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Category: Misc
Date: 06/20/12 02:20 PM

138 Responses to In 50 Years Will People Still Believe In God?

  1. Profile photo of kitteh9lives
    kitteh9lives Female 70 & Over
    8044 posts
    June 20, 2012 at 9:18 am
    Link: In 50 Years Will People Still Believe In God? - The rising numbers for people under 30 who identify as non-believers and what that might mean in the future.
  2. Profile photo of Neoptolemos
    Neoptolemos Male 30-39
    625 posts
    June 20, 2012 at 2:32 pm
    Please, let`s hope so.
    Don`t get me wrong, I still want everyone to be free to believe whatever they want to believe. But if religion would go extinct, not a single tear would be shed by me
  3. Profile photo of bataleon27
    bataleon27 Male 18-29
    1178 posts
    June 20, 2012 at 2:38 pm
    At the end of the day, it`s a personal choice, but I really think the world would be a better place without religion.
  4. Profile photo of TheGuySmiley
    TheGuySmiley Male 18-29
    1243 posts
    June 20, 2012 at 2:39 pm
    Yes, people will believe in God for all time to come. Of this, you can be certain! In due time, every person that ever lived will know the truth about God: God is real, and God is the greatest and most sovereign of all!
  5. Profile photo of TruTenrMan
    TruTenrMan Male 30-39
    2553 posts
    June 20, 2012 at 2:41 pm
    I-A-B should stay away from two thing: politics and religion.
  6. Profile photo of mykunter
    mykunter Male 40-49
    2424 posts
    June 20, 2012 at 2:43 pm
    No
  7. Profile photo of TKD_Master
    TKD_Master Male 18-29
    4794 posts
    June 20, 2012 at 2:46 pm
    "Yes, people will believe in God for all time to come. Of this, you can be certain! In due time, every person that ever lived will know the truth about God: God is real, and God is the greatest and most sovereign of all! "

    Actually, according to your bible, god is a total dick. One of his Angels stands up to his tyranny, the angel doesnt want to just be gods slave anymore. The angel demands fair equality and a free will. What does god do? He banishes him to unimaginable torture for all eternity. Satan is NOT the evil one in the bible, God is. So congratulations, you have been brainwashed to worship an evil god. Read your bible, question why everything happens, and THINK FOR YOURSELF. You`ll realize how terrible it is.
  8. Profile photo of TKD_Master
    TKD_Master Male 18-29
    4794 posts
    June 20, 2012 at 2:47 pm
    Also, FU*K YOU RELIGIOUS FUC*S for the christian dark ages, you stupid fuc*ing bastards.
  9. Profile photo of drawman61
    drawman61 Male 50-59
    7752 posts
    June 20, 2012 at 2:53 pm
    Sorry, but religion and God are man-made. It`s to keep everyone in their place. It`s your own fear that keeps you from questioning things.
  10. Profile photo of soundman655
    soundman655 Male 50-59
    1558 posts
    June 20, 2012 at 3:00 pm
    The golden age of reasoning is to come!!!!
  11. Profile photo of BlazingBird
    BlazingBird Male 13-17
    98 posts
    June 20, 2012 at 3:04 pm
    Tabbed out with this playing and looked at the other content on IAB.
  12. Profile photo of Essersmith
    Essersmith Male 18-29
    275 posts
    June 20, 2012 at 3:05 pm
    Yes! But which one?
    I think its going to be a anorld clone sent back from the future to save conner!

    Also very believable, not at all made up studies, show that religious people breed like vermin with children, animals and whatnot. They will still be around in 50++ years.
  13. Profile photo of LordJim
    LordJim Male 60-69
    7070 posts
    June 20, 2012 at 3:15 pm
    Religion isn`t going anywhere. It may decline in the face of education and people placing human rights above ancient dogma but as long as people fear death the promise of eternal life will find takers.

    So will snake-oil, but that`s just my opinion. Nothing to do with me.
    As far as religion in the public square is concerned if your religous beliefs inspire you, good luck. If they entitle you, we have a problem.

  14. Profile photo of sweetrebelnc
    sweetrebelnc Female 18-29
    847 posts
    June 20, 2012 at 3:21 pm
    well, the amount of religious people may be declining, but the ones that are still here get crazier and crazier every day.
  15. Profile photo of QueenZira
    QueenZira Female 18-29
    2228 posts
    June 20, 2012 at 3:35 pm
    I`ve seen the research from Pew too, and it doesn`t bear out what they seem to think it does. "Nones" who report having no official affiliation are growing in number, they report no affiliation with traditional organized religion, but they *do* still believe in a higher power(s) of some kind.

    What this says of course is that institutional forms of religion are dying, organized religion is quickly becoming anathema to my age group, but not spirituality itself. When the structures of conventional belief finish crumbling there will be something left, but it will be personal, free form and non dogmatic. In short, everything conventional religion today *isn`t*.
  16. Profile photo of wolladude
    wolladude Male 30-39
    366 posts
    June 20, 2012 at 3:35 pm
    Well as long as 50% of the world population are dumber than average, there will always be someone to believe in mumbo jumbo, just look at all the silly diets and poo people buy in to....
  17. Profile photo of skytz1337
    skytz1337 Male 18-29
    687 posts
    June 20, 2012 at 3:45 pm
    I bet that there will be some sort of "religious war" in the next 20 years just because some people are so stupid and scared of atheists
  18. Profile photo of LordJim
    LordJim Male 60-69
    7070 posts
    June 20, 2012 at 3:56 pm
    @TheGuySmiley

    What kind of god are you imagining that could concern itself with something as trivial as sovereignty of the universe?
    That`s a small god in a big universe.
  19. Profile photo of Mikeoxsbiggg
    Mikeoxsbiggg Male 30-39
    1502 posts
    June 20, 2012 at 4:05 pm
    I have magic underwear.
  20. Profile photo of jamie76
    jamie76 Male 30-39
    2345 posts
    June 20, 2012 at 4:12 pm
    religion should die.

    it is a man made concept and has nothing to do with God.

    also, atheist are cool by me so long as they respect my beliefs and I respect theirs.
  21. Profile photo of Fleaman1797
    Fleaman1797 Male 18-29
    718 posts
    June 20, 2012 at 4:29 pm
    They will be Pitied? Just for believing their is a god, or a higher being then we humans? this guy is the VERY REASON i cannot stand in your face Atheist`s! they act like they are somehow SO MUCH BETTER then anyone else just because they have a different mindset or belief then the person standing next to them. i would have told this guy to go drat himself straight away!..
  22. Profile photo of RdDan
    RdDan Male 30-39
    759 posts
    June 20, 2012 at 4:43 pm
    I still believe in my god - He`s called Kevin and he`s a bit self-concious so i don`t need to worship him.
    In fact, he prefers it if i leave him alone to eat eucalyptus leaves and play with himself.

    He didn`t create the universe though, that`s just silly.
  23. Profile photo of tfizzle
    tfizzle Male 18-29
    25 posts
    June 20, 2012 at 4:50 pm
    If, if, if . . . it`s what irritates me the most. . . if the leader of the Atheist coalition wouldn`t let his bias bleed into his rhetoric we`d be in a better place. "brainwashed" "man-in-the-sky" "pitied" and "oh, I can know the future" "shut their mind off and believe in something ridiculous".

