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Date: 02/26/12 11:30 AM

106 Responses to If Abortion Is Murder… [Pic]

  1. Profile photo of half-a-life
    half-a-life Male 13-17
    254 posts
    February 26, 2012 at 11:31 am
    Link: If Abortion Is Murder... - Wait... Is there actual logic in this theory?
  2. Profile photo of aquaman1227
    aquaman1227 Male 18-29
    683 posts
    February 26, 2012 at 11:37 am
    It`s only half way to cannibalism.
  3. Profile photo of collegebound
    collegebound Male 18-29
    3745 posts
    February 26, 2012 at 11:37 am
    nope there isn`t sorry :)
  4. Profile photo of Grendel
    Grendel Male 40-49
    6170 posts
    February 26, 2012 at 11:41 am
    They`re only half-right.

    Of course, they`re only working with half a brain (between them).

    Fallacy in logic.
  5. Profile photo of Buiadh
    Buiadh Male 30-39
    6739 posts
    February 26, 2012 at 11:44 am
    Ok. No. That`s not comparible.

    I am pro-choice btw, but that poster is stupid.

  6. Profile photo of tripout420
    tripout420 Male 18-29
    51 posts
    February 26, 2012 at 11:45 am
    If both the father and mother want an abortion, I don`t see the harm in it. You can`t miss what you never really had, right? People can have opinions, and by all means they can share them, but they can`t take out rights and freedom away. If they do that, then what the hell am I fighting for?
  7. Profile photo of Angilion
    Angilion Male 40-49
    12387 posts
    February 26, 2012 at 11:46 am
    Wait... Is there actual logic in this theory?

    No. It`s either highly illogical or extremely ignorant of human biology. It`s only logical if you think that each and every sperm contains the entire "blueprint" for a person and needs only a host and time to become a person.
  8. Profile photo of verbosity
    verbosity Male 30-39
    83 posts
    February 26, 2012 at 11:47 am
    While I agree with the sentiment, unfortunately it is an incorrect conclusion: anti-abortionists are arguing that life and thus the status of a human begins at conception - not at the point of ejaculation.
  9. Profile photo of tvremote
    tvremote Male 18-29
    447 posts
    February 26, 2012 at 11:47 am
    Well you can`t have any pudding if you don`t eat your meat.
  10. Profile photo of Angilion
    Angilion Male 40-49
    12387 posts
    February 26, 2012 at 11:49 am
    It would arguably be more logical to say that breathing anywhere near anyone else is cannibalism. Everyone sheds some cells all the time and those cells contain their entire DNA, not just half of it. Breathing anywhere near them will suck in some of those cells.
  11. Profile photo of SmagBoy1
    SmagBoy1 Male 40-49
    4432 posts
    February 26, 2012 at 11:50 am
    No, incorrect. It should read that if contraception/birth control is murder, then blowjobs are cannibalism. That would be a lot closer, and, fact is, a lot of idiot politicians are trying to limit/prevent access to contraception/birth control, so, even stated as I did, it`d be poignant and on target, just not quite as hot-button, I don`t reckon.
  12. Profile photo of cobrakiller
    cobrakiller Male 18-29
    7470 posts
    February 26, 2012 at 11:51 am
    I will give them that its on par with drinking blood. But, is drinking blood considered cannibalism?
  13. Profile photo of Fatninja01
    Fatninja01 Male 30-39
    25420 posts
    February 26, 2012 at 11:53 am
    win!
  14. Profile photo of WeePee
    WeePee Male 18-29
    612 posts
    February 26, 2012 at 11:54 am
    sperm alone is not a fertilized egg. their analogy is not sound. using their same logic would also mean that every period a girl has is an abortion.
  15. Profile photo of jendrian
    jendrian Male 18-29
    2516 posts
    February 26, 2012 at 12:00 pm
    If abortion is murder, then miscarriage is involuntary manslaughter.
  16. Profile photo of Thonious
    Thonious Male 40-49
    987 posts
    February 26, 2012 at 12:01 pm
    Since when do you use a spoon?
  17. Profile photo of Enomai
    Enomai Male 18-29
    43 posts
    February 26, 2012 at 12:08 pm
    vv Jendrian ftw!
  18. Profile photo of jtrebowski
    jtrebowski Male 40-49
    3359 posts
    February 26, 2012 at 12:10 pm
    This would apply more relevently to Republicans against birth control.
  19. Profile photo of I-IS-BORED
    I-IS-BORED Male 18-29
    2419 posts
    February 26, 2012 at 12:14 pm
    @weepee and both would be the same logic, it`s not a living thing when it`s a few unspecialized cells
  20. Profile photo of 5Cats
    5Cats Male 50-59
    32813 posts
    February 26, 2012 at 12:24 pm
    Epic fail: sperm is not a human being, just a body fluid.
    Of course Anti-Life zealots are a brainless bunch...
  21. Profile photo of Gerry1of1
    Gerry1of1 Male 50-59
    36666 posts
    February 26, 2012 at 12:26 pm

