as individuals) be responsible for our actions and decisions. With this, we must accept the consequences. This is the definition of liberty.
  82. Profile photo of madest
    madest Male 40-49
    7378 posts
    July 28, 2012 at 2:29 pm
    You cannot legislate away empathy. Perhaps that`s the flaw with libertarianism.
  83. Profile photo of HumanAction
    HumanAction Male 18-29
    2357 posts
    July 28, 2012 at 2:49 pm
    @madest: Perhaps the fallacy in your statement is that you assume there exists a flaw in libertarianism?

    A different way to look at it is this - legislation is meaningless without social acceptance and morality. For example, anti-marijuana laws are widely ineffective; why? Because society deems it to be acceptable.

    Unfortunately, society does not deem Obamacare acceptable nor moral - especially the individual mandate aspect of it. The purpose of the individual mandate it to increase funding in order to balance out treatment for those most in need.

    Most Americans Still Oppose Obamacare

    Since I am a fan of old-timey quotes:

    "To compel a man to furnish contributions of money for the propagation of opinions which he disbelieves and abhors, is sinful and tyrannical.&quo
  84. Profile photo of HumanAction
    HumanAction Male 18-29
    2357 posts
    July 28, 2012 at 2:55 pm
    Also, we Libertarians still believe in empathy - we just believe in being empathetic via private donations and charity.

    There will certainly be cases like the uninsured man in Aurora. My niece was born with a heart defect that cost us hundreds-of-thousands of dollars in open heart surgery. Insurance would never have covered the surgeries (my sister/the mother is a nurse and is fully insured).

    Private business and personal donations from the family and community allowed her to get the treatment she needed.

    People will be empathetic towards those deserving our empathy. Government should not force us to be empathetic towards those who do not deserve it. I think you probably agree.
  85. Profile photo of robosnitz
    robosnitz Male 40-49
    2737 posts
    July 28, 2012 at 3:15 pm
    RON PAUL 2012!!!!!
  86. Profile photo of madest
    madest Male 40-49
    7378 posts
    July 28, 2012 at 3:48 pm
    Most Americans Still Oppose Obamacare.------
    We don`t run this country by polls as I`m sure you`d point out if said otherwise. What`s to like? It hasn`t even kicked in yet. What I like most about Obamacare is not all the people it`s going to help but all the people it`s going to F. Yeah F as in F in some dry deserving A. Healthcare CEO`s! These nimrods didn`t see the writing on the wall in the Reagan / Clinton years. No, they doubled down. They used these giant machinations as piggy banks. Instead of granting claims they hired lawyers looking for reasons to deny claims. When quotas weren`t met they fired supervisors, had to make sure CEO and investors got theirs and boy did they. Now it`s our turn. Under Obamacare they must spend 80% of premiums on care, what`s left goes back to customers not investors. All those CEO`s cutting their $50,000,000 salaries makes my nipples hard. I don`t care if the majority doesn`t like Obamacare, I do and that`s all that matters.
  87. Profile photo of HumanAction
    HumanAction Male 18-29
    2357 posts
    July 28, 2012 at 10:00 pm
    @madest: I won`t disagree that many CEOs have taken advantage of the system. However, it is tough to criticize capitalism since we haven`t had it for a very long time.

    I don`t support Obama because, as it always the case with government, this will be a fine example of croney capitalism. Unfortunately, Obama has consistently shown his support for corporations and CEOs.

    Let me ask you this - since when did you start trusting the government with our money? Was it in lieu of their excellent track record? Of course not - they don`t have an excellent track record. In fact, Obama`s record is downright abysmal.

    Simply put, Americans are being duped. We`ve been led to believe that these actions are being done as a favor to us, but they aren`t. They are a sinister handout to tempt those too blind to see that our freedoms are being attacked.
  88. Profile photo of 5Cats
    5Cats Male 50-59
    32813 posts
    July 28, 2012 at 10:39 pm
    @madest: You`ve truely run amuk here, and accidentally shown your true colours!

    I wouldn`t be the least bit surprised if you deleted half your comments due to shame!

    If only you had the capacity to understand how pathetic you really are...

    PS: Human Action: keep the faith Bro! @madest does NOT NOT NOT represent IAB ok?
  89. Profile photo of madest
    madest Male 40-49
    7378 posts
    July 29, 2012 at 5:38 am
    Let me ask you this - since when did you start trusting the government with our money? --------
    I`m not a government hater. And thanks to government research, testing and implementation I can tell you that via the internet. Yeah there`s waste but waste isn`t limited to the government. Every entity is wasteful. Thomas Paine was a wise founding father, he said in -Agrarian Justice Part Three:

    Separate an individual from society, and give him an island or a continent to possess, and he cannot acquire personal property. He cannot be rich. So inseparably are the means connected with the end, in all cases, that where the former do not exist the latter cannot be obtained. All accumulation, therefore, of personal property, beyond what a man`s own hands produce, is derived to him by living in society; and he owes on every principle of justice, of gratitude, and of civilization, a part of that accumulation back again to society from whence the whole came.
  90. Profile photo of HumanAction
    HumanAction Male 18-29
    2357 posts
    July 29, 2012 at 8:21 am
    @madest: ... but your quote talks about society, not government. We are, after all, pack animals so this quote makes sense.

