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Category: Misc
Date: 12/09/11 09:40 AM

158 Responses to Joe Horn – Neighborhood Hero Or Murderer?

  1. Profile photo of kitteh9lives
    kitteh9lives Female 70 & Over
    8033 posts
    December 9, 2011 at 9:15 am
    Link: Joe Horn - Neighborhood Hero Or Murderer? - The 911 call from Joe Horn as he catches 2 burglars at his neighbors home. Would you want Joe to be your neighbor I-A-B?
  2. Profile photo of nijd
    nijd Male 18-29
    267 posts
    December 9, 2011 at 10:00 am
    Meh, looks like he just took out some trash.
  3. Profile photo of Revolutioniz
    Revolutioniz Male 18-29
    911 posts
    December 9, 2011 at 10:01 am
    Despite the robbers being scum of the earth crooks, the guy had no right to end their lives for theft. Definitely murder..
  4. Profile photo of Kain1
    Kain1 Male 18-29
    1473 posts
    December 9, 2011 at 10:02 am
    well hurray for the second amendment.. right guys??.. :S
  5. Profile photo of Revolutioniz
    Revolutioniz Male 18-29
    911 posts
    December 9, 2011 at 10:02 am
    Oh wait, never mind. i was having this weird delusion that we had a fair justice system.
  6. Profile photo of ChiefRocka
    ChiefRocka Male 18-29
    65 posts
    December 9, 2011 at 10:04 am
    ok you cant post news that is four years old its now called olds
  7. Profile photo of DingDingDong
    DingDingDong Male 30-39
    1511 posts
    December 9, 2011 at 10:05 am
    Meh, two less burglars now. Thanks Joe.
  8. Profile photo of sssfdg
    sssfdg Male 18-29
    190 posts
    December 9, 2011 at 10:08 am
    Murderer ... a nice family... christian man... who just killed two people. mmmm seems a little screwy
  9. Profile photo of Hedkwab
    Hedkwab Male 18-29
    340 posts
    December 9, 2011 at 10:16 am
    He exercised restraint by staying on the phone with the police station. The police did not arrive in time to stop the crime being committed on his community, so he stopped it himself.
  10. Profile photo of pmarren
    pmarren Male 40-49
    4575 posts
    December 9, 2011 at 10:17 am
    I say give him a goddam medal.
  11. Profile photo of chance13
    chance13 Male 40-49
    219 posts
    December 9, 2011 at 10:17 am
    A 4 year old case that ended up with Mr. Horn never being charged. They came into the yard after clearly being told to stop...oh...illegal immigration status on both robbers btw...

    In any case, 4 years old is a little outside the statute of limitations.
  12. Profile photo of angelo0317
    angelo0317 Male 18-29
    331 posts
    December 9, 2011 at 10:22 am
    I support Joe. Hell to all that try to oppose me. :)

    The robbers got what they deserve, they tried to take Joe`s property, Joe returned the favor by taking their life. Equivalent exchange.
  13. Profile photo of leesah
    leesah Female 18-29
    1566 posts
    December 9, 2011 at 10:23 am
    They were two black illegal immigrant criminals in Texas, this was going to happen anyway. I am a fan of the way he casually mentions he has a shotgun and asks if he should take care of it.
  14. Profile photo of BoredFrank
    BoredFrank Male 40-49
    2211 posts
    December 9, 2011 at 10:24 am
    Let`s see, two burglars dead.

    Nope, don`t see a downside!
  15. Profile photo of Klivel
    Klivel Male 18-29
    106 posts
    December 9, 2011 at 10:29 am
    "I feel like he wanted to shoot him"

    God damned right he did. He still gave them both a warning not to move, they came across the street figuring the old man isn`t really gonna shoot, and they learned different.

    This is texas, you new york-based BBC anchor. We have the castle doctrine which to plainly failed to mention in your rush to paint the story in a stilted manner. Castle doctrine states quite clearly that so long as you reasonably believe you are acting as your neighbor would want you to act, you may take lethal action in defense of their property, just as you could in defense of your own.

    The statute of limitations on murder is 5 years, and he won`t ever be charged. You rob someone, you knowingly take the risk of being shot for it. They deserved it.
  16. Profile photo of mrpuddle
    mrpuddle Male 18-29
    385 posts
    December 9, 2011 at 10:30 am
    Hero
  17. Profile photo of LillianDulci
    LillianDulci Female 18-29
    2674 posts
    December 9, 2011 at 10:37 am
    He said multiple times he`d kill them. It`s understandable if he meant to harm them but not kill them, but it really seems like he intended to kill them (and it wasn`t a situation that warranted killing).
  18. Profile photo of Grendel
    Grendel Male 40-49
    5885 posts
    December 9, 2011 at 10:45 am
    Joe Horn was attempting to stop the burglery of his neighbor. He asked them to stop. They came for him. One is now dead.

    Diego Ortize was no family man. He was a criminal.

    If Diego Ortize thought that his life was worth the junk he was stealing, who am I to argue?

    Stealing other people`s stuff is not a safe career in Texas.

    Way to go, Joe. I wouldn`t mind having him as a neighbor.
  19. Profile photo of Tiredofnicks
    Tiredofnicks Male 30-39
    5101 posts
    December 9, 2011 at 10:47 am
    Property is never, ever worth someone`s life.
  20. Profile photo of Kain1
    Kain1 Male 18-29
    1473 posts
    December 9, 2011 at 10:51 am
    So it`s the death penalty for theft then?.. That`s just immoral..
  21. Profile photo of CaptKangaroo
    CaptKangaroo Male 50-59
    2314 posts
    December 9, 2011 at 10:52 am
    We do not need more and better equipped police, we need more and better equipped civillians.
    Kudos to this guy.
  22. Profile photo of Rick_S
    Rick_S Male 40-49
    3275 posts
    December 9, 2011 at 10:53 am
    Murderer.
  23. Profile photo of scoomanchoo
    scoomanchoo Male 18-29
    219 posts
    December 9, 2011 at 10:53 am
    So if a robber hurts himself in your house they can sue you... but if you shoot them while they rob someone elses it`s all good?
  24. Profile photo of Gerry1of1
    Gerry1of1 Male 50-59
    36229 posts
    December 9, 2011 at 10:55 am

    Neither hero nor villain. Just a guy.

    And if criminals knew they could get killed in the act I would bet real money we would have less crime. As it is, crooks are confidant you can`t do anything to them.
  25. Profile photo of RuralNinja
    RuralNinja Male 18-29
    519 posts
    December 9, 2011 at 10:55 am
    So he sees two thugs desecrating his neighbor`s home and goes out to confront them. They proceed to enter his property, disregard his clear verbal orders to not move, proceed to advance on him, and make the last idiotic mistake of their lives. I see nothing wrong here.

    Whether you believe it was justified or not, his actions were legal and allowable. I`d have him as a neighbor.
  26. Profile photo of CrakrJak
    CrakrJak Male 40-49
    17515 posts
    December 9, 2011 at 11:01 am
    Yup, they shoot burglars in Texas, no surprise there. No sympathy for those burglars, they should`ve known better.
  27. Profile photo of krembill
    krembill Male 18-29
    1094 posts
    December 9, 2011 at 11:03 am
    Ass.
  28. Profile photo of madest
    madest Male 40-49
    7379 posts
    December 9, 2011 at 11:08 am
    Don`t teach your kids to steal.
  29. Profile photo of Thdot
    Thdot Male 30-39
    658 posts
    December 9, 2011 at 11:11 am
    @RuralNinja, he did not go outside to confront and verbally order them. He went outside to kill them. At 30 seconds he tells the 911 operator, "I`m gonna kill them."
  30. Profile photo of auburnjunky
    auburnjunky Male 30-39
    10339 posts
    December 9, 2011 at 11:13 am
    Screw that woman. He shouldn`t have been robbing the house in the first place.

