Rockin' in the free world since 2005.

[Total: 20    Average: 2.9/5]
88 Comments - View/Add
Hits: 6737
Rating: 2.9
Category: Games
Date: 04/11/12 10:40 AM

88 Responses to Zimmerman`s Lawyers Call It Quits-`He`s Gone AWOL`

  1. Profile photo of kitteh9lives
    kitteh9lives Female 70 & Over
    8033 posts
    April 11, 2012 at 10:35 am
    Link: Zimmerman`s Lawyers Call It Quits-`He`s Gone AWOL` - Zimmerman`s lawyers have withdrawn from the case because they have lost contact with Zimmerman. Story in credits link
  2. Profile photo of collegebound
    collegebound Male 18-29
    3745 posts
    April 11, 2012 at 10:49 am
    looks like we`ve got a runner...
  3. Profile photo of MacGuffin
    MacGuffin Female 30-39
    2602 posts
    April 11, 2012 at 10:51 am
    I saw this on the BBC. Don`t get me wrong, I fully hope that Zimmerman is brought before a court to be tried for this alleged crime. However I feel about him personally, though, I think it`s appalling of any lawyer to drop a client like this. Especially when you hold a press conference afterwards to talk about your decision in a case that may well soon be sub judice. I think they should be called before their Bar for this, and thrown out of the profession.
  4. Profile photo of LillianDulci
    LillianDulci Female 18-29
    2674 posts
    April 11, 2012 at 10:53 am
    And this is why he should have been arrested.
  5. Profile photo of MacGuffin
    MacGuffin Female 30-39
    2602 posts
    April 11, 2012 at 10:58 am
    And this is why he should have been arrested.
    He was arrested. This is why he should have been charged. Not that it would have made much difference in Florida - look at the debacle surrounding Casey Anthony. We`ve got our faults too, but you simply wouldn`t get the sort of trial by media and leaking of evidence by so-called law enforcement personnel that you saw in that case over here. I mean, the media had actual hidden camera footage of her talking to FBI officers whilst in custody, before the trial, FFS. If that`s not blatant Contempt of Court, I don`t know what is.
  6. Profile photo of Arazekiel
    Arazekiel Male 18-29
    34 posts
    April 11, 2012 at 10:59 am
    either ran, or someone did something bad to him. Votes on as to which.
  7. Profile photo of Gerry1of1
    Gerry1of1 Male 50-59
    36176 posts
    April 11, 2012 at 10:59 am

    If I were him, I would totally run for it. It is the only logical response.

    A: If he`s guilty he`d want to escape prosecution, so run.
    B: If he`s innocent there`s no way he is NOT going to jail because of the media hooplah, so again, run.
    &
    3: It won`t make his prison sentance any longer by trying to run before arrest so he has nothing to lose by trying... so run.

  8. Profile photo of LillianDulci
    LillianDulci Female 18-29
    2674 posts
    April 11, 2012 at 11:01 am
    No, he was not arrested. He was taken in for questioning and released. He wasn`t locked in a jail cell with bail and held until trial or anything like he should have been.
  9. Profile photo of leesah
    leesah Female 18-29
    1566 posts
    April 11, 2012 at 11:04 am
    I don`t even think he`s running, I think he`s suicidal. He doesn`t mean to come back, his life is over either way, he`s acknowledged it himself.
  10. Profile photo of MacGuffin
    MacGuffin Female 30-39
    2602 posts
    April 11, 2012 at 11:10 am
    It won`t make his prison sentance any longer by trying to run before arrest so he has nothing to lose by trying.
    No, but it would make the time he serves far less `pleasant`. Once identified as having an escapee history, in most prisons there`s no scope for minimum security, ever, no matter how much of an over-privileged, white-collared, well-behaved inmate you later prove to be.
  11. Profile photo of collegebound
    collegebound Male 18-29
    3745 posts
    April 11, 2012 at 11:11 am
    MacGuffin: i`ve been in cuffs without having been arrested...they do it for their own protection.
  12. Profile photo of MacGuffin
    MacGuffin Female 30-39
    2602 posts
    April 11, 2012 at 11:11 am
    >>>No, he was not arrested. He was taken in for questioning and released. He wasn`t locked in a jail cell with bail and held until trial or anything like he should have been.<<<

