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Date: 03/20/12 10:59 AM

62 Responses to ANOTHER Witness In Neighborhood Watch Shooting

  1. Profile photo of kitteh9lives
    kitteh9lives Female 70 & Over
    8044 posts
    March 20, 2012 at 6:18 am
    Link: ANOTHER Witness In Neighborhood Watch Shooting - A friend on the phone with the teen before his death heard his last moments, FBI now investigates.Story in credits link.
  2. Profile photo of 5Cats
    5Cats Male 50-59
    32763 posts
    March 20, 2012 at 7:29 am
    Well, it`s looking worse for Zimmerman.
    But a petition to arrest him? idk if that`s a good idea. Sure it shows that lots of people are concerned and are watching the case, but it doesn`t change any facts.
    Justice shouldn`t be a popularity contest.
  3. Profile photo of Draculya
    Draculya Male 40-49
    14620 posts
    March 20, 2012 at 7:42 am
    Swept under the carpet, now the community is shaking the carpet out.
  4. Profile photo of Gerry1of1
    Gerry1of1 Male 50-59
    36647 posts
    March 20, 2012 at 7:43 am

    So we learned nothing from her. The line went dead.

    I`m sick to death of every time a black kid is shot it`s a "race thing". Why can`t it be the kid was doing something wrong? Why can`t he be culpable in his death? Why is the shooter always a villain or cold blooded racist killer?

    Even if Zimmerman is wrong, the police have to have evidence to arrest and charge someone. A petition? Really? How stupid is america going to get. The "Justice System" is not supposed to be based on popularity. ... Get enough signatures and we`ll go to court. It`s not American-Idol of Crime fer crisakes!
  5. Profile photo of LillianDulci
    LillianDulci Female 18-29
    2674 posts
    March 20, 2012 at 8:06 am
    If someone murders someone, and it`s clear that they murdered someone, the police never say "oh we can`t take him in, we have to prove it first". Casey Anthony wasn`t convicted of murder but she spent quite a bit of time in jail to prevent her from running away.
  6. Profile photo of LillianDulci
    LillianDulci Female 18-29
    2674 posts
    March 20, 2012 at 8:09 am
    And Gerry, we learned that he was approached by Zimmerman, not that he approached Zimmerman, even if she wasn`t able to hear what went on in the few seconds leading to his death.
  7. Profile photo of carmium
    carmium Female 50-59
    6381 posts
    March 20, 2012 at 8:24 am
    I`m sitting in a place where you`re headed for jail if you pack a gun and you will be remanded for trial if you kill somebody with it, except in the most obvious case of self-defense. How amazing that laws can differ so greatly in how much value they place on a human life.
  8. Profile photo of CrakrJak
    CrakrJak Male 40-49
    17514 posts
    March 20, 2012 at 9:12 am
    So now we are supposed to believe an unnamed `girlfriend`s` word, several days after the fact, and a petition ?

    Why won`t these damn news outlets show the police report that they claim to have ?

    Zimmerman had trauma to the back of his head, a bloody nose, and a wet grass stained back. But never mind that, Trayvon was completely innocent and would never... Yeah right.

    You`re seeing the press trying to `create` news here, not report the news. Listen to the wording being used `Gunned down`, `vigilante`, `hate crime` and `national outrage`. They are convicting Zimmerman in the press and poisoning the jury pool.

    The chances this guy gets a fair trial, if they even charge him, is now nil. Ask yourself this, If Zimmerman had died would there be a `national outrage`, a petition, a `hate crime`, an FBI investigation ? No, there wouldn`t.
  9. Profile photo of Smutleybutt
    Smutleybutt Male 18-29
    1377 posts
    March 20, 2012 at 9:24 am
    So the 2nd video says he wasn`t even registered with Neighborhood Watch. Just a guy with a gun wishing he was a cop.
  10. Profile photo of Gerry1of1
    Gerry1of1 Male 50-59
    36647 posts
    March 20, 2012 at 9:49 am

    Lillian - What we learned from her {if she can be believed} is that the kid, apon leaning he was being watched, put his hoodie up thereby hiding his face. I think that falls in the category of "suspicious behavior" prompting the secuirty guard to approach him. At some point, no one knows when, a scuffle broke out and the kid was shot. According to Zimmerman it was self-defense and so far I`ve see/heard nothing to contradict that statement.