    Hooray for Castle laws.
  31. Profile photo of Naitsirhc88
    Naitsirhc88 Male 18-29
    391 posts
    December 9, 2011 at 11:13 am
    If they came on to his property with malicious intent like he claims he was within his rights. You have a right to defend your property with deadly force if necessary. The dispatcher on the phone advised him not to go outside for his own safety, and not because he would be committing a crime by defending a neighbor`s property. It doesn`t surprise me that he wasn`t charged. I bet the neighbor who was robbed thinks he`s a hero. The man with the family who died, should have been thinking about what would happen to his family without him.
  32. Profile photo of Grendel
    Grendel Male 40-49
    5885 posts
    December 9, 2011 at 11:15 am
    Tiredofnicks-"Property is never, ever worth someone`s life."

    Diego Ortize obviously thought it was.
  33. Profile photo of maxxim
    maxxim Male 30-39
    125 posts
    December 9, 2011 at 11:15 am
    the video couldn`t be more biased toward gun control, but the man did the right thing. Two fewer potential murderers on the street.
  34. Profile photo of auburnjunky
    auburnjunky Male 30-39
    10339 posts
    December 9, 2011 at 11:17 am
    "He exercised restraint by staying on the phone with the police station. The police did not arrive in time to stop the crime being committed on his community, so he stopped it himself."

    ^^This

    "They were two black illegal immigrant criminals in Texas, this was going to happen anyway. I am a fan of the way he casually mentions he has a shotgun and asks if he should take care of it."

    ^^and This.

    "Let`s see, two burglars dead.

    Nope, don`t see a downside!"

    ^^also This.

    "He still gave them both a warning not to move, they came across the street figuring the old man isn`t really gonna shoot, and they learned different."

    ^^I-A-B is growing ever more right.
  35. Profile photo of RyanHake
    RyanHake Male 18-29
    2690 posts
    December 9, 2011 at 11:20 am
    He could`ve aimed low...disable them instead. I didn`t hear any mention of them having guns, in which case aiming high makes sense. Regardless, they were in the wrong and when you commit crimes like that you are risking your life. Either by actually dying or risking losing having a life by rotting in prison.
  36. Profile photo of RuralNinja
    RuralNinja Male 18-29
    519 posts
    December 9, 2011 at 11:21 am
    @Thdot If you listen, he says that in response to the operator telling him he`ll get shot if he goes out. His reply doesn`t mean that he`s going to shoot without warning, but that he`ll shoot if they come at him.

    What he actually says is that he isn`t going to let them get away, and he`ll protect himself in the process if he has to. He then goes outside and tells them that if they move, they`re dead. They proceeded to move at him, and he killed them.
  37. Profile photo of ChrisP12
    ChrisP12 Male 40-49
    186 posts
    December 9, 2011 at 11:22 am
    When seconds count the police are only minutes away.
  38. Profile photo of TKD_Master
    TKD_Master Male 18-29
    4794 posts
    December 9, 2011 at 11:24 am
    I think he should have done it differently... He should have made them lie down on the ground. Shoot a shell into the ground to scare em if you have to. If they pull weapons, then murdering their asses is completely ok in my book. The way I see it, he saved everybody in his state some tax money because that is two less prisoners they are paying for.
  39. Profile photo of xaxxonjolly
    xaxxonjolly Male 30-39
    85 posts
    December 9, 2011 at 11:24 am
    Joe handed out the death penalty for robbery. Of the crazed right wing americans who agree with this, which of you has never broken the law? Fancy the death penalty any of you?
  40. Profile photo of dm2754
    dm2754 Male 40-49
    3286 posts
    December 9, 2011 at 11:28 am
    i hope Joe Horn gose to jail. that was rwrong and uncalled for. is a mans life worth a few hunderd in useless junk?
    if he was a cop he would be in a lot of trobble
  41. Profile photo of Sexy_R1
    Sexy_R1 Male 18-29
    41 posts
    December 9, 2011 at 11:28 am
    Thats right. come to Texas to drat with someone, you will get shot. dont worry about the dog, worry about the owner.
  42. Profile photo of barberthe
    barberthe Male 18-29
    103 posts
    December 9, 2011 at 11:30 am
    Aim low? Why disable the guy? Dead men can`t sue you, seek revenge, or commit crimes against anyone else. It`s never good to have this happen, but they knew the risks they were taking. I would have done the exact same thing(admittedly, with a handgun instead...still don`t have a shotgun). Hell, if he was my neighbor, I would be damned proud.
  43. Profile photo of SunnyNphilly
    SunnyNphilly Male 18-29
    645 posts
    December 9, 2011 at 11:33 am
    Come to my neighborhood with the intent to take things that don`t belong to you... same conclusion, you lying on the ground, taking your last breaths. Criminals have no rights.
  44. Profile photo of LillianDulci
    LillianDulci Female 18-29
    2674 posts
    December 9, 2011 at 11:38 am
    Criminals have no rights. So it`s perfectly fine to shoot and kill a teenager for stealing a $5 bracelet. It`s perfectly fine to shoot and kill someone for running a red light or speeding. That`s definitely how the law is supposed to work. Do something illegal = get murdered.
  45. Profile photo of xiquiripat
    xiquiripat Male 18-29
    2423 posts
    December 9, 2011 at 11:42 am
    In a court of law, in front of a jury of their peers, those two would have gotten a few years max. This man handed out a death sentence on his own initiative. Lethal force is justified only in defending one`s own life or the life of another and seeing as how his life was not in danger and that his neighbors were gone there was no reason to confront a pair of petty crooks with a shotgun. He went out there looking to execute them. Fifty years ago he would be the kind of guy leading a lynch mob.

    You know what`s even worse than stealing TVs? Defying the rule of law our society is built upon and taking the deliberative process of Justice and placing it into the hands of a hillbilly with a gun.
  46. Profile photo of Inter237
    Inter237 Male 18-29
    2441 posts
    December 9, 2011 at 11:42 am
    He clearly went too far. I`m assuming he could have held them up with the shotgun. I won`t call him a hero or murderer, but will stay perfectly on the fence.
  47. Profile photo of a1butcher
    a1butcher Male 40-49
    4812 posts
    December 9, 2011 at 11:48 am

    Double Murderer...

    You don`t deserve the death penalty for a B-E.
  48. Profile photo of trippyhippy9
    trippyhippy9 Male 18-29
    559 posts
    December 9, 2011 at 11:49 am
    For those claiming SOL is 5 years, you are mistaken. It is 5-7 years for depending on the crime, but murder has no statute of limitations.

    Also, this life long liberal thinks Joe did nothing wrong. If you get hurt or killed because someone was trying to prevent you from committing a crime, it is your own fault.

