Pay Your Fair Share Of Taxes But What`s Fair?

Submitted by: 5cats 5 years ago in

Obama calls for the USA to pay their ""fair share"" but what exactly is ""fair""?
There are 74 comments:
Male 40,277

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Male 389
What a loon.
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Male 40,277
@middlewaytao: Net? Not net? There is no difference.
If the top 1% paying ANY tax makes them `monorns`, then by golly, LOTS OF RICH FOLKS ARE MORONS! Because the top 1% PAYS 30%! Not "theoretically" but IN FACT.

PAYS!
Not `might pay`
Not `could pay`
IN FACT PAYS!

Try to keep up sonny-boy, you`re laggin behind...

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Male 389
@5cats Once again No, I specifically said net. If you are in the top 1% and paying income tax you are a moron.
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Male 40,277
Oh: btw: I personally have made this point MANY times here at IAB, to no avail...
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Male 40,277
[quote]The lower classes surely pay more percentage wise of total income than the upper classes.[/quote]
BING! BING! BING!
You are absolutely correct @jarjarburns! And who, anywhere, is addressing this problem?
The LEFT wants to increase:
gasoline taxes
electricity taxes
sales taxes
food prices
And WHO does this harm the most? The poorest amoung us!
So: the left wishes to harm the poorest amoung us. Period.
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Male 98
Very misleading.
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Male 17
This completely ignore all the income that goes out for all the other taxes. The lower classes surely pay more percentage wise of total income than the upper classes.
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Male 40,277
@jt: none of what you said amounts to a hill of beans. I`d strike them down one by one but it always takes longer to show WHY something is false than to repeat a `Democrat talking point` eh?

@middlewaytao: You didn`t say it? But left it out there for all to infer...

@OutWest: True, flat taxes might be more fair, but the poor`d need to pay 30% just like the rich folks! Or else the left will squeal "ooo! ooo! The rich got tax-cuts! wee wee wee!"

Good point @Gerry1, we don`t have a `capitalist` system in North America any longer.
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Male 39,531

Capitalism worked pretty well.
We should go back to doing that.
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Male 4,142
this is such BS
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Male 389
[quote]top 1% = 30% of net taxes - 43% of net wealth[/quote]
@middlewaytao: "Income" and "Wealth" are two ENTIRELY different subjects. Unless you like the idea of Governmant confiscation of private property? Your name, it seems... unfitting.

Yah, that`s why I didn`t say income taxes....
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Male 3,369
man..it`s late, and the charachter counter isn`t very accurate...but one more thing. It didn`t ruffle my feathers. I took it as a funny. Have a good night. :-)
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Male 3,369
5cats:"EVERYTHING BAD you say about the Republicans, Obama has ALREADY DONE!"

Really? Republicans wanted to let the auto industry fail. Obama gave them a loan and saved at least a million jobs. (think of all the other satellite industries that benefit)
Republicans wanted to keep gays out of the military. So did Oba...oh..wait..never mind. He repealed DADT.
He expanded the SCHIP program. That helped alot of kids. Like millions.
Republicans loved how Bush didn`t wan`t casualities in the wars to be reprted on. You might remeber he ordered a blackout on coverage of caskets coming home? So did Oba...wait...Obama lifted that ban. sorry.
Republicans were trying to save public sector jobs and....wait...no...they want to shyte-can the. Obama took steps to protect them. Republicans said something about "not being worried about Bin Laden" (because Saddam was actually the one who was harboring Al-Queda and had the WMD`s)!!??!! Well, und
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Male 546
One person`s fair is another person`s unfair.

Why not a flat percentage for each of us, regardless?
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Male 40,277
[quote]5cats: "Don`t give up the day job sonny..."[/quote]
@jt: I say, I say that was a joke there son! (Foghorn Leghorn voice)
I meant it as a funny, sorry it ruffled your feathers.