    Ryan Reynolds looks delicious.
    Yeah for cannibalism.
  22. Profile photo of PizzaPits
    PizzaPits Male 18-29
    553 posts
    February 26, 2012 at 12:49 pm
    @5Cats Sperm is not a body fluid, Semen is. Sperm are the little tadpole guys that swim around in it. If you`re gonna call out "Epic fails" at least get it right.
  23. Profile photo of Colors
    Colors Male 18-29
    96 posts
    February 26, 2012 at 1:09 pm
    I`m dumb. I don`t get the correlation.
  24. Profile photo of bardockjerms
    bardockjerms Male 30-39
    232 posts
    February 26, 2012 at 1:20 pm
    Eating a foetus would be the equivalent of abortion not a blowjob -___-
  25. Profile photo of bardockjerms
    bardockjerms Male 30-39
    232 posts
    February 26, 2012 at 1:21 pm
    And why is she using a spoon???? 0__o
  26. Profile photo of Discobiscuit
    Discobiscuit Male 18-29
    542 posts
    February 26, 2012 at 1:22 pm
    Fallacious logic... Please, women, just try to avoid the whole ordeal if you can.
  27. Profile photo of FAKEBACON
    FAKEBACON Male 18-29
    586 posts
    February 26, 2012 at 1:23 pm
    Sperm just make up one half of the human gene equation. It is not a human. Why would someone swallow sperm? Stupid argument.
  28. Profile photo of Baalthazaq
    Baalthazaq Male 18-29
    4548 posts
    February 26, 2012 at 1:27 pm
    Eating eggs is consistent with vegetarianism.
    Eating eggs with chicks in them is not.

    To take it further:
    A chicken eating unfertilized egg isn`t a cannibal.
    A chicken eating a fertilized one is.
  29. Profile photo of Baalthazaq
    Baalthazaq Male 18-29
    4548 posts
    February 26, 2012 at 1:30 pm
    "If abortion is murder, then miscarriage is involuntary manslaughter."

    Still no. If you accidentally DO something to cause it INVOLUNTARILY , that might be, but miscarriage happens for many reasons beyond your control.
  30. Profile photo of jtrebowski
    jtrebowski Male 40-49
    3359 posts
    February 26, 2012 at 1:42 pm
    FAKEBACON: "Why would someone swallow sperm?"

    It`s her way of saying "I love you"
  31. Profile photo of LillianDulci
    LillianDulci Female 18-29
    2674 posts
    February 26, 2012 at 1:43 pm
    If a guy eats his own semen it can be seen as a form of autocannibalism, so if someone else eats it instead, it`s kinda like cannibalism :P
  32. Profile photo of LazyMe484
    LazyMe484 Male 18-29
    10441 posts
    February 26, 2012 at 1:57 pm
    I don`t follow the logic here, unless you consider that everything which is a "potential human" has the same value.