    Also, sometimes property is worth a life. Those times are extremely circumstantial, but sometimes, a stealing a someones property is stealing their livelyhood. What if they stole tools used for working or sensitive documents needed to run a business?
  49. Profile photo of AvatarJohn
    AvatarJohn Male 30-39
    1059 posts
    December 9, 2011 at 11:51 am
    Sorry Lillian, but there`s a difference between running a red light and breaking into someone`s home. If you break a traffic law, you get a fine. If you break into a house, you are potentially threatening the lives of everyone in that house. Homeowners have the right to defend their home with deadly force. I don`t own a gun, but I do own a bat, and if someone breaks into my home where my wife and children are I will beat them mercilessly until they are dead.
  50. Profile photo of LillianDulci
    LillianDulci Female 18-29
    2674 posts
    December 9, 2011 at 11:53 am
    @trippyhippy9 - There`s a difference between shooting to kill (like this guy did) and shooting to injure (like this guy should have done, injure them so they couldn`t get away and let the police take care of them). If he accidentally killed them that`s one thing, but he set out to kill them when they weren`t a danger to him.
  51. Profile photo of jamie76
    jamie76 Male 30-39
    2346 posts
    December 9, 2011 at 11:53 am
    wait, he had no reason to appraoch either of these men, if he had not approached them they would not have had a confrontation with him and thus he would not have had to shoot them.

    a persons life is not worth taking over a theft, that is all there is too this. he had called the police, they were on the way, he then took the law into his own hands and killed to me for stealing.

    he should be arrested.
  52. Profile photo of LillianDulci
    LillianDulci Female 18-29
    2674 posts
    December 9, 2011 at 11:54 am
    "Homeowners have the right to defend their home with deadly force. "
    They were in their neighbors home when no one was home, then they left the home and weren`t in the killer`s home. They weren`t a danger to the killer. The killer wasn`t defending his own life. They didn`t have weapons as far as I know. He could have easily shot at their legs or something instead of shooting to kill. If they were a threat to him that`s one thing, but that was not the case.
  53. Profile photo of LillianDulci
    LillianDulci Female 18-29
    2674 posts
    December 9, 2011 at 11:56 am
    Also AvatarJohn, my response was to SunnyNphilly saying that criminals have no rights. Criminals are anyone who disobeys the law, so stealing a $5 bracelet or running the red light do apply.
  54. Profile photo of jamie76
    jamie76 Male 30-39
    2346 posts
    December 9, 2011 at 11:57 am
    the bottom line here is that he was in a safe place while on the phone and did not have to leave where he was. he caused the confrontation, that is the bottom line.

    if they had entered his house that is different, if he had entered his neighbors house to stop them, that would be different, but no, he confronted them OUTSIDE the house as they were leaving.

    this is by definition MURDER. It was two killings that did not have to occur and were not in self defense. for it to be self defense he would have to have been in a position where he could not be assured his safety and thus forced to act but he was safe and did not have to act.

  55. Profile photo of Grendel
    Grendel Male 40-49
    5885 posts
    December 9, 2011 at 12:26 pm
    RyanHake-"He could`ve aimed low...disable them instead."

    What? And face a lawsuit? (btw..you NEVER aim to wound).

    xaxxonjolly-"Joe handed out the death penalty for robbery."

    Here`s an axiom: If you are breaking into houses in Texas, you are ACCEPTING the death penalty.

    xaxxonjolly-"which of you has never broken the law?"

    Are you SERIOUSLY equating crosswalking with burglery? That`s screwed up.

    dm2754-"is a mans life worth a few hunderd in useless junk?"

    I don`t think so, but obviously Diego thought HIS was. And it was his choice.

    xiquiripat-"This man handed out a death sentence on his own initiative"

    Nope, Diego VOLUNTEERED for it.

    xiquiripat-"Lethal force is justified only in defending one`s own life"

    They were approaching him with intent.
  56. Profile photo of Grendel
    Grendel Male 40-49
    5885 posts
    December 9, 2011 at 12:26 pm
    a1butcher-"You don`t deserve the death penalty for a B-E."

    But, in Texas, it`s an occupational hazard. (i.e. they volunteered for it)

    LillianDulci-"and shooting to injure"

    Life ain`t like a movie. You don`t magically shoot the gun out of they guys hand. You shoot to kill.

    jamie76-"a persons life is not worth taking over a theft"

    Again, THEIR choice. They thought someone elses junk was worth risking their life over.
  57. Profile photo of Baelzar
    Baelzar Male 40-49
    1399 posts
    December 9, 2011 at 12:27 pm
    If you break into someone`s house, you forfeit your life ahead of time.

    Hero.
  58. Profile photo of pmarren
    pmarren Male 40-49
    4575 posts
    December 9, 2011 at 12:29 pm
    MeGrendel, dude I think you are my new hero.
  59. Profile photo of LillianDulci
    LillianDulci Female 18-29
    2674 posts
    December 9, 2011 at 12:32 pm
    @MeGrendel - I`m sure there are plenty of ways of aiming the gun where you know there`s a much smaller chance of actually killing the person. If your life isn`t in danger (and the killers life was not in danger) then it`s not your right to shoot to kill.
  60. Profile photo of LillianDulci
    LillianDulci Female 18-29
    2674 posts
    December 9, 2011 at 12:33 pm
    "If you break into someone`s house, you forfeit your life ahead of time. "
    But it wasn`t this guys house. No one was in the house that they stole from. This guy was perfectly safe in his own house and went out of his way to take justice into his own hands and kill the robbers.
  61. Profile photo of the_windy
    the_windy Female 18-29
    1589 posts
    December 9, 2011 at 12:33 pm
    While what he did is admirable, going as far as killing them is too much. He could have found a way, I`m sure, to just injure the fugitives. But even then, it`s not a just cause.
    Firing of a weapon should only be used if you, or someone else is in danger. Stealing, while illegal, isn`t harming anyone.
  62. Profile photo of insane_ai
    insane_ai Male 30-39
    740 posts
    December 9, 2011 at 12:34 pm
    I think MeGrendel summed it up right.
  63. Profile photo of LillianDulci
    LillianDulci Female 18-29
    2674 posts
    December 9, 2011 at 12:35 pm
    "They were approaching him with intent. "
    HE approached THEM with intent. He was perfectly safe in his own home and not in harms way at all until he went out of his way to go /to/ them. He wasn`t some innocent person caught off guard and being threatened. He even said before leaving his house that he`d kill them.
  64. Profile photo of nosecret
    nosecret Male 18-29
    62 posts
    December 9, 2011 at 12:39 pm
    and burglaries were never a problem in that neighborhood again...the end.
    when you disobey the law, bad things can happen.
    i wonder how many robberies/burglaries those two gents had completed successfully?
  65. Profile photo of onoffonoffon
    onoffonoffon Male 30-39
    2315 posts
    December 9, 2011 at 12:41 pm
    Are the robbers family`s really entitled to an opinion?
  66. Profile photo of xfactormunky
    xfactormunky Male 18-29
    116 posts
    December 9, 2011 at 12:41 pm
    Well it is legal to shoot someone if they are trespassing on your property, I don`t see how this is much difference. So these guys aren`t allowed to get shot because the got lucky and picked the right house?
  67. Profile photo of xfactormunky
    xfactormunky Male 18-29
    116 posts
    December 9, 2011 at 12:44 pm
    also, why is this getting posted? It`s like 4 years old
  68. Profile photo of trippyhippy9
    trippyhippy9 Male 18-29
    559 posts
    December 9, 2011 at 12:55 pm
    @LillianDulci

    I disagree that his life wasn`t in danger. If he had let those guys get away, they would definitely be coming back to that neighborhood for more.

    Would you have him depend on the police? Act like those guys aren`t a joke. Should he just be indifferent and let people steal whatever they want?