    I`m sorry, but he *was* arrested. You know those cuffs he was wearing?, they don`t put them on just for Ride Alongs. This is apparently his arrest report, though I can`t find it referenced by any mainstream media outlet, so I can`t confirm if it`s real. My point remains, though: you don`t wear cuffs when accompanying the police, unless you`re under arrest or your cop boyfriend is kinky.
  13. Profile photo of MacGuffin
    MacGuffin Female 30-39
    2602 posts
    April 11, 2012 at 11:12 am
    MacGuffin: i`ve been in cuffs without having been arrested...they do it for their own protection.
    If any officer tries to pull that on you and you let them, you`re a fool. Unless you`re under arrest, the police are not allowed to restrain you.
  14. Profile photo of PinkRhoid
    PinkRhoid Male 18-29
    1239 posts
    April 11, 2012 at 11:16 am
    His lawyers were looking for a way out anyways. Guilty or innocent anyone helping this guy is in real danger. Even if he is innocent and a mountain of evidence supported it no one against him would blink at it and he`d be dead as soon as he was spotted in the outside world. Dead in prison guilty, dead outside prison innocent, what`s left but to try and run?
  15. Profile photo of collegebound
    collegebound Male 18-29
    3745 posts
    April 11, 2012 at 11:20 am
    MacGuffin: im going to point out that you live in the UK and we live in the States. things here are different from things there.
  16. Profile photo of Smutleybutt
    Smutleybutt Male 18-29
    1377 posts
    April 11, 2012 at 11:22 am
    The use handcuffs by a Police Officer is covered in section 117 of the Police and criminal evidence act, the legislation that covers the use of force by a Police Officer.

    This legislation applies only to Police Officers in the course of their lawful duty.

    If an officer feels that its necessary to place handcuffs onto someone in order to search them then this would be seen as a lawful use of force.

    Its up to the individual officer to justify their actions and use of force but I would suggest that the use of handcuffs was to prevent the disposal of evidence, i.e. any drugs that they thought you may have been carrying.

    So yes in the U.S.A. you can be put in cuffs but not be under arrest.
  17. Profile photo of Gerry1of1
    Gerry1of1 Male 50-59
    36176 posts
    April 11, 2012 at 11:25 am

    You guys leave MacGuffin alone. I for one am glad to have an expert on everything here to clarify these things for us.
  18. Profile photo of PinkRhoid
    PinkRhoid Male 18-29
    1239 posts
    April 11, 2012 at 11:26 am
    you don`t wear cuffs when accompanying the police, unless you`re under arrest or your cop boyfriend is kinky.

    Entirely incorrect. Cuffs are used in detaining. Often people are detained this way for questioning and it isn`t until much later they decide whether they have what it takes to make an arrest. Being cuffed, taken in, or even held for awhile does not constitute arrest. As for Z, I don`t know if his was an arrest or a detainment. What you linked appears to be a police report, and on its own does not indicate arrest.
  19. Profile photo of FoolsPrussia
    FoolsPrussia Male 30-39
    3446 posts
    April 11, 2012 at 11:26 am
    The Washington Post is now reporting that the special prosecutor will file charges against George Zimmerman.
  20. Profile photo of RPossum
    RPossum Male 30-39
    1059 posts
    April 11, 2012 at 11:29 am
    Damnit stupid off whitey...you`re messin up our system.
    You don`t run away...you pay the judge. Sheesh.
  21. Profile photo of PinkRhoid
    PinkRhoid Male 18-29
    1239 posts
    April 11, 2012 at 11:32 am
    The Washington Post is now reporting that the special prosecutor will file charges against George Zimmerman.

    I would think so. Despite having, imo, a reason to run, (like I said before dead either way) running is almost as good as admitting guilt. Assuming he ran, I think it`s far more likely someone made some money on the bounty on his head or flat out murdered him.
  22. Profile photo of MacGuffin
    MacGuffin Female 30-39
    2602 posts
    April 11, 2012 at 11:38 am
    >>>MacGuffin: im going to point out that you live in the UK and we live in the States. things here are different from things there.<<<

    Actually, you`re right. I`m not an expert in either jurisdiction (though I have at least worked in the UK police service, not as an officer).