    There are plenty better arguments for abortion.
  33. Profile photo of Dad4Life
    Dad4Life Male 50-59
    2081 posts
    February 26, 2012 at 2:03 pm
    Looks like someone only paid half attention in their logic class.
  34. Profile photo of FeeFee
    FeeFee Female 18-29
    583 posts
    February 26, 2012 at 2:03 pm
    Honestly, all I can think about George Carlin while reading the comments, "Not every ejaculation deserves a name."
  35. Profile photo of TKD_Master
    TKD_Master Male 18-29
    4794 posts
    February 26, 2012 at 2:07 pm
    Some states now consider the fetus to be a person. So if you want to have a legal abortion, just say the person is trespassing upon your body and have the law remove them from the premises.
  36. Profile photo of ivran
    ivran Male 18-29
    599 posts
    February 26, 2012 at 2:16 pm
    It`s funny because they`re just as illogical as the pro-lifers.
  37. Profile photo of honkeylips
    honkeylips Male 30-39
    1586 posts
    February 26, 2012 at 2:52 pm
    So if blowjobs are cannibalism then masturbation is genocide.
  38. Profile photo of dm2754
    dm2754 Male 40-49
    3336 posts
    February 26, 2012 at 3:03 pm
    penicillin is murder
  39. Profile photo of CrakrJak
    CrakrJak Male 40-49
    17514 posts
    February 26, 2012 at 3:19 pm
    ivran: Not really. I`ve proposed a very logical compromise for a long time now.

    If you`re dead when your heart stops beating, you should be considered alive when it starts beating.
    The heart starts beating around the fifth week of the pregnancy. Home pregnancy tests can now detect it 6 days before a missed period, that`s 3 weeks into a pregnancy.

    For argument and timings sake let`s compromise to 10 weeks in, that`s more than long enough for women to be aware they are pregnant and make a decision.

    Now I know this compromise won`t settle the issue or satisfy everyone. But this 12 week picture,



    makes it pretty damn hard to argue that it isn`t a human being.
  40. Profile photo of Matwix_2004
    Matwix_2004 Male 18-29
    2551 posts
    February 26, 2012 at 3:20 pm
    bardockjerms - She`s a classy lady. That`s why.

    And abortion is murder. Tasty tasty murder.
  41. Profile photo of RPGillespie
    RPGillespie Male 13-17
    217 posts
    February 26, 2012 at 3:23 pm
    No, if abortion is murder, than eating half-formed fetuses is cannibalism. And yes, it is.
  42. Profile photo of LillianDulci
    LillianDulci Female 18-29
    2674 posts
    February 26, 2012 at 3:46 pm
    "For argument and timings sake let`s compromise to 10 weeks in, that`s more than long enough for women to be aware they are pregnant and make a decision. "

    Not necessarily. Women are usually ~4 weeks along before they find out, so 10 weeks gives them 6 weeks for an abortion. Some women continue to bleed while pregnant, so it`ll take those women longer to notice. A lot of women aren`t even showing by 10 weeks. Not everyone has the funds right away to travel to and get an abortion right away, especially with Republicans trying to reduce the amount of planned parenthood`s and etc that`ll offer the service for a cheaper price.

    That picture you posted isn`t completely accurate. At 12 weeks the fetus is only about 2 inches long, so that picture is ~2x the size of the actual fetus. No one`s denying that it`s human, but "oh it looks just like a mini-baby" isn`t a valid argument.
  43. Profile photo of OldOllie
    OldOllie Male 60-69
    15841 posts
    February 26, 2012 at 4:33 pm
    If liberals want to kill their kids before they have a chance to grow up and vote, I say let `em.
  44. Profile photo of intrigid
    intrigid Male 18-29
    914 posts
    February 26, 2012 at 4:55 pm
    Abortion IS the killing of the human being. And guess what. I still support it.
  45. Profile photo of Zeegrr60
    Zeegrr60 Male 40-49
    2106 posts
    February 26, 2012 at 5:09 pm
    Abortion is legal, I support the constitution.
  46. Profile photo of antagonizer
    antagonizer Male 18-29
    508 posts
    February 26, 2012 at 5:12 pm
    @OldOllie "If liberals want to kill their kids before they have a chance to grow up and vote, I say let `em."