    How was he supposed to know those guys weren`t armed? To do nothing about it would almost be like inviting potential armed criminals to come back and pillage your neighborhood.

    Justice was served.
  69. Profile photo of LillianDulci
    LillianDulci Female 18-29
    2674 posts
    December 9, 2011 at 12:55 pm
    @xfactormunky - The reason you`d shoot someone for entering your house is they are a threat to you/your family. That`s not the same as you willingly confronting thieves and then shooting them.
  70. Profile photo of Grendel
    Grendel Male 40-49
    5885 posts
    December 9, 2011 at 12:56 pm
    LillianDulci-"I`m sure there are plenty of ways of aiming the gun where you..."

    Not too familiar with shotguns, now are you? Plus, you don`t ever shoot to harm, you shoot to kill.

    LillianDulci-"the killers life was not in danger"

    The HOMEOWNER (not killer) was being approached in a threatening manner by CRIMINALS. HIS judgement call to make.

    LillianDulci-"HE approached THEM with intent."

    HE approached THEM with LEGAL intent (to stop a crime and make a citizens arrest). THEY approached him with THREATENING intent. His call.

    onoffonoffon-"Are the robbers family`s really entitled to an opinion?"

    Of course. Everyone`s entitled to an opinion. But if it`s anything other than `My hubby was an idiot` it has no bearing on the case.
  71. Profile photo of LillianDulci
    LillianDulci Female 18-29
    2674 posts
    December 9, 2011 at 12:58 pm
    @trippyhippy9 - He could have shot to injure and not to kill. The legal punishment for theft is not death, so it is definitely not his right to go out of his way to murder them on his own. I don`t have a problem with it if he only shot at their legs even if he accidentally killed them anyway. But he went out there with the intent of killing them for a crime that doesn`t warrant death.
  72. Profile photo of LillianDulci
    LillianDulci Female 18-29
    2674 posts
    December 9, 2011 at 1:00 pm
    "Not too familiar with shotguns, now are you? Plus, you don`t ever shoot to harm, you shoot to kill. "
    You can repeat this all you want, but it doesn`t make it true.

    "The HOMEOWNER (not killer) was being approached in a threatening manner by CRIMINALS. HIS judgement call to make. "
    He`s a killer so I`ll call him like he is. He was approached after purposefully putting himself in a dangerous situation.

    "HE approached THEM with LEGAL intent (to stop a crime and make a citizens arrest). THEY approached him with THREATENING intent. His call. "
    BEFORE he left his house, he said that he`d kill them. HE approached THEM with the intent to kill for a crime that doesn`t warrant death.
  73. Profile photo of earthshone
    earthshone Male 18-29
    1688 posts
    December 9, 2011 at 1:09 pm
    feckin`a a... gimmie that neighbor, hes a great guy. kill the baddies
  74. Profile photo of Lobotomy
    Lobotomy Male 13-17
    495 posts
    December 9, 2011 at 1:10 pm
    2007. Really on top of the ball here.
  75. Profile photo of Grendel
    Grendel Male 40-49
    5885 posts
    December 9, 2011 at 1:14 pm
    LillianDulci-" The legal punishment for theft is not death"

    So he should wait until they kill him so they can get the death penalty?

    THEY considered their life to be worth someone else`s junk.

    LillianDulci-"He`s a killer so I`ll call him like he is."

    Your delusions do not equate reality.

    LillianDulci-"He could have shot to injure"

    Again, Your delusions do not equate reality.

    LillianDulci-"a crime that doesn`t warrant death."

    Sorry, you approach me with criminal entent, it warrents death.

    I will make this so simple that even you might understand it: "Breaking into peoples houses in Texas (among other areas) is a good way to get killed. THEY knew this, but did it anyway. THEY knew what they valued their lifes at, and it was less that the price of a flatscreen t.v."

    This occurred 4 years ago. Joe was never charged. I`m sure that the entire town`s
  76. Profile photo of LillianDulci
    LillianDulci Female 18-29
    2674 posts
    December 9, 2011 at 1:17 pm
    @MeGrendel - It`d be one thing if they broke into HIS house. But no. He was perfectly safe and fine in his own home. He flat out said he`s going to go out and kill them. So he went out and killed them. If he stayed inside, there was no danger to him, but instead he left with the intent to kill them for stealing material possessions.
  77. Profile photo of Thetas
    Thetas Male 18-29
    1540 posts
    December 9, 2011 at 1:21 pm
    Hell yeah I want someone like this as my neighbor. He`s not going to just sit around and let someone walk off with my TV. I`ll rest easy knowing when I get back home, if my TV`s not in the living room, there will be a corpse out front and Joe will have my TV back on my porch for me when I get home.
  78. Profile photo of tyekit
    tyekit Male 30-39
    15 posts
    December 9, 2011 at 1:24 pm
    We need more _HEROS_ like Mr Horn.
  79. Profile photo of driftwoodslo
    driftwoodslo Male 18-29
    15 posts
    December 9, 2011 at 1:25 pm
    Actually, you don`t shoot to kill. You shoot to stop. That`s what you will get trained to do in any concealed weapon class. You also have the right being a concealed weapon holder to "stop" anybody committing a felony. And in some states you can actually be arrested for not stopping somebody committing a felony if you are a permit holder.
  80. Profile photo of Angilion
    Angilion Male 40-49
    12390 posts
    December 9, 2011 at 1:34 pm
    Killing someone cleanly while they`re posing a threat (which they are by being in your home after breaking in) - reasonable force in defence.

    Deliberately going out to someone else`s home with the explicitly stated intention of killing people who were not a threat to anyone at the time, and then killing them - murder.

    The fact that the victim was burgling a house should be relevant to sentencing, but not to conviction.

    To all those who think it`s reasonable force, try this scenario:

    A burglar is caught and convicted after a fair trial. The homeowner had cameras in their house, the whole thing was on video. Absolutely definitely guilty. They go to jail.

    When they get out some years later, someone with a yearning to kill someone tracks them down and kills them.

    Do you think that`s a good thing? If not, why not?
  81. Profile photo of RedSpeed
    RedSpeed Male 18-29
    16 posts
    December 9, 2011 at 1:35 pm
    I love Texas!!! This is the way it should be,you steal you get shot. don`t steal and you won`t get shot.
  82. Profile photo of MountainBord
    MountainBord Female 18-29
    1894 posts
    December 9, 2011 at 1:42 pm
    He`s like Dexter but gets it done right. lol
  83. Profile photo of McGovern1981
    McGovern1981 Male 30-39
    14273 posts
    December 9, 2011 at 1:45 pm
    Good neighbor someone get him a beer he saved the system thousands upon thousands of dollars and mabey made criminals think twice about robbing someones house. If ya don`t want to be shot don`t steal peoples s**t!
  84. Profile photo of britt566
    britt566 Female 18-29
    2291 posts
    December 9, 2011 at 2:00 pm
    Joe horn = Hero
  85. Profile photo of corywebb
    corywebb Male 30-39
    106 posts
    December 9, 2011 at 2:12 pm
    He`d be a fine neighbour until one night you lose your keys, climb into your own window, and he comes over and shoots you.
  86. Profile photo of DJL
    DJL Male 30-39
    134 posts
    December 9, 2011 at 2:23 pm
    The death penalty does not apply to people who steal silverware.
  87. Profile photo of FuriousC
    FuriousC Male 30-39
    38 posts
    December 9, 2011 at 2:33 pm
    WIN!
  88. Profile photo of Hedkwab
    Hedkwab Male 18-29
    340 posts
    December 9, 2011 at 2:44 pm
    @Angilion

    I don`t know what kind of fairy-tale world you live in, but in my book, breaking into a neighbors house and stealing their things IS a "threat".
    I don`t sympathize with people who obviously lack moral intelligence or just simply don`t care for the laws of society. They attacked his home. He defended it.
  89. Profile photo of GuiStuie
    GuiStuie Male 30-39
    119 posts
    December 9, 2011 at 2:48 pm
    lol, drating loser ass drating faggot deserved to die. what a waste of drating life that piece of poo was. his family is a drating joke, too. Oh, and the fat man? nuff sed
  90. Profile photo of Lucky2u
    Lucky2u Male 18-29
    315 posts
    December 9, 2011 at 2:56 pm
    I would make sure to introduce myself to him when I moved in and made sure he knew my face, after that... shoot on sight joe!
  91. Profile photo of Grendel
    Grendel Male 40-49
    5885 posts
    December 9, 2011 at 3:05 pm
    DJL-"The death penalty does not apply to people who steal silverware."