    Sounds like he wants to champion belittling others IMO.
  24. Profile photo of Justahuman
    Justahuman Male 18-29
    109 posts
    June 20, 2012 at 4:59 pm
    TKD_Master

    This is YOUR interpretation of the bible TKD_Master,all im gonna say is you have no clue.And that Lucifer was infatuated with himself he thought he could do a better job than god he challenged god to a skirmish and lost.He wanted to make everyone at peace and perfect which in turn would make everyone mindless SLAVES that can only love him(which he would have basked in)God understands the importance to make a choice between good or evil,its beautiful to choose too love,God understands you cannot force people to love you because that is not true love.He cannot force us to be peaceful because he wants us to stand up for what is right on our own.Like a good father he taught us and disciplined us when it was necessary he gave us the instruction manual to live a good life and he lets us go out into the world to put his word into motion.He taught us how to live through Jesus,Now he is hoping for the best from the children he loved and died for, ALL OF US.
  25. Profile photo of Justahuman
    Justahuman Male 18-29
    109 posts
    June 20, 2012 at 5:02 pm
    TheGuySmiley

    You speak truth,the children of God will endure to the end,even in the darkest times and places His light will shine.
  26. Profile photo of TheGuySmiley
    TheGuySmiley Male 18-29
    1243 posts
    June 20, 2012 at 5:03 pm
    tfizzle: obviously!
    LordJim: you`ll know in due time.
    TKD_Master: Well, after reading your diatribe, it`s possible that you may have missed the point of the Bible. hint: "Love One another as i have loved you" :D
  27. Profile photo of CrakrJak
    CrakrJak Male 40-49
    17514 posts
    June 20, 2012 at 5:09 pm
    QueenZira: People in your age group have put aside religion, temporarily, since the 1960`s at least.

    Later in life most people, like you, do come back for one reason or the other. I know of people who were devout atheists that one day just came to an epiphany and realized that there really is a God and that he cares about them.
  28. Profile photo of Hedkwab
    Hedkwab Male 18-29
    340 posts
    June 20, 2012 at 5:19 pm
    People will always believe in their personal gods. Christianity..? Islam? Their doctrines change every day, and so do the interpretations. Your stupid religion is not the same as god.
  29. Profile photo of Rick_S
    Rick_S Male 40-49
    3291 posts
    June 20, 2012 at 5:27 pm
    "Later in life most people, like you, do come back for one reason or the other. I know of people who were devout atheists that one day just came to an epiphany and realized that there really is a God and that he cares about them."

    Been there, done that. Was an atheist, found a personal relationship with Jesus, then watched 9/11 unfold, in the name of the same god I worshiped, and realized I couldn`t accept that any god would let that happen.
  30. Profile photo of Justahuman
    Justahuman Male 18-29
    109 posts
    June 20, 2012 at 5:35 pm
    "Been there, done that. Was an atheist, found a personal relationship with Jesus, then watched 9/11 unfold, in the name of the same god I worshiped, and realized I couldn`t accept that any god would let that happen."

    You think 9/11 was sad for you Rick_S? those people were your brothers and sisters,but they are Gods very own children! And he was forced to watch them murder one another.Gods heart breaks for what breaks yours and even more so because they do it in HIS own name sometimes.I cant imagine the pain we put him through everyday through our blood lust and misguidance.
  31. Profile photo of NottaSpy
    NottaSpy Male 40-49
    881 posts
    June 20, 2012 at 5:49 pm
    You think 9/11 was sad for you Rick_S? those people were your brothers and sisters,but they are Gods very own children! And he was forced to watch them murder one another.Gods heart breaks for what breaks yours and even more so because they do it in HIS own name sometimes.I cant imagine the pain we put him through everyday through our blood lust and misguidance.
    Wow, your God is a prick! It pains us because we couldn`t stop it and we are now doing what we can to prevent it in the future. Your God had the power to stop it. He had 2,000 years of doing it his way and that hasn`t changed a thing.

    Time for some rational people to a crack at it.
  32. Profile photo of QueenZira
    QueenZira Female 18-29
    2228 posts
    June 20, 2012 at 5:49 pm
    Crakr, my age group is vastly different from the generation that witnessed the `60s.

    And another thing, my spirituality isn`t mainstream or organized, I`m just watching from the bleachers on this one, and I don`t feel any need to "go back to" anything because there is nothing to "go back to." My Goddess suits me just fine, thanks. She may not be your cup of tea, and that`s fine by me. I don`t believe anyone has to follow my path on pain of fiery damnation.
  33. Profile photo of mesovortex
    mesovortex Male 30-39
    458 posts
    June 20, 2012 at 6:17 pm
    CrakrJak:

    I know plenty of older people who gave up religion later in life because they were wiser as they got older. What`s your point?

    I also know plenty of people like myself who gave up christianity after reading the bible. I know I did.

    I`m going to Godwin this thread, but you know who else killed people or condemned them for not worshiping him?

    Also, have you bothered to learn anything about evolution yet, or are you still arguing against a straw man?
  34. Profile photo of maddux32
    maddux32 Male 30-39
    926 posts
    June 20, 2012 at 6:28 pm
    I don`t want to be around when and if we figure it all out. I don`t want to be around the day people stop believing in some form of God. Even if that belief is substantially diverse, and even if at times discussions of such things leads to mindless fits of rage (kind of like what I just read in this thread).

    Also....interesting display of "Law of Attraction" manifesting itself in society. Hardcore athiest and hardcore christian are equivalent.
  35. Profile photo of DrProfessor
    DrProfessor Male 18-29
    3894 posts
    June 20, 2012 at 6:36 pm
    Humanity follows this trend fairly often. We cycle back and forth between a highly religious population and a highly secular population every few generations.

    The more mainstream church sects get, the more secular they become. After a while you`ve got a bunch of fat lazy religions that aren`t very zealous in their beliefs, and a small, passionate new sect will sweep in and light a fire under everyone, and the fervor will spread. Then it slowly goes back down as the fire burns low.

    We`re just on a downswing, coming back off the wave that peaked around the `50s and `60s. Religion isn`t on its way out (whether you believe that`s a good thing or a bad thing).
  36. Profile photo of Justahuman
    Justahuman Male 18-29
    109 posts
    June 20, 2012 at 6:48 pm
    NottaSpy

    You either didn`t understand what i said,or you don`t know that God will not come down and physically intervene again until judgment day where he will make everything right again in one swoop(so yes he will stop evil once and for all).In the old testament he intervened many times showed great miracles destroyed evil and sent emissaries and prophets of god to bring peace and justice but over and over again his emissaries were rejected and his miracles ignored.We "the rational people" screwed up over and over again,so he did do something different,he conquered sin so that it wont hurt us,gave us an example of how to live a good life through Jesus, and now he hopes for the good in us too out do the bad preserving our freewill.God is not a prick he has had great patience with us because he loves us so.
  37. Profile photo of Quackor
    Quackor Male 18-29
    2856 posts
    June 20, 2012 at 7:03 pm
    hipsters will believe in god
  38. Profile photo of TKD_Master
    TKD_Master Male 18-29
    4794 posts
    June 20, 2012 at 7:09 pm
    Okay then, churchies, explain why god says that a rape victim must marry her rapist, or be put to death. Go ahead, explain it.

    Your religion makes no fuc*ing sense.
  39. Profile photo of TKD_Master
    TKD_Master Male 18-29
    4794 posts
    June 20, 2012 at 7:11 pm
    Wait let me explain it for you. It`s because your religion is completely made up. None of it exists, though some of it may loosely be based upon real events. It only ever existed as a form of control. In 1000 years when times have changed and morals have evolved, there will probably have been a "whole new series of books" found for the bible. "found".
  40. Profile photo of xiquiripat
    xiquiripat Male 18-29
    2422 posts
    June 20, 2012 at 7:19 pm
    There are only 3 viable conclusions regarding God.
    1. He does not exist
    2. He exists and doesn`t give a damn
    3. He exists and is insane
    Pick your poison.