    Thank you. I wish more A N A L retentive right wingers thought that way. Whatever your motivation...you`re on the right track.
  47. Profile photo of SarahofBorg
    SarahofBorg Female 18-29
    3564 posts
    February 26, 2012 at 5:24 pm
    Abortion is no more killing a human being than it is killing a kitten. At that stage in the embryo development there is physically no difference.
  48. Profile photo of ShudBWorking
    ShudBWorking Male 18-29
    86 posts
    February 26, 2012 at 5:54 pm
    Logic fail. Abortion, at least according to most people I know, is the killing of the cells that have at least past the stage of fertilization and implantation. Without either of those, there never would have been a baby in the first place. Therefore, blow jobs are not cannibalism, they are only stopping the fertilization process, not killing an already likely and possible human being. To those of you that support abortion, besides intrigid, he`s just sick, please check out 3D photos of babies in the womb. Please also see the movie "Silent Scream". Also, if your feeling brave, please google photos of aborted babies, it changed my point of view forever. Once you see all of that, you cannot call it anything but murder and still be sane.
  49. Profile photo of 5Cats
    5Cats Male 50-59
    32813 posts
    February 26, 2012 at 5:55 pm
    vv @SarahofBorg: Except for DNA of course.
    Humans having human DNA as opposed to cat, and the fetus having DIFFERENT DNA than the mother. Other than that... :rolleyes:
  50. Profile photo of luda16
    luda16 Male 18-29
    206 posts
    February 26, 2012 at 6:00 pm
    is that bitch eating cum with a spoon?
  51. Profile photo of LillianDulci
    LillianDulci Female 18-29
    2674 posts
    February 26, 2012 at 6:31 pm
    "Please also see the movie "Silent Scream"."

    You`re promoting this piece of propaganda junk filled with complete lies... and you expect me to take you seriously...?
  52. Profile photo of cyborg
    cyborg Male 13-17
    2790 posts
    February 26, 2012 at 6:50 pm
    and handjobs are strangle victims?
  53. Profile photo of LazyMe484
    LazyMe484 Male 18-29
    10441 posts
    February 26, 2012 at 7:03 pm
    Sometime during the 2nd trimester seems like a reasonable compromise.

    Of course I would prefer it at birth, since up until that point the baby is attached to and technically part of the mother`s body.

    But practically there are very, very few women who would wait that long to get an abortion, it also presents additional... problems.
  54. Profile photo of ShudBWorking
    ShudBWorking Male 18-29
    86 posts
    February 26, 2012 at 7:05 pm
    @LillianDulci: "...propaganda junk filled with complete lies...". To that I say, please point out the complete lies, because to me, it sounds like you are expressing opinion. Whereas the film is expressing fact, unless you can find a more reputable source to point out any errors that negate the point of the film, which was to show that an embryo is more than just a sack of cells, and is actually a human being. Before that file, no one had seen what an abortion does to the child.
  55. Profile photo of thelonious
    thelonious Male 40-49
    3284 posts
    February 26, 2012 at 7:51 pm
    You`re assuming that pro-lifers are swallowers. Logic fails
  56. Profile photo of avail9988
    avail9988 Male 18-29
    700 posts
    February 26, 2012 at 8:03 pm
    I lol`d so hard
  57. Profile photo of Seggallion
    Seggallion Male 30-39
    40 posts
    February 26, 2012 at 8:23 pm
    Ladies, if you are swallowing fertilized eggs, then yes, you are a murderer. And you`re doing it wrong.
  58. Profile photo of beangirl
    beangirl Female 30-39
    51 posts
    February 26, 2012 at 8:24 pm
    Only if ya swallow!
  59. Profile photo of ElijaBlack
    ElijaBlack Male 18-29
    275 posts
    February 26, 2012 at 8:25 pm
    Do vegans spit or swallow?
  60. Profile photo of LillianDulci
    LillianDulci Female 18-29
    2674 posts
    February 26, 2012 at 9:00 pm
    @ShudBWorking - Here`s a website detailing some of the claims made in "Silent Scream" and how they are factually incorrect. "Silent Scream" is just a propaganda tool and medically inaccurate and you really shouldn`t recommend people watch it unless you want to be laughed at. click here

    The atrocious film does more than "show that an embryo is more than just a sack of cells". It makes many incorrect claims such as a 12 week fetus being able to feel pain and that it tries to prevent being aborted. A 12 week old fetus in reality is about 2 inches long and can`t feel pain and is not anywhere close to being a fully developed infant.
  61. Profile photo of jendrian
    jendrian Male 18-29
    2516 posts
    February 26, 2012 at 10:00 pm
    @ShudBWorking: BURN!
    @CrakrJak: that`s a drawing of a fetus, and a rather exaggerated one at that.
    These are pictures of 10 and 11 week old fetuses, respectively:

  62. Profile photo of ShudBWorking
    ShudBWorking Male 18-29
    86 posts
    February 26, 2012 at 10:06 pm
    @LilianDulci: I don`t have the time to check all the claims on that website, so for now, I will take your word for it on that video and stop pushing that subject. As for the development stage of a 12 week old baby, you have just proved my point. You have not educated your-self on the development cycle, and so do not know what the baby is like at 12 weeks. To back up my claim, I have a site that I will link to here in a sec., but first I want to say that I could have linked to any of hundreds of sites to back up my claim, this was just one of the first, and has a nice picture to go along with it. Enjoy. 12 Weeks In
  63. Profile photo of ShudBWorking
    ShudBWorking Male 18-29
    86 posts
    February 26, 2012 at 10:08 pm
    @jendrian - were those pictures in support of abortion? Because they kinda seem to prove CrakrJak`s point. Even from those, kinda hard to argue that they are not human, oh, and they have a human heart beating in those human chests at that time. I`m not sure what defines human life more than a beating human heart.
  64. Profile photo of jendrian
    jendrian Male 18-29
    2516 posts
    February 26, 2012 at 10:08 pm
    it doesn`t really look that different one week before or after from what I posted
  65. Profile photo of jendrian
    jendrian Male 18-29
    2516 posts
    February 26, 2012 at 10:10 pm
    no, they`re supposed to prove to you and CrakrJak that there`s no brain in there yet to feel, think, or respond to anything, much less "scream"
  66. Profile photo of LillianDulci
    LillianDulci Female 18-29
    2674 posts
    February 26, 2012 at 10:27 pm
    ShudBWorking - Uh, how does what I said show that I don`t know anything about a "12 week old baby" (I`m assuming you mean 12 week fetus though, a 12 week baby is obviously able to feel pain and is cognitive, unlike a 12 week fetus). It`s debated on when a fetus actually becomes sentient, but the general consensus is that its around 22ish weeks. Not 12. At 12, it does have some functions, but they`re automatic actions (not something that the fetus is able to control). It`s only ~2 inches long and hardly anything like an actual infant.
  67. Profile photo of LillianDulci
    LillianDulci Female 18-29
    2674 posts
    February 26, 2012 at 10:31 pm
    "I`m not sure what defines human life more than a beating human heart. "

    A beating heart means nothing other than you`re alive. Other creatures have beating hearts. People can be kept alive after they`re dead by keeping their hearts beating. Brain dead people can be kept alive, just as long as their heart beats. But they`re not really alive. What defines humans is mostly our brains. Brain dead people are hardly people any more than dead people are people. Having a heart beat means nothing when you aren`t able to think for yourself. A functioning body is nothing more than a machine until there`s brain function.
  68. Profile photo of Edgarska19
    Edgarska19 Male 18-29
    1045 posts
    February 26, 2012 at 10:51 pm
    Well, if abortions aren`t murder, then I wonder if I can get away with killing some hipsters by calling it something else.
    What if I call it "overpopulation control"?
  69. Profile photo of CrakrJak
    CrakrJak Male 40-49
    17514 posts
    February 27, 2012 at 2:46 am
    jendrian: "At 11 weeks pregnant, nearly all structures and organs are formed and beginning to function." - according to pregnancy.org

    Week 5 - "A neural groove (future spinal cord) forms over the notochord with a brain bulge at one end. Neuromeres appear. (day 18 of fert."
    Week 7 - "The brain divides into 5 vesicles, including the early telencephalon." - wikipedia

    So yes there is a brain in there to feel.
  70. Profile photo of jendrian
    jendrian Male 18-29
    2516 posts
    February 27, 2012 at 3:06 am
    @CrakrJak: I see you didn`t read LillianDulci`s link,
    here it is again, quote:

    Claim:
    The 12-week fetus makes purposeful movements (e.g., agitated movement in an attempt to avoid suction cannula).
    Facts:
    At this stage of pregnancy, all fetal movement is reflexive in nature rather than purposeful, since the latter requires cognition, which is the ability to perceive and know. For cognition to occur, the cortex (gray matter covering the brain) must be present, as well as myelinization (covering sheath) of the spinal cord and attached nerves, which is not the case.

