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Date: 01/22/12 01:41 AM

161 Responses to Obama Administration Blocks SC Voter ID Law

  1. Profile photo of auburnjunky
    auburnjunky Male 30-39
    10339 posts
    January 22, 2012 at 1:41 am
    Link: Obama Administration Blocks SC Voter ID Law - It doesn`t get much more screwed up than this.
  2. Profile photo of randomxnp
    randomxnp Male 30-39
    1293 posts
    January 22, 2012 at 1:47 am
    "The Obama administration on Friday blocked a new South Carolina law that requires voters to have photo identification because of concerns it would hurt minorities` ability to cast a ballot."

    Lies in Reuters: let me correct "The Obama administration on Friday blocked a new South Carolina law that requires voters to have photo identification because of concerns it would prevent left-wing groups rigging the vote"
  3. Profile photo of markust123
    markust123 Male 40-49
    3889 posts
    January 22, 2012 at 1:59 am
    It sure doesn`t. Anyone who supports these Jim Crow laws is a racist.
  4. Profile photo of Buiadh
    Buiadh Male 30-39
    6739 posts
    January 22, 2012 at 2:04 am
    I had this down as a 5Cats submission. How wrong I was. :(
  5. Profile photo of fancylad
    fancylad Male 30-39
    18831 posts
    January 22, 2012 at 2:13 am
    Buiadh, as did I.
  6. Profile photo of Fwoggie2
    Fwoggie2 Male 30-39
    1803 posts
    January 22, 2012 at 2:17 am
    Once upon a time IAB was quite fun, and even had games. These days it`s riddled with politics and US sports. It`s often hard to appreciate it these days if you`re not American.
  7. Profile photo of Baalthazaq
    Baalthazaq Male 18-29
    4548 posts
    January 22, 2012 at 3:10 am
    Obama was entirely right to do this.

    The law was partisan.
    Voter fraud happens about 0.0009% of the time.
    The GOP has tried to force law enforcement to "find" voter fraud, but still failed.
    Attempts at CREATING voter fraud have ended in investigations and them being found out.

    Shush.
  8. Profile photo of GolfPunk69
    GolfPunk69 Male 30-39
    58 posts
    January 22, 2012 at 3:19 am
    @randomxnp so when the republicans brought the law in they weren`t at all attempting to prevent a section of predominantly left wing constituents from exercising their right to vote. I`m sure they trying to prevent voter fraud, especially after what happened with the bush election.
  9. Profile photo of Baalthazaq
    Baalthazaq Male 18-29
    4548 posts
    January 22, 2012 at 3:34 am
    To summarize (ran out of space).

    You`re fixing a, at highest estimates, a 200 vote across the entire nation problem, after the GOP has been desperately looking for it for 6 years, out of 120`000`000 voters.

    By bringing in laws which would make it more difficult for millions (and that its disproportionately the black and poor vote that gets impacted... I`m sure that has nothing to do with it).
  10. Profile photo of SheaSF
    SheaSF Male 40-49
    98 posts
    January 22, 2012 at 3:41 am
    The Justice Department is required by the 1965 Voting Rights Act to review voting laws passed by states that have a history of discriminatory voting practices. South Carolina is one of them. And based on the applause to certain race-batting lines from Republican candidates during the debates, South Carolina hasn`t changed much.
  11. Profile photo of SheaSF
    SheaSF Male 40-49
    98 posts
    January 22, 2012 at 4:00 am
    It is a federal crime to commit voter fraud. If that isn`t enough to stop someone, they could go into a voting precinct`s polling place, give someone else`s name, that would have to be on a list of registered voters. They would be running the risk that the person had already voted, which throws up red flags. They could cast one person`s vote, then they`d have to go to another precinct so as not to be recognized, give someone else`s name.... This kind of fraud would not statistically affect a state-run election. The real voter fraud can`t be stopped with a photo ID. And that is scandalously run county election offices losing flash drives or boxes of ballots. Partisan state secretaries of state, closing polling places in heavily partisan districts or under-supplying them with voting machines and ballots.
  12. Profile photo of SheaSF
    SheaSF Male 40-49
    98 posts
    January 22, 2012 at 4:04 am
    When more people vote, Democrats win. That is why Republicans are passing these laws. That is why the shenanigans always happen in Republican controlled state and local governments. The demographics of America are changing. It is the only way a dying political party can win, now.
  13. Profile photo of bex753
    bex753 Male 40-49
    221 posts
    January 22, 2012 at 4:17 am
    The only reason for this law is to stop poor people voting
  14. Profile photo of gary8162
    gary8162 Male 40-49
    939 posts
    January 22, 2012 at 4:46 am
    A few states already have this law. It`s primarily to stop illegal immigrants from voting. Historically, illegals vote for liberals which would tip an election in the democrats favor. That is why conservatives want this law. They want a fair election. So don`t cry and say it`s unfair to non-whites and poor people. It`s unfair to encourage illegals to vote when you damn well know they`re going to vote democrat. Quit being so damn naive.
  15. Profile photo of jtrebowski
    jtrebowski Male 40-49
    3359 posts
    January 22, 2012 at 4:56 am
    @gary1692: Again, voter fraud only happens 0.0009% of the time. Read Baalthzaqs link. Maybe you or other conservatives here can post evidence to support your claims? Yeah...I don`t think so. You`re the ones who are naive by believing the scare tactics Fox "News" is telling you.
  16. Profile photo of daroofa
    daroofa Male 40-49
    132 posts
    January 22, 2012 at 4:57 am
    Since when did obtaining a state ID become the equivalent of climbing Mt. Everest?
  17. Profile photo of Rawrg
    Rawrg Male 18-29
    934 posts
    January 22, 2012 at 5:02 am
    I just don`t understand how someone could vote without showing I.D. What`s to stop someone from voting for someone else, and then going to multiple voting sites and doing the same thing?

    On the whole discrimination against the poor argument, if you`re so homeless that you don`t even have your state issued I.D. on you anymore, then are you really going to make the effort to go vote? I mean, c`mon. Most state I.D.s cost $20 at most, and someone who`s homeless is typically eligible for welfare, could panhandle the money, or just pick up working as a day laborer for a few hours to pay for it.

    I mean, I`m all for human and civil rights, don`t get me wrong, but I`m also for personal responsibility. I don`t see how having a photo I.D. is unreasonable.
  18. Profile photo of jtrebowski
    jtrebowski Male 40-49
    3359 posts
    January 22, 2012 at 5:04 am
    Oh, and here`s data from the REPUBLICAN National Lawyers Assoc. They conducted a study and compiled a list of instances of voter fraud since 2000. Huge problem, right? LOL!
  19. Profile photo of jtrebowski
    jtrebowski Male 40-49
    3359 posts
    January 22, 2012 at 5:16 am
    South Carolina DMV: To Obtain "Free" Voter ID Card, People Must Provide Birth Certificate, Social Security Card, And Proof Of Residency -- Documents Some Lack And Need To Purchase.
    Look, folks...I`m fairly well off, but years ago, I had my passport and wallet stolen (unfortunately, my SS card was in it) So I can tell you that it was a real beaureacratic pain in the ass to get another drivers license. There is no reason to enact a law to fix a problem that barely exists unless you`re just trying to prevent voters from showing up.
  20. Profile photo of Ilikelogic
    Ilikelogic Male 40-49
    550 posts
    January 22, 2012 at 5:23 am
    Stupid question: How much money and effort does it take to get a photo id in South Carolina?
    For comparison, her in Luxemburg (Europe), with luxemburgish nationality, you have to have an identity card. You get one at the local administration with a birth certificate and 6 Euros. A picture is taken by the administration. The birth certificate can be obtained on simple request at your birth location administration (3Euros). Delivery of the ID card within 6 weeks.
  21. Profile photo of Grendel
    Grendel Male 40-49
    6165 posts
    January 22, 2012 at 5:38 am
    trebowski-"Huge problem, right?"

    Actually it is. You must have missed this claim on the site you cited: "Please note...not intended to be a comprehensive list of all instances of vote fraud...We looked for at least one example in each state."

    It was demonstrated in a recent election just how easy it is to obtain a ballot of a dead person still on the rolls (and the dead have historically voted Democrat). Rather than acknowlege the problem, they`re deciding wether to prosecute the whistle blowers.