    However, have you seen all the kids those Mormons have? He`s not going to run out of worshipers any time soon.
  41. Profile photo of Steelgrid
    Steelgrid Male 30-39
    2700 posts
    June 20, 2012 at 7:20 pm
    "Later in life most people, like you, do come back for one reason or the other. I know of people who were devout atheists that one day just came to an epiphany and realized that there really is a God and that he cares about them. "

    Oooooooh really. Then tell us, o great believer, what has god EVER done for you in your current lifetime? Cmon can you name a single thing that god has actually done for you?
  42. Profile photo of Steelgrid
    Steelgrid Male 30-39
    2700 posts
    June 20, 2012 at 7:21 pm
    For that matter in my previous post, any of you believers out there, can you name a SINGLE time god has done anything for you? Anything at all?
  43. Profile photo of Steelgrid
    Steelgrid Male 30-39
    2700 posts
    June 20, 2012 at 7:27 pm
    "You speak truth,the children of God will endure to the end,even in the darkest times and places His light will shine."

    Except you fail to realize that the darkest of times has usually been spawned in the name of god.

    Or am I imagining the Crusades?

    Or the inquisition?

    Or the Bible`s take on the rights of Blacks, Gays, Women?

    Or perhaps ill draw from the history YOU believe, maybe killing all the first born of a country?

    Or pressing the reset button with a flood, then spawning a bunch of colors to say "oh its ok"

    Or maybe the kid who was teased and prayed to god for revenge, so god sent bears to maul the bullies?

    Man this is too easy, as it always is
  44. Profile photo of mesovortex
    mesovortex Male 30-39
    458 posts
    June 20, 2012 at 7:28 pm
    Justahuman:

    Until you realize that some of us don`t consider the bible an authority on anything your posts are going to not work for those that can think for themselves.

    It might be what convinced you, but some of us just are not that gullible.
  45. Profile photo of 2L84ME
    2L84ME Male 18-29
    208 posts
    June 20, 2012 at 7:31 pm
    I`m a believer but not in the traditional sense. The believe in God is will not disappear. Ask yourselves, what is God?
  46. Profile photo of Justahuman
    Justahuman Male 18-29
    109 posts
    June 20, 2012 at 7:37 pm
    "Okay then, churchies, explain why god says that a rape victim must marry her rapist, or be put to death. Go ahead, explain it."

    Ok i will give it a go, not to prove a point but to help you understand.and....cmon man bashing the old testament......thats new...you could have just looked this up yourself.

    Ok so this is old Mosaic law if an engaged woman was raped the rapist would be put to death by stoning(not the good kind either),if she was not engaged then the rapist was not stoned for the sake of the woman’s social and financially security. losing her virginity she would have been undesirable for marriage and in the culture of the day, a woman without a husband to provide for her would be forced to a life of poverty,and social ostracism.

    the problem here is that your comparing a 2000 year old culture to a modern one.

    and also When Jesus died on the cross that saved us from all the old testament Mosaic laws,we dont have to follow th
  47. Profile photo of Justahuman
    Justahuman Male 18-29
    109 posts
    June 20, 2012 at 7:42 pm
    "Until you realize that some of us don`t consider the bible an authority on anything your posts are going to not work for those that can think for themselves."

    I realize this,i set things straight when people act like they know what they are talking about when they speak about my beliefs is all.People tend to take things out of context when they don`t understand the bible when speaking about the bible.
  48. Profile photo of Justahuman
    Justahuman Male 18-29
    109 posts
    June 20, 2012 at 7:43 pm
    "For that matter in my previous post, any of you believers out there, can you name a SINGLE time god has done anything for you? Anything at all?"

    God saved me from myself,he saved my life.
  49. Profile photo of CrakrJak
    CrakrJak Male 40-49
    17514 posts
    June 20, 2012 at 7:46 pm
    mesovortex, TKD_Master, xiquiripat, Steelgrid: You`ve all demonstrated your ignorance of the bible more than once and keep using the same old tired atheist rhetoric over and over.

    Your rhetoric usually goes like this.
    #1 Find obscure Old Testament passage
    #2 Take passage completely out of context
    #3 Wrongly apply Jewish Old Testament law to Christians
    #4 Declare that God and all Christians are evil.

    You`re all sad ignorant trolls, that are vomiting up weak arguments made by other atheist trolls decades ago. I pity you, not because you`re not Christians, but for the fact that you troll Christians to make believe you`re smarter.
  50. Profile photo of Justahuman
    Justahuman Male 18-29
    109 posts
    June 20, 2012 at 7:48 pm
    "For that matter in my previous post, any of you believers out there, can you name a SINGLE time god has done anything for you? Anything at all?"

    He taught me how to love everyone no matter who they are and what they believe in.

    yea i could go on forever with this man,God has done so much in my life.

    btw more attacks on the old testament....so lame....

    and with the holy wars, ill go back to what i said already,You think 9/11 was sad for you Rick_S? those people were your brothers and sisters,but they are Gods very own children! And he was forced to watch them murder one another.Gods heart breaks for what breaks yours and even more so because they do it in HIS own name sometimes.I cant imagine the pain we put him through everyday through our blood lust and misguidance.
  51. Profile photo of Justahuman
    Justahuman Male 18-29
    109 posts
    June 20, 2012 at 7:55 pm
    I dont think ALL you guys are trolling maybe your looking for the truth,just like i did.And maybe you can find the truth like i did.i remember using all of these out of context arguments when i was 16-19 btw that`s why they bore me.I like it when non-belivers ask me questions i don`t have the answer too,so i can study and find things out about god that i have never thought about which grows me deeper in my faith and is very exciting because god has never let me down, i look for the truth and he has never and will never dissapoint me.
  52. Profile photo of jkfld
    jkfld Male 30-39
    138 posts
    June 20, 2012 at 8:09 pm
    Religious beliefs evolved in an environment where information was difficult to come by. That environment has changed drastically. The advent of the internet means information is now ubiquitous, easy to obtain, and easy to share. Great swaths of religion`s traditional habitat (the abjectly ignorant human mind) have been lost due to the spread of information. Now religion is left squealing and choking to death in a strange new environment it was never designed to deal with: one absolutely teeming with toxic facts, relentless truths, and deadly evidence. Its extinction is assured, and I couldn`t be happier.
  53. Profile photo of mesovortex
    mesovortex Male 30-39
    458 posts
    June 20, 2012 at 8:11 pm
    CrakrJak:

    I`m not the one who is repeatedly trying to mix the new and old testaments together. Look at the christians who want to ban gay marriage, or want the 10 commandments everywhere, or look to Revelations for the end times and all that nonsense.

    The non believers are just pointing out your hypocrisy.

    By the way, you still haven`t a clue what evolution is and what it isn`t. You don`t seem to be willing to educate yourself on it either.

    Justahuman:
    I`m glad you want to study and look things up, but you`re not doing it honestly. You start with a conclusion then look for whatever it is you want to hear. You`re not interested in anything that might show you to be wrong.
  54. Profile photo of Zeegrr60
    Zeegrr60 Male 40-49
    2106 posts
    June 20, 2012 at 8:14 pm
    Being able to think for myself has pretty much ruined the fear and hate that is religion for me.
  55. Profile photo of davymid
    davymid Male 30-39
    12140 posts
    June 20, 2012 at 8:26 pm
    The way I see it, religion is just going the same way as many other ancient, antiquated world-views. Not to say that there`s anything wrong with a sense of personal spirituality per se, but organized religion is dying, at least in the advanced, modern First World. And I`m neither happy nor sad about that, just making an observation.