    In certain parts of the country, yes it does get applied...by a law-abiding citizen who`s put up with enough.

    And Diego was not given the death penalty. He was given Justice, both barrells of it.

    He also received the penalty for being stupid.
  92. Profile photo of SmagBoy1
    SmagBoy1 Male 40-49
    4432 posts
    December 9, 2011 at 3:07 pm
    Joe Horn = trigger happy dick who ought to be in jail.
  93. Profile photo of Jokee
    Jokee Male 18-29
    23 posts
    December 9, 2011 at 3:21 pm
    Can`t believe how many drating rednecks are on here. Since when do you deserve to get your brain exploded for STEALING? Taking some drating objects. The insurance company would pay it back anyway. Those robbers were probably poor as drat and needed to feed their family. I`m not trying to justify them though. Stealing is wrong but it should never deserve a death sentence.

    This is why the world hates United-States. You are 100 years back. Where I live we try and promote peace and educate kids to love their neighbor (although I`m not religious, it says it in the drating bible you drating jesus freaks), and it doesn`t mean literal neighbor, it means other human beings. And where you live, you still think it is acceptable to take someone`s life because he grabbed some material goods.

    Why don`t you go and kill all the bankers and politicians who get rich on your back? Those guys don`t need to feed their poor as drat family.
  94. Profile photo of Equation
    Equation Male 18-29
    43 posts
    December 9, 2011 at 3:31 pm
    It was the drating illegal aliens` fault for breaking into a godamn house when they should have gotten a drating job cleaning windows or some poo. He was just doing what any good neighbor would have done. I would`ve.
  95. Profile photo of bentley22
    bentley22 Male 30-39
    244 posts
    December 9, 2011 at 3:33 pm
    not exactly hero status, but I appreciate what he did. I bet there are fewer robberies in that area now. Guns = deterrent
  96. Profile photo of 5Cats
    5Cats Male 50-59
    31800 posts
    December 9, 2011 at 3:34 pm
    I thought this was old:

    Nov 2007

    He was cleared of any wrongdoing in 2008.
    Justice, a dish best served cold.
  97. Profile photo of dude21862004
    dude21862004 Male 18-29
    768 posts
    December 9, 2011 at 3:45 pm
    If things like this happened more often there would be a lot less burglary.
  98. Profile photo of Shelworth
    Shelworth Male 50-59
    384 posts
    December 9, 2011 at 4:03 pm
    Hey Jokee so it`s OK with you if I just come over and take all your stuff? Cool, be right there.
  99. Profile photo of snakecharmer
    snakecharmer Male 18-29
    321 posts
    December 9, 2011 at 4:41 pm
    Me = Proud Texan.
    Those two burglars = No good m*therf*ckers.

    I`d do the same thing, and I own many guns. I am so sick of people who are afraid to take matters into their own hands and actually DO SOMETHING if something is not right.

    All of you who think what he did was wrong = P*ssies
  100. Profile photo of kittehdee29
    kittehdee29 Female 18-29
    803 posts
    December 9, 2011 at 4:45 pm
    Ugh. I get that his widow is mourning and is now likely stuck on gov`mint help, but come on. I highly doubt that was her husbad`s first offense and wouldn`t have been his last if he`d lived. He would`ve gotten out and done it all over again because our justice system is failing miserably.
  101. Profile photo of Grendel
    Grendel Male 40-49
    5885 posts
    December 9, 2011 at 7:32 pm
    Jokee-"Since when do you deserve to get your brain exploded for STEALING?"

    Since he charged at a law-abiding citizen with a shotgun? Since they were dumb enough to try it in Texas.

    Stupid should hurt. In this case, it was terminal.

    And since when is this trashe`s life worth more than the hard work and effort of the owner the items he stole?

    Jokee-"The insurance company would pay it back anyway."

    Some things can not be replaced by an insurance company.

    Jokee-"Those robbers were probably poor as drat "

    Not an excuse. I got an idea! Why don`t you blame the criminals?!?! (I know, not very progressive thinking...they probably had nlow self esteem)

    Jokee-"you still think it is acceptable to take someone`s life because he grabbed some material goods."

    And these idiots considered their life worth those same material goods. Bad choice, that.
  102. Profile photo of tyekit
    tyekit Male 30-39
    15 posts
    December 9, 2011 at 8:21 pm
    So what we need are designated areas where home owners are "required" to own guns and other area which don`t. That way the criminals know which houses to avoid if they don`t want to get shot. This way everyone is happy. The criminals know where the easy marks are, the gun owners are able to defend their communities, and the bleeding hearts don`t have to worry about criminals getting shot.
  103. Profile photo of whipplefunk
    whipplefunk Male 30-39
    973 posts
    December 9, 2011 at 9:14 pm
    Ya I would want him as my neighbor.
  104. Profile photo of GasMaskKid
    GasMaskKid Male 18-29
    694 posts
    December 9, 2011 at 9:15 pm
    guns are for self-defense not justice
  105. Profile photo of davymid
    davymid Male 30-39
    12151 posts
    December 9, 2011 at 10:01 pm
    Since he charged at a law-abiding citizen with a shotgun?
    I must have missed that bit. Where did the two perps charge at him, forcing him to unleash the shotgun rounds?

    Must admit, didn`t pay that much attention (only watched it once), just didn`t hear that. Maybe it was in the back-story.

    Also, I can understand the whole American Gun-happy thing. Heck, we`ve all watched westerns, and we know the background to America`s upbringing etc. But at what point does that allow a random Joe Public with a gun to summarily execute two criminals for burgling a house of some goods (probably covered under house insurance anyway)?
  106. Profile photo of davymid
    davymid Male 30-39
    12151 posts
    December 9, 2011 at 10:02 pm
    To those that say: "I wish he was my neighbour!", let`s put the shoes on the other foot. Let`s say your younger brother was an assh*le, turned criminal, and decided to burgle a house for some silverware. If he was shot in the face by a neighbour, acting like Judge Dredd, would you still applaud the shooter/killer as a hero?