    So the brain is there forming, but it`s not ready to be used. Ergo, no feeling.
  71. Profile photo of jendrian
    jendrian Male 18-29
    2516 posts
    February 27, 2012 at 3:09 am
    @Edgarska19: quote again from the link:

    A fetus of 12 weeks cannot in any way be compared to a fully formed functioning person. At this stage only rudiments of the organ systems are present. The fetus is unable to sustain life outside the woman`s womb, it is incapable of conscious thought; it is incapable of essential breathing. It is instead an in utero fetus with the potential of becoming a child.

    So it`s not the same as just changing the name of something, it`s more like removing an apple that could`ve become a pie
  72. Profile photo of Calithlin
    Calithlin Male 18-29
    40 posts
    February 27, 2012 at 3:12 am
    I know this is going to sound weird, but given my understanding and practice of creating virtual machines with artificial intelligence, and the insights that has provided me into the workings of living beings, I can say that despite the `grey matter` the article brings up which brings context to the pain a fetus would feel, there is still a `feeling` being had of pain, even if at a different level of consciousness. A fully grown human and a severely unintelligent animal acting only on reflexive instinct will both `feel` pain.
  73. Profile photo of madest
    madest Male 40-49
    7378 posts
    February 27, 2012 at 3:36 am
    The great thing about abortion is you might feel it. But you won`t remember it.
  74. Profile photo of robosnitz
    robosnitz Male 40-49
    2737 posts
    February 27, 2012 at 4:39 am
    Then what is masterbation?
  75. Profile photo of deutza92
    deutza92 Female 18-29
    99 posts
    February 27, 2012 at 4:54 am
    she has a point :D
  76. Profile photo of CrakrJak
    CrakrJak Male 40-49
    17514 posts
    February 27, 2012 at 4:58 am
    jendrian: We aren`t talking about killing "fully formed functioning people" now are we ?

    We are talking about killing a fetus with all 10 fingers and toes, all major organs, a beating heart, functioning muscles, bones, and nerves, eyes, a tongue, and can even suckle it`s own thumbs. All of those attributes are comparative to full-term babies, even though they aren`t yet viable outside the womb.
  77. Profile photo of Justin9235
    Justin9235 Male 18-29
    1582 posts
    February 27, 2012 at 5:23 am
    @Calithlin

    Actually a fetus doesn`t become sentient until about 8-12 weeks into pregnancy, and in that time cannot feel any level of pain.
  78. Profile photo of Gerry1of1
    Gerry1of1 Male 50-59
    36666 posts
    February 27, 2012 at 6:08 am

    "Cannibalism" huh?
    Well I would definately make a sandwich with these guys. Hefty, but not more meat than I can handle.

  79. Profile photo of geckohead
    geckohead Female 50-59
    591 posts
    February 27, 2012 at 6:11 am
    IT`S MY BODY!!!!!!!!
  80. Profile photo of madest
    madest Male 40-49
    7378 posts
    February 27, 2012 at 6:12 am
    You can freeze a fetus. You can`t freeze a baby.
  81. Profile photo of burbclaver
    burbclaver Male 50-59
    878 posts
    February 27, 2012 at 7:20 am
    "Then what is masterbation?"

    Don`t know. There`s no such word.
  82. Profile photo of paddy215
    paddy215 Male 18-29
    1677 posts
    February 27, 2012 at 8:07 am
    If the dude you`re blowing spunks out fully fertilized human eggs then yes it is.
  83. Profile photo of chicagojay
    chicagojay Male 40-49
    2018 posts
    February 27, 2012 at 8:31 am
    So, I can remove your 8 month three week old body part and only be charged with theft or something?
  84. Profile photo of IRockYeah
    IRockYeah Male 40-49
    2619 posts
    February 27, 2012 at 8:40 am
    Blowjobs aren`t. Swallowing semen could be .(fertilisation etc. apart)
  85. Profile photo of edana42
    edana42 Female 50-59
    2509 posts
    February 27, 2012 at 8:57 am
    "Then what is masterbation?"