    Out with the old, in with the new. It`s always been the way. Personally, I think in time* school kids will look back on organised religion with the same kind of interest we currently have for neolithic cave-paintings. An interesting snapshot of thinking at that point in human evolution, one that lingered, caused a lot of sh*t at that point in time, but no more than that.

    *when I say "in time", I`m thinking episodes of Star Trek. But, you know, in the future.
  56. Profile photo of NottaSpy
    NottaSpy Male 40-49
    881 posts
    June 20, 2012 at 8:31 pm
    Justahuman, you speak of freewill as you parrot someone else`s interpretation of the Bible and lead you life within it`s confines. I know what freewill is since I am free from religion.

    You speak of how God had to change his approach and of his ultimate plan and it doesn`t sink in that that in itself disproves your version of God.

    You speak of whats in God mind and then rebuff people here for acting as if they know yours.

    The reality is, we already understand all that you have said and rejected it as absurd. We understand that God saved you and we feel pity that you couldn`t save yourself. We understand that you don`t get it when we say that all the good things you like about God, you can have without God. You don`t get it when we try to explain that religion brings a lot of bad with that good. We know that your identity is tied to your faith and that you may never let go because of it. But we are willing to help you try.
  57. Profile photo of Justahuman
    Justahuman Male 18-29
    109 posts
    June 20, 2012 at 9:39 pm
    "I`m glad you want to study and look things up, but you`re not doing it honestly. You start with a conclusion then look for whatever it is you want to hear. You`re not interested in anything that might show you to be wrong."

    You cant say if im doing anything honestly really only i will know that in my heart and conscience,and if im not honest about anything it will take a toll on me,as it would in any honest person.I start with a question that is asked by another i then look for the answer because ive only been a believer for about 2 1/2 years.All kinds of science is intresting to me,i dont deprive myself of any knowledge i try to do my best.
  58. Profile photo of HalfPintRoo
    HalfPintRoo Female 18-29
    2765 posts
    June 20, 2012 at 9:44 pm
    religion is what you need it to be
  59. Profile photo of Justahuman
    Justahuman Male 18-29
    109 posts
    June 20, 2012 at 9:48 pm
    "We know that your identity is tied to your faith and that you may never let go because of it. But we are willing to help you try."

    You try to make it seem like i have no character at all,thats not right to say. im my own person with my own beliefs,which im glad to be in a free country to exercise this,and i will say a thing or two when someone takes something that I do my best to study and twists the words of the bible what i believe to be the words of God.I appreciate you want to help me try to rid me of my faith but im happy and content with all i have and who i am. i tried the other ways and it just didn`t work for me,but Jesus works for me,this is just how i choose to live.

    You said "We" alot too i believe your speaking for yourself.
  60. Profile photo of Justahuman
    Justahuman Male 18-29
    109 posts
    June 20, 2012 at 10:01 pm
    "You speak of how God had to change his approach and of his ultimate plan and it doesn`t sink in that that in itself disproves your version of God. "

    Thats actually a great question! can god change his mind?

    To my knowledge and in my words, maybe changing his mind WAS part of his ultimate plan.Or maybe Human freewill makes us humans completely unpredictable,which makes sense to me because Adam and Eve ate the apple from the tree of knowledge,which gave them the knowledge of good and evil a part of gods own knowledge(he banished them before they ate from the tree of life because they would have become gods!)that would have been bad.So then he tries to mold us into choosing good over evil,like a scientist he saw what worked and what didn`t work changing his approach to perfect us for our own good.Cool question i never thought about.
  61. Profile photo of kangoala
    kangoala Male 18-29
    702 posts
    June 20, 2012 at 10:21 pm
    I really wish Hitchens was around to take part in this interview.
  62. Profile photo of maddux32
    maddux32 Male 30-39
    926 posts
    June 20, 2012 at 10:25 pm
    The two main athiests in this thread sound just as idiotic as Christians who say, "look at how perfect God made the universe...take this banana for example...it comes with a ready made tab to open it."

    I mean I get that you don`t believe in God, but try making arguments not spawned by 2nd graders. You guys sound like raving lunatics.
  63. Profile photo of maddux32
    maddux32 Male 30-39
    926 posts
    June 20, 2012 at 10:27 pm
    For that matter in my previous post, any of you believers out there, can you name a SINGLE time god has done anything for you? Anything at all?

    One of the stupidest questions to ask a believer. Just stupid. I don`t think I have to explain why.
  64. Profile photo of maddux32
    maddux32 Male 30-39
    926 posts
    June 20, 2012 at 10:29 pm

    There are only 3 viable conclusions regarding God.
    1. He does not exist
    2. He exists and doesn`t give a damn
    3. He exists and is insane
    Pick your poison.


    That is a rather short sighted, naive perspective of the universe.
  65. Profile photo of maddux32
    maddux32 Male 30-39
    926 posts
    June 20, 2012 at 10:31 pm

    I really wish Hitchens was around to take part in this interview.


    Me too. Those in this thread attempting to take his place are absolute morons.
  66. Profile photo of NottaSpy
    NottaSpy Male 40-49
    881 posts
    June 20, 2012 at 10:33 pm
    I`m not trying to rid you of your faith. I`m trying to rid us all of the ugly things that some of faith inflict upon us while they preach the opposite.

    I did not mean to imply you have no character. I did mean for you to understand that freedom from religion means having more freewill, not less as you implied.

    I am happy when those of faith find peace, hope, and happiness from their faith. But unfortunately the most religions, especially the Abrahamic religions, bring horrible side affects. I would praise Christianity if it lived up to its own hype. But when it breeds bigotry, hatred, and ignorance among its radicals, and those radicals are enabled by its moderates, I will always condemn it.

    I will also speak up and mock religion when it claims its lies to be the truth.
  67. Profile photo of maddux32
    maddux32 Male 30-39
    926 posts
    June 20, 2012 at 10:34 pm
    Okay then, churchies, explain why god says that a rape victim must marry her rapist, or be put to death. Go ahead, explain it.

    Your religion makes no fuc*ing sense.

    Because what`s the point of giving man free will without allowing him the opportunity to see the consequences of his actions. The perils of morality and malignant growths in society are the consequence of free will. Otherwise, we`d all be mindless drones praising the "will" of God.

    And I`m not even Christian. Grown up.
  68. Profile photo of Supersack
    Supersack Male 50-59
    15 posts
    June 20, 2012 at 10:41 pm
    Religion is just a device to allow a small number of people to control a much larger number of people, always has been, always will be.
  69. Profile photo of maddux32
    maddux32 Male 30-39
    926 posts
    June 20, 2012 at 10:46 pm
    Religion is just a device to allow a small number of people to control a much larger number of people, always has been, always will be.

    Religion is a way to control belief. Those who think for themselves reject it summarily, believing what they want.
  70. Profile photo of MattPrince
    MattPrince Male 40-49
    2220 posts
    June 20, 2012 at 10:46 pm
    5 posts from maddux insulting peoples intelligence and debating prowess.
    Lol.
  71. Profile photo of mon360
    mon360 Male 13-17
    735 posts
    June 20, 2012 at 10:52 pm
    i will and their aint nuthin u can doo to not make me not to
  72. Profile photo of MattPrince
    MattPrince Male 40-49
    2220 posts
    June 20, 2012 at 10:59 pm
    A bullet to the head would stop the crazy thoughts and crazy sentence construction soon enough.
  73. Profile photo of maddux32
    maddux32 Male 30-39
    926 posts
    June 20, 2012 at 11:01 pm
    5 posts from maddux insulting peoples intelligence and debating prowess.
    Lol.