    The judicial system is there for a reason. The day we all turn militia-vigilante and get away with it, and f*ck the so-called Law, is the day we return to being a neanderthal society. It`s 2011 for f*ck sake.
  107. Profile photo of shiftyplus1
    shiftyplus1 Male 18-29
    311 posts
    December 9, 2011 at 10:29 pm
    Drew Brees doesn`t need guns....If you put him in that same exact situation, and his o-line gave him enough time and a good pocket it`s game over. Two footballs of non-lethal holy righteousness to the back of their heads and Joe horn was not needed at all.
  108. Profile photo of inversegrav
    inversegrav Male 30-39
    770 posts
    December 9, 2011 at 10:51 pm
    Well Davymid, fortunatly everyone in my family is smart enough, and has enough self respect to not become a criminal so I have no problem saying I wish he was my neighbor.
  109. Profile photo of Neyro
    Neyro Male 18-29
    148 posts
    December 9, 2011 at 11:07 pm
    I wouldn`t mind having him for a neighbor. It is my personal philosophy that if someone is going to encroach upon my safety or the safety of my friends and family, they lose their right to safety.

    Criminals take what they get. No lost sleep on my part.
  110. Profile photo of CrakrJak
    CrakrJak Male 40-49
    17515 posts
    December 9, 2011 at 11:27 pm
    Davy: If...(your younger brother was an assh*le, turned criminal)... was shot in the face by a neighbour, acting like Judge Dredd, would you still applaud the shooter/killer as a hero?

    I`d be sad for my brother and family, but I wouldn`t blame the shooter/neighbor for it.

    And by the way, the neighbor wasn`t saying `f*ck the so-called Law` he was defending the law, the criminals burglarizing the house are the law breakers, and they damn well should`ve known the risks of getting shot while doing so.
  111. Profile photo of logandaninja
    logandaninja Male 13-17
    227 posts
    December 9, 2011 at 11:38 pm
    the reason I have rock salt shells, wont kill you but you`ll wish you where dead
  112. Profile photo of Grendel
    Grendel Male 40-49
    5885 posts
    December 9, 2011 at 11:41 pm
    davymid-"I must have missed that bit."

    Yup, you did. Check again.

    911 transcript: “I had no choice. They came in the front yard with me, man.” Pasadena police confirmed that the two men were shot after they ventured into Horn`s front yard. Police Capt. A.H. Corbett stated the two men ignored Mr. Horn`s order to freeze and that one of the suspects ran towards Joe Horn (he had arrived, but not gotten out of his car, so he was a witness).

    davymid-"Joe Public with a gun to summarily execute two criminals for burgling a house "

    There was not execution. He order them to stop (as is his right), they charge him, he killed them in self-defense.

    Dumb crooks.
  113. Profile photo of Grendel
    Grendel Male 40-49
    5885 posts
    December 9, 2011 at 11:46 pm
    davymid-"If he was shot in the face by a neighbour, acting like Judge Dredd, would you still applaud the shooter/killer as a hero"?

    I would be the first to admit that it was my brother`s fault. ANY person breaking into a house in my area (heavy on hunters and guns) is taking the chance of forfeiting his life.

    davymid-"The judicial system is there for a reason."

    Yes, Joe should have let them shoot HIM so that judicial system could handle it.

    davymid-"and f*ck the so-called Law"

    It`s called the "Castle Doctrine" and it IS the law. Look into it.

    davymid-"It`s 2011 for f*ck sake."

    Ain`t nothing special about 2011. We`re not more `enlightened`, we`re not less violent, mana does not fall from the sky. We`re still human, and still have to put up with violent criminals and stupid liberals.
  114. Profile photo of ChrisP12
    ChrisP12 Male 40-49
    186 posts
    December 10, 2011 at 12:04 am
    The world is rid of two pieces of sh*t. Only a few million more to go. Good luck Joe.

  115. Profile photo of chunkymonkie
    chunkymonkie Male 13-17
    670 posts
    December 10, 2011 at 1:11 am
    meh, too much
  116. Profile photo of TypicalJerk
    TypicalJerk Male 18-29
    533 posts
    December 10, 2011 at 1:12 am
    drat YEAH, America!

    But, seriously. It is his right. We don`t have the right to bear arms to just look cool. We are allowed to protect ourselves and our belongings by these means. Unless the nigglets were shot in the back, more power to the man.
  117. Profile photo of NILE12
    NILE12 Male 18-29
    157 posts
    December 10, 2011 at 3:07 am
    guns?
  118. Profile photo of AGit
    AGit Male 30-39
    996 posts
    December 10, 2011 at 5:51 am
    I really shouldn`t be surprised at some of the ever so witty remarks that can be found here, but I must admit that it`s quite funny.
    I`ve more or less got used to the fact that most of the people here hailing this guy as a hero are simultaneously pro-life. Apparently not every life is sacred, but pro-lifers who are also in favour of death penalty seems to be the norm, strange as that may seem.
    But it gets even better knowing that also most of the people that consider this guy to be a good example are the ones ranting in other posts about how you should always obey the officers of the law or suffer the consequences.
    I guess coherence is too much to ask for...
  119. Profile photo of tommy2X4
    tommy2X4 Male 50-59
    3441 posts
    December 10, 2011 at 5:52 am
    Looks like four douche bags to me.
  120. Profile photo of mcboozerilla
    mcboozerilla Male 30-39
    646 posts
    December 10, 2011 at 6:02 am
    That`s murder, people

    Thou shalt not kill. Period.
  121. Profile photo of barberthe
    barberthe Male 18-29
    103 posts
    December 10, 2011 at 6:17 am
    @Agit,

    I do not fall to either side of the fence on abortion. I will never be forced to make a choice about it, so it`s not my right to choose for someone else. I personally believe that life does begin at conception, but that`s another argument for another day. I do not support nor oppose abortion.

    I do support the death penalty. Do I agree with all the instances in which it is used? No. I do wish they would find a way to speed up the appeals process...why keep someone alive for twenty years just to kill them?

    As for obeying the police, yes, it is a good idea as long as doing so does not infringe on your rights. The only time I have allowed an officer to do so was one time I got pulled over and the officer had a bug up his ass about me for some unknown reason. I figured letting him search the car and look like an idiot would be wiser than refusing and making him even more pissy. I knew he wouldn`t find anything and the car was already a pos, so what did I ha
  122. Profile photo of barberthe
    barberthe Male 18-29
    103 posts
    December 10, 2011 at 6:19 am
    Continued,

    the car was already a pos, so what was there to worry about?

    Also, I totally agree with McGrendel
  123. Profile photo of PierreJeanFR
    PierreJeanFR Male 40-49
    1360 posts
    December 10, 2011 at 6:39 am
    USA! USA!
    United States of As-holes!
    And many of those are commenting on this post.
  124. Profile photo of yusuksomuch
    yusuksomuch Male 40-49
    1008 posts
    December 10, 2011 at 7:36 am
    hey i think abortions should be free and available to any who want it and i also think I would like this guy as my neighbor, this thief was a great family man? Setting a fine example for the next generation of criminals? He is a much better example now.
  125. Profile photo of yusuksomuch
    yusuksomuch Male 40-49
    1008 posts
    December 10, 2011 at 7:37 am
    lol i love it when eurodbags cry! its like springtime in venice, the way the sunlight hits the buildings in the evening..........
  126. Profile photo of PierreJeanFR
    PierreJeanFR Male 40-49
    1360 posts
    December 10, 2011 at 8:07 am
    I hope you all have this guy as a neighbour and he`s drunk and he mistakens your kid for a burglar and cold-bloodedly shoots the guts out of him.
  127. Profile photo of robosnitz
    robosnitz Male 40-49
    2737 posts
    December 10, 2011 at 8:34 am
    If you break into someones home, you take your life into your own hands. If you rob or mug someone, you take your life into your own hands. It`s a ballsy thing to do. So if you get hurt or killed, too bad.I had some guy knock on my door once, I didn`t know him so I stood by the door and just watch him. He kept looking around and kept knocking.After a while he tried the door nob, then went to pick the lock. I went to my bedroom, armed my shotgun and waited in the living room. he came in and I racked my shotgun and pointed at him. He froze. All I said to him was,"Don`t slam my door on the way out." He slowly walked out and closed my door gently, and ran down the road fast. I never called the police. They`re worthless anyway. I saw the guy a few months later in Walmart. I walked up behind him and quietly asked him if he was still breaking into houses, he looked at me, grabbed his daughter and left the store. Never saw him again.
  128. Profile photo of yusuksomuch
    yusuksomuch Male 40-49
    1008 posts
    December 10, 2011 at 9:35 am
    eurodbags who wish death to innocent children are just representing, i get it
  129. Profile photo of furrything
    furrything Male 50-59
    1310 posts
    December 10, 2011 at 9:57 am
    The guy is a dratin` hero!
  130. Profile photo of mcssls
    mcssls Female 70 & Over
    695 posts
    December 10, 2011 at 10:22 am
    Bravo
  131. Profile photo of Grendel
    Grendel Male 40-49
    5885 posts
    December 10, 2011 at 12:34 pm
    AGit-"pro-lifers who are also in favour of death penalty seems to be the norm, strange as that may seem. "