    Unfortunately, in the case of Obamacare, the money will need to come from taxes. Simple economics demand that, if we are to treat all people the same, regardless of their state of health, then those who underuse the system will pay more than they get from it.

    This system discriminates against healthy, and young people. I do not smoke, eat properly, exercise properly and get a physical (check-up) once a year - which I pay for out of pocket }-).

    With this system in place, those of us who have been responsible with our health up to this point, are penalized. The incentive to independently stay healthy falls, as the cost for all health levels becomes more constant.

    If you are in good health, you will pay more than your fair share for this.
  91. Profile photo of madest
    madest Male 40-49
    7378 posts
    July 29, 2012 at 1:58 pm
    I have no problem taxing those who don`t have insurance. It`s their fault we`re in this mess. It`s not a tax increase for me. I have insurance. Always have. Never needed it by the way and I`m knockin on 50. Look at it this way, now you got 20% extra to spend.
  92. Profile photo of HumanAction
    HumanAction Male 18-29
    2357 posts
    July 29, 2012 at 8:44 pm
    @madest: No... and no.

    The government is why we are in this mess, not the uninsured - they are the ones trying to regulate what should be a free market. Hospitals should have the right to turn people away.

    "I have no problem taxing those who don`t have insurance"

    So you support discrimination as long as it is against minority groups that you don`t like? I believe this line of thinking led to the Jim Crow laws.

    "It`s not a tax increase for me"

    We shall see - I expect you will see an increase. It`s been argued both ways.

    "Never needed it by the way and I`m knockin on 50"

    Congratulations - quite a bit of money spent without a return of that investment though.

    "Look at it this way, now you got 20% extra to spend."

    This line of thinking is why we are in this mess.
  93. Profile photo of madest
    madest Male 40-49
    7378 posts
    July 30, 2012 at 3:38 am
    In no way do I support discrimination. I think everyone has to pull their weight. You`re just a dick. You`re one of these douchebags who thinks you got it all figured out. You can`t be Mr. Rule of law and say I`m not going to ever need insurance because I won`t get sick and I`ll have the money to pay for any ailment. Tell that to the Aurora victims. Screw you. The health care law pisses you off and that in and of itself makes me happy. My way won. Your way lost. Haha douchebag. Your free ride ends here.
  94. Profile photo of HumanAction
    HumanAction Male 18-29
    2357 posts
    July 30, 2012 at 5:08 am
    @madest: You`re clearly upset that I`ve shown all of the inconsistencies in your argument. Since you are a typical liberal, I should have expected the argument would be reduced to simple name-calling; to think, you are the one here twice my elder. Allow me to once again rebut your misquotes and misguidings.

    "I think everyone has to pull their weight".
    I provide jobs to my community. Do you?

    "You can`t be Mr. Rule of law and say I`m not going to ever need insurance because I won`t get sick"
    I never said that (you sure do like putting words in peoples mouths). Certainly insurance is a good thing - at some point, I will assess it more reasonable to buy it. At 23, and in good health, it is a risk I am willing to take.

    "Tell that to the Aurora victims"
    We`ve addressed this - multiple times. Remember? Private charity... I know - this mind slips with age.

    "My way won"
    My state isn`t participating - hah
  95. Profile photo of HumanAction
    HumanAction Male 18-29
    2357 posts
    July 30, 2012 at 5:19 am
    @madest: I very much do enjoy arguing with you; anticipating where your next outburst will take us is most entertaining.
  96. Profile photo of madest
    madest Male 40-49
    7378 posts
    July 30, 2012 at 6:28 am
    You haven`t shown any inconsistencies in my argument. You`re one of these dumb uninsured jerkoffs that don`t understand the definition of the word "accident" they happen everyday and to people who don`t plan for them. Stop the nonsense. I don`t care if you have an accident. I don`t care. What I care about is if I have one, money is not a concern.
  97. Profile photo of HumanAction
    HumanAction Male 18-29
    2357 posts
    July 30, 2012 at 6:47 am
    @madest: So let`s further your logic...

    Blacks Overburden the Prison System... So let`s tax them!

    Democrats Overburden Social Services; so let`s tax them as well!

    You`re Generation "Got Us Into This Mess"... So let`s also tax your generation!