    In this day and age the ONLY reason not to have an ID is that you`re illegal. The ONLY reason not to require Voter ID is to allow voter fraud. Ergo, which side of the aisle want to encourage voter fraud? That would be the same side that decided NOT to prosecute the Blank Panthers that were caught on camera threatening potential voters during the last presidential election.
  22. Profile photo of gary8162
    gary8162 Male 40-49
    939 posts
    January 22, 2012 at 5:49 am
    @ itrebowski
    The one thing I`ve learned about the internet is you can search for anything and find it. Doesn`t matter one wit if it`s right or wrong. And I don`t know anyone who believes everything FOX News (or any other news agency) has to say. I will say this. I work around a lot of illegals and have gotten to know quite a few of them. For the most part they`re very nice, very hard working people. But do you know what they aren`t? Americans! They aren`t taxpayers! They have no legal rights! Do you know what else? They ALL vote! All of them. What proof do I have? They tell me this. They brag about it. I don`t care what stats Baalthzaq puts up. He`s not here, is he? I can easilly get stats to counter his but that won`t change anything. If they want to vote, let them do it legally.
  23. Profile photo of patchouly
    patchouly Male 40-49
    4746 posts
    January 22, 2012 at 5:55 am
    My wife and I went through a period were we were quite poor. She went without photo ID for years. The place to go and fill out the forums was in another city and the cost of each of the cards was huge (to us at the time).

    I don`t think most people understand what it means to be poor. To have no money in the bank, no savings and have about $60 to get you through the next two weeks. When the ID cards are around $25-$30 a pop, you can either buy some rice and macaroni for those two weeks or you can buy IDs to vote with.

    Now, I can sit here and say "it`s only $25 bucks. What`s the big deal?". But back then, $25 was half of our entire budget for a two week period. For folks who are in that position, they would be unable to vote. Unless you offer some sort of free alternative, you can`t deny a person`s right to vote.
  24. Profile photo of andybme
    andybme Male 50-59
    296 posts
    January 22, 2012 at 6:02 am
    "protect the integrity of our electoral process," she said in an emailed statement."

    What integrity is that? The electoral process is already a freakin joke. They can`t even count.
  25. Profile photo of gary8162
    gary8162 Male 40-49
    939 posts
    January 22, 2012 at 6:02 am
    Oh and let`s not kid ourselves here. Democrats want illegals to vote. Plain and simple. Why? Because they know, they KNOW they`re going to vote democrat and that`s they`re "go to" solution to win an election easilly.
  26. Profile photo of jtrebowski
    jtrebowski Male 40-49
    3359 posts
    January 22, 2012 at 6:14 am
    @MeGrendel: Ah...you speak of the infamous James O`Keefe. LMAO!! First, not only did he and his cronies attempt to commit voter fraud themselves (a felony), they also broke New Hampshire`s law requiring both parties consent to being recorded. O`keefe also "left out" the section where one of his cronies was caught by a poll worker using a dead man`s identity, and he ran away before the cops got him. Lastly, the ballots are checked before being submitted, and the fraudulant ones (what miniscule amount there might be) are thrown out. So, get yourself informed and educated, and let us know how many illegal immigrants are voting, or stop wasting our time with this "voter fraud problem", mmmkay?
  27. Profile photo of jtrebowski
    jtrebowski Male 40-49
    3359 posts
    January 22, 2012 at 6:21 am
    Gary8162: "They ALL vote! All of them. What proof do I have? They tell me this. They brag about it."

    I live in a palatial 37,000 sq. foot mansion. I own three yachts with 24k gold plated hulls. I have a beautiful wife who not only answers my beck and call whenever I demand it, but is constatly searching for beautiful young 18 year old supermodels for me to play with just to keep me happy. I have been to the moon....twice.
    What proof do I have? I don`t need any. I told you this, and I`m bragging about it, and that`s all you need to know.
  28. Profile photo of FoSchizle
    FoSchizle Male 18-29
    330 posts
    January 22, 2012 at 6:23 am
    @Baalthazaq

    Wrong. Wrong, wrong, Wrong.

    Obama had absolutely NO right nor authority to do this. Voting laws are reserved to the States, not the President who is one man, much less one who benefited from the efforts of ACORN to register dead people to vote. I`m sorry for those that are poor, but if you can`t prove you are a citizen here, you shouldn`t be able to vote. Yes, it keeps some legitimate citizens out of the polls, but laws like this keep more illegitimate people out.
  29. Profile photo of Gerry1of1
    Gerry1of1 Male 50-59
    36665 posts
    January 22, 2012 at 6:26 am

    markust "Anyone who supports these Jim Crow laws is a racist." Drama!Drama!Drama! Jim Crow laws are what kept black out of resteraunts. This is hardly the same thing.

    I don`t see why showing an id when you vote is harmful. And I don`t see how it only affects minorities. White people would also have to show their id or not vote.

  30. Profile photo of jtrebowski
    jtrebowski Male 40-49
    3359 posts
    January 22, 2012 at 6:33 am
    Oh, and just so you know, we had the caging of voters here in Florida (republicans compared black voters names to the names of convicted felons, and did not let them vote because of similarities); Republican operatives blocking the phone lines of voter hot-lines responsible for finding transport to bring Democratic voters to the polls; Republicans hanging up and delivering flyers stating that voting for Democrats is on Wednesday, not Tuesday; Republicans sending mail stating that Democrats cannot vote if they have unpaid taxes or bills. Reoublicans sending out flyers stating that new voter i.d laws were in effect when they were`nt., etc etc. Please....spare us with your "we just want more Democrats to vote" bullcrap when it`s Republicans who are unabashadly trying to suppress votes. You people are twisted and uninformed.

  31. Profile photo of lorcan
    lorcan Male 18-29
    5 posts
    January 22, 2012 at 6:37 am
    you mean to say that you dont need ID to vote in the US?. You do in the UK and most of europe, its to prevent people taking your vote. I cant see any problem.
  32. Profile photo of gary8162
    gary8162 Male 40-49
    939 posts
    January 22, 2012 at 6:40 am
    @ itrebowski
    Now you`re just being childish. It`s not totally unexpected. Are you sure you don`t want to just hold your breath until you turn blue? How about just an ordinary temper tantrum?
  33. Profile photo of gary8162
    gary8162 Male 40-49
    939 posts
    January 22, 2012 at 6:52 am
    Caging of voters? Democrats told voting is on Wednesday? Can`t vote if you have unpaid taxes? Who told you this? The democrat fairy? Give me a break. What moron is going to believe that crap? That is typical liberal bullsh*t.
  34. Profile photo of Rawrg
    Rawrg Male 18-29
    934 posts
    January 22, 2012 at 7:12 am
    @Baal

    Don`t you think that those numbers of "convicted" fraudulent voters is low because it`s an incredibly hard thing to track down? Can you imagine trying to go through voting tallies after they`ve happened, where millions of people voted in a single day, and trying to discern which were genuine and which were false?
  35. Profile photo of jtrebowski
    jtrebowski Male 40-49
    3359 posts
    January 22, 2012 at 7:20 am
    "moron"? LOL!!! You`re the one who believes there`s a problem when it`s essentially a non-issue. Anyway...a little info to help you understand what caging is. More criminal activity from the Conservatives here.
  36. Profile photo of drworm2002
    drworm2002 Male 30-39
    662 posts
    January 22, 2012 at 7:31 am
    @gary8162 That fact that you don`t believe it can happen is how they get away with it for some long. They have been doing this for hundreds of years with Jim Crow laws and such.
  37. Profile photo of xiquiripat
    xiquiripat Male 18-29
    2422 posts
    January 22, 2012 at 7:34 am
    "Voting laws are reserved to the States"

    Except that when it comes to the South the federal government has had authority over the voting practices over all the Southern States since the Voting Rights Act of 1965. A practice which was extended for another 25 years by Dubya. History. Learn that poo.

    To me, stripping fellow citizens of their rights is a much more egregious abuse than the rather minuscule problem of voter fraud. It`s like trying to use a sledgehammer for something that requires a scalpel.
  38. Profile photo of LazyMe484
    LazyMe484 Male 18-29
    10441 posts
    January 22, 2012 at 7:39 am
    Good move Obama... although it`s still deplorable that it even had to be done.
  39. Profile photo of LazyMe484
    LazyMe484 Male 18-29
    10441 posts
    January 22, 2012 at 7:42 am
    I don`t see why showing an id when you vote is harmful.
    It means that those who don`t have id, ie, the poor and minorities, would have to get it, which is an unnecessary challenge just to get to vote.
  40. Profile photo of DSDavis008
    DSDavis008 Male 13-17
    68 posts
    January 22, 2012 at 7:43 am
    The minimum wage is $7.25, if you can work 40 hours a week that`s $290. Whats this $60 for 2 week budget. I know after housing and food its not much but you have more than a year to save up enough for an id if you want to vote. I don`t think the fraudulent voter thing is a problem, but you should have a photo id in general for your own safety and law enforcement reasons.
  41. Profile photo of DSDavis008
    DSDavis008 Male 13-17
    68 posts
    January 22, 2012 at 7:45 am
    This should not apply to this election because there is not enough time for people to save up money and get an id, but it is not as horrible as you guys make it out to be.
  42. Profile photo of mjy34222
    mjy34222 Male 50-59
    26 posts
    January 22, 2012 at 8:07 am
    The law to require ID is a law that is trying to solve a problem that doesn`t exist. The law is created for the express purpose of making it harder for the poor to vote. Period.
  43. Profile photo of Gafnaz
    Gafnaz Male 30-39
    138 posts
    January 22, 2012 at 8:11 am
    What`s the fuss? In Portugal we have always had to have an id to vote! In lots of others countries as well... Minorities are the problem? Shouldn`t any citizen have an id anyway?
  44. Profile photo of Gerry1of1
    Gerry1of1 Male 50-59
    36665 posts
    January 22, 2012 at 8:16 am

    Who the hell doesn`t have an ID?
    You have to have ID to open a bank account or cash a paycheck.
    You have to have ID to cash a government check.
    You have to have ID at the time you get a job...