    Child abandonment.
  86. Profile photo of LillianDulci
    LillianDulci Female 18-29
    2674 posts
    February 27, 2012 at 9:06 am
    "So, I can remove your 8 month three week old body part and only be charged with theft or something?"

    I have an 8 month three week old body part? o.o
  87. Profile photo of jendrian
    jendrian Male 18-29
    2516 posts
    February 27, 2012 at 9:50 am
    CrakrJak: Watch the pictures I posted before, read every article on 12 week old fetuses: the fingers are webbed, the eyes are not functioning, the lungs are not functioning, the brain is not functioning, the fetus by then is NOT functioning yet, it`s in development to become a functioning baby, which supposedly should happen around the 20th week
  88. Profile photo of CrakrJak
    CrakrJak Male 40-49
    17514 posts
    February 27, 2012 at 10:01 am
    jendrian: No, you`re wrong on that.

    Pregnancy.org and Wikipedia are my sources and I have no reason to doubt their accuracy.
  89. Profile photo of jendrian
    jendrian Male 18-29
    2516 posts
    February 27, 2012 at 10:07 am
    CrakrJak: From wikipedia:

    Weeks 10–12
    - Embryo measures 30–80 mm (1.2–3.2 inches) in length.
    - Ventral and dorsal pancreatic buds fuse during the 8th week. AKA known as still in development.
    - Intestines rotate. Because they`re still in development
    - Facial features continue to develop. Because they haven`t finished developing.
    - The eyelids are more developed. But not completely developed
    - The external features of the ear begin to take their final shape. Begin to, as in, it hasn`t finished, mainly, it just started.
    - The head comprises nearly half of the fetus` size. Unlike in working formed babies.
    - The face is well formed. Check one for you!
    - The eyelids close and will not reopen until about the 28th week. Because they`re not ready yet.
    - Tooth buds, which will form the baby teeth, appear. Just appear
    - The limbs are long and thin.
    - The fetus can make a fist with its fingers. Webbed fingers
    - Genitals
  90. Profile photo of jendrian
    jendrian Male 18-29
    2516 posts
    February 27, 2012 at 10:10 am
    The last part said: "genitals are well differentiated" but again, not well developed

    I don`t doubt their accuracy, I doubt your comprehension skills. Which part of "still in development" tells you everything`s already working fine?
  91. Profile photo of LillianDulci
    LillianDulci Female 18-29
    2674 posts
    February 27, 2012 at 10:11 am
    Here`s the pregnancy.org page for 12 week fetus

    How the hell does that disprove what jendrian said?
    The only thing I see that`s wrong is that at 11 weeks according to that site the fingers aren`t webbed anymore.
  92. Profile photo of LillianDulci
    LillianDulci Female 18-29
    2674 posts
    February 27, 2012 at 10:13 am
    Also according to pregnancy.org, the fetus isn`t considered viable until 24 weeks, so...
  93. Profile photo of DingDingDong
    DingDingDong Male 30-39
    1511 posts
    February 27, 2012 at 12:01 pm
    Here`s some logic: If fetus is viable, don`t kill it. I don`t know how ANYONE can argue against that.
  94. Profile photo of madest
    madest Male 40-49
    7378 posts
    February 27, 2012 at 1:37 pm
    jendrian, Using facts to debate CJ is a waste of time. They get in the way of unthoughtful arguments.
  95. Profile photo of CrakrJak
    CrakrJak Male 40-49
    17514 posts
    February 27, 2012 at 3:23 pm
    jendrian: Why don`t you back up several weeks there bud.

    Week 5 - "A neural groove (future spinal cord) forms over the notochord with a brain bulge at one end. Neuromeres appear. (day 18 of fert."