    I`ve just been reading up on some case law and news stories, though, and it looks like yet another civil right you guys have handed over to the boys in blue. I found cases of people being convicted based on statements they made after being handcuffed, despite not being given Miranda warnings, and other cases where `consent` to search was apparently given by a handcuffed, `un-arrested` man, without probable cause for the search

    ...
  23. Profile photo of MacGuffin
    MacGuffin Female 30-39
    2602 posts
    April 11, 2012 at 11:39 am
    Still, in a country that sanctions torture and rendition of civilians at government level, nothing surprises me any more about just how distorted a version of justice exists in the US.
  24. Profile photo of FoolsPrussia
    FoolsPrussia Male 30-39
    3446 posts
    April 11, 2012 at 11:39 am
    Zimmerman is either having some sort of mental breakdown or he was off to start with. He`s obviously alienated his lawyers by disappearing, and he even called Sean Hannity for advice. Now he`s set up his own web site with an American flag background image, with a paypal link to support his legal defense.
  25. Profile photo of MacGuffin
    MacGuffin Female 30-39
    2602 posts
    April 11, 2012 at 11:41 am
    You guys leave MacGuffin alone. I for one am glad to have an expert on everything here to clarify these things for us.

    At least I differentiate between opinion and independently-verifiable facts, Gerry. And, unlike you, I don`t take refuge in sarcasm or denial when other people point out any hypcocrisy or inconsistency in anything I`ve said.
  26. Profile photo of collegebound
    collegebound Male 18-29
    3745 posts
    April 11, 2012 at 11:41 am
    MacGuffin: yup. there used to be a day and age when if you weren`t mirandized then when you went to court nobody could touch you...wonder if that still works...also if you asked to have your arresting officer drug tested they HAD to test him/her. i miss those days...
  27. Profile photo of MacGuffin
    MacGuffin Female 30-39
    2602 posts
    April 11, 2012 at 11:43 am
    Entirely incorrect. Cuffs are used in detaining. Often people are detained this way for questioning and it isn`t until much later they decide whether they have what it takes to make an arrest.

    You`re right - I`ve just been checking my facts (see below). This wouldn`t happen in the UK, though, I assure you. It never ceases to amaze me just how many rights American civilians appear to have willingly handed over or had forcibly taken from them by those meant to protect them.
  28. Profile photo of BoredFrank
    BoredFrank Male 40-49
    2197 posts
    April 11, 2012 at 11:45 am
    Oh MacGuffin, is there *any* aspect of American life or society on which you are not a world-renowned expert?

    I suppose living in your flawless European Utopia leaves you plenty of time to study the faults of the US. We`re just glad you`re here to disseminate your knowledge and blunt wisdom!
  29. Profile photo of Gerry1of1
    Gerry1of1 Male 50-59
    36176 posts
    April 11, 2012 at 11:46 am

    @ MacGuffin - Why so mad? I said you were an `expert`.

    Geezsh! You can`t pay some people a compliment.
  30. Profile photo of MacGuffin
    MacGuffin Female 30-39
    2602 posts
    April 11, 2012 at 11:50 am
    MacGuffin: yup. there used to be a day and age when if you weren`t mirandized then when you went to court nobody could touch you...wonder if that still works...also if you asked to have your arresting officer drug tested they HAD to test him/her. i miss those days...

    As distasteful as it is when apparently genuine criminals go free when the police don`t do their jobs properly (such as not remembering to give a Miranda warning prior to questioning after arrest), it`s little rules like those that should protect ordinary people from tyranny.
  31. Profile photo of maddux32
    maddux32 Male 30-39
    926 posts
    April 11, 2012 at 11:53 am
    Miranda is still alive and well. And what violation of Miranda are you referring to? As far as I know, he was questioned voluntarily, and not charged. He lawyered up, and ignored the advice of his lawyers. By the way, he had the worst defense attorneys anyone could ever ask for, and good luck to them getting clients ever again. Holy crap. Morons.
  32. Profile photo of MacGuffin
    MacGuffin Female 30-39
    2602 posts
    April 11, 2012 at 11:54 am
    @ MacGuffin - Why so mad? I said you were an `expert`.

    Geezsh! You can`t pay some people a compliment.

    And to think you`ve got the cheek to call me a troll (though I do realise that, for some people on IAB, yourself included, "troll" = "person that has merely beaten me in an argument").

    I`ll put you in my `not worth responding to` pile from now on.
  33. Profile photo of collegebound
    collegebound Male 18-29
    3745 posts
    April 11, 2012 at 11:57 am
    maddux32: we never said anything about Miranda rights and Zimmerman in the same sentence...

    Holy crap. Moron.
  34. Profile photo of PinkRhoid
    PinkRhoid Male 18-29
    1239 posts
    April 11, 2012 at 11:58 am
    It never ceases to amaze me just how many rights American civilians appear to have willingly handed over or had forcibly taken from them by those meant to protect them.