[quote]top 1% = 30% of net taxes - 43% of net wealth[/quote]
@middlewaytao: "Income" and "Wealth" are two ENTIRELY different subjects. Unless you like the idea of Governmant confiscation of private property? Your name, it seems... unfitting.

[quote]He`ll close those corporate loopholes!!!!![/quote]
Just like Obama! HE promised to close corporate loopholes too! And had majorites in both houses... so tell me again why ANYONE is `worse` than Obama?
EVERYTHING BAD you say about the Republicans, Obama has ALREADY DONE! Or not done as the case may be.
Name one thing! Go on! It`s either fiction or Obama has done it.
iirc @jt: YOU blamed Repubs for keeping Guantanimo Bay open...
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Male 3,369
Ooooh! I have an idea! Let`s get Willard Romney elected! He`ll close those corporate loopholes!!!!!
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Male 3,369
middlewaytao: "Or we could just treat every working person as a corporate charter, only pay 15% on what you have left over after all living expenses, home improvements, etc. are paid"

Now THAT`S an idea I could get behind! Hell, if I work it right, after living expenses, home improvements, and investments (offshore, of course) I could sucessfully end up with paying almost nothing!
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Male 3,369
5cats: "Don`t give up the day job sonny..."
Maybe you should come down here to the deep south to hear what a REAL conservative sounds like. As I said...it wasn`t trolling. It wasn`t satire. It was an impression. I`ll take you to some bars were that talk will get you a free beer. Hell, I`ll take you up to Sanford where there`s a bar not even ten minutes drive from where Trayvon Martin was killed that if I called Obama the "N" word, we`d probably drink for free.
I know you`re not a racist, nor do you approve of it, but after seeing some of the posts on this site on other threads, why get all hot and bothered at me? Bark up the other tree, man.
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Male 389
"Here`s a thought: Since corporations have lobbied to have `person` status, let`s just wipe out ALL of their corporate tax breaks and tax them as `people`."

Or we could just treat every working person as a corporate charter, only pay 15% on what you have left over after all living expenses, home improvements, etc. are paid
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Male 389
top 1% = 30% of net taxes - 43% of net wealth
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Male 40,277
Odd @jt, I DO remember the MSM being all over Reagan for that. And back then there was actually SOME righties in the Media...

Impressions? Don`t give up the day job sonny...
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Male 3,369
Oh, and btw. i`m not "trolling". I`m just doing impressions. Not bad, eh?
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Male 3,369
"You remember when Obama called Bush "unpatriotic" for spending so much? I DO!"


Do you remember fiscal "conservatives howling about Reagan borrowing from Social Security to pay for his budgets? I DON`T!
Please....both sides suck.
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Male 40,277
@jt: Stop trolling @logandaninja, plz!

Carter: let inflation and intrest rates skyrocket.
Canada: inflation and intrest skyrockets.
Reagan: imposes anti-inflation measures, gets the economy rolling.
Canada: imposes anti-inflation measures (stupid ones that didn`t work) economy rolls anyhow because the USA is rolling.
Bush I: Invades Iraq.
Canada: We do too.
Clinton: cuts welfare, seriously reduces the deficit
Canada: cuts medical spending, slightly reduces the deficit.
Bush: invades Afghanistan
Canada: We do too.

Want more? I got TONS!

And yes @jt: thanks to our `socialism`; we used to carry a heavy debt-load per capita.
Thanks to Obam, the USA has WAY MORE debt per capita now! In only 3 year`s he`s out-spent Bush`s 8 years!
You remember when Obama called Bush "unpatriotic" for spending so much? I DO!
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Male 3,369
logananddaninja: "I feel like those statistics aren`t 100% accurate."

Well, then you must be a Communist, Socialist tree-hugging Kenyan homosexual that hates America!! Go back to Mexico, you Muslim!!
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Male 3,369
"if the USA is doing well, Canada does well!"