    Week 7 - "The brain divides into 5 vesicles, including the early telencephalon." - wikipedia
  96. Profile photo of CrakrJak
    CrakrJak Male 40-49
    17514 posts
    February 27, 2012 at 3:26 pm
    Lillian: Viability has little to do with it. I suggested a compromise and as I predicted, no one wants to. You and jendrian have proven that quite well.
  97. Profile photo of CrakrJak
    CrakrJak Male 40-49
    17514 posts
    February 27, 2012 at 3:27 pm
    madest: Go back to searching for UFOs that`s your thing.
  98. Profile photo of LillianDulci
    LillianDulci Female 18-29
    2674 posts
    February 27, 2012 at 3:32 pm
    CrakrJak, how does viability have nothing to do with it? Also, I explained why your "compromise" isn`t good enough. You haven`t bothered to explain how I`m wrong. I`m fine with a compromise of 20 weeks, since that`s around when they start feeling pain and being sentient. 10 weeks isn`t enough.

    Having a developing brain doesn`t mean having a functioning brain. At 12 weeks, the fetus is only about 2 inches long. Even with a developing brain, there`s no way that it`s developed enough to actually do anything besides automatic actions (which happen naturally and isn`t something the fetus has control over).
  99. Profile photo of HalfPintRoo
    HalfPintRoo Female 18-29
    2765 posts
    February 27, 2012 at 3:36 pm
    All of you people who think that abortion is not killing someone- what if your parents had one...
  100. Profile photo of LillianDulci
    LillianDulci Female 18-29
    2674 posts
    February 27, 2012 at 5:25 pm
    "what if your parents had one"

    I was planned, so it would have been from a medical condition where it was necessary. But even disregarding that, I wouldn`t be here to discuss it with you. Simple as that. I wouldn`t have existed, nothing for me to mourn over (not that I could anyway, I`d be nonexistent xD), nothing for my family to mourn over, because it wouldn`t have been possible for them to have known how different their life would have been with me (just like we can`t tell how different their life would be if I had been aborted).

    That argument`s kinda like saying, what if your dad decided to jack off the night when you were conceived instead of impregnating your mom? You wouldn`t have existed. Is masturbation bad then?
  101. Profile photo of jendrian
    jendrian Male 18-29
    2516 posts
    February 27, 2012 at 5:52 pm
    @madest. I know, I debate mostly for fun, I doubt anyone has been convinced of anything through IAB chit-chat.

    @CrakrJak. As I said before, and as Lillian pointed out as well, in developing = still not functioning. It`s like you`re trying to use your printer as soon as the chip arrives at the factory. Wait a little longer and even if the printer isn`t finished and in your hands you`ll be able to send jobs to it. Before that what`s the problem with dismantling it when it`s still not a printer?

    I personally don`t agree with your compromise of the first heart-beat. When you die a bunch of your organs are still functioning, some even last longer than the heart, so by that definition we can choose any other organ (say the skin) and choose that as our starting point, or the very last organ to be developed, and then push the weeks back. Why the heart? because it sounds pretty?
  102. Profile photo of CrakrJak
    CrakrJak Male 40-49
    17514 posts
    February 27, 2012 at 11:55 pm
    jendrian: The idea is to limit abortion BEFORE everything is functional and viable, not after.

    And as I said, the heart starts beating at 5 weeks, which to my logic means it`s alive. A reasonable compromise, twice that time, to 10 weeks is not irrational.
  103. Profile photo of RoboPatton
    RoboPatton Male 30-39
    2424 posts
    February 28, 2012 at 12:27 am
    needs more testing... let me help (with the supply side(not the supply of bjs the other side(yeah I knew you would go there))).

    TRIPLE PARENTHESES SEX JOKE COMBO!
  104. Profile photo of jendrian
    jendrian Male 18-29
    2516 posts
    February 28, 2012 at 12:40 am
    CrakrJak: I agree with the premise, not with the thesis; I believe too there should be a limit as to when you can abort a baby, but 5 weeks is way too little. 20 weeks (as Canadian law properly suggests) is a long enough period.
  105. Profile photo of Satkela
    Satkela Female 18-29
    583 posts
    February 29, 2012 at 5:14 pm
    Sperm by itself does not a human make. It is when the sperm and egg meet is when the journey of human life begins. I`m pro-life and even I think this sign is just plain ignorant.
  106. Profile photo of PhotoKing
    PhotoKing Male 30-39
    526 posts
    March 2, 2012 at 1:32 pm
    who uses a spoon?

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