    Well, a lot of it isn`t that they are for it or willing but too damn stupid to see it happening. They`ve become sloths, loathe to do anything that interferes with their cozy daily lives. If something is unpleasant, ignore it or make excuses so you can move on and not care. They are lobsters in a pot of once cold water and they don`t feel it getting hotter. Not all of us though, and those of us who are aware are powerless to stop it unless people wake up.
  35. Profile photo of MacGuffin
    MacGuffin Female 30-39
    2602 posts
    April 11, 2012 at 11:59 am
    Oh MacGuffin, is there *any* aspect of American life or society on which you are not a world-renowned expert?

    I suppose living in your flawless European Utopia leaves you plenty of time to study the faults of the US. We`re just glad you`re here to disseminate your knowledge and blunt wisdom!

    I`m pretty sure I made clear I wasn`t an expert below, Frank, but I guess you just read what you want to read, exactly like Gerry.
  36. Profile photo of maddux32
    maddux32 Male 30-39
    926 posts
    April 11, 2012 at 11:59 am
    Don`t hate on MacGuffin because she can speak intelligently about things that are not in her backyard. If she`s too much for you, of you feel intimidated by her, don`t resort to, "Oh, here comes the expert again...Mrs. Freaking Know it all." Weaksauce.
  37. Profile photo of PinkRhoid
    PinkRhoid Male 18-29
    1239 posts
    April 11, 2012 at 12:00 pm
    didn`t end the quote. Oops.
  38. Profile photo of LillianDulci
    LillianDulci Female 18-29
    2674 posts
    April 11, 2012 at 12:01 pm
    Unlike some others here, I`m forgiving (+forgetting) MacGuffin`s mistake. I looked it up after I said what I said and noticed the differing laws between the UK and the USA. It`s an honest mistake. Idk why you guys keep bothering her about it :|
  39. Profile photo of MacGuffin
    MacGuffin Female 30-39
    2602 posts
    April 11, 2012 at 12:04 pm
    Well, a lot of it isn`t that they are for it or willing but too damn stupid to see it happening. They`ve become sloths, loathe to do anything that interferes with their cozy daily lives. If something is unpleasant, ignore it or make excuses so you can move on and not care. They are lobsters in a pot of once cold water and they don`t feel it getting hotter. Not all of us though, and those of us who are aware are powerless to stop it unless people wake up.

    Actually, the more I read about the way the US treats its own citizens, I don`t think stupidity of the victims is the reason that those who abuse get away with it.

    IMO, the US authorities get away with abusing people`s rights, and re-inventing the law every five minutes to suit themselves, because the silent majority, whilst occasionally appalled by isolated cases like this one, simply don`t have the imaginative capacity to realise that they themselves could be the next victim.
  40. Profile photo of maddux32
    maddux32 Male 30-39
    926 posts
    April 11, 2012 at 12:04 pm
    @Macguffin

    There are four exceptions to Miranda v. Arizona, and it is entirely possible to convicted based on statements made to police before receiving Miranda warnings.

    1. Impeachment
    2. Waiver
    3. Booking Info
    4. Emergency
  41. Profile photo of MacGuffin
    MacGuffin Female 30-39
    2602 posts
    April 11, 2012 at 12:05 pm
    Unlike some others here, I`m forgiving (+forgetting) MacGuffin`s mistake. I looked it up after I said what I said and noticed the differing laws between the UK and the USA. It`s an honest mistake. Idk why you guys keep bothering her about it :|

    Thanks, Lillian.
  42. Profile photo of diylobotomy
    diylobotomy Male 18-29
    1832 posts
    April 11, 2012 at 12:06 pm
    You guise know what`s more annoying that people arguing on the internet? When its actually not 12 year old kids, but rather adults acting like 12 year olds.
  43. Profile photo of MacGuffin
    MacGuffin Female 30-39
    2602 posts
    April 11, 2012 at 12:06 pm
    @Macguffin

    There are four exceptions to Miranda v. Arizona, and it is entirely possible to convicted based on statements made to police before receiving Miranda warnings.

    1. Impeachment
    2. Waiver
    3. Booking Info
    4. Emergency

    Worrying stuff, eh? Especially number 4, which is open to wide misinterpretation.
  44. Profile photo of MacGuffin
    MacGuffin Female 30-39
    2602 posts
    April 11, 2012 at 12:07 pm
    maddux32: we never said anything about Miranda rights and Zimmerman in the same sentence...