Um, 5cats...how does that work, since you`re Socialists and stuff?
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Male 294
5cats, I sort of thought our economy was destroyed before obama got here.

On the other hand I guess I really shouldn`t say anything since I`m likely not going to be present if anyone responds, so I`ll leave it there.
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Male 3,369
@%cats: "And if they destroy their economy, like Obama is,"

Um, you make a statement like that without including any of our past presidents, like Bush, Clinton, and Reagan? Or responding to the link I posted? Have you lost your friggin` mind????
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Male 227
I feel like those statistics aren`t 100% accurate.
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Male 25,417
tax... just another way to screw you over
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Male 10,855
[quote]It doesn`t work. Fact.[/quote]

Socialism doesn`t work. Fact.
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Male 40,277
@FoolsPrussia: Fair question, it gets asked here a LOT! And usually in a rude way...

I`m a Canadian! I live right beside an 800 pound gorilla. I am VERY interested in what that gorilla does, because my country`s economy depends almost entirely on his!
Laws he passes? Usually we copy them.
Wars he gets into? Usually we`re in them too.
Ememnies he makes? They hate us also.
&etc.

SO: if the USA is doing well, Canada does well! And if they destroy their economy, like Obama is, Canada`s is doomed.
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Male 3,445
5cats: Not an attack, just a question. Are you Canadian, or are you an American citizen living in Canada? I`m just curious as to why you`re so interested in American politics.
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Male 559
What a bunch of bullmess.
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Male 3,369
The highest in the world? Only before the loopholes they use. Profits are at an all time high and they`re paying much MUCH less.
Now, if you want to bandy around a corporate rate of %25-28% with no loopholes, no exceptions, maybe that might be acceptable. (and certainly lower than what right-wingers think corporations are paying)
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Male 40,277
But @madest, were his pants tucked in? Eh? When he made the video? Were they?
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Male 7,378
Fair share in this context is merely 4%. Obama wants to roll back tax rates to what they were under Clinton when the economy was booming. From 35% to 39%. If the maker of this video used Google he wouldn`t need to waste all the time making this nonsense. But one can`t expect intelligence from the right.
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Male 40,277
@jt: yes Bush made a mistake by signing the First Stimulus, which the DEMOCRAT controlled house (including Omaba!) put forth. The Dems wrote, but Bush signed it so it`s his responsibility.

[quote]when corporations pay lower tax rates[/quote]
US Corporate taxes are amoung the highest in the world. Taxing them more would `imporve` the economy? It is to laugh!
They`ll either: move away, cut staff, pass on the tax through price increases. ALL of which harm the US`s economy and poorest people!
Think man! Think!
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Male 3,369
@5cats: Because, as much as the Republicans claim they never would`ve bailed out the companies, once in the "hot seat", you can bet they would declare them "too big to fail". Even George Bush did! Also, when corporations pay lower tax rates then someone like myself, but they didn`t thirty years ago, I`d call THAT "redistribution" of wealth. We`re paying lower taxes than when Reagan was in office, yet the gap between the top 1% and the rest of us has widened. You may love your "trickle-down" economics, but isn`t that what we had before the Great Depression? Then we had it again under Bush. Hmmm...
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Male 2,667
I`m no tax expert but it seems to me that not paying and fed tax and then getting money back seems BS.

I never got a job from a poor man.

Rich people are rich because they worked their asses off for 80 hours a week for years. Now tell me straight. If busted butt for that long would you not want to keep most of it?

Ask yourself honestly why you deserve the fruits of another man`s labor. I mean really think about that.

There is no such thing as free money though politicians will certainly make it seem that way.

If you want more of something tax it less, if you want less of something, tax it more.

The economy is not a zero sum game. Just because Mister X earns a dollar that doesn`t mean that`s one less dollar available to be earned by Mister Y.
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Male 40,277
[quote]Because they didn`t need it[/quote]
See? @jt? THAT is `redistribution of wealth` that Obama said he`d do! Remember Joe The Plumber?