    If you can`t handle to the complex responsability of being able to get an ID...maybe you should just stay at home.

    Or is it because illegal aliens don`t have IDs and we wouldn`t want to block their voting rights...would we.
  45. Profile photo of NightHack
    NightHack Male 18-29
    204 posts
    January 22, 2012 at 8:22 am
    This is one of many tactics the republican party has been using as an attempt to prevent poor and working class people from voting.
    DSDavis: $290/week BEFORE TAXES. After taxes, it`s roughly $220, or $880 per month. If you rent and you split your rent with a partner/roommate, that`s between $400-$600 depending where you live. So, with $480 per month left, you pay your phone bill leaving you with just about $400. You buy groceries, so around $300. Car insurance, now you have about $150. Split that into four weeks, it`s about $35 per week that will most likely go to gas. This is a conservative estimate, because where I live you can`t get even a studio apartment for less than $850/month.
    Poor people should be allowed to vote too, even though poor people do sometimes vote against their own interests.
  46. Profile photo of number1man
    number1man Male 13-17
    240 posts
    January 22, 2012 at 8:40 am
    this is ridiculous if I was SC I would say drat Obama we`re going to enforce our law anyways.
  47. Profile photo of SmagBoy1
    SmagBoy1 Male 40-49
    4432 posts
    January 22, 2012 at 8:59 am
    Trying to educate you right wing nutjobs with actual facts is like trying to nail jell-o to a tree. We show demonstrable and reproducible FACTS about how often voter fraud occurs versus how disproportionately this law TARGETS minorities and you don`t care. It`s a racist law with HUGE civil rights implications, and you don`t care! Not only do you not care, you WILLFULLY choose to be ignorant of the facts. It`s ridiculous. And sad.

    And congratulations on putting Newt up as your candidate (the thrice-married, big government, lobbyist, flip-flopping hypocrite who so clearly embodies your family values, small government ethos. Bravo! You guys rock!).
  48. Profile photo of TKD_Master
    TKD_Master Male 18-29
    4794 posts
    January 22, 2012 at 9:01 am
    I think they should enforce it. If they don`t have a goddamn ID then get one like the rest of us. I bet if they are poor enough they could get it for free. This is stupid.
  49. Profile photo of TKD_Master
    TKD_Master Male 18-29
    4794 posts
    January 22, 2012 at 9:02 am
    Also, everybody go to SC and vote like a bajillion times. They don`t need an ID so they can`t possibly know who votes and who has already voted.
  50. Profile photo of CoyoteKing
    CoyoteKing Male 18-29
    2988 posts
    January 22, 2012 at 9:09 am
    @NightHack: one MAJOR flaw in your argument, you talk about car insurance and gas which would leave someone to believe that if an individual is paying for those then that person must have a drivers licence in order to use the vehicle. Now let me recap the 1st light of the article that you seemed to miss:

    "Republican Governor Nikki Haley in May signed into law a measure that says voters must show a driver`s license, passport or military identification along with their voter registration card in order to vote."

    So if you have a driver`s license than you can prove who you are and vote!
  51. Profile photo of mjy34222
    mjy34222 Male 50-59
    26 posts
    January 22, 2012 at 9:12 am
    About 20 million US citizens do not qualify to vote under this law. Mostly elderly. A law without a reason to be. You prove who you are when you register to vote.
  52. Profile photo of CrakrJak
    CrakrJak Male 40-49
    17514 posts
    January 22, 2012 at 9:12 am
    LazyMe: It means that those who don`t have id, ie, the poor and minorities, would have to get it, which is an unnecessary challenge just to get to vote.

    NO, What it means is that dead people, children, and imaginary people won`t be fraudulently voting.

    ACORN, and groups like them have been committing vote fraud for decades, and have been convicted of it. Obama has been joined at the hip with those groups since he arrived in Chicago, he learned from the best vote cheats in the country.

    This has nothing to do with disenfranchisement and all to do with having free, fair, and non-fraudulent elections.

    patchouly: I`m sorry you Canadian IDs are so expansive, but here in the US many states will give you one for free,

    My state doesn`t charge for IDs if you are in the armed forces, over 65, disabled, homeless, or had your ID stolen, Otherwise it`s $20 but lasts 5 years.
  53. Profile photo of CrakrJak
    CrakrJak Male 40-49
    17514 posts
    January 22, 2012 at 9:23 am
    mjv: You prove who you are when you register to vote.

    Actually no, you don`t have to `prove` anything to register to vote. Many places like ACORN will just take your word for it, they`ll toss them in with the busload of other fraudulent voter apps they`ve written down out of the telephone book`s white pages.

    It`s not unreasonable to ask for an ID to vote, as I said in my state the homeless, disabled, elderly, and military persons get them for free.

    The time for lame excuses to cover for widespread vote fraud going on is over, Get a damn ID already.
  54. Profile photo of FoSchizle
    FoSchizle Male 18-29
    330 posts
    January 22, 2012 at 9:24 am
    @xiquiripat

    The Constitution says it is reserved to the States, and the federal government has been effing that up for a long time. Requiring ID is common practice around the world and doesn`t abridge anyone`s rights. Many states have offered free IDs to counteract the possible second-hand economic discrimination these new laws could provide. There is absolutely no excuse for what Obama did. He is a power hungry, sleazy politician.
  55. Profile photo of lennyc
    lennyc Female 18-29
    73 posts
    January 22, 2012 at 9:25 am
    here in ny it cost about 75 bucks with out counting the driving classes if you must take them, you must pass the test,so you have to know how to read, write, and take time to study,you also have to bring proof of identity so if you don`t have a birth certificate, ss card you have to get that too. I have never been asked for I.D when voting all I give is my name an signature, ifi had to get go through all that to vote I would just stay home.
  56. Profile photo of jtrebowski
    jtrebowski Male 40-49
    3359 posts
    January 22, 2012 at 9:32 am
    Crakrjak: First of all, as I have demonstrated earlier with links with facts and numbers, all but a miniscule fraction of those "dead people, children, and imaginary people voting" are in your head. You might as well get a law passed that requires mice to get an ID before voting. Secondly, You`re wrong about ACORN.
  57. Profile photo of Reed12321
    Reed12321 Male 18-29
    26 posts
    January 22, 2012 at 9:33 am
    this isnt really that big of a deal. States give out voter registration cards for free. many times it is not advertised, so those who dont have an ID or voter registration card believe that they have to pay for the voter registration card. Voter registration cards are a necessity so people dont go around on voting day to different towns and states and vote numerous times.
  58. Profile photo of CoyoteKing
    CoyoteKing Male 18-29
    2988 posts
    January 22, 2012 at 9:34 am
    @lennyc: check out http://www.dmv.org/ny-new-york/

    its easier than you think. "You may get an ID card at any age, but applicants under 16 require parental consent. You may not have both a New York State driver license or learner permit and a non-driver photo ID card.

    For applicants under 62, a short-term ID card is valid for four to five years and costs $9 to $10. A long-term ID card is valid for eight to nine years and costs $13 to $14. The DMV will issue you a temporary card when you apply, and your permanent photo ID card will arrive in the mail within five weeks."

    "Seniors 62 and older and those under 62 who are receiving Social Security Income (SSI) may apply for a 10-year card for a reduced fee of only $6.50."

    there really is no excuse to obtain and provide ID
  59. Profile photo of jtrebowski
    jtrebowski Male 40-49
    3359 posts
    January 22, 2012 at 9:35 am
    SmagBoy1: "We show demonstrable and reproducible FACTS..."