    Holy crap. Moron.
    I brought up Miranda rights, in the context of being handcuffed and not realising you weren`t under arrest.
  45. Profile photo of PinkRhoid
    PinkRhoid Male 18-29
    1239 posts
    April 11, 2012 at 12:08 pm
    Ya, Miranda is only valid on things said to police after arrest. If you volunteer info before they`ve said anything about detainment or arrest it`s fair game I believe. Otherwise they`d have to miranda any and all people they ever talk to as any could self incriminate at any time even if they aren`t a suspect. They use this fact to screw people too sometimes.
  46. Profile photo of imnakdjumpme
    imnakdjumpme Male 18-29
    598 posts
    April 11, 2012 at 12:08 pm
    Zimmerman just used their legal council and doesnt need a lawyer at this time since hes not charged with anything. THey said they would still represent him if he needed it, especially because he has a strong case, but he doesnt right now, so who f`ing cares.
  47. Profile photo of xXBrodieXx
    xXBrodieXx Male 30-39
    57 posts
    April 11, 2012 at 12:09 pm
    He was arrested just not charged. Any time you are detained by the police with force and or restraint is an arrest.
  48. Profile photo of maddux32
    maddux32 Male 30-39
    926 posts
    April 11, 2012 at 12:09 pm
    @Macguffin

    Very worrying. Basically, "in the interests of justice" the trial judge can do whatever he wants and dare anyone who doesn`t like it to appeal. The policy behind the emergency exceptions is supposed to be in the interest of public safety, for example, read New York v. Quarles since your researching case law.

    "We conclude that the need for answers to questions in a situation posing a threat to the public safety outweighs the need for the prophylactic rule protecting the fifth amendment.
    "We do not believe that Miranda requires application in a situation where police officers ask questions reasonably prompted by a concern for the public safety."
  49. Profile photo of Beauxner
    Beauxner Male 30-39
    68 posts
    April 11, 2012 at 12:09 pm
    "A: If he`s guilty he`d want to escape prosecution, so run.
    B: If he`s innocent there`s no way he is NOT going to jail because of the media hooplah, so again, run.
    &
    3: It won`t make his prison sentance any longer by trying to run before arrest so he has nothing to lose by trying... so run."

    4. Running is good for the cardiovascular system....so run.
  50. Profile photo of PinkRhoid
    PinkRhoid Male 18-29
    1239 posts
    April 11, 2012 at 12:11 pm
    You guise know what`s more annoying that people arguing on the internet? When its actually not 12 year old kids, but rather adults acting like 12 year olds.

    For the most part this has remained pretty calm, better than I`ve seen before, and a discussion is not an argument. Your comment is as childish as the few others you are likely complaining about.
  51. Profile photo of maddux32
    maddux32 Male 30-39
    926 posts
    April 11, 2012 at 12:11 pm
    Even with Miranda, if the defendant takes the stand, anything said in the interrogation room, or in any situation where Miranda would be a valid defense, can be used against him for impeachment purposes.
  52. Profile photo of PinkRhoid
    PinkRhoid Male 18-29
    1239 posts
    April 11, 2012 at 12:13 pm
    Any time you are detained by the police with force and or restraint is an arrest.

    Again, this isn`t wholly right. I have been cuffed and run in for mistaken identity and later released. No arrest to speak of. I encourage you to look it up. If a cop has even a suspicion you could be violent or a flight risk he may cuff you. Detainment is not arrest and neither is cuffing.
  53. Profile photo of PinkRhoid
    PinkRhoid Male 18-29
    1239 posts
    April 11, 2012 at 12:14 pm
    Not saying Z wasn`t arrested btw, just that it isn`t a set rule that cuffed = arrest.
  54. Profile photo of maddux32
    maddux32 Male 30-39
    926 posts
    April 11, 2012 at 12:20 pm
    Pinkrhoid is absolutely correct. There is a difference between being detained and formally arrested.
  55. Profile photo of xXBrodieXx
    xXBrodieXx Male 30-39
    57 posts
    April 11, 2012 at 12:20 pm
    "A seizure or forcible restraint; an exercise of the power to deprive a person of his or her liberty; the taking or keeping of a person in custody by legal authority, especially, in response to a criminal charge." This states "especially" not "only" in response to a criminal charge.
  56. Profile photo of xXBrodieXx
    xXBrodieXx Male 30-39
    57 posts
    April 11, 2012 at 12:21 pm
    An arrest may occur (1) by the touching or putting hands on the arrestee; (2) by any act that indicates an intention to take the arrestee into custody and that subjects the arrestee to the actual control and will of the person making the arrest; or (3) by the consent of the person to be arrested. There is no arrest where there is no restraint, and the restraint must be under real or pretended legal authority. However, the detention of a person need not be accompanied by formal words of arrest or a station house booking to constitute an arrest.
  57. Profile photo of xXBrodieXx
    xXBrodieXx Male 30-39
    57 posts
    April 11, 2012 at 12:22 pm
    It boils down to two things. Either a citizen is free to go, or they are detained which constitutes being under arrest.
  58. Profile photo of maddux32
    maddux32 Male 30-39
    926 posts
    April 11, 2012 at 12:26 pm
    @Brodie