SO: One company bets billions, it`s competators get... taxed!
Why be financially responsible and build a fine product when all you need is a greedy politician and a pork-filled law?
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Male 3,099
Here`s a thought: Since corporations have lobbied to have `person` status, let`s just wipe out ALL of their corporate tax breaks and tax them as `people`.
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Male 17,512
jtrebowski: Sweden, Yes I have. It makes most all of it`s GDP off of Hydroelectric power, timber and Iron ore and it still taxes it`s citizens at 60%, after their so called `tax wedge`.

Sweden`s GDP has been falling since the year 2000 and their government has had to impose spending cuts, they are also privatizing more and more of their formerly state controlled monopolies.

They also decided to not adopt the Euro, which was a good move on their part.

Care to try and `inform` me further? I`m not what you believe to be a typical `dumb American`, I know that even they are moving toward a more capitalist society and a less socialist one. It also doesn`t hurt that they have the second lowest corporate tax rate in Europe.

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Male 646
Save the rich! Save the rich!

Jesus Christ.
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Male 472
that was incredibly stupid.
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Male 1,471
Wait, what?.. He`s not a muslim nazi ??!?
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Male 12,138
5Cats?

Yep, nailed it. Still at 100%.
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Male 3,369
@%cats: Because they didn`t need it. Look, I`ve never seen any evidence that Obama or his administration are picking and choosing, but he was elected by people who would like to see a step towards more efficient and cleaner energy. As far as using stimulus money to do so, I`m not sure how I feel about it, but I do know that the most profitable corporation in the world still get subsidies, and for what reason?
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Male 40,277
@unmercyfuldu: This was hashed out before, the top 1% earns (iirc!) about 24% but pays 30% of all Federal taxes.
The bottom 50% earns about 24% too, but pays nothing.
Again, iirc, I`m too tired to look it all up again...

I like "flat tax" too, but there are so many variables! And you`d have to end "corporate welfare" to impliment it.

NOTE: Obama LOVES corporate welfare! What the drat do you think "the stimulus" was? He`s saying `more money for green, more money for rails` but really? He`s asking for MORE tax money (yours) to go to companies of HIS choosing.

IF that were not true: why didn`t Ford get the same amount of cash as GM?
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Male 3,369
OldOllie: I agree. I wouldn`t post a political ad and present them as "facts" either.
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Male 762
I have heard the statistic that the top 1% of earners pay 30% of the federal tax and it drives me nuts because the top 1% makes more than 30% of all the money. If there was a flat tax, dollar to dollar they would pay a whole lot more. Stop bitching.
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Female 2,674
OldOllie, been reading your own replies lately, huh? ^-^~
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Male 15,832
It`s getting harder and harder to distinguish between ignorance and stupidity on this site.
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Male 3,369
@5cats: The problem is where and how we spend it. If we spent it on infrastructure, education, and healthcare like you Canadians do, maybe we`d be in better shape. (like Canada is)
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Male 4
That`s Republican dogma you roll out, but talk is cheap. Overlay historical economic growth with tax rates, and do the same with deficits.
Warren Buffet is entirely correct. The wealthy should be paying more, and as a policy, history has repeatedly shown that it would not have the menacing effects you like to use in fear mongering.
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Male 3,369
CJ: "No country in the world has ever taxed itself into prosperity"

You even hear of Sweden?
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Male 40,277
[quote]And what % of the income do the 1% bring in? What % percent of the wealth do they control?[/quote]
@j_d0g: Those are two entirely, completely and totally UNRELATED issues. Unless you want the US government to confiscate private property?

@jt You have NO concept of basic economics, statistics OR what is fair. Are you familiar with the "Bar Tab" scenario? (help me out @crackr, I can`t recall it`s "proper name" to find it) Where people who PAY MORE get a bigger discount? DUH! It`s simple math!