    Why would you consider it strange. Abortion and Capital Punishment are two totally different situations with their own rational for arguments on either side.

    Kinda like saying `Most animal-rights activists are also against the in-field-fly rule`. Not related to each other.


    mcboozerilla-"Thou shalt not kill. Period."

    Original translation: "Thou shalt not murder". Different meaning. This was not murder.
  132. Profile photo of SaintsFan
    SaintsFan Male 30-39
    256 posts
    December 10, 2011 at 12:54 pm
    Joe Horn - Thank you! It`s time someone stood up and did what is right.
  133. Profile photo of GodDamnDevil
    GodDamnDevil Male 40-49
    164 posts
    December 10, 2011 at 2:48 pm
    The only mistake Horn made was calling 911 BEFORE he shot them.
  134. Profile photo of rayc
    rayc Male 40-49
    2 posts
    December 10, 2011 at 5:41 pm
    only wish we could do that over here in the UK
  135. Profile photo of SilverThread
    SilverThread Male 30-39
    3435 posts
    December 10, 2011 at 7:30 pm
    Effing, Hero, the house next door is for sale, I would be happy to see him move in.
  136. Profile photo of SilverThread
    SilverThread Male 30-39
    3435 posts
    December 10, 2011 at 7:46 pm
    If an immune response is triggered by a cancerous cell within a body resulting in the destruction of that cell for the preservation of the organism as a whole how is this possibly a bad thing?

    Society as a whole is a dynamic living organism composed of myriad smaller organisms that must function in symbiosis for the well being of the whole.

    When that one cell is allowed to metastasize it can afflict myriad other cells and propagate on its own creating a much greater threat and ultimately disable or completely destroy the original construct.

    Ask yourself this, if everyone within a society operated on the guiding principals of the two men that were killed in this story, what would that society look like and how would it function?

    Now contrast that answer using Joe Horn as the model and contrast the answers, then ask yourself which society you believe you would prefer to live in.
  137. Profile photo of PacoP42
    PacoP42 Male 13-17
    1064 posts
    December 10, 2011 at 9:47 pm
    i`m just glad he wasn`t killed. there wouldn`t be a news story here if he was
  138. Profile photo of Angilion
    Angilion Male 40-49
    12390 posts
    December 10, 2011 at 10:53 pm
    Nobody answer before, so I`ll ask again. Have a go if you can:

    The fact that the victim was burgling a house should be relevant to sentencing, but not to conviction.

    To all those who think it`s reasonable force, try this scenario:

    A burglar is caught and convicted after a fair trial. The homeowner had cameras in their house, the whole thing was on video. Absolutely definitely guilty. They go to jail.

    When they get out some years later, someone with a yearning to kill someone tracks them down and kills them.

    Do you think that`s a good thing? If not, why not?

    Serious question. After all, there are quite a few people here arguing that killing burglars is a good thing regardless of circumstances because it improves society. So they should consider the above scenario to be a good thing.

    Maybe a reward for their severed heads, like there used to be?
  139. Profile photo of Suicism
    Suicism Male 18-29
    3625 posts
    December 11, 2011 at 1:54 am
    Awwww - how sweet! The bad man knocked up a naive female! That makes him a family man.. just like Goebbels. Maybe there`d be less attempts at burglary if there were more outcomes like this.
  140. Profile photo of Grendel
    Grendel Male 40-49
    5885 posts
    December 11, 2011 at 9:06 am
    Angilion-"Nobody answer before"

    No one answered because the scenario you put forth is so far out there it bears no resemblence to what actually happened. (BTW, the `victim` was not burglaring a house, the `criminal` was. The `victim` was the person who`s house was being burglered.)

    But, in answer to your asanine scenario: IF there were caught, and served their time, then technically they have served their debt to society.

    When they got out, they could have been upstanding citizens, or trash. Their choice.

    If someone decided to `track them down and kill them`, then that person would be guilty of murder. That fact has no bearing on the fact that they were burglers, and definitly no bearing that they were killed by a law abiding citizen in the commision of a felony.

    Any more dumb questions?
  141. Profile photo of Suicism
    Suicism Male 18-29
    3625 posts
    December 11, 2011 at 12:08 pm
    MeGrendel, I understand the concept of justice that Angilion was trying to illustrate, but here`s the fundamental problem - as you pointed out, yes at that point they would have paid their debt to society, so additional punitive punishment of that nature would be considered murder. I think what bothers him about this event is that the `criminal` was deprived the opportunity to face trial by the very society whose job it is to determine what his debt should be. The irony of course is that had Joe let these two burglars go, they probably would have gotten away and never had to face any form of justice. Thus, I default to my original contention.
  142. Profile photo of Bountykat
    Bountykat Female 18-29
    399 posts
    December 11, 2011 at 3:03 pm
    I live in Texas, my house just got robbed. I wish my neighbors had shot them in the drating face. Or shot them multiple times in other spots to make them suffer before they killed them. Disgusting pieces of poo, to make a living by stealing from people who actually work hard. This guy did the world a favor. I wouldn`t think twice about tearing a gigantic hole through these men, or the men who burglarized our house, with a big ol` shotgun. And I`d feel absolutely wonderful while watching them bleed to death. True story.
  143. Profile photo of Angilion
    Angilion Male 40-49
    12390 posts
    December 11, 2011 at 4:16 pm
    No one answered because the scenario you put forth is so far out there it bears no resemblence to what actually happened.

    Since I never claimed it did, how is that of any relevance?

    As I said before:

    After all, there are quite a few people here arguing that killing burglars is a good thing regardless of circumstances because it improves society. So they should consider the above scenario to be a good thing.
  144. Profile photo of Angilion
    Angilion Male 40-49
    12390 posts
    December 11, 2011 at 4:22 pm
    I think what bothers him about this event is that the `criminal` was deprived the opportunity to face trial by the very society whose job it is to determine what his debt should be.

    That`s part of it, but my main concern is the effect on society. I`m not very bothered about what happens to burglars, but I am very bothered about what happens to society because that affects me.

    I like a society ruled by laws and a criminal justice system. It`s not perfect, but it`s the least bad system anyone has come up with so far.