    Should we try for six?
  74. Profile photo of MattPrince
    MattPrince Male 40-49
    2220 posts
    June 20, 2012 at 11:14 pm
    Lol.
  75. Profile photo of Justahuman
    Justahuman Male 18-29
    109 posts
    June 20, 2012 at 11:22 pm
    Nottaspy

    "I am happy when those of faith find peace, hope, and happiness from their faith. But unfortunately the most religions, especially the Abrahamic religions, bring horrible side affects. I would praise Christianity if it lived up to its own hype. But when it breeds bigotry, hatred, and ignorance among its radicals, and those radicals are enabled by its moderates, I will always condemn it."

    Im with you 100% on this sir!sorry for misunderstanding what u said before,just be wary(im sure you are) there are some believers in Christ that arent total bigot,high and mighty douchers.It breaks my heart when i see sidewalk preachers telling people they are going to hell.....Christianity does live up to itself through the few good examples of what a real bible devoted christian is,although i feel drowned out by the sidewalk preachers and people like the WBC.And thats what happens,we get one bad example and im branded as a bigot and a gay basher that hates athies
  76. Profile photo of Draculya
    Draculya Male 40-49
    14656 posts
    June 20, 2012 at 11:39 pm
    How about this: everyone is subject to religious law, except people who confess a religion are subject to all the laws of their religion as well. An aggrieved party, such as a raped woman, gets to choose which law a religious criminal is prosecuted under. That way, we`ll reduce the number of religious people by summary stoning.
  77. Profile photo of Draculya
    Draculya Male 40-49
    14656 posts
    June 20, 2012 at 11:41 pm
    "I dont think ALL you guys are trolling maybe your looking for the truth"

    Looking for the truth? That`s how I came to accept the saving grace of atheism into my life.
  78. Profile photo of TKD_Master
    TKD_Master Male 18-29
    4794 posts
    June 20, 2012 at 11:49 pm
    "Because what`s the point of giving man free will without allowing him the opportunity to see the consequences of his actions."

    Lets say I murder somebody. The consequence of the action is solely sourced from the laws of man. I will not go to hell for it, i will not be tortured for all eternity for it. Religion exists solely for mindless people. They believe the bible because the bible tells them to. The rest of us will go ahead and be adults and think for ourselves. Religion is a blemish upon the history of man-kind. It has cost us hundreds of years of progress.
  79. Profile photo of TKD_Master
    TKD_Master Male 18-29
    4794 posts
    June 20, 2012 at 11:53 pm
    Here is an example of how churchies are retarded. Thanks to 9/11, a vast majority of them illegitimately hate muslims and chastise their religion. They are so caught up with circle-jerking each other and talking about how terrible muslims are that they don`t even realize that half of their religion IS the muslim faith. Old testament = book muslims use.
  80. Profile photo of TKD_Master
    TKD_Master Male 18-29
    4794 posts
    June 20, 2012 at 11:54 pm
    Oh and then in defense of what I just stated, churchies will say something like "Well we go by the new testament" which is fuc*ing retarded. The god in the new testament is just as evil as the god in the old testament.
  81. Profile photo of spanerbulb
    spanerbulb Male 30-39
    1244 posts
    June 21, 2012 at 12:07 am
    I think religion as it is now will die out, because quite frankly it`s a load of old crap and it`s quite transparent to most people that this is the case. However, as long as we don`t have the scientific answers to the universe there will always be some kind of faith system out there.
  82. Profile photo of Nickel2
    Nickel2 Male 50-59
    5879 posts
    June 21, 2012 at 12:17 am
    god who?
  83. Profile photo of maddux32
    maddux32 Male 30-39
    926 posts
    June 21, 2012 at 12:20 am
    Here is an example of how churchies are retarded. Thanks to 9/11, a vast majority of them illegitimately hate muslims and chastise their religion. They are so caught up with circle-jerking each other and talking about how terrible muslims are that they don`t even realize that half of their religion IS the muslim faith. Old testament = book muslims use.

    Here`s an example of how people are retarded. Thanks to differences in the immutable characteristics of men, some choose to hate on the basis of those characteristics. And it really has nothing to do with religion at all.
  84. Profile photo of maddux32
    maddux32 Male 30-39
    926 posts
    June 21, 2012 at 12:25 am
    Oh and then in defense of what I just stated, churchies will say something like "Well we go by the new testament" which is fuc*ing retarded. The god in the new testament is just as evil as the god in the old testament.

    Why are you arguing the finer points of the Bible if you don`t believe in God in the first place? If non-belief in God is genuine, it should come from an objective place, that doesn`t claim to stand for the ultimate truth of God, especially if you know to a reasonable degree of certainty that it was written by man. It should come from something more concrete, like science.

    You can`t attack peoples belief in religious texts by stating your own non-beliefs based on the same text. Arguing how illogical the Bible is does nothing to disprove the existence of God. It serves only to say that certain religious people are illogical.
  85. Profile photo of maddux32
    maddux32 Male 30-39
    926 posts
    June 21, 2012 at 12:26 am
    Lets say I murder somebody. The consequence of the action is solely sourced from the laws of man. I will not go to hell for it, i will not be tortured for all eternity for it. Religion exists solely for mindless people. They believe the bible because the bible tells them to. The rest of us will go ahead and be adults and think for ourselves. Religion is a blemish upon the history of man-kind. It has cost us hundreds of years of progress.

    You will be punished under the laws of man that man had the free will to create. Men follow religious texts of men who had the free will to create them, and neither of those two bodies of law precludes the existence of a God who gave them the ability to do it. If you dismiss the existence of God on the basis of the illogical conclusions in religious texts, you are no different than the man who believes in God on those strength of those same texts.
  86. Profile photo of CrakrJak
    CrakrJak Male 40-49
    17514 posts
    June 21, 2012 at 12:46 am
    mesovortex: Wrong, I full well understand the theory of evolution, I also know it`s faults and falsehoods. If Darwin was still alive, even he would have doubts about his own theory. According to his own writings then, the `Theory` has jumped the shark and entered the realm of imagination and fantasy.

    If slow change/natural selection was actually happening, we`d be literally drowning in the bones of transitional species. Instead there are giant leaps of change between the fossils and the theories supporters now believe evolution oscillates between rapid change, due to stress, followed by long periods of stasis.

    Darwin warned that his own theory wouldn`t withstand credulity if natural selection couldn`t be proven.
  87. Profile photo of JoexBro
    JoexBro Male 18-29
    550 posts
    June 21, 2012 at 12:54 am
    Heres the best answer: Our human minds are too simplistic to understand the true nature of our existence. It is clear that the men who wrote the bible and all these other books of faith were writing them based on moral guidelines. How we should live our lives, not meant to be literally translated. Intelligent life of past generations may have very well come down to this earth and our even more simpler minds at the time could have easily mistaken them for gods. Billions of stars here in our galaxy alone, so there are a lot more out there, no mistake.
  88. Profile photo of CrakrJak
    CrakrJak Male 40-49
    17514 posts
    June 21, 2012 at 12:54 am
    In Darwin`s own words: "If it could be demonstrated that any complex organ existed which could not possibly have been formed by numerous successive, slight modifications, my theory would absolutely break down."

    "The number of intermediate varieties which have formally existed on earth must be truly enormous. Why then is not every geological formation and stratum full of such intermediate links? Geology assuredly does not reveal any such finely graded organic chain; and this perhaps is the most obvious and gravest objection which can be urged against my theory."

    "To suppose that the eye with all its inimitable contrivances for adjusting the focus to different distances, for admitting different amounts of light, and for the correction of spherical and chromatic aberration, could have been formed by natural selection, seems, I freely confess, absurd in the highest degree."
  89. Profile photo of beternal
    beternal Male 18-29
    2589 posts
    June 21, 2012 at 1:23 am
    "Religion is just a device to allow a small number of people to control a much larger number of people, always has been, always will be."