    Yep. Notice how those posts have been conveniently ignored?
  60. Profile photo of Malakamike
    Malakamike Male 18-29
    52 posts
    January 22, 2012 at 9:38 am
    You have to have some sort of ID to vote, what this law really wants is to have people show multiple pieces of identification which is BS, they had this on the daily show and colbert report and both talked about how retarded it is, the had videos of the people who proposed this bill saying that the reason was to make it harder for people who shouldn`t get to vote aka "the poor" because they aren`t important. They try to make this law seem like it`s doing good but its all BS to keep those in power who don`t want to be kicked out
  61. Profile photo of jtrebowski
    jtrebowski Male 40-49
    3359 posts
    January 22, 2012 at 9:42 am
    @CayoteKing: As I noted earlier, I had my wallet and passport stolen, and, even for someone fairly well off, it was a royal pain in the ass. It`s not that "easy"
  62. Profile photo of jtrebowski
    jtrebowski Male 40-49
    3359 posts
    January 22, 2012 at 9:50 am
    Watch this and then tell me conservatives aren`t trying to simply supress the vote. I dare you.
  63. Profile photo of auburnjunky
    auburnjunky Male 30-39
    10339 posts
    January 22, 2012 at 9:53 am
    @JT: I saw "fall of 1980" and couldn`t get past it, because it`s 32 YEARS AGO!
  64. Profile photo of lennyc
    lennyc Female 18-29
    73 posts
    January 22, 2012 at 9:58 am
    @CoyoteKing
    what you left out of your response is the documents needed to get this state I.D...
  65. Profile photo of auburnjunky
    auburnjunky Male 30-39
    10339 posts
    January 22, 2012 at 10:03 am
    @Lenny: Birth Certificate, Passport, Social Security Card, or VOTER ID CARD!

    If you have one, and can get the other.
  66. Profile photo of CrakrJak
    CrakrJak Male 40-49
    17514 posts
    January 22, 2012 at 10:04 am
    jtrebowski: From your own link "Several ACORN canvassers have been found guilty of faking registration forms.."

    Where there is smoke there is fire, and Yes there has been massive vote fraud in places like Chicago, St. Louis, Wash. DC and elsewhere. Several counties reported more people voting then there were registered voters and fictional, comic book like, names on ballots.
  67. Profile photo of CrakrJak
    CrakrJak Male 40-49
    17514 posts
    January 22, 2012 at 10:09 am
    jtrebowski: So, you link to a thirty two year old quote from one person, whom I`d never even heard of until today.

    Congratulations, you`ve won the prize for the most obscure, out of context, out of date quote of the year.
  68. Profile photo of pfkdxius
    pfkdxius Male 18-29
    314 posts
    January 22, 2012 at 10:16 am
    To the people complaining about Obama interfering with the state`s right to control voting rules:

    The Justice Department reviewed the state`s rules as required by law since 1965. Barack Obama did not personally go to South Carolina and tell them to stop being racist.
  69. Profile photo of carmium
    carmium Female 50-59
    6381 posts
    January 22, 2012 at 10:24 am
    In my province (that`s as in "Canada"), you can get a provincial ID card if you don`t drive or travel or serve in the army. I don`t know why someone in that situation wouldn`t want one. It`s the instant answer to "Can I see some ID?"
    I also don`t see why this would be onerous for minorities; vetoing the law just continues to treat certain segments of society like incapable children.
  70. Profile photo of jtrebowski
    jtrebowski Male 40-49
    3359 posts
    January 22, 2012 at 10:47 am
    @AJ and CJ: This is from Last Year
  71. Profile photo of auburnjunky
    auburnjunky Male 30-39
    10339 posts
    January 22, 2012 at 10:52 am
    @JT: That ad wasn`t asking Latinos not to vote. It was attacking the government.

    How is that discouraging them from voting? It would make me WANT to vote, to fix the government.

  72. Profile photo of narmenia89
    narmenia89 Male 13-17
    4 posts
    January 22, 2012 at 10:52 am
    This is not a bad thing.
    Only around half the American population votes during the presidential election. This makes the process easier, and raises that percentage. (Most people think that their vote wont mean a thing, so why would they go through so much trouble to vote?)
    Furthermore, this lets more of the American population vote. The Dreamers, for example, compose a large number that are not eligible to vote, but now could (in SC)
  73. Profile photo of auburnjunky
    auburnjunky Male 30-39
    10339 posts
    January 22, 2012 at 10:53 am

  74. Profile photo of SheaSF
    SheaSF Male 40-49
    98 posts
    January 22, 2012 at 11:03 am
    By that logic, auburnjunky, no one is allowed to call out racism, then. How convenient for the racists.
  75. Profile photo of auburnjunky
    auburnjunky Male 30-39
    10339 posts
    January 22, 2012 at 11:04 am
    No Shea. By that logic, someone can`t call out racism, when there is no racism.
  76. Profile photo of auburnjunky
    auburnjunky Male 30-39
    10339 posts
    January 22, 2012 at 11:06 am
    The SC Voter ID law was not racist. Liberals (who want undocumented people to vote) said "OH SNAP! NOW ILLEGALS CAN`T VOTE FOR US! THAT`S RACIST!"


  77. Profile photo of SheaSF
    SheaSF Male 40-49
    98 posts
    January 22, 2012 at 11:23 am
    I didn`t call the law racist, just the idea that no one is allowed to name racism when they see it. Like Newt Gingrich pandering to an audience who stands and applauds race-bating statements.

    What a poorly run state election if non-citizens are allowed to register. Voter fraud at the polls is statistically insignificant. It`s only a problem on right-wing radio and television, because the only way Republicans win is if Democrats stay home.

    The truth about voter fraud, if you have an open mind on the subject.
  78. Profile photo of auburnjunky
    auburnjunky Male 30-39
    10339 posts
    January 22, 2012 at 11:26 am
    "Voter fraud at the polls is statistically insignificant."

    Yes, I agree. TRACEABLE voter fraud is insignificant.

  79. Profile photo of SheaSF
    SheaSF Male 40-49
    98 posts
    January 22, 2012 at 11:35 am
    Why would a person living in this country illegally, with no documentation, put themselves in jeopardy of being deported or charged with voter fraud to vote? What`s the motivation?
  80. Profile photo of SheaSF
    SheaSF Male 40-49
    98 posts
    January 22, 2012 at 11:38 am
    If you`re talking about ballot box stuffing, lost ballots, or machine tampering, yes, I think that goes on all the time (there are question about the Iowa Caucuses, already). A picture ID will not solve this problem.
  81. Profile photo of SmagBoy1
    SmagBoy1 Male 40-49
    4432 posts
    January 22, 2012 at 11:40 am
    So, auburnjunky, what *would* you call a law that is specifically and demonstrably targeted at a minority group who just happen to all be of the same socioeconomic background and heritage? Slanted? Biased? Purposefully and willfully discriminatory? I`m okay with any of those descriptions if "racist" doesn`t do it for you.
  82. Profile photo of SheaSF
    SheaSF Male 40-49
    98 posts
    January 22, 2012 at 11:40 am
    "Even for the few who view voting merely as a means to an end, however, voter fraud is a singularly foolish way to attempt to win an election. Each act of voter fraud risks five years in prison and a $10,000 fine - but yields at most one incremental vote. The single vote is simply not worth the price."
  83. Profile photo of auburnjunky
    auburnjunky Male 30-39
    10339 posts
    January 22, 2012 at 11:42 am
    "What`s the motivation?"

    To keep the people in office who allow them to stay.
  84. Profile photo of auburnjunky
    auburnjunky Male 30-39
    10339 posts
    January 22, 2012 at 11:43 am
    @Smagboy: How is the law targeted at a particular race of people. The law states that ALL VOTERS MUST SHOW IDENTIFICATION MATCHING THEIR VOTER REGISTRATION CARD!" All does not single out anyone.
  85. Profile photo of markust123
    markust123 Male 40-49
    3889 posts
    January 22, 2012 at 11:49 am
    What is all this ridiculousness that liberals want "illegals" to vote. You have to prove who you are when you register to vote. The vetting process weeds out any illegal registrations. Plus you can`t just walk in and vote. They have to find your name on the list. You sign next to your name and then you vote. That is why there is very little voters fraud at the polls. The fraud is behind the scenes with machines with no paper trail that switch your vote and boxes that are stuffed. Funny how conservatives aren`t screaming about that. People should be out of their minds that there are still machines out there with no paper trail that could be used to recount when there are discrepancies.
  86. Profile photo of SheaSF
    SheaSF Male 40-49
    98 posts
    January 22, 2012 at 11:53 am
    Seriously, auburnjunky, with respect, check out my link. It`s a summary of a very extensive study done on the subject of voter fraud. It`s just a few short paragraphs.