    A petition signed by a bunch of people who are not witnesses and have no knowledge of actual events is not evidence to arrenst/convict anyone. The Feds are only getting involved because of publicity... a sad commentary of the justice system.
  11. Profile photo of Gerry1of1
    Gerry1of1 Male 50-59
    36647 posts
    March 20, 2012 at 9:51 am

    @ CrakrJak - It`s about showmanship now. If they can`t get him for an actual crime, they`ll charge him on a civil rights violation. Look at the Rodney King defendants. They were found not-guilty so they were tried again until something ANYTHING could be pinned on them.

    It`s not about justice anymore. It`s about keeping the rabbid mob happy. Like in the olden days when everyone went out to see a haning and took picnic baskets and such...made a day of it with the family.
  12. Profile photo of Otto67
    Otto67 Male 40-49
    438 posts
    March 20, 2012 at 10:17 am
    Crakr:

    Zimmerman would not have "trauma to the back of his head, a bloody nose, and a wet grass stained back" if he would have followed dispatches directions and stayed in his car. He did not have to confront the boy at all and was not trained to do so. He has repeatedly called police on what turned out to be false alarms. When you hear him talk to the police he had already decided the boy was guilty because he was on "drugs or something". Everything Zimmerman thought was going on he was wrong about, as he had been dozens of times in the past. He told dispatch "they always get away", he made sure this one didn`t. Zimmerman was a loose cannon and a tradgedy waiting to happen.
  13. Profile photo of CrakrJak
    CrakrJak Male 40-49
    17514 posts
    March 20, 2012 at 10:29 am
    Gerry: As sadly true as that is, we are still a country of law and order, not mob justice.

    Unfortunately there are `reporters` like Nancy Grace that professionally perform hatchet jobs on `suspects` before and during trials.

    I abhor that sort of so called `journalism`, they`ve completely ignored the facts in the police report and any witnesses in support of Zimmerman are going to feel intimidated and not come forward now.

    I have a feeling they will try to railroad Zimmerman, not unlike what they tried to do to Bernie Goetz, only this time they`ll add the vaguely worded `hate crime` law.
  14. Profile photo of CrakrJak
    CrakrJak Male 40-49
    17514 posts
    March 20, 2012 at 10:36 am
    Otto: Asking someone questions isn`t a crime, last I heard of. If Martin was so afraid, then why did he not just go home ?

    There is no evidence that Zimmerman did anything to start a confrontation. In fact there is evidence that Martin was the aggressor, pinning Zimmerman on the ground, bloodying his nose and pounding his head into the sidewalk. Martin had no other injuries except the gunshot wound in his chest.
  15. Profile photo of PirateNinja
    PirateNinja Female 13-17
    121 posts
    March 20, 2012 at 10:36 am
    The facts are as follows:
    1) Zimmerman (armed) was following Martin (unarmed) after explicitly being told not to by 911 operators.
    2) At some point, Zimmerman confronted Martin and a scuffle occurred. It is impossible to tell who initiated, but it`s no stretch of the imagination to think that it was probably Zimmerman as he was the one who had initiated all actions thus far.
    3) Zimmerman shot and killed Martin, and whether Martin had initiated the scuffle or not, this was undeniably excessive force.