    *claps*

    But I would expand upon this and add:

    It is a way for the feeble-minded to justify/ explain/ vent all the bad luck in their life.

    ...If you can`t prove God has helped you IN ANY WAY, then who says He has at all?! An outcome, positive or negative might simply be the result of luck, entropy etc
  90. Profile photo of New_Guy
    New_Guy Male 30-39
    406 posts
    June 21, 2012 at 1:23 am
    het Crak Jack. Are those full qoutes or just some choice picks? do you even know or have you just been surfing fstdt.com?
  91. Profile photo of New_Guy
    New_Guy Male 30-39
    406 posts
    June 21, 2012 at 1:27 am
    Nice post by the way... like to read the debat
  92. Profile photo of TKD_Master
    TKD_Master Male 18-29
    4794 posts
    June 21, 2012 at 1:49 am
    "Heres the best answer: Our human minds are too simplistic to understand the true nature of our existence."

    I would disagree. I believe that there is nothing the human race can not do/achieve/understand. Assuming we don`t go extinct from any number of causes, I think nothing is impossible to us if given enough time.
  93. Profile photo of TKD_Master
    TKD_Master Male 18-29
    4794 posts
    June 21, 2012 at 1:52 am
    "you are no different than the man who believes in God on those strength of those same texts."

    That is simply insulting. I do not understand how a person of even mediocre intelligence can read the bible and accept it as fact. I`ve come to terms that people can believe whatever the hell they want. Believe me, I don`t go around arguing with every religious person I meet. However, if they try to push their filthy religion onto me, I will argue them to the grave.
  94. Profile photo of mesovortex
    mesovortex Male 30-39
    458 posts
    June 21, 2012 at 2:53 am
    CrakrJak:

    1) There are thousands of transitional fossils:
    http://tinyurl.com/5vvw

    2) Here`s a refutation of your eye evolution quote:
    http://tinyurl.com/7c6oa4v

    3) We also find plenty of biomass indicating an ancient earth and that plenty of life existing. If they changed from generation to generation, that`s evolution.
    http://tinyurl.com/cbnatgb

    4) Evolution is the non-random selection of naturally varying replicators. Dog breeding is evolution. Horse breeding is evolution. The Nylon Bacteria is evolution.

    For someone who claims to be christian, you are awfully dishonest.
  95. Profile photo of Thonious
    Thonious Male 40-49
    987 posts
    June 21, 2012 at 2:54 am
    Take a look around the Internet. There are people who still believe in witchcraft, demons, spells, vampires, and werewolves. There are people who honestly believe the Earth is flat and the moon landings were faked. They are not just children; many adults believe. Fifty years from now or five hundred, there will always be people who want to believe in things that do not make sense, but there is no arguing with them. It`s in our nature. As long as we are humans, we will have some people with ridiculous beliefs.
  96. Profile photo of Thonious
    Thonious Male 40-49
    987 posts
    June 21, 2012 at 2:56 am
    This is not about realism or religion, evolution or creation, science or miracles. This is about the natural human desire to believe.

    No amount of rational argument or logical analysis will change that. People will believe.
  97. Profile photo of fancythat
    fancythat Male 30-39
    1950 posts
    June 21, 2012 at 4:26 am
    I`m oxymoronic. I`m extremely agnostic. If others believe without doubt or pound the atheist drum all day, I giveth no pooteth.
  98. Profile photo of MattPrince
    MattPrince Male 40-49
    2220 posts
    June 21, 2012 at 4:41 am
    "If slow change/natural selection was actually happening, we`d be literally drowning in the bones of transitional species. Instead there are giant leaps of change between the fossils and the theories supporters now believe evolution oscillates between rapid change, due to stress, followed by long periods of stasis. "

    Some theories suggest change is rapid and constant, but that the stress of survival of the fittest constantly pulls these changes back towards an optimal design for the current environment and competition, until things change whereupon positive feedback pushes the evolution in a consistent direction and speciation occurs to exploit the change.

    Also.. we know that the eye was a significant challenge to Darwins conviction, but it has been shown with transitional models that it can evolve in small logical changes from simple light sensitive cells to the complex structures found in nature today. God not required.
  99. Profile photo of Suicism
    Suicism Male 18-29
    3625 posts
    June 21, 2012 at 4:44 am
    Also - Variations on a Hominid theme -

    This would include Australopithecus (both varieties), Homo-Erectus, Neanderthal, Cro-Magnon etc.

    Which do you think is a more credulous explanation for these variations in our Hominid family - that they arose and fell through the course of natural selection (our lineage being the current champion), or that the ID`er simply messed-up a couple times before getting it right? And as a side note, what`s to have stopped these other highly cognitive species from having souls? Where`s the soul gene, is this part of ID too?
  100. Profile photo of Suicism
    Suicism Male 18-29
    3625 posts
    June 21, 2012 at 4:45 am
    CrakrJak, I don`t usually weigh in on these discussions since someone`s usually making the point for me, but you used the term credulity. With all your anecdotal evidence about the likelihood of fossil preponderance and Darwin`s own honest, scientific doubts about his own theory (which is healthy, mind you) what do you have to say about the likelihood between THESE two options as satisfactory explanations for the following:

    - Genetic Mutation that is NOT beneficial to a species -

    Which worldview do you think better accommodates this phenomenon? One in which mutations happen as part of the "selection of naturally varying replicators," as mesovortex describes, or one in which they must essentially be inexplicable, as the result of `intelligent` design?

    I don`t know what`s so intelligent about down syndrome, parkinson`s or cerebral palsy designs.
  101. Profile photo of andybme
    andybme Male 50-59
    296 posts
    June 21, 2012 at 5:42 am
    She can only speculate. That`s what religion is all about, speculation.
  102. Profile photo of OutWest
    OutWest Male 50-59
    546 posts
    June 21, 2012 at 7:04 am
    ....will people still believe in God?


    Only if it is trendy, and all the cool kids are doing it! (wait that`s just like now!)
  103. Profile photo of burbclaver
    burbclaver Male 50-59
    878 posts
    June 21, 2012 at 7:20 am
    One thing is certain. You`ll never convince anyone of the existence or non-existence of god in a comment post on the Internet. Your time is better spent in getting out more.
  104. Profile photo of Draculya
    Draculya Male 40-49
    14656 posts
    June 21, 2012 at 7:36 am
    "One thing is certain. You`ll never convince anyone of the existence or non-existence of god in a comment post on the Internet."

    We can but mock. Eventually they`ll think "Hey why is everyone mocking me?" and have an epiphany.
  105. Profile photo of patchgrabber
    patchgrabber Male 30-39
    5812 posts
    June 21, 2012 at 8:25 am
    If slow change/natural selection was actually happening, we`d be literally drowning in the bones of transitional species.
    Goodness not your fossil BS again. Punctuated equilibrium, the ridiculously specific circumstances necessary for fossils to form, vestigial organs, all these laugh in the face of your pathetic argument. And irreducible complexity? I`d laugh if it wasn`t so sad, but you go ahead and use your kettle logic to spur your arguments.

    God doesn`t exist because there has never been any proof that He ever has, just anecdotal nonsense.