Taxing the "rich" even more than they are will NOT:
Pay for the deficit
Stimulate the economy
Create new jobs

It will: INCREASE the deficit as tax revenue will likely drop (overall!)
Kill the economy
Cut jobs as companies try to remain solvent.

How about: SPEND LESS!
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Female 1,743
Hmm, a 5cats post. I`ll pass.
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Male 1,737
I agree with the part about people not paying in or living off government assistance should not get tax refunds. We have the same stupid thing in here in Canada, it makes no sense.
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Male 17,512
jtrebowski: Even if you taxed the 1% at a 100% tax rate it still wouldn`t be able to pay for the unfunded obligations of the US government.

No country in the world has ever taxed itself into prosperity, what is needed is economic growth and that can`t happen with confiscatory tax policies.

It`s simple, when people have more money, they have more money to invest and that leads to economic growth and more jobs. More jobs means more tax revenues and less government spending on unemployment, welfare, food stamps etc..
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Male 2,440
Ya wanna be fair? F*ck all this "class warfare" political horsesh^t. Stop giving corporations tax breaks and stop bailing out banks; THEN we`ll talk about being far. Take care of the biggies first.
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Male 3,369
@5Cats: Maybe if you actually read the facts instead of posting paranoid BS, maybe you wouldn`t feel so embarrassed as you will after reading this.

There you go, buddy.
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Female 2,674
EmagehtmaI apparently believes in trickle-down economics. It doesn`t work. Fact.
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Male 15,175
I am of course joking. Nobody really appreciates what`s fair. Everybody resents what they pay and considers what they get to be too little.
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Male 15,175
Just introduce a poll tax and tax every American the same dollar amount.
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Male 187
Sounds about right. People like to imagine "the rich" as the villain, but the truth is that the vast majority of "the rich" are just small business owners who will only be further burdened by tax hikes. Higher taxes = less money businesses have to spend on things like expansion and hiring new employees. Fact. We`re just now starting to pull out of this recession. If Obama gets his way and raises taxes on "the rich", you can say goodbye to any further economic growth and hello to a second great depression. Fact.

*is not a Republican*
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Male 39,531

That was a well produced collection of distorted facts.

"Fair" means everyone pays the same... I pay 26% so I want a billionaire to pay 26% also... not 6% or 13%..... unless they want to drop my taxes down to a Billionaire`s rate.

As for their Small Businness example getting $1 mill.. in sales, not in profit so they do not fit into the 1%.... not even a good lie.
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Male 3,369
(cont) bill. Also, why doesn`t the ad complain about corporations that don`t pay taxes and get subsidies?
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Male 4
And what % of the income do the 1% bring in? What % percent of the wealth do they control? Nice how the propaganda refers only to Federal income tax; not the payroll tax and state and local taxes.
Even with only federal income tax, the 50% pay none number is a lie.
More importantly, what were the tax rates during the periods the US economy has done best?
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Male 3,369
Posting political ads now? Wow. Ok. First of all, this was probably put out by the "people" who support Eric Cantors "Small Business Tax Cut Act". Just so you know,under that bill, the top 1 percent would receive an average tax cut that is 1000 times bigger than the average tax cut for people in the middle quintile ($23 vs. $23,000). The top 0.1 percent would receive an average tax cut of more than $130,000
Half of the tax benefits would go to millionaires, who comprise less than one-half of one percent of all taxpayers and only 4 percent of actual small business owners according to a recent Treasury study. Millionaires, on average, would get a tax cut of $45,000 — almost as much as median household income in 2010.

And business owners with annual income of $200,000 or less — who comprise more than 75 percent of small business owners — would receive only 16 percent of the benefit from Cantor&#
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Male 1,754
I knew it was 5cats that posted this.
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Male 2,579
ugh
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Male 40,277
Link: Pay Your Fair Share Of Taxes But What`s Fair? [Rate Link] - Obama calls for the USA to pay their ``fair share`` but what exactly is ``fair``?
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