    There is no excuse for the police not investigating this further.
  16. Profile photo of PirateNinja
    PirateNinja Female 13-17
    121 posts
    March 20, 2012 at 10:41 am
    Gerry, he admittedly shot the kid and the police did nothing. It`s not about "popularity" it`s about making sure that the police know that their inaction was inexcusable. We know that this is a "race thing" because Zimmerman stalked and then shot this kid for "being suspicious" which is undoubtedly a condition afforded by being a black-skinned kid in a predominantly non-black neighborhood.
  17. Profile photo of Gerry1of1
    Gerry1of1 Male 50-59
    36647 posts
    March 20, 2012 at 10:53 am

    CrakrJak "we are still a country of law and order, not mob justice"
    Please, tell that to the Ramsey family, who were tried/convited in the media for the death of their daughter. After ruining them and splitting their life/family apart it was learned someone else killed the kid.

    Tell it to Jose Padilla who spent YEARS in jail without ever being charged with a crime nor contact with a lawyer or his family.

    Tell that to Ken Starr who, not finding any wrong doing in a real estate deal, decided to investigate a presidents sex life instead.

    Tell it to Richard Jewell who had his life destroyed when the media decided he was responsible for the Atlanta Olyimpic bombing. The FBI leaked only part of some information to make him look guilty because they couldn`t prove anything. Later of course it was proven he was not involved.

    Etc....

    How long do you want this list to be?
  18. Profile photo of Gerry1of1
    Gerry1of1 Male 50-59
    36647 posts
    March 20, 2012 at 10:55 am

    he admittedly shot the kid and the police did nothing
    He admitted he shot in self-defense which IS NOT A CRIME.
    Now the FBI are involved because of media attention... ie enough uninformed people cried about it making it a "popular" story.

    Justices is fact... not media hype.
  19. Profile photo of Otto67
    Otto67 Male 40-49
    438 posts
    March 20, 2012 at 11:28 am
    Crakr:

    Some guy who may or may NOT have identified himself starts following you in a car and than gets out and confronts you and you have done NOTHING wrong, as the person being confronted do you have any reason to think this person confronting you is NOT dangerous? Even if he did identify himself what reason do you have to believe him? Some nutjob confronts me I am going to feel threatened ESPECIALLY if the guy is armed. Zimmerman had already decided the boy was up to no good and on drugs based on nothing, so how do you think the confrontation went?

    If it was your son who was an examplary student and citizen and he was killed coming home from the store by a needlessly armed person who needlessly confronted your son after being told not to by the police and had a record of calling police dozens of times for what turned out to be false alarms would you still feel the same? I am betting not.
  20. Profile photo of 5Cats
    5Cats Male 50-59
    32763 posts
    March 20, 2012 at 11:30 am
    Tell that to Ken Starr who, not finding any wrong doing in a real estate deal, decided to investigate a presidents sex life instead.
    Sorry @Gerry1, you`re dead wrong on that. The sex thing WAS part of the origional Whitewater investigation when the formet law partner accused Bill of cheating with his wife. This lead to finding out if Bill was a `serial cheater` and so forth, in an effort to establish motivation for his actions, which included perjury. It was never `about sex` it was always about purjury.

    Back to the topic:
    What was telling for me was the notion that Martin ran off and "thought he`d lost him". If he`d gone directly home he could have avoided this?
  21. Profile photo of FoolsPrussia
    FoolsPrussia Male 30-39
    3446 posts
    March 20, 2012 at 11:36 am
    I haven`t really been following this story closely. If Zimmerman claims self-defense, what made him feel his life was threatened? Was there any reason for him to believe Martin was armed? If they`d already started to fight, wouldn`t the kid have already made any weapons known to Zimmerman?

    Sounds to me like Zimmerman is overly paranoid.
  22. Profile photo of Draculya
    Draculya Male 40-49
    14620 posts
    March 20, 2012 at 11:47 am
    If the police don`t press charges, it`s open season on small black boys. "Oooh he`s so black I felt threatened, so I had to execute him". In any other developed country other than America, he`d be charged by now.
  23. Profile photo of CrakrJak
    CrakrJak Male 40-49
    17514 posts
    March 20, 2012 at 12:03 pm
    Otto: Some nutjob confronts me I am going to feel threatened..