    What you just listed was a procedural guideline for how an arrest can occur. However, for Miranda purposes, their has to be a distinguishing period as to when the detention has turned into an arrest. For legal purposes, and heavily weighing on the evidence record, this is crucial. Generally a detention occurs when a reasonable person feel they are not free to leave, be it from physical detention or a showing of authority. A formal arrest is normally starts with a formal explanation to the detainee that they are being arrested, or upon a showing of all the circumstances that for all intents and purposes, the suspect has been arrested.
  59. Profile photo of MacGuffin
    MacGuffin Female 30-39
    2602 posts
    April 11, 2012 at 12:30 pm
    >>>Even with Miranda, if the defendant takes the stand, anything said in the interrogation room, or in any situation where Miranda would be a valid defense, can be used against him for impeachment purposes. <<<

    That`s worrying.

    By comparison, in the UK, all police interviews are tape recorded, with a copy immediately given to the arrested person afterwards.

    There was also a relevant case in Scotland recently (which has its own law, separate from England), called the Cadder Case, whereby a detainee who`d been questioned without a lawyer present had their conviction quashed.

    ...
  60. Profile photo of MacGuffin
    MacGuffin Female 30-39
    2602 posts
    April 11, 2012 at 12:30 pm
    A key outcome of the Cadder Case was that "the ruling states that confessions obtained by the police cannot be used as evidence at a trial, unless the suspect was allowed legal advice from a solicitor beforehand." (from the above link).

    I feel a lot safer knowing I have that kind of protection against prosecutorial misconduct. :\
  61. Profile photo of Gerry1of1
    Gerry1of1 Male 50-59
    36176 posts
    April 11, 2012 at 12:32 pm

    MacGuffin, "And to think you`ve got the cheek to call me a troll"
    When did I call you a `troll` ?

    Of course, english is my second language, I`m actually fluent in red-neck, being just a backwards american and not oh-so sophisticated like you european types. But over here `expert` and `troll` have differant meaning. Perhaps you could explain to me the correct usage. I`m sure you`re an expert on that as well.
  62. Profile photo of xXBrodieXx
    xXBrodieXx Male 30-39
    57 posts
    April 11, 2012 at 12:34 pm
    @maddux32 You state that "A formal arrest is normally starts with a formal explanation to the detainee" yet in the "procedural guideline" guideline I posted it states "the detention of a person need not be accompanied by formal words of arrest or a station house booking to constitute an arrest." Slightly conflicting.
  63. Profile photo of xXBrodieXx
    xXBrodieXx Male 30-39
    57 posts
    April 11, 2012 at 12:37 pm
    All I am saying is if a person is detained they are under arrest, they may not have charges filed and be released soon after but they were still under arrest.
  64. Profile photo of maddux32
    maddux32 Male 30-39
    926 posts
    April 11, 2012 at 12:40 pm
    "You state that "A formal arrest is normally starts with a formal explanation to the detainee" yet in the "procedural guideline" guideline I posted it states "the detention of a person need not be accompanied by formal words of arrest or a station house booking to constitute an arrest." Slightly conflicting."

    That is absolutely correct. Procedurally. However, pertaining to the admissibility of evidence, the formalities of the arrest have to be presented to the detainee (i.e., Miranda Warnings). As far as the present sense impression of the detainee, I agree, that an arrest and a detention are exactly the same. But how the courts see it, they are separate.
  65. Profile photo of maddux32
    maddux32 Male 30-39
    926 posts
    April 11, 2012 at 12:43 pm
    A key outcome of the Cadder Case was that "the ruling states that confessions obtained by the police cannot be used as evidence at a trial, unless the suspect was allowed legal advice from a solicitor beforehand." (from the above link).