    Look, having a photo ID in this country seems like a reasonable thing to expect, but until everyone does, through a free national ID or something, it makes no sense to disenfranchise, believe it or not, millions of Americans to stop something as rare as identification fraud.
  87. Profile photo of SmagBoy1
    SmagBoy1 Male 40-49
    4432 posts
    January 22, 2012 at 11:54 am
    auburnjunky, the law disproportionately affects a single group of people. Those are facts that have been demonstrated here time and again. I`m not going to argue that obvious point. It costs money to get IDs. Sure, maybe not the IDs themselves, but the documentation that`s required for the IDs. We can continue to bang our heads together, but, neither of us is going to change our minds. My point is clear though: this law significantly and disproportionately (and by design) affects one, single group of citizens.
  88. Profile photo of auburnjunky
    auburnjunky Male 30-39
    10339 posts
    January 22, 2012 at 11:56 am
    Also, why is he blocking it in SC, when many other states have this law? You have to show ID here in `Bama.

    Seems weird.
  89. Profile photo of SheaSF
    SheaSF Male 40-49
    98 posts
    January 22, 2012 at 11:58 am
    The Justice Department is required by the 1965 Voting Rights Act to review voting laws passed by states that have a history of discriminatory voting practices. South Carolina is one of them.
  90. Profile photo of auburnjunky
    auburnjunky Male 30-39
    10339 posts
    January 22, 2012 at 11:58 am
    @Smag: Yes. I can concur that it effects people without money more so than people with. The problem with that is, you can`t say that`s a group the same as you would say a race is a group, or a sexual orientation is a group.

    Crossing into that area, promotes class warfare. Poverty is relative, and changeable.
  91. Profile photo of auburnjunky
    auburnjunky Male 30-39
    10339 posts
    January 22, 2012 at 11:59 am
    @Shea: All states have a history of discriminatory voting practices. Blacks and women haven`t always been allowed to vote.
  92. Profile photo of SheaSF
    SheaSF Male 40-49
    98 posts
    January 22, 2012 at 12:09 pm
    I didn`t just make that up. It`s written into a law that was designed to stop the disenfranchisement of blacks and poor whites through poll taxes, literacy tests, etc. Yes, there is racism everywhere, but you`re not suggesting that there isn`t a long sad history of Southern States using the government to separate and deny full citizenship, through Jim Crow laws, to decedents of African slaves.
  93. Profile photo of SheaSF
    SheaSF Male 40-49
    98 posts
    January 22, 2012 at 12:14 pm
    Don`t get me wrong, I`m not claiming the South Carolina law is racist, like I said. You`ll be interested to know that the law states that college photo IDs aren`t good enough. The law is designed to keep young college students, who are trending Democratic in their vote, and poor voters, many of whom are African American in South Carolina, who tend to vote Democratic.
  94. Profile photo of SheaSF
    SheaSF Male 40-49
    98 posts
    January 22, 2012 at 12:19 pm
    The 1965 Voting Rights Act. What I said is explained in the first two paragraphs.
  95. Profile photo of Selous
    Selous Male 30-39
    1197 posts
    January 22, 2012 at 12:26 pm
    you guys need mandatory voting, with fines for people that dont, it would clear up many of your problems
  96. Profile photo of SheaSF
    SheaSF Male 40-49
    98 posts
    January 22, 2012 at 12:29 pm
    "The Act established extensive federal oversight of elections administration, providing that states with a history of discriminatory voting practices (so-called "covered jurisdictions") could not implement any change affecting voting without first obtaining the approval of the Department of Justice, a process known as preclearance. These enforcement provisions applied to states and political subdivisions (mostly in the South) that had used a "device" to limit voting and in which less than 50 percent of the population was registered to vote in 1964. The Act has been renewed and amended by Congress four times, the most recent being a 25-year extension signed into law by President George W. Bush in 2006."

    Ironic that President Bush extended the law, affirming that problems still exist today, and yet it was the Bush campaign in 2000 that planted the story that John McCain had fathered an illegitimate black baby (his adopted son) as a way of turn
  97. Profile photo of Fatninja01
    Fatninja01 Male 30-39
    25420 posts
    January 22, 2012 at 12:32 pm
    votings supposed to be anon anyways...
  98. Profile photo of SheaSF
    SheaSF Male 40-49
    98 posts
    January 22, 2012 at 12:37 pm
    Selous, why would any country want people voting who were uninformed or disinterested in government and current events? Mandatory voting sounds dictatorial...something that North Korea would do. One might hope that civic duty and a little patriotism might inspire people to pay attention and vote thoughtfully. I consider myself pretty informed, but I never vote for issues or candidates that I haven`t investigated. Cheers!
  99. Profile photo of SheaSF
    SheaSF Male 40-49
    98 posts
    January 22, 2012 at 12:47 pm
    The vote is secret ballot. You only need sign next to your name and birth date. After that you are handed a ballot with a number on it that cannot be traced back to your name. But as auburnjunky and many on the political right are arguing, you have to validate your eligibility. They think this should be done with a government issued ID. For over 200 years that has been done with your signature, date of birth, and home address. Now this is done with a few more things like social security number and employer info, before you go to the polls.
  100. Profile photo of Dad4Life
    Dad4Life Male 50-59
    2081 posts
    January 22, 2012 at 1:07 pm
    You need an ID for practically anything, even to get a damn beer at a concert. The only reason someone would oppose a voter ID law is because they want to cheat.
  101. Profile photo of markust123
    markust123 Male 40-49
    3889 posts
    January 22, 2012 at 1:14 pm
    I find it odd the the cons are supporting voter suppression. I thought you didn`t like government intrusion? You would be screaming bloody murder if the elderly vote was being suppressed. But when it is college students and poor that`s all right because the majority vote democrat. In your actions we can clearly see why the students and the poor vote for the progressives.
  102. Profile photo of Zeegrr60
    Zeegrr60 Male 40-49
    2106 posts
    January 22, 2012 at 2:08 pm
    Republican voters must pass an IQ test. There`s todays great idea, run with it.
  103. Profile photo of jtrebowski
    jtrebowski Male 40-49
    3359 posts
    January 22, 2012 at 2:17 pm
    markust123: Nothing odd about it. They`ve got all sorts of crazy ideas they love, unless it affects them. Remember the Tea Party folks out there at rallys howling for less spending and smaller government? Then Paul Ryan came along with his plan, and when those tri-corner hat kooks found out it would affect them, they screamed bloody murder. Cons also hate stuff that "cheapens" mariage, so they want to same-sex marriage, but when you point out how much divorce cheapens marriage, and ask if they want to ban that, they run away like little pussies. Cons are funny, aren`t they?
  104. Profile photo of jtrebowski
    jtrebowski Male 40-49
    3359 posts
    January 22, 2012 at 2:20 pm
    zeegrr60: um..then we`d be the ones suppressing the vote, and in a earth-shattering way. Let`s be nice and fair now.
  105. Profile photo of Cajun247
    Cajun247 Male 18-29
    10732 posts
    January 22, 2012 at 2:33 pm
    Why isn`t the admin going after Texas? Seriously we have the same law here, I show my ID everytime I vote. I don`t even have to present registration.
  106. Profile photo of GolfPunk69
    GolfPunk69 Male 30-39
    58 posts
    January 22, 2012 at 2:36 pm
    From SCFan:


    You need an ID for practically anything, even to get a damn beer at a concert. The only reason someone would oppose a voter ID law is because they want to cheat.



    Brilliant. 15% of your country lives below the poverty threshold; that`s $22,500 pa for a family of 4. Do you really think these people are going to concerts and drinking $8 beers?

    It may seem hard to imagine, but some people just don`t have the money to buy luxuries like that (and yes, when the choice is dinner, or getting to vote, voting is the luxury).

    I don`t have a problem with the requirement of id, but they`re can`t be an associated cost with that, be it to get the ID itself, or to get the supporting documents to get the ID (e.g. my bank now charges me $3 for a copy of my bank statement).
  107. Profile photo of jtrebowski
    jtrebowski Male 40-49
    3359 posts
    January 22, 2012 at 2:54 pm
    Where in the Constitution does it require state issued I.D to vote?
  108. Profile photo of Grendel
    Grendel Male 40-49
    6165 posts
    January 22, 2012 at 3:01 pm
    LazyMe484-"It means that those who don`t have id, ie, the poor and minorities"

    By `poor and minorities` you really mean `illegals that want to vote`, right? There is no valid reason to not have an ID in this country.
    Some things that require a photo ID:
    -Cashing a check.
    -Getting a job.
    -Buying Oven cleaner.
    -Buying some over-the-counter medications.
    -Buying beer.
    -Buying cigs.

    mjy34222-"The law is created for the express purpose of making it harder for the poor to vote. Period."

    Get your head out of your posterior. The law has the express purpose of battling voter fraud, which is a major problem. Opponents of this law only want to get rid of it for one reason, so more voter fraud can be perpetrated, as they can`t get elected in a fair vote.
  109. Profile photo of ledzeppeloyd
    ledzeppeloyd Male 18-29
    2385 posts
    January 22, 2012 at 3:18 pm
    in short its essentially a poll tax
  110. Profile photo of Grendel
    Grendel Male 40-49
    6165 posts
    January 22, 2012 at 3:23 pm
    GolfPunk69-:"Do you really think these people are going to concerts and drinking $8 beers?"