    So what would you do, turn and fight or run the few yards toward your home and safety ?

    See, there is the problem ? You`d run, most everyone would, this kid didn`t. If there was no gun Zimmerman would be dead right now and no one but the locals in Florida would even know about it.

    Also if this kid was so afraid, why didn`t he hang up on his GF and call 911 ?

    If my son was shot, of course I`d be upset, but I wouldn`t be pulling the race card and assuming facts NOT in evidence. No one wants to believe their kid does anything wrong, it`s called parental bias.
  24. Profile photo of 5Cats
    5Cats Male 50-59
    32763 posts
    March 20, 2012 at 12:15 pm
    Zimmerman is claiming he was jumped from behind, and one witness has said he saw Martin on top of Zimmerman while they were fighting.

    The main thing that seperates defense from murder is what was going on at the time the gun was fired? If they were fighting it`s clearly self-defense (or accidental) but if Zimmerman was standing over him? That sounds like murder.
    Hope there`s more witnesses. Also they can tell how far away the gun was, the angles and trajectories & stuff.
  25. Profile photo of Gerry1of1
    Gerry1of1 Male 50-59
    36647 posts
    March 20, 2012 at 12:17 pm

    "The sex thing WAS part of the origional Whitewater investigation"
    The Whatewater real estate deal happened years before Slick Willy became president. It had absolutely NOTHING to do with the investigation. It was, however, an excellant way for the Republican part to emberass a hugely successful democratic president to insure a "moral" victory in the next campaign.
  26. Profile photo of wake_n_bake
    wake_n_bake Male 18-29
    663 posts
    March 20, 2012 at 12:17 pm
    CrakrJak, you never fail to make me lolz. You`re my favorite troll on here
  27. Profile photo of 5Cats
    5Cats Male 50-59
    32763 posts
    March 20, 2012 at 12:29 pm
    @Gerry1: It was an ongoing legal action, it didn`t suddenly start when he got elected. Ken Star was appointed by Clinton`s AG (Janet Reno iirc) under a law Clinton re-signed.
    Felony perjury would disqualify someone from being PotUS, which is what Clinton admitted to after his term was over.
  28. Profile photo of Otto67
    Otto67 Male 40-49
    438 posts
    March 20, 2012 at 12:32 pm
    "So what would you do, turn and fight or run the few yards toward your home and safety ?"

    Your question assumes Zimmerman is telling the truth, it is apparent in the 911 calls Zimmerman was intent on confrontation, the boy may have felt he had no choice but to fight. The bottomline is if Zimmerman follows the instuctions given to him by police to stay in his car this never happens. The funny thing is usually you are the one who criticizes people for not following the instuctions of police but for some reason in this case that is not a concern, why is that?
  29. Profile photo of FoolsPrussia
    FoolsPrussia Male 30-39
    3446 posts
    March 20, 2012 at 12:39 pm
    Sorry if this has been posted, but in this call you can hear the kid actually get shot (warning, a bit disturbing):

    http://youtu.be/3WI4x2JPcOA
  30. Profile photo of Fatninja01
    Fatninja01 Male 30-39
    25420 posts
    March 20, 2012 at 1:04 pm
    scary
  31. Profile photo of LillianDulci
    LillianDulci Female 18-29
    2674 posts
    March 20, 2012 at 3:20 pm
    "You`d run, most everyone would, this kid didn`t."
    He DID run, and Zimmerman CHASED him. Why do you keep ignoring this? Zimmerman could have caught up or cut him off at some point.