    Thats interesting. When Miranda first came out I believe in 1967, the rule was similar. But the courts worried that the Miranda rule would be overly broad and affect police investigations in ways not intended by the Miranda Court. The impeachment exception has no bearing on a case if the defendant does not testify, which is why someone who is guilty is highly advised not to take the stand. When they do, it`s all fair game.
  66. Profile photo of maddux32
    maddux32 Male 30-39
    926 posts
    April 11, 2012 at 12:44 pm
    From Harris v. New York

    "Miranda barred the prosecution from making its case with statements of an accused made while in custody prior to having or effectively waiving counsel. It does not follow from Miranda that evidence inadmissible against an accused in the prosecution`s case in chief is barred for all purposes, provided of course that the trustworthiness of the evidence satisfies legal standards."
  67. Profile photo of xXBrodieXx
    xXBrodieXx Male 30-39
    57 posts
    April 11, 2012 at 12:46 pm
    Right, once in court everything gets twisted. The difference in a felony and expungement here in the states usually depends on the accused ability to obtain large enough sums to pay good lawyers and fines.
  68. Profile photo of PinkRhoid
    PinkRhoid Male 18-29
    1239 posts
    April 11, 2012 at 12:46 pm
    It boils down to two things. Either a citizen is free to go, or they are detained which constitutes being under arrest.

    Being detained is not synonymous with arrest. I will concede that cuffing is always indicative of an arrest by action. However, it does not always stick as an arrest in the books because of mistakes.
  69. Profile photo of PinkRhoid
    PinkRhoid Male 18-29
    1239 posts
    April 11, 2012 at 12:48 pm
    An example is the Kony guy who was detained but not arrested.
  70. Profile photo of PinkRhoid
    PinkRhoid Male 18-29
    1239 posts
    April 11, 2012 at 12:56 pm
    I think we are discussing different terms of arrest. The word itself by definition is exactly as you say. To be held still. In essence detained is arrested but it becomes relevant when an arrest looks bad on a record whereas being detained isn`t even in the record.
  71. Profile photo of xXBrodieXx
    xXBrodieXx Male 30-39
    57 posts
    April 11, 2012 at 1:02 pm
    You are right Pink. Our system is so convoluted that the actual meaning of something has no bearing.
  72. Profile photo of ledzeppeloyd
    ledzeppeloyd Male 18-29
    2385 posts
    April 11, 2012 at 1:08 pm
    running away like a guilty bitch
  73. Profile photo of Enjin
    Enjin Male 30-39
    802 posts
    April 11, 2012 at 1:26 pm
    No idea if the guy is guilty of some crime or not, but didn`t he have a bounty put on his head? I`d be gone too if I was in his shoes. This is not surprising in the least.
  74. Profile photo of patchgrabber
    patchgrabber Male 30-39
    5812 posts
    April 11, 2012 at 1:50 pm
    Was he issued a summons in lieu of arrest? An arrest requires fingerprinting, booking etc.
  75. Profile photo of Fatninja01
    Fatninja01 Male 30-39
    25406 posts
    April 11, 2012 at 1:55 pm
    What you misplaced him.... Hes probably in Mexico by now.. everyone flees to mexico dont they
  76. Profile photo of Baelzar
    Baelzar Male 40-49
    1399 posts
    April 11, 2012 at 2:07 pm
    I`d hide too.

    If I had an illegal bounty on my life, a political prosecutor after me (without a grand jury, hmm...) and every know-nothing lefty wanting to hang me before I even see a courtroom...bet your ass I`d hide.
  77. Profile photo of ivran
    ivran Male 18-29
    599 posts
    April 11, 2012 at 2:13 pm
    @patchgrabber I`ve read that the prosecutor will call for his arrest later today.