    Yes, and many go to NASCAR races and buy $12 beer.

    GolfPunk69-:"some people just don`t have the money to buy luxuries like that"

    Haven`t hung out at a grocery store lately, have you. You can see people `poor as churchmice` paying for food with EBT and whipping out a wad of cash to pay for cartons of cigarettes and cases of beer. (just as I`ve seen kids crying for a candybar and momma saying `we can`t afford it` while paying for a carton of Marlboros). Or a `well fed` lady with a $100 manicure pulling an EBT card out of a $700 purse to pay for $400 steak, seafood and such fook I can`t afford and loading it into the back of a brand new Lincoln Navigator. Or lady who was upset that the EBT didn`t cover the dog food, so she puts it back and buys 40 lbs of hamburger.
  111. Profile photo of Grendel
    Grendel Male 40-49
    6165 posts
    January 22, 2012 at 3:26 pm
    ledzeppeloyd-"in short its essentially a poll tax"

    No, esentially a head tax is a poll tax.

    Asking someone to prove they are who they claim they are in order to vote is essentially common sense.
  112. Profile photo of Grendel
    Grendel Male 40-49
    6165 posts
    January 22, 2012 at 3:32 pm
    jtrebowski-"Where in the Constitution does it require state issued I.D to vote?"

    Where in the Consituttion does it forbid it?

    It`s the old argument that some people believe that if it`s not permitted, it`s automatically proscribed while others believe that if it`s not specifically proscribed, it`s permitted.
  113. Profile photo of jtrebowski
    jtrebowski Male 40-49
    3359 posts
    January 22, 2012 at 3:53 pm
    MeGrendel: "Get your head out of your posterior. The law has the express purpose of battling voter fraud, which is a major problem."

    No. Get your head out of yours. I, along with others on this thread have posted links with stats and numbers proving that it`s not, and you and the other microbes simply choose to ignore the facts. Go through the thread, do the research, and spare us the anecdotal claims that you dingleberries think supports your case, because it just makes you look like idiots.
  114. Profile photo of button_guy
    button_guy Male 18-29
    171 posts
    January 22, 2012 at 4:22 pm
    They have state ID cards! Jesus Christ! They are making sure only American citizens can vote for the leaders of America! If you aren`t a citizen, you don`t get a vote! If you really can`t afford a $20 ID card, you obviously don`t care enough to vote, which means you wouldn`t have anyways. drating stupid.
  115. Profile photo of Grendel
    Grendel Male 40-49
    6165 posts
    January 22, 2012 at 4:31 pm
    jtrebowski-" have posted links with stats and numbers proving that it`s not"

    Correction, you have posted links with biased stats and fraudulant numbers "proving" nothing. For every site you provide where it`s `not`, another can be provided that it `is` and another can be provided that Big Foot exists and is living in a Tampa Fl condo.

    One `cite` is by Brennan Center for Justice, run by former Clinton speechwritter (no bias there), and founded on the ideals of an associate justice of the Supreme Court known as leader of the judicially liberal wing of the Court. Another is by FactCheck.org, run by Annenberg Public Policy Center, which is itself supported by the same foundation that Bill Ayers secured the 49.2 million dollars from to create the Chicago Annenberg Challenge “philanthropic” organization in which Barack Obama was the founding Chairman of the Board for and Ayers served as the grant writer of and co-Chair of for its two operat
  116. Profile photo of grindinblade
    grindinblade Male 18-29
    234 posts
    January 22, 2012 at 5:05 pm
    Over 900 dead people voted in the SC primary. I understand that southern states have a history of voter discrimination and thus can`t change voter laws without prior approval, but you also don`t want things like this.Update
  117. Profile photo of QueenZira
    QueenZira Female 18-29
    2228 posts
    January 22, 2012 at 5:31 pm
    Grindinblade, an update to your update.

  118. Profile photo of QueenZira
    QueenZira Female 18-29
    2228 posts
    January 22, 2012 at 5:37 pm
    Stuff like this just goes to show you how important voting really is. If *some* folks are so threatened by Democracy itself that they feel they have to slant the field in their favor by illegal means, what does that say about them?

    The average voter may look at their ballot and reason out that it has as much effect as a deer tick on the continent of Asia, but clearly that isn`t true if these people are fighting so hard to prevent it from ever being cast...
  119. Profile photo of jtrebowski
    jtrebowski Male 40-49
    3359 posts
    January 22, 2012 at 6:24 pm
    @Megrendel: Pardon me for not using "News"max or Fox "News" as a source. It still doesn`t excuse any of you from not not being able to provide credible proof to support your claims. As I stated before, so much of what you pansies claim as fact is purely anectdotal, while at least my links provided sources to back it up, so, either debunk the facts rather than just trash the site, or chew on that a while, and go jerk off to that cop kicking the drunk handcuffed girl in the head.
  120. Profile photo of gary8162
    gary8162 Male 40-49
    939 posts
    January 22, 2012 at 6:37 pm
    @markust123
    You`re right! We do want less gov`t intrusion, which is why Obama should keep his paws out of South Carolina`s laws. This isn`t a federal issue. It`s a state issue. This isn`t about civil rights. It`s about a state taking action to do what`s right and the federal gov`t. has the gall to tell the state "No, no, no. You can`t do that." And why? Because the illegals are their constituents. This is what they do to get in office or stay in office.
  121. Profile photo of GolfPunk69
    GolfPunk69 Male 30-39
    58 posts
    January 22, 2012 at 6:38 pm
    MeGrendal:- ALL of your points thus far have been horrifyingly anecdotal. I`ve even gone as far as doing the work for you but I can`t actually find any reasonable piece of information on the internet suggesting that voter fraud is a real problem. The vast majority of articles on the internet indicate that voter fraud is so minute it barely warrants consideration.

    I know this is the internet and you get to say whatever you want, but you`ve got to admit your case thus far has been weak at best.

    I can`t see why you would want to have a measure in place that would disadvantage so many Americans.

    Bear in mind, I don`t vote in the US elections, and when home, I often vote for the Right of center party. I just don`t think this is a great policy.

    And no self-respecting democrat voter would be caught dead (pun-intended) at a NASCAR event. That poo`s for redneck republicans :)
  122. Profile photo of gary8162
    gary8162 Male 40-49
    939 posts
    January 22, 2012 at 7:10 pm
    @jtrebowski
    I know I`ve been off this thread for a few hours (I do have a life you know) but let me just reiterate. For every stat/link/source you provide, I can come up with a counter to it. I mentioned earlier that the illegals I knew have bragged about being able to vote and you countered with some tripe like "if I say this, then it must be true too". What I haven`t told you is that these illegals also told me that they would be taken down to register in groups and told to vote democrat so they can have their piece of the American Dream...and without changing their status.
    I don`t need internet proof to show you. I have life experience. I know what I`m talking about. I don`t begrudge these people from wanting a better life. They just need to abide by our laws to have it.
  123. Profile photo of QueenZira
    QueenZira Female 18-29
    2228 posts
    January 22, 2012 at 7:12 pm
    Gary- see the 24th Amendment to the US. Constitution.

    Also the conflation of Latinos with "Illegals" outright is duly noted in your post. As "illegals" are no one`s constituents,(Because you know...they can`t vote) and Latinos are mostly Dem voters, and Republicans are disproportionally white, you have made crystal clear the racial animus operating behind these laws.
  124. Profile photo of jtrebowski
    jtrebowski Male 40-49
    3359 posts
    January 22, 2012 at 7:16 pm
    Gary8162: Yep...more anecdotes. lol..ok, dude.
  125. Profile photo of jtrebowski
    jtrebowski Male 40-49
    3359 posts
    January 22, 2012 at 7:22 pm
    Golfpunk69: "And no self-respecting democrat voter would be caught dead (pun-intended) at a NASCAR event. That poo`s for redneck republicans :)"

    Now hold on a second! I`m not real big on aligning myself with political parties, but I`m pretty Liberal, and not only do I like Nascar, and been to a few races, there`s quite a few activities I enjoy that you might associate with "redneck republicans", and I`m a city boy from a well-off background.
  126. Profile photo of jtrebowski
    jtrebowski Male 40-49
    3359 posts
    January 22, 2012 at 7:29 pm
    Oh, and one more thing MeGrendel: Why did Annenburg endorse MCCain?
  127. Profile photo of Grendel
    Grendel Male 40-49
    6165 posts
    January 22, 2012 at 7:55 pm
    @jtrebowski

    In 2005, the U.S. Government Accountability Office found that up to 3 percent of the 30,000 individuals called for jury duty from voter registration rolls over a two-year period in just one U.S. district court were not U.S. citizens.

    btw...3% is a big enough margin to steal an election.