    "If there was no gun Zimmerman would be dead right now and no one but the locals in Florida would even know about it."
    You`re assuming an UNARMED kid, who was minding his own business, would have murdered Zimmerman? Why?? If it had resulted in Zimmerman`s death, it WOULD HAVE been self defense because Zimmerman was stalking Trayvon and Trayvon obviously felt he was in danger. Zimmerman was the only one in the situation who could have made the situation not result in harm or death, by minding his own business and NOT CHASING AFTER Trayvon.

    And why are some people on IAB so quick to assume the murderer is telling the 100% complete truth, but when someone comes that builds on the defense of Trayvon, they assume she`s probably lying?
  32. Profile photo of LillianDulci
    LillianDulci Female 18-29
    2674 posts
    March 20, 2012 at 3:23 pm
    "The main thing that seperates defense from murder is what was going on at the time the gun was fired? If they were fighting it`s clearly self-defense (or accidental) but if Zimmerman was standing over him? That sounds like murder. "

    Not really. I`ll go back to a point I already made that no one addressed. Zimmerman caused the conflict no matter what, he was chasing after Trayvon and Trayvon was running which seems to indicate that Trayvon felt in danger. Even if Trayvon did attack Zimmerman and Zimmerman felt he was in danger, Zimmerman caused the conflict in the first place. What you`re saying is, if I decide I want to murder someone, all I have to do is initiate a fight with them or give them reason to be afraid of me. Then when they fight back, shoot them in the chest and claim it was self defense when it was my fault for getting in the fight in the first place.
  33. Profile photo of TrustusJones
    TrustusJones Male 30-39
    61 posts
    March 20, 2012 at 3:34 pm
    How unfortunate. It sounded like he went out like a b!tch. Life in prison for this Megalomaniac.
  34. Profile photo of paddy215
    paddy215 Male 18-29
    1677 posts
    March 20, 2012 at 5:29 pm
    @CJ and anyone else trying to defend the child killer.

    If the kid had the gun and chased down Zimmerman despite being told specifically by the police not to, then there was a scuffle that involved Zimmerman screaming for help and ending with the kid shooting Zimmerman dead. Can you honestly say you`d be defending the kid?
  35. Profile photo of CrakrJak
    CrakrJak Male 40-49
    17514 posts
    March 20, 2012 at 5:29 pm
    Lillian: There is no evidence that Zimmerman chased Martin, None. The claim of his GF was that he was putting his `hoody` on, not running.

    Now do you mess with putting clothes on if you`re afraid and running ? No, you don`t. You put on a `hoody`, more than likely, to help conceal your identity. In the end, Zimmerman had a bloody nose, trauma to the bad of his head, wet grass stains on his back and was treated by paramedics at the seen for his wounds.
  36. Profile photo of CrakrJak
    CrakrJak Male 40-49
    17514 posts
    March 20, 2012 at 5:35 pm
    paddy: Problem is you have your `facts` bass-ackwards there and the police report supports Zimmerman`s account of the events that night.

    What you should be asking yourself is this, why aren`t the news channels showing the redacted police report, that they claim to have possession of, to the public ? Why are they not mentioning Zimmerman`s wounds ?
  37. Profile photo of CrakrJak
    CrakrJak Male 40-49
    17514 posts
    March 20, 2012 at 5:43 pm
    Lillian: why are some people on IAB so quick to assume the murderer is telling the 100% complete truth..?

    Because if he wasn`t he`d have been arrested, the evidence was consistent with Zimmerman`s story. It`s the news that has spun the story around to make Zimmerman out as a `vigilante` that `gunned down` a `innocent child` in a `hate crime`. All the quoted terms above are not facts, they are spin, manufactured to demonize Zimmerman.
  38. Profile photo of lauriloo
    lauriloo Female 40-49
    1803 posts
    March 20, 2012 at 5:46 pm
    Zimmerman SAID Martin was running away before 911 told him not to follow him. How do you catch up to a man running away if you`re not chasing him?

    It was raining, That`s why his hoodie was up.