    See, madest likes to discriminate as long as nobody calls it discrimination. Taxing one group of people because they "burden" the system is discrimination. The SYSTEM is the problem - not the group.
  98. Profile photo of HumanAction
    HumanAction Male 18-29
    2357 posts
    July 30, 2012 at 6:48 am
    @madest: You`re one of these dumb liberal jerkoffs that doesn`t understand the definition of the word "economics." It happens every day and to everyone; even those who don`t plan for it.
  99. Profile photo of madest
    madest Male 40-49
    7378 posts
    July 30, 2012 at 7:04 am
    Democrats overburden social services? LOL, you haven`t had a run in with CrakrJak yet have you? He`s on disability. Sucks on the government nipple day in and day out and he`s right of Cheney. The poll you provided on that btw doesn`t prove democrats overburden the system it proves dumb people partake in polls. You`d know that from George Bush`s re-election.
  100. Profile photo of HumanAction
    HumanAction Male 18-29
    2357 posts
    July 30, 2012 at 7:11 am
    @madest: Ah great, so we can introduce exceptions into the argument and act as if they are the norm. Well then, this makes the conversation much more interesting.

    I also noticed that you didn`t defend your stance that discrimination is OK. Am I to assume that you now understand that your proposition is discrimination, and you are fine with that?
  101. Profile photo of madest
    madest Male 40-49
    7378 posts
    July 30, 2012 at 7:20 am
    Really? You think CJ is the exception not the rule? I know several in my private life and you`ve only been a member here since July. You`ll see what I mean. There`s even right wing conservative cat loving Canadians. Lots of dumb people on the planet sadly.
  102. Profile photo of HumanAction
    HumanAction Male 18-29
    2357 posts
    July 30, 2012 at 7:34 am
    @madest: There certainly are many unintelligent and government-coddled people from both groups. I`ve provided a peer-reviewed study that suggests that a higher percentage of government-entitlement recipients are Democrats. The best thing to do to further your point would be to find some contradictory evidence.

    That being said, I hardly look at I-A-B as a significant sample size, let alone a significant sample pool/population.

    I`m still waiting for your counter on the following subjects:

    1. You are fine with discimination.
    2. You have yet to show how you, "pull your weight" more than I. I am responsible for creating jobs, are you?
    3. You have yet to counter my argument that special victims (as in Aurora) should receive benefits via private charity and donations rather than government.
    4. You have yet to provide an argument as to how Obamacare will not punish the healthy (economics argument).
  103. Profile photo of madest
    madest Male 40-49
    7378 posts
    July 30, 2012 at 7:58 am
    Peer reviewed proof? Come on you provided a poll. Mississippi is one of the leading welfare states in the nation and it`s solidly republican. Same could be said for Alabama, Arizona, Tennessee, Florida. When you`re looking up the word accident look up peer review.
  104. Profile photo of HumanAction
    HumanAction Male 18-29
    2357 posts
    July 30, 2012 at 8:05 am
    @madest: Before I look anything up, I think you should look up the definition of proof and the definition of evidence. I have consistently submitted my articles as evidence.

    You, on the other hand, have declared quite a bit of evidence to be proof... Perhaps you only consider it proof if it is in your favor? You should read into Confirmation Bias while you`re looking up the definitions above.

    Also, there is a very strong difference between STATES and INDIVIDUALS. Yes, there is evidence that Republican STATES use more entitlement money. However, there is just as much EVIDENCE that Democratic INDIVIDUALS use more entitlement money.

    Still waiting on your response for the other listed topics.
  105. Profile photo of madest
    madest Male 40-49
    7378 posts
    July 30, 2012 at 8:15 am
    I don`t need to do any work for you. I`m stating fact. If you don`t believe that Mississippi is the leading welfare state look it up. If you don`t believe they are solidly republican look up their voting history. I don`t work for you and I don`t Google my statements for peer reviewed studies that support my views (an NPR poll is not a peer reviwed study btw but I guess that little nugget didn`t resonate). I`m a reader. I read newspapers everyday, it`s an addiction and it`s wrong because trees die to provide me with news. How liberal is that?
  106. Profile photo of HumanAction
    HumanAction Male 18-29
    2357 posts
    July 30, 2012 at 8:40 am
    @madest: You should go back and read my previous post again; I agreed with you about Republican states (so no worries - you don`t need to look that one up).

    However, at first glance, your "facts" appear to be wrong. According to CNBC,

    California is the Leading Welfare Recipient... Democratic states - can`t live with `em... well that`s about it.

    As for the NPR study, "The survey research team included Mollyann Brodie, Ph.D., Liz Hamel, Bianca DiJulio, Sarah Cho, and Theresa Boston
    from the Kaiser Family Foundation; and Joe Neel, Vickie Walton, Steve Drummond, Uri Berliner and Anne Gudenkauf from NPR." Two seperate organizations had teams working on this - I consider that peer-reviewed.

    Still waiting on your response for the other listed topics.
  107. Profile photo of HumanAction
    HumanAction Male 18-29
    2357 posts
    July 30, 2012 at 8:43 am
    @madest: Actually, according to that study - Democratic states rank as follows in welfare usage:

    #1 - California
    #2 - Maine
    #4 - Massachusetts
    #5 - Vermont
    #6 - DC
    #7 - New York
    #8 - Minnesota
    #9 - Washington
    #10 - New Mexico
    #11 - Indiana
    #12 - Rhode Island
    #13 - Michigan
    #14 - Pennsylvania
    #15 - Oregon

    In fact, the only Republican-leaning state on the list is #3 - Tennessee.

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