    A Campton, CA candidate who was elected to the city council was permanently disqualified from holding public office in California for soliciting non-citizens to register and vote.

    No big problem?

    Of course you`re going to find media `studies` that it`s `no big problem`. You`ll also find liberal studies about how hardley anyone defrauds to get welfare/foodstamps and how great a job Obama is doing. All are obviously false.

    It`s called `The Big Lie`. Goebbels was a firm believer
  128. Profile photo of Grendel
    Grendel Male 40-49
    6165 posts
    January 22, 2012 at 8:05 pm

    @jtrebowski-"Why did Annenburg endorse MCCain?"

    Please try not to misrepresent who was doing the endorsing.

    Specifically, Leonore Annenberg was one of 100 ambassadors endorsing McCain (who I didn`t care for). She also worked in the Reagan admin.

    The Annenberg Foundation DID NOT endorse McCain. When asked, a foundation officials stated `Ms. Annenberg is very elderly and does not do interviews."
  129. Profile photo of Baalthazaq
    Baalthazaq Male 18-29
    4548 posts
    January 22, 2012 at 9:09 pm
    MeGrendel:
    Except ID that is acceptable to do all those things, is being outlawed in favour of stricter ID requirements than all those things.

    For example in several states a gun license is acceptable, but student ID is not. Meanwhile a gun license is NOT valid for many of the purposes you stated, but a student ID is.

    Pay closer attention.
  130. Profile photo of jtrebowski
    jtrebowski Male 40-49
    3359 posts
    January 22, 2012 at 9:12 pm
    @MeGrendel: since we`re contesting sources, how bout some insight into your buddy Spakovsky and here
    Yeah...not too biased..lol
  131. Profile photo of Baalthazaq
    Baalthazaq Male 18-29
    4548 posts
    January 22, 2012 at 9:18 pm
    Incidentally, voter restrictions apply to 10% of your population who currently don`t have valid ID, this jumps to up to 25% in the AA community, and other poor areas. That, as you can tell, is much larger.

    You`re also SPECIFICALLY looking at peripherals, because every time studies and investigations are done into ACTUAL VOTER FRAUD, not "how many people COULD be committing voter fraud", but how many actually do, you fail to find significant numbers.

    On the other hand, if you WANT peripherals, there are plenty of examples, the 112`000 robocalls made in black neighborhoods telling them Barack Obama had already won, and just to stay home for example.
  132. Profile photo of CrakrJak
    CrakrJak Male 40-49
    17514 posts
    January 22, 2012 at 9:58 pm
    SheaSF: Voter fraud at the polls is statistically insignificant.

    with the great number of close elections we`ve had in the past decade or so, vote fraud can no longer be considered `statistically insignificant`, even 1/2 of one percent of the total vote can be very significant.
  133. Profile photo of CrakrJak
    CrakrJak Male 40-49
    17514 posts
    January 22, 2012 at 10:03 pm
    SmagBoy1: what *would* you call a law that is specifically and demonstrably targeted at a minority group who just happen to all be of the same socioeconomic background and heritage?

    Does the law say, "All blacks and latinos must have an ID to vote" ? No it doesn`t, it doesn`t mention race at all. So climb off that `It`s Racist!` bandwagon and get real.
  134. Profile photo of CrakrJak
    CrakrJak Male 40-49
    17514 posts
    January 22, 2012 at 10:14 pm
    Markust: You have to prove who you are when you register to vote. The vetting process weeds out any illegal registrations.

    No, it doesn`t weed out anyone who`s here illegally because many `community groups` that fill out these registrations for people never check for ID. I know for a fact that has happened because people have been convicted of it in my own state and other states as well.
  135. Profile photo of CrakrJak
    CrakrJak Male 40-49
    17514 posts
    January 22, 2012 at 10:26 pm
    Baal: It`s a lot harder to get a gun license than a student ID at a college campus.

    Also, illegals hide/blend in within communities of their own racial makeup, they know they`ll be less likely to be caught and deported in those areas. So it`s no surprise to find higher numbers of people with no valid ID in those communities.
  136. Profile photo of markust123
    markust123 Male 40-49
    3889 posts
    January 22, 2012 at 10:42 pm
    Even Fox News ran an AP article stating that the kind of election fraud that the laws are intended to stamp out is rare.
  137. Profile photo of markust123
    markust123 Male 40-49
    3889 posts
    January 22, 2012 at 11:05 pm
    "Markust: You have to prove who you are when you register to vote. The vetting process weeds out any illegal registrations."

    "No, it doesn`t weed out anyone who`s here illegally because many `community groups` that fill out these registrations for people never check for ID. I know for a fact that has happened because people have been convicted of it in my own state and other states as well."

    What are you talking about? The vetting process weeded out the people in your example (Which I might add you gave no proof that these things actually happened). The states run all applicants against a database. They don`t just take peoples word.
  138. Profile photo of HiEv
    HiEv Male 40-49
    621 posts
    January 23, 2012 at 1:23 am
    This is a case of "neither solution is perfect". Therefore you have to find a solution that causes the least harm.

    Based on what we know, the percentage of voter fraud is smaller than the percentage of people who would be blocked from voting, so the better choice of the two is to continue with the current system.

    It should be noted that, while not perfect, it is basically the same system we`ve had in place for decades, and in that time has worked reasonably well.

    Furthermore, I think it is always better to presume innocence instead of guilt. The current system presumes innocence, while the picture ID requirement presumes guilt. So that`s yet another reason why I`m uncomfortable with requiring picture IDs.

    If, however, the percentage of the voting population with picture IDs was 97% or higher, I`d be fine with switching to requiring them.
  139. Profile photo of auburnjunky
    auburnjunky Male 30-39
    10339 posts
    January 23, 2012 at 2:35 am
    As far as I know, Alabama and Texas requires IDs to vote.

    There must be other states that do too. Seems kinda funny/selective.
  140. Profile photo of mjy34222
    mjy34222 Male 50-59
    26 posts
    January 23, 2012 at 5:02 am
    One in five people over 65 do not have proper identification to vote according to this law.
  141. Profile photo of QualityJay
    QualityJay Male 18-29
    303 posts
    January 23, 2012 at 7:24 am
    idk how I feel about this...
  142. Profile photo of Altaru
    Altaru Male 18-29
    3483 posts
    January 23, 2012 at 9:19 am
    For every stat/link/source you provide, I can come up with a counter to it.
    Okay then, put up or shut up asshat.

    I`m sick of watching you conservatives provide nothing but anecdotes and claims that "I can find the proof!"

    Either post the proof, or shut your face. It`s annoying watching sore losers bitch.

    Because as-is, all I`ve seen out of any of you is bitching, moaning, and anecdotes.

    I had to go through a pain in the ass process to get my proof of ID when I wanted to get my license. I`m not sure about other states, but to get it here in Ohio my voter registration card counted as a secondary source, which meant I still needed at least one primary source and another secondary source, both of which ended up costing me money to obtain. Not including the gas I had to waste because I needed to get the documents from the district I was born in, and I had moved half-way across the state.
  143. Profile photo of M_Archer
    M_Archer Male 18-29
    525 posts
    January 23, 2012 at 10:04 am
    I`m really loving the thumbnail that accompanies every Obama post. Keep up the good work, guys!
  144. Profile photo of CrakrJak
    CrakrJak Male 40-49
    17514 posts
    January 23, 2012 at 1:15 pm
    markust: It took years of investigation and finally someone coming forward as a witness to stop just a few of them, In St.Louis. When they were caught, that ACORN office immediately started destroying it`s files and closed it`s office to cover their ass.

    They still operate, just under another name, I believe they call themselves `MORE` now.
  145. Profile photo of CrakrJak
    CrakrJak Male 40-49
    17514 posts
    January 23, 2012 at 1:22 pm
    Altaru: The "bitching, moaning, and anecdotes." reached epic proportions during GW`s terms as president.

    Even today the urge to `Blame Bush` for everything that Obama has screwed up, is irresistible for most.

    So please don`t get sanctimonious.
  146. Profile photo of markust123
    markust123 Male 40-49
    3889 posts
    January 23, 2012 at 3:29 pm
    Your head is so far to the right CrakrJak you can`t see straight. The ACORN investigation wasn`t about voter fraud it was about a couple organizers registering false names to get their quota. In most instances it was ACORN themselves that found the errors. And when a few slipped through ACORN worked with officials to correct the errors. The following is my opinion. ACORN closed certain offices because the GOP in congress lied on the floor and was able to get ACORN`s funding reduced. The ACORN "scandal" was 100% about shutting down an organization that registers black voters. It was voter suppression on a massive level. Sources: PolitiFact FactCheck
  147. Profile photo of CrakrJak
    CrakrJak Male 40-49
    17514 posts
    January 23, 2012 at 6:03 pm
    markust: [quote">...when a few slipped through...[/quote">

    A few ? There were hundreds in some places, thousands in others.