    I wouldn`t be surprised if there was a scuffle where the kid managed to get one good punch in before he was shot. Still doesn`t justify shooting someone. The kid was fighting for his life against some random big dude getting in his face.

    Zimmerman had several opportunities to not have this end badly but he was hell bent on being "big bad man in the neighborhood" and feeding his own prejudice. A normal person would have a) let the police handle it and b) calmly identified himself as the neighborhood watch and asked the kid if he belonged there. The kid would have pointed out his dad`s house and that would have been the end of it. Obviously Zimmerman wasn`t afraid the kid had a gun if he ran after him and confronted him so what`s his excuse?
  39. Profile photo of 5Cats
    5Cats Male 50-59
    32763 posts
    March 20, 2012 at 6:14 pm
    @lauriloo: One punch doesn`t account for Zimmerman`s injuries. Also a witness said he saw Martin on top of Zimmerman as they were struggling on the ground.
    As for the other part: yes it`s true. Zimmerman should not have had a gun. He should not have persued Martin. He should have stayed in his truck and let the police deal with it.

    But he didn`t and the result is tragic.

    Still, until he`s charged and convicted all WE can do is guess.
  40. Profile photo of CrakrJak
    CrakrJak Male 40-49
    17514 posts
    March 20, 2012 at 6:19 pm
    lauriloo: So you can jump right into his mind and know exactly what Zimmerman was thinking ? I didn`t know you were clairvoyant. You`ve bought the media spin on this, hook, line and sinker.

    You should be asking yourself this, If Trayvon was afraid and running, why didn`t he continue running to his house only yards away ?

    Martin was a football athlete, weighed 130lbs, was 17 years old and I`m sure could`ve out ran an overweight middle aged man easily, instead he tackled Zimmerman and attacked him.
  41. Profile photo of FoolsPrussia
    FoolsPrussia Male 30-39
    3446 posts
    March 20, 2012 at 6:37 pm
    The truth is that nobody knows exactly what happened right now. But Zimmerman was charged with battery against a police officer in 2005. The charge was "expunged from his record," which allowed him to carry the gun.

    It seems strange to me that Crakrjak is willing to give the benefit of the doubt to a man who once beat a police officer rather than to a young individual with no police record, who obviously cannot tell his own side of the story because he`s deceased.
  42. Profile photo of LillianDulci
    LillianDulci Female 18-29
    2674 posts
    March 20, 2012 at 6:37 pm
    CJ - Because it`s impossible for the police to be corrupt, right? I mean, they already tried to manipulate the witnesses and tell them that they heard something they didn`t hear (one witness said they heard Trayvon screaming, and the police told them "no, you heard Zimmerman scremaing").

    "There is no evidence that Zimmerman chased Martin, None. "
    Except, of course, for the fact that Zimmerman said Trayvon was running away, and 911 asked if he was following (most likely running as well, based on the sound of the wind), and he said yes, and was told to stop (and he didn`t stop).
  43. Profile photo of FoolsPrussia
    FoolsPrussia Male 30-39
    3446 posts
    March 20, 2012 at 6:40 pm
    Also, Zimmerman is only 28 and weighs 250 lbs. Does that sound like an easy target for a 17 year old who weighs 140 lbs?

    As far as who was screaming, three witnesses say it was Martin.

    http://thinkprogress.org/justice/2012/03/18/446768/what-everyone-should-know-about-about-trayvon-martin-1995-2012/
  44. Profile photo of FoolsPrussia
    FoolsPrussia Male 30-39
    3446 posts
    March 20, 2012 at 6:46 pm
    Also, Zimmerman is only 28 and weighs 250 lbs. Does that sound like an easy target for a 17 year old who weighs 140 lbs?