    Heres the best answer: Our human minds are too simplistic to understand the true nature of our existence.
    Argument to moderation.
  106. Profile photo of patchgrabber
    patchgrabber Male 30-39
    5812 posts
    June 21, 2012 at 8:32 am
    Religious beliefs evolved in an environment where information was difficult to come by. That environment has changed drastically. The advent of the internet means information is now ubiquitous, easy to obtain, and easy to share. Great swaths of religion`s traditional habitat (the abjectly ignorant human mind) have been lost due to the spread of information.
    I couldn`t have said it better.
  107. Profile photo of jkfld
    jkfld Male 30-39
    138 posts
    June 21, 2012 at 8:40 am
    I full well understand the theory of evolution.
    No you don`t, CrakrJak. Every time you make a post about evolution here, it`s full of misunderstandings (as well as distortions and lies of omission) which are immediately pointed out to you, but which you refuse to recognize. You consistently go on to regurgitate the same points in later threads as if they were still legitimate.

    But please do keep on posting! Your blatant dishonesty and intractable ignorance is a shining example of the stultifying effect religious indoctrination can have on the mind of a child, and a dire warning to any thinking person who might stumble upon one of your posts. Your more liberal religious peers are embarrassed by people like you, and would prefer to sweep you under the rug, but as an anti-theist I welcome the bold and conspicuous example you provide of just how effective religion can be at thwarting human potential.
  108. Profile photo of jkfld
    jkfld Male 30-39
    138 posts
    June 21, 2012 at 8:41 am
    I couldn`t have said it better.
    Thanks!
  109. Profile photo of joeblowsglas
    joeblowsglas Male 30-39
    72 posts
    June 21, 2012 at 9:05 am
    crakrjak is a shining example of IAB idiocy and ignorance. we should know this by now :)
  110. Profile photo of mesovortex
    mesovortex Male 30-39
    458 posts
    June 21, 2012 at 10:04 am
    jkfld:

    Exactly. I wonder why it`s okay to lie for the lord.
  111. Profile photo of BoredFrank
    BoredFrank Male 40-49
    2374 posts
    June 21, 2012 at 10:19 am
    Jkfld and Patchgrabber are my Heroes of the Day, for turning the light of science and literacy on the face of ignorance and stupidity (that would be you, CrakrJak).
  112. Profile photo of nayrbarr
    nayrbarr Male 18-29
    366 posts
    June 21, 2012 at 10:21 am
    jkfld well said :)
  113. Profile photo of nayrbarr
    nayrbarr Male 18-29
    366 posts
    June 21, 2012 at 10:31 am
    @CrakrJak And since Darwin died we have gathered a multitude of data, transitional fossils and generally expanded our knowledge of how the world works. Frankly, quoting Darwin about the flaws in his theory is ridiculous because he only knew a fraction of what is available to modern scientists. He may have come up with the concept, but he is hardly qualified to take part in a modern debate on the subject.

    In reference to an earlier post about bible quote, you can shut the f*ck up. The Old Testament is just as valid to you as the New. Your God is *eternal*. Unchanging. You can`t simply ignore half of what He`s said. Furthermore, if you`re dismissing the Old Testament, Christians are no longer entitled to use your religion in arguments concerning gay right or whatever other crap the bible is used to justify (or forbid).
  114. Profile photo of T3hHippie
    T3hHippie Male 18-29
    166 posts
    June 21, 2012 at 11:15 am
    A news media company now some-what saying that atheism is completely fine and not evil? GREAT NEWS!
  115. Profile photo of CrakrJak
    CrakrJak Male 40-49
    17514 posts
    June 21, 2012 at 12:00 pm
    mesovortex: Dog breeding is evolution. Horse breeding is evolution. The Nylon Bacteria is evolution.

    No it is not, human breeding of animals is NOT evolution. If that is what you were taught in school you`ve been severely lied too.

    Suicism: And that`s all we have to show about mutation, that it`s almost always detrimental to the organism and not beneficial. Mutations are so rare and detrimental that in order to carry on that mutation to a next generation requires a male and female with the same mutations to mate. Genetic diseases are not `mutations`, since they don`t carry the `traits` of the parents.
  116. Profile photo of CrakrJak
    CrakrJak Male 40-49
    17514 posts
    June 21, 2012 at 12:12 pm
    jkfld: My oh my. must`ve hit a nerve there.

    Apparently you can`t stand to have your worldview under any kind of scrutiny. You seem to be the type that wants to hang Christians for your perception of their heresy.

    You`re acting exactly like what you accuse Christians of doing, killing blasphemers by burning them at the stake, right?

    You are the shining example of what atheism wants to be, the new Roman Empire, crucifying anyone that doesn`t believe as you do. Atheists like you have committed atrocities that make Hitler`s look like child`s play (Stalin & Mao).
  117. Profile photo of CrakrJak
    CrakrJak Male 40-49
    17514 posts
    June 21, 2012 at 12:20 pm
    nayrbarr: Darwin would be aghast at the modern twisting and bending of his theory. He had the forethought enough to know that his theory could be misused and it certainly has been. Yet it persists, it persists because atheists cling to it like a warm blanket, without it their worldview is nothing.

    There is design in every living thing on this Earth, but keep blinding yourself to that fact.
  118. Profile photo of mesovortex
    mesovortex Male 30-39
    458 posts
    June 21, 2012 at 12:36 pm
    CrakrJak:
    Dog breeding is evolution:
    http://tinyurl.com/qgrg4b

    It doesn`t matter what puts the selection on a population whether it`s natural or man-made. Evolution is evolution.

    This isn`t what I was taught in public schools. This is what I was taught by actual biologists. I`ll trust biologists over some creationist, thank you very much.

    Also, Darwin would want his theory to be modified to best fit the evidence as new evidence comes around - and it has. As far as it being `misused` - how can you say that if you say anything selected by humans isn`t evolution? Are you saying nature misuses evolution? Or wait, are you saying because gravity is used to hurt people it must also be invalid?

    ID is NOT science:
    http://tinyurl.com/76xgmbx

    You are completely scientifically illiterate.
  119. Profile photo of mesovortex
    mesovortex Male 30-39
    458 posts
    June 21, 2012 at 12:37 pm
    CrakrJak:

    Apparently you can`t stand to have your worldview under any kind of scrutiny. You seem to be the type that wants to hang scientists for your perception of their heresy.
  120. Profile photo of mesovortex
    mesovortex Male 30-39
    458 posts
    June 21, 2012 at 12:39 pm
    Evolution can INDEED happen with artificial-selection (man-made selection):

    http://tinyurl.com/2dqcjeo
  121. Profile photo of patchgrabber
    patchgrabber Male 30-39
    5812 posts
    June 21, 2012 at 12:50 pm
    Apparently you can`t stand to have your worldview under any kind of scrutiny. You seem to be the type that wants to hang scientists for your perception of their heresy.
    Actually, Crakr is quite accepting of science, provided it aligns with his ideology and world view; otherwise it`s all just a conspiracy.

    Mutations are so rare and detrimental that in order to carry on that mutation to a next generation requires a male and female with the same mutations to mate.
    There are many detrimental mutations, however this only supports my position that ID is BS. If design were intelligent, why are there random, harmful mutations? You are also blind to the positive mutations that have conferred resistance to malaria, bubonic plague, and AIDS. Your assertion that both male and female must carry the mutation for it to proliferate is hysterically wrong.
  122. Profile photo of patchgrabber
    patchgrabber Male 30-39
    5812 posts
    June 21, 2012 at 12:51 pm
    You obviously have zero biology experience and have no idea how genetics works. I, on the other hand, have studied it for years and work in the fields of genomics, proteomics, and study organisms at the molecular level. Go try your "biology" elsewhere because you are just making a fool of yourself.
  123. Profile photo of jkfld
    jkfld Male 30-39
    138 posts
    June 21, 2012 at 1:01 pm
    @CrakrJak

  124. Profile photo of 8BitHero
    8BitHero Male 18-29
    5414 posts
    June 21, 2012 at 1:19 pm
    As the top comment on this video said:

    "No one brought up the fact that, just like the religions of the past which we call `myths` today, the three mono-theisms of today`s world WILL meet the same fate. As we, as a species, grow more intelligent and understand of the world and universe around us, we will continue to outgrow the need of such superstitious and dangerous beliefs.
    Religion has outgrown its usefulness in this world and people are now starting to realize that fact."
  125. Profile photo of CrakrJak
    CrakrJak Male 40-49
    17514 posts
    June 21, 2012 at 2:05 pm
    mesovortex: Dog breeding is design. You must be completely mentally obtuse to not know that. Your first link is a writer opinion and a falsehood. Speciation is like this. Horse`s and Donkey`s can breed, but they breed sterile Mules. Why? because they truly are different species.