    Going out hunting criminals with the explicitly stated intention of killing them goes against that. It`s fine for a plot in a film, not so much in reality.
  145. Profile photo of AGit
    AGit Male 30-39
    996 posts
    December 11, 2011 at 4:36 pm
    MeGrendel "Abortion and Capital Punishment are two totally different situations"
    Could you elaborate? Perhaps it`s my poor understanding, but I`d say that those against abortion are so due to sanctity of life. All human life is sacred and, if mixed with religion, any act redeemable through true repentance. Execution skips both.
    As practically all have skiped the obeying a police officer bit I mentioned, except barberthe. And even then with quite poor results "as long as doing so does not infringe on your rights". Then again, in the United States there may be a right that allows you to shoot at people that are stealing your neighbour even though a police officer tells you not to leave your house that I`m not aware of, as well may be the case...
  146. Profile photo of SilverThread
    SilverThread Male 30-39
    3435 posts
    December 11, 2011 at 6:45 pm
    911 Operators are not police officers. This man acted fully within the bounds of the law and has been widely lauded as a hero by his neighbors and citizens of the United States.

    He was found Not Guilty of any wrong doing by a grand jury, which is proof that our legal system does in fact work.

    The men he killed were victims of their own very bad decision making.

    Criminals *should* be afraid to break the law and to think otherwise speaks to a questionable base of morality. If the Law itself seems flawed to the Majority of a society, then it should be changed, if not, then in order to maintain social cohesion, those that are dissident would do well to retrain their point of view.
  147. Profile photo of Grendel
    Grendel Male 40-49
    5885 posts
    December 11, 2011 at 8:12 pm
    Suicism-"what bothers him about this event is that the `criminal` was deprived the opportunity to face trial"

    That sometimes happens when you`re a criminal. It`s the utmost in hypocrisy when a criminal, who intentionally breaks the law, all of a sudden starts crying that his right have been violated and that OTHERS should not follow the Law where it concerns the criminal.

    Angilion-"So they should consider the above scenario to be a good thing."

    But they don`t because you scnario was based on ignorance.

    Angilion-"I like a society ruled by laws"

    Then get the criminals to obey the law and we wouldn`t have this problem. But you want to complain about a guy who DID NOT break the law just because you don`t like the outcome.
  148. Profile photo of Grendel
    Grendel Male 40-49
    5885 posts
    December 11, 2011 at 8:22 pm
    AGit-"Could you elaborate?"

    Would be glad to. Let me preface it by saying that I, personally, am against abortion. BUT, my convictions are not to the point where I`m willing to make that decision for somene else. So I have no problem with the laws as they stand (except I would like it that no taxpayer money were used to fund abortions).

    It`s actually very simple and I can explain my belief with the addition of one, single word.

    You say `sanctity of life`. I say `sanctity of INNOCENT life`. I believe that life starts at conception, and that the child should have a chance. BUT, it`s entirely possible that he will grow up to be a criminal, in which case he loses some of his right, up to and including the right to live.
  149. Profile photo of Grendel
    Grendel Male 40-49
    5885 posts
    December 11, 2011 at 8:22 pm
    AGit-" All human life is sacred"

    Nope, not really. Some humans have forfeited their rights.

    AGit-"even though a police officer tells you not to leave your house"

    A police officer didn`t. A 911 operator is not an officer of the law.
  150. Profile photo of Suicism
    Suicism Male 18-29
    3625 posts
    December 11, 2011 at 9:52 pm
    MeGrendel - I was essentially agreeing with you. Thanks for the cameo though.
  151. Profile photo of AGit
    AGit Male 30-39
    996 posts
    December 12, 2011 at 1:28 am
    MeGrendel, thanks for answering, quite useful. I was not aware that the person responding to the call was not a police officer, although I`m curious now to know what would have happened if a policeman answered and said the same thing. Would it be different?
    And you say sanctity of innocent life, fine. But in this case, guilt was established not by a trial but by a lone man based on his own experience, and I don`t think that`s enough to establish guilt. Both men were shot in the back, I don`t really believe that they were threatening his life with their arses, so I have to go for voluntary manslaughter at the least. Good job I`m not American and part of the grand jury, huh?
  152. Profile photo of barberthe
    barberthe Male 18-29
    103 posts
    December 12, 2011 at 5:09 am
    AGit, the one time I have had to talk with a police dispatcher while holding a gun, all they did was ask if I was armed and if I knew how to use it. I was babysitting the grocery store I work at during the big power outage in April and someone was trying to break in. Sadly, the perpetrator ran off before the officers arrived. However, when the officers got there, they flat-out told me to shoot the person if they came back. Quote: "If they come back, blast their ass"

    Granted, I do live in Alabama, but it wouldn`t surprise me if Texans had similar stories.
  153. Profile photo of Grendel
    Grendel Male 40-49
    5885 posts
    December 12, 2011 at 6:51 am
    AGit-"guilt was established not by a trial but by a lone man based on his own experience"

    The criminals` guilt has never been in question. They were caught in the act. They were witnessed to have broken into a house, and has stolen property from that house on their person.

    Funny how you`re upset that their supposed `rights` were violated, and yet you have no problem with THEM breaking the law.

    AGit-"Both men were shot in the back"

    Please cite: According to the coroner`s report that was indeterminant.

    AGit-"voluntary manslaughter at the least."

    Sorry, the facts do not bear that out. It`s been 4 years and he`s never been charged. Rightly so.

    AGit-"Good job I`m not American"

    Rational people across the U.S. are thankful for that fact.
  154. Profile photo of AGit
    AGit Male 30-39
    996 posts
    December 12, 2011 at 7:08 am
    MeGrendel, on SilverThread`s link it states that both were shot in the back, that`s the only source I can give you, if there is any other, I`m more than willing to take a look.
    I do care they broke the law, but I find being shot to death totally unjustified.
    It`s nice to know that rational people are thankful, I aim to please (but not at the back:)
  155. Profile photo of Kalimata
    Kalimata Male 30-39
    661 posts
    December 12, 2011 at 8:05 am
    Hmmm, iffy imho. He technically acted within the boundaries of the law. I think he acted in what he perceived to be the "spirit of the law". He also believed he was doing the right thing in his eyes.

    He escalated the situation by intervening, with a firearm, placing himself into a position to shoot two men that did not exist before he exited his house. He was in no physical danger, and the robbery had been "completed" (for lack of a better term).

    It wasn`t me, I wasn`t there, so my opinion is offered with those two things in my mind. IMHO, not murder, but a good case for manslaughter.

  156. Profile photo of Grendel
    Grendel Male 40-49
    5885 posts
    December 12, 2011 at 8:49 am
    AGit-"SilverThread`s link it states that both were shot in the back"

    Ah, okay, you were going on the detective`s statement (he also stated one of the criminals ran towards Joe).

    I was going on the Coroner`s report, where the ballistics were indeterminant.

    Plus, they were both shot IN HIS FRONT YARD.

    AGit-"I find being shot to death totally unjustified"

    A Harris County grand jury concluding the act was a justifiable use of deadly force and not murder. That`s it. End of story. It was justified.

    Sorry, but possible death is an occupational hazard when you break into homes. They knew that in Texas they could legally be shot for doing so. Obviously they thought their lives were worth less than a flatscreen t.v. Who am I to argue?
  157. Profile photo of MrLogic
    MrLogic Male 30-39
    106 posts
    September 4, 2012 at 9:02 am
    If everyone treated robberies like this, we would have no robberies. Think about it.

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