    As far as who was screaming, three witnesses say it was Martin.

    http://thinkprogress.org/justice/2012/03/18/446768/what-everyone-should-know-about-about-trayvon-martin-1995-2012/
  45. Profile photo of Otto67
    Otto67 Male 40-49
    438 posts
    March 20, 2012 at 8:06 pm
    Crakr:

    Answer why Zimmerman should not be held accountable for confronting and instigating the situation when he was told not to. Zimmerman obviously was wrong about every preconceived notion he had going into the situation. The boy did nothing wrong, he defended himself from a nutjob who then killed him, it did not have to happen and Zimmerman is responsible for the escalation.
  46. Profile photo of CrakrJak
    CrakrJak Male 40-49
    17514 posts
    March 20, 2012 at 9:34 pm
    FoolsPrussia: Think progress is not a legitimate news source, it`s a liberal media mouthpiece that has no integrity.

    Otto: You don`t have a clue as to how it actually `went down`, you`re relying on rumor and supposition spin by the liberal media.

    The bits and pieces of the police report, that were released before this story blew up, paint a much different picture. I find it extremely odd that the media demanded the 911 tapes, but won`t, themselves, release any copy of the police report that they claim to have.

    If Trayvon was afraid of a `creepy` guy, why didn`t he go home or call 911 himself ? Why did he put on his `hoody`, if he was being chased ? Why did Trayvon choose to assault Zimmerman instead of run the few yards home ?

    There is no evidence, that Zimmerman `ran` after Trayvon and even if he had tried to, It`s more likely that a 130lb. 17yr old football athlete would easily outrun an overweight middle-aged man.
  47. Profile photo of CrakrJak
    CrakrJak Male 40-49
    17514 posts
    March 20, 2012 at 9:44 pm
    Lillian: It was dark at the time and no one saw the struggle clearly, the 3 people that claimed to hear the word `Help`, could not identify who said `help` while they were on the phone with the 911 dispatchers. One witness did however see Trayvon on top of Zimmerman hitting him.

    Now please tell me, why would Trayvon, who was on top of Zimmerman at the time, be screaming for help ? Doesn`t it make more sense that the person on the bottom and being physically assaulted be screaming for help ?
  48. Profile photo of 5Cats
    5Cats Male 50-59
    32763 posts
    March 20, 2012 at 10:02 pm
    FoolsPrussia`s Link What Everyone Should Know... about this case. I`m still reading it. Looks interesting, thx! Even if it is a VERY liberal website.

    @FoolsPrussia: "who once beat a police officer" Beat? really? If during an arrest I push a cop, I can be charged with "assault" ok? That it was expunged suggests it was a fairly minor `crime`.
  49. Profile photo of 5Cats
    5Cats Male 50-59
    32763 posts
    March 20, 2012 at 10:09 pm
    Meh, there`s nothing there that hasn`t been discussed already. It is helpful to see it all together, even if it is `slanted`.
    Several points count against Zimmerman (2,9,11,14 & 15)
    Some count against Martin (16, 17 if true)
    Many are just `factoids` that don`t have much to do with the case.

    All we can do, here at IAB, is guess what happened based on incomplete evidence.
  50. Profile photo of 5Cats
    5Cats Male 50-59
    32763 posts
    March 20, 2012 at 10:19 pm
    Why is this thread rated 2.7, and the other thread rated 3.4?
    Weird!
  51. Profile photo of grindinblade
    grindinblade Male 18-29
    234 posts
    March 20, 2012 at 10:37 pm
    @CrakrJak You said Otto doesn`t know how it went down and is relying on spin by liberal media. However you are just picking pieces of evidence and witness statements that fit the story you want it to be. I never read anything about a witness saying it was Trayvon on top, just the opposite as I posted in the other video comments.
    The one piece of evidence I would say that we really do have is the 911 call where the shot can be heard. It is clearly a child yelling for help, not a grown man.
  52. Profile photo of grindinblade
    grindinblade Male 18-29
    234 posts
    March 20, 2012 at 10:49 pm
    CrakrJak "There is no evidence that Zimmerman chased Martin, None. The claim of his GF was that he was putting his `hoody` on, not running. "
    The original 911 call he says he is following Trayvon and he started to run away, how can you really be arguing this point?
    I am not saying give him the death penalty or 60 years in jail, I am saying he needs to be arrested an put on trial to determine what happened.
  53. Profile photo of IrishJesus
    IrishJesus Male 18-29
    483 posts
    March 20, 2012 at 11:21 pm
    grindblade, stop refreshing your browser.
  54. Profile photo of xCYBERDYNEx
    xCYBERDYNEx Male 18-29
    4903 posts
    March 21, 2012 at 1:18 am
    @grindinblade, your level of interest in this story is extremely creepy.
  55. Profile photo of xCYBERDYNEx
    xCYBERDYNEx Male 18-29
    4903 posts
    March 21, 2012 at 1:22 am
    "Treyvon, the boy who let his father kiss him in public"