    By the way, just how is an election board supposed to prove vote fraud when they don`t have the voters show ID ?

    Answer: You can`t. They can and do suspect it, but without any physical evidence they can`t prove it.

    And please, quit recycling links to liberal funded, `fact` sites.

    Link 1 Link 2
  148. Profile photo of jtrebowski
    jtrebowski Male 40-49
    3359 posts
    January 23, 2012 at 6:58 pm
    @Crakrjak: You complain about "liberal funded" fact sites, then you post links to an article written by John Fund andthe PJ website???!! ROTFFLMFAO!!!! Please.
  149. Profile photo of gary8162
    gary8162 Male 40-49
    939 posts
    January 23, 2012 at 7:23 pm
    I`m sick of watching you conservatives provide nothing but anecdotes and claims that "I can find the proof!"

    Either post the proof, or shut your face. It`s annoying watching sore losers bitch.

    First of all, it`s true. I can post a counter to every stat put up here. I`ve done it several times before. But all that happens when I do is you guys want to start a "post" war and it gets out of hand.
    Second, you`re not the only one who`s tired of sore losers bitching but you must mean liberals instead of conservatives. You guys just go off the deep end any time someone says anything bad about the great God Obama.
    Third, to QueenZira. What planet do you live on? Illegals most definitely are their constituents. They can and do vote. They have been REGISTERED by the bus load by democrats. Don`t you dare give me this sh*t about this being a "racial animus operating behind these laws". Race has no bearing on this at all. It`s strictly about
  150. Profile photo of Altaru
    Altaru Male 18-29
    3483 posts
    January 23, 2012 at 8:26 pm
    Second, you`re not the only one who`s tired of sore losers bitching but you must mean liberals instead of conservatives. You guys just go off the deep end any time someone says anything bad about the great God Obama.
    I think this law is a good idea. If they made the necessary documents and such freely available to any legal citizen, it would make voting fraud much more difficult.

    However, I am also a good referee who calls bullsh­it when he sees it.

    And all that you`ve posted so far is bullsh­it.

    You have provided no facts, no statistics, no PROOF of any kind besides hearsay, anecdotes, and bitchy claims that voter fraud is an issue, while the liberals here have posted plenty of stats proving it`s not a big enough issue to warrant the possibility of damaging the voting rights of a group of people.
  151. Profile photo of Altaru
    Altaru Male 18-29
    3483 posts
    January 23, 2012 at 8:28 pm
    In short...

    All of the conservatives that have posted here need to work on their debate tactics.

    "You won`t listen!" is more "whiny asshat" than "intelligent individual with informed opinions."

    And whiny asshats only change the opinions of other whiny asshats.
  152. Profile photo of markust123
    markust123 Male 40-49
    3889 posts
    January 23, 2012 at 9:03 pm
    "By the way, just how is an election board supposed to prove vote fraud when they don`t have the voters show ID ?"

    By matching the signature on record with the signature signed like they have been doing for over 100 years.

  153. Profile photo of gary8162
    gary8162 Male 40-49
    939 posts
    January 23, 2012 at 9:30 pm
    Look I`m not saying all this just to be trolling here. I have first hand knowledge of what I`m talking about. How am I supposed to prove to you that which I personally saw and heard? Is the only thing you`ll believe that which is posted on the Internet?
    Altaru, you and jtrebowski are just being purposely obtuse. You`re vehemently standing by your positions without considering legitimate reasons behind this law. Well, that`s what I`m pointing out. Go ahead and get pissy all you want. Call me names (it is what liberals like to resort to). But I`m not going to search the Internet for position papers that you`ll just look for a reason to debunk anyway. I`m never going to change your mind. That was never my intent and quite frankly, I don`t care if you believe me or not.
  154. Profile photo of markust123
    markust123 Male 40-49
    3889 posts
    January 23, 2012 at 9:37 pm
    I am actually fine with showing ID at a polling place to prove you are who you say you are (Drivers license, state issued ID, passport, student ID). We had to here in Washington until they went to an all mail ballot. I am not in favor of a special voters ID. Or laws that prohibit legitimate ID`s like a student ID. And if a new law is going to suppress votes like the one in South Carolina seams to be I am not in favor of implementing it until it has been re-written to allow for every registered voter to have equal access to the polls.
  155. Profile photo of CrakrJak
    CrakrJak Male 40-49
    17514 posts
    January 23, 2012 at 10:20 pm
    markust: Getting a S.C. ID is not difficult and costs only $5, that`s not prohibitive.

    Anyone can make a fake student ID, there are even websites that will help you do it. That is why they aren`t considered valid proof.
  156. Profile photo of Altaru
    Altaru Male 18-29
    3483 posts
    January 23, 2012 at 10:44 pm
    But I`m not going to search the Internet for position papers that you`ll just look for a reason to debunk anyway. I`m never going to change your mind. That was never my intent and quite frankly, I don`t care if you believe me or not.
    Then why`d you post in the first place, except to bitch, then keep coming back and bitch some more?

    I`m not calling you a whiny asshat just to call you names, I`m calling you a whiny asshat because that`s what people who do nothing but bitch are. And so far, you`ve done nothing but bitch.

    If it looks like a duck, walks like a duck, and quacks like a duck, it`s not exactly insulting or "name calling" to call it a duck.
  157. Profile photo of gary8162
    gary8162 Male 40-49
    939 posts
    January 24, 2012 at 3:15 am
    @ Altaru
    I posted my position in the first place as a valid reason why this law needs to be passed. I just said that. You`re not the only one who reads or responds to these posts. And I`m not bitching, I`m relating to you life experience. While it`s true I can`t prove to you that these conversations took place (which I assure you, they did), does this mean it didn`t happen and I`m just bitching? No. It merely means I don`t carry a recording device on me at all times.
    By calling me names you prove to all of us that you`re just being chidish. Now, go to your room. No tv for you for one whole week.
  158. Profile photo of markust123
    markust123 Male 40-49
    3889 posts
    January 24, 2012 at 3:23 pm
    "Anyone can make a fake student ID, there are even websites that will help you do it. That is why they aren`t considered valid proof."

    Student ID`s are only not considered valid ID`s by the Republicans. The Democrats have no problem with it. That issue is absolutely voter suppression. You have been absolutely ridiculous defending this. Your points do not fall into the realm of logic or truth. If it was Democrats suppressing the Republican vote you would be out of your mind. But because it will help your "side" you are fine with it. That is un-American. Ever citizen should have equal opportunity to vote. You make me sick - in the most comical of ways. You really are ridiculous. I have just been playing with you here. Laughing the whole time. You didn`t disappoint.
  159. Profile photo of CrakrJak
    CrakrJak Male 40-49
    17514 posts
    January 25, 2012 at 2:48 am
    markust: This issue doesn`t have `a side`, unless you believe that illegal aliens should be allowed to vote or wish voter fraud to continue unabated.

    If you`re for either of those then you make me sick.
    What`s `absolutely ridiculous`, are your claims of racism and `voter suppression`. Might I remind you that it was the democrat party that enacted Jim Crow laws and voter suppression in the south after the civil war and kept it that way for nearly a hundred years.

    Democrats now treat blacks, hispanics, and illegals as exclusively their constituency, and viciously attack any minority person that becomes a republican or doesn`t tow the party line. That sort of `plantation` attitude and persecution of `uncle toms` is what is truly racist.
  160. Profile photo of gary8162
    gary8162 Male 40-49
    939 posts
    January 25, 2012 at 3:23 am
    Well said CrakrJak, well said.
    I find it sad that these liberals are so vitriolic when calmly presented with arguments against their beliefs. Being passionate about it is one thing but some of them are just being childish about it. But it`s not like I haven`t seen this before. Here in Indiana, the democratic representatives keep walking out so as not to have a quorum thus preventing, not just a vote on anything, but even any discussion on it. That`s akin to kid sticking their fingers in their ears and screaming la, la, la, la, la as loud as they can while someone else is talking to them so they can`t be heard.
  161. Profile photo of HiEv
    HiEv Male 40-49
    621 posts
    January 29, 2012 at 1:41 pm
    @CrakrJak: "Democrats now treat blacks, hispanics, and illegals as exclusively their constituency, and viciously attack any minority person that becomes a republican or doesn`t tow the party line. That sort of `plantation` attitude and persecution of `uncle toms` is what is truly racist."

    I call shenanigans. Where is your evidence of this? Come on, show me some quotes from Democrats saying that.

    What I`m saying is, put up or shut up, `cause I`m tired of reading your baseless libel.

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