    Also, is Z-Booty actually `missing` or is he just not willing to communicate with anybody? The two are different things. If he`s missing, I think it`s only fair to investigate the people who have illegally put a bounty on his head and got away with it(ironic, isn`t it?). I do think it`s a great possibility that a suicide is on the horizon, which in my opinion, should warrant an apology by the news media who has done nothing but slander this, as of right now, innocent man. They can hate on him all he wants if he gets convicted, but he has done nothing to put himself in front of the media, in fact, he has been avoiding it.
  78. Profile photo of DromEd
    DromEd Male 40-49
    1835 posts
    April 11, 2012 at 2:35 pm
    Weather he`s guilty or innocent there are a lot of angry people out there who could and would do him harm. I don`t see a problem with making myself scarce under these circumstances. Just be there to face the music if you`re called upon.
  79. Profile photo of ivran
    ivran Male 18-29
    599 posts
    April 11, 2012 at 2:40 pm
    @patchgrabber Yea, it`s going to happen at 6pm.
  80. Profile photo of simbha
    simbha Male 30-39
    412 posts
    April 11, 2012 at 3:09 pm
    I am a strong supporter of having this man arrested and prosecuted for the alleged crime. I`m not saying that he is guilty, but there does appear to be enough to reasonable try him. He was instructed (though not `ordered`) not to pursue Martin; he did and some sort of scuffle occurred which resulted in Martin`s death at his hands. He should not be tried in a court of public opinion, but his actions directly led to the death of a person and it should be decided in a court of law.

    Having said that, if any harm does come to him - by his own hand or through vigilantism - I would like to see the instigators (such as the NBPs) investigated and prosecuted, as well.

    It is imperative that we live in a civil society that adheres to reasonable laws, to the best of our ability. Vigilantism of any sort - by Zimmermand or the NBPs or any other actors (including law enforcement officers - should not be tolerated. Period.
  81. Profile photo of DingDingDong
    DingDingDong Male 30-39
    1511 posts
    April 11, 2012 at 3:09 pm

    I bet the New Black Panthers have him right now. They are probably beheading him (because they are Islamic organization)
  82. Profile photo of LillianDulci
    LillianDulci Female 18-29
    2674 posts
    April 11, 2012 at 3:09 pm
    ivran, are you calling for an apology from all the people who have slandered Trayvon too?
  83. Profile photo of 5Cats
    5Cats Male 50-59
    31762 posts
    April 11, 2012 at 3:12 pm
    Lets see: Hollywood types are Tweeting his "address"...
    News stations are "editing" 911 tapes to make him sound like a racist...
    A violent Black Rights group has a "dead or alive" bounty on him...
    The "Race Baiters" have been calling for "Justice... or Else!" for some time now...

    IS there a law that says he MUST stay in contact with the police? No? Well then, what has he done wrong?

    I`m glad few IABers (so far) are suggesting that if he hides it means he`s guilty. It means there`s a "Dead Or Alive" bounty on his head! Pre-trial!

    Remember the Duke Lacross Team? Same deal.
  84. Profile photo of 5Cats
    5Cats Male 50-59
    31762 posts
    April 11, 2012 at 3:16 pm
    @LillianDulci: WHO, anywhere, has "slandered" Saint Trayvon?

    The MSM tried to hide the truth about him, is telling the truth "slander" these days?
  85. Profile photo of ivran
    ivran Male 18-29
    599 posts
    April 11, 2012 at 4:08 pm
    @LillianDulci The media, as far as I know, has not slandered Trayvon. Individuals on the internet cannot be accused of slander in the legal sense of the word.
  86. Profile photo of patchgrabber
    patchgrabber Male 30-39
    5812 posts
    April 12, 2012 at 6:54 am
    Individuals on the internet cannot be accused of slander in the legal sense of the word.
    Technically it would be libel, but in either event you`re correct. To be actually found guilty of either of them is nigh impossible, since you have to prove that the other person KNEW it was a lie when they said it.
  87. Profile photo of Wibble4321
    Wibble4321 Male 40-49
    405 posts
    April 16, 2012 at 10:47 am
    @patchgrabber "Technically it would be libel, but in either event you`re correct. To be actually found guilty of either of them is nigh impossible, since you have to prove that the other person KNEW it was a lie when they said it."

    Actually almost the opposite. You can be found guilty of libel if you make a statement about someone in the form of a fact when you do not have sufficient proof of that fact. i.e. passing rumors.

    Typically the test then moves to how would the average person on the street interpret any statement or remark and was it damaging to the individual.

    There is no defense against libel in saying Í thought it was true. If you make a statement of fact in writing the responsibility is on you to research that fact adequately.

    On the internet the issue typically rest around the owner/operator of forums and areas with public comment and the moderation or censorship of potentially defaming statements on them. This is p
  88. Profile photo of jamie76
    jamie76 Male 30-39
    2346 posts
    August 29, 2012 at 4:40 pm
    Zimmerman finally admitted to himself that he murdered an unarmed kid and lost it...tha tis the headline I hope to see out of this.

Leave a Reply