    Did I just hear that? WTF???
  56. Profile photo of CrakrJak
    CrakrJak Male 40-49
    17514 posts
    March 21, 2012 at 5:56 am
    grindinblade: Zimmerman`s account said Martin was running behind and through people`s yards. Martin`s GF says that Martin told her that he `lost him`.

    Now at this point, why didn`t Trayvon just go home ? He`d `lost` Zimmerman, why push your luck, stay outside and get `found` by the `creepy guy` again ?

    As Johnnie Cochran once said, "if it doesn`t fit you must acquit."
  57. Profile photo of FoolsPrussia
    FoolsPrussia Male 30-39
    3446 posts
    March 21, 2012 at 7:44 am
    Crakrjak: I know ThinkProgress is a liberal site, but everything there is cited. Read the linked articles. The truth is that this should not be a left/right issue. I also don`t see evidence of a hate crime yet.

    Still, Zimmerman needs to be investigated. This guy had a 100lb size advantage in a fight. You don`t shoot someone after fighting with them, because Trayvon would have already demonstrated that he had a weapon. I can see little reason for Zimmerman to feel his life was threatened.
  58. Profile photo of CrakrJak
    CrakrJak Male 40-49
    17514 posts
    March 21, 2012 at 12:35 pm
    FoolsPrussia: Cited rumor and suspicion is still rumor and suspicion only now with added liberal spin. The media has lynched many people over the years, raked them over the coals, convicted them in the eyes of the world and never says sorry or pays for the damage they`ve done to innocent lives.

    Let`s allow a grand jury to do it`s job based on the facts, not spin, not rumors and not suspicions after the incident.
  59. Profile photo of CrakrJak
    CrakrJak Male 40-49
    17514 posts
    March 22, 2012 at 2:59 am
    Finally, The Sanford PD has released the redacted partial police report of the incident, Here.
  60. Profile photo of jtrebowski
    jtrebowski Male 40-49
    3359 posts
    March 22, 2012 at 5:30 am
    CJ: Just so you know, the authors of the "Stand your ground law" (Republicans, I might add!) have stated bluntly that Anyone who is out pursuing and confronting people is not protected by this statute. Zimmerman should be arrested.
  61. Profile photo of CrakrJak
    CrakrJak Male 40-49
    17514 posts
    March 22, 2012 at 9:00 am
    jtrebowski: `stand your ground` doesn`t apply when your assailant is on top of you beating your face bloody and pounding your head into the sidewalk, at that point it`s called self-defense.
  62. Profile photo of mrbrainiac2u
    mrbrainiac2u Male 50-59
    24 posts
    March 22, 2012 at 9:25 am
    Racist murderer. If I stepped out to go to the store and some person started following me I wouldn`t go to my home and let them see where I lived. I would stop and confront them as to why they were following me just like this kid did. This dude wasn`t registered with the Neighborhood Watch program AND he had a gun and clearly wanted to use it so he followed the kid and provoked him into a conflict so he could shoot him. Premeditated MURDER.

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