    Humans can and have bred animals by eliminating supposed `barriers`. A chihuahua can still be bred with a doberman, and although it might look like a mutt, it`ll have viable offspring.

    The malpractice of declaring an animal a different species based solely on isolation or `barriers` makes a mockery of what speciation really is.

    Your second link leads to Eugenics, trying to breed the perfect race, that`s what Hitler espoused, it`s EVIL and WRONG!

    jkfld: Go hide back under your bridge.
  126. Profile photo of TheGuySmiley
    TheGuySmiley Male 18-29
    1243 posts
    June 21, 2012 at 4:14 pm
    draculya, you said "We can but mock. Eventually they`ll think "Hey why is everyone mocking me?" and have an epiphany."

    no they won`t, they`ll think this: 2 Peter 3:3 >>
    First of all, you must understand that in the last days scoffers will come, scoffing and following their own evil desires.

    And their faith will grow stronger as they remember these things were foretold by Christ. Besides, why leave a faith of love, for life of mocking others?

    Love is the way of the future.
  127. Profile photo of TheGuySmiley
    TheGuySmiley Male 18-29
    1243 posts
    June 21, 2012 at 4:16 pm
    joeblowsglas: crakrjak has some pretty good posts in this thread, and i think the general rule of thumb is when someone starts calling another person names.. the name caller is the loser of the debate.
  128. Profile photo of SoCal
    SoCal Male 18-29
    650 posts
    June 21, 2012 at 4:40 pm
    Less religion... Less war.
  129. Profile photo of mesovortex
    mesovortex Male 30-39
    458 posts
    June 21, 2012 at 6:05 pm
    CrakrJak:

    Dog evolution is dog evolution. The selection is either natural or artificial, but the principal is the same. Why are you so dense that you can`t understand it?

    Evolution is the non-random selection (natural or artificial) of naturally varying replicators. By your logic, flowers aren`t evolution because bees and other insects `artificially` selected them.

    Biologists are telling you that you are wrong, Crakr. Yet, you refuse to listen to them.

    I`ve heard of wallowing in ignorance but you make a trophy out of it and put it on the mantle.

    TheGuySmiley:

    No he hasn`t. He`s regurgitation the same lies over and over again.
  130. Profile photo of mesovortex
    mesovortex Male 30-39
    458 posts
    June 21, 2012 at 6:11 pm
    CrakrJak:

    As far as Eugenics goes, I`ve already addressed it. That`s an ethical problem and in no way validates or invalidates evolution. People get hurt and killed due to the laws of physics. Things explode. Heavy things hurt and injure people. Because they are misused, by your logic, the laws of physics wouldn`t even exist.

    You strike me as someone that hasn`t even bothered to honestly research their own opinions or even know when or how they might be wrong.

    You are dishonest.

  131. Profile photo of Suicism
    Suicism Male 18-29
    3625 posts
    June 21, 2012 at 6:41 pm
    Crakr,

    I appreciate that you`ve conversing with like 5 different people right now but I feel compelled to respond.

    I`m about to take what you used to turn around and support your argument and throw it right back at you. How are mutations, which do not benefit a species, examples of intelligent design?

    Btw, my aside about the genetic diseases I mentioned were meant as just that, an aside, though I can see how you thought I was presenting them in the context of mutation (even though downs syndrome IS typically understood as the product of a mutation). Still doesn`t answer my question though - how are genetic diseases and everything else that we find inherently, medically flawed in organic life an example of `intelligent` design, more than they are an example strictly of imperfect reproductive processes?
  132. Profile photo of NottaSpy
    NottaSpy Male 40-49
    881 posts
    June 21, 2012 at 7:55 pm
    CrakrJak, if you know that Evolution is a lie it is easy to overthrow the whole damn thing. Simply publish a paper in a peer reviewed journal and after others have tested your hypothesis and found it genuine, *poof* the whole theory of Evolution will be thrown out and you will make headlines. You will command millions in speaking fees and will be hailed as the savior of Christianity.

    Good luck! Not a single piece of evidence has been found, in 150 years of looking, that can disprove Evolution. Oh BTW, the internet twaddle that you have been parading around as evidence has been debunked decades and even a century ago by cold hard facts that are easily reproducible, even by you.
  133. Profile photo of NottaSpy
    NottaSpy Male 40-49
    881 posts
    June 21, 2012 at 8:09 pm
    CrakrJak, I am willing to help you in your quest to prove Evolution is a lie. Mainly because I think the greatest argument for teaching kids science is having you take center stage and talk about your beliefs. Anyway, here is a list of simple things you can do to disprove Evolution:
    1) Find a fossil in the wrong place. Find a mammal in the Devonian Period.
    2) Show a lack of genetic variation in a species.
    3) Find an adaptation that isn`t good for a species but is good for a second species.
    4) Find an adaptation that could not have evolved by a step-by-step process of ever-increasing fitness.
    5) find an adaptation that inimical for individuals but good for populations or species.
    6) Find altruistic behavior among non-relatives in non-social animals.
    7) Find discordance between phylogenies based on morphology/fossils and on DNA.

    Remember, your findings will be tested by others, so it better not be your usual Christian think-tank bullpoo.
  134. Profile photo of davymid
    davymid Male 30-39
    12140 posts
    June 21, 2012 at 8:55 pm
    Guys, I admire the effort, but save your energy when it comes to reasoning with Crakrjak on matters of science.

  135. Profile photo of Suicism
    Suicism Male 18-29
    3625 posts
    June 22, 2012 at 1:47 am
    Geeze, you know - we define good and evil by that which benefits our species, and further, by that which is beneficial to our individual components of it. Bacteria, viruses, Fungi and alternative predators have the right to compete for dominance as much as we do, but when this effort overrides our immunity/werewhithal we cry evil. Take the egocentric equation out of it, and what do we have but the latter scenario? I say the distinction between good and evil is the dividing line between a Will to Power, and its efficiency therein. We can debate about the intra-specie manifestation of this ad-nauseum.
  136. Profile photo of WizardofCOR
    WizardofCOR Male 40-49
    155 posts
    June 22, 2012 at 4:12 pm
    One can only hope that eventually, people will have become intelligent enough to refute any potential belief in non-existent entities and fantastical, horrific fictions. Religion = joke.
  137. Profile photo of photomstr
    photomstr Male 50-59
    766 posts
    June 25, 2012 at 9:23 am
    In 50 Years Will People Still Believe In God? I sure hope not. Religion, all religion, is holding mankind back from realizing our full potential. Religion could even bring down modern civilization. There are primitive tribal peoples trying to do just that right now . . .
  138. Profile photo of photomstr
    photomstr Male 50-59
    766 posts
    June 25, 2012 at 9:29 am
    @CrakrJak - there is no god, get over it and grow up silly . . . people like you are holding back all mankind. That is right, I equate you with all other primitive superstitious religions INCLUDING intelligent design.

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