PeTA Sues Seaworld For What? Slavery?

Submitted by: Gerry1of1 5 years ago in
http://www.peta.org/b/thepetafiles/archive/2011/10/25/peta-sues-seaworld-for-violating-orcas-constitutional-rights.aspx

Is PeTA waging a stupid law suit or are they Orca Emancipators? Let the debate begin!
There are 79 comments:
Female 196
Eh, I can see it. Child abuse laws were only written up once the precedent of animal abuse laws were enacted.
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Female 114
Having animals perform in a circus like SeaWorld is stupid anyway and the only ones impressed by them are small children and the mentally challenged. SeaWorld and the "trainers" that work there are an over paid side show. Peta has a point, why do they keep it up? They rescue the animals from the wild that were hurt by humans so that they can entertain humans? WTF????
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Male 356
When will the naked protesters appear this time?
But wait, no. Laws are made to protect people from people, not animals from people. Animals abuse? Oh please. We abuse animals everyday, and why is it not okay for household pets but okay for other livestock? If I have a dog and I want to eat it, THE DECISION IS MINE. Americans and their stupid, pretentious laws, duh. You cannot extend your love to your fellow human beings, but you can to your stupid animals? That is not humanism at all, that`s selfism -- to care only about things that YOU can relate to. At least speciesism is better than that.
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Male 1,735

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Male 1,045

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Female 8,055
Bit Late ( went to bed) yes MrOrange- I have read Singer, but he grossly underestimates the mental abilities of most animals- I have more sympathy for Regan as it happens- but don`t think he got it quite right either. It is fine to eat each other- it is the way we treat each other while alive that is the issue, and the manner of getting to dead. Singer allowed billions of chickens and ducks to suffer unimaginable pain every year because he thinks they are too stupid to care- proven wrong now but he still won`t budge and keeps quiet!
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Male 2,419
@Pinkrhoid
As much as i hate christianity, and dispise what it has done, is doing and wants to do.
i financialy support some of their projects becuase i think they are f***ing awsome, such as the salvation army, you hold certian principles and act on them and becuase of that help people who have it rough? _legend_

I`m trying to judge actions by themselves and forget the big picture, otherwise i am not going to get anywhere of get anything done.
the cops do some nasty poo, but some cops are nothing short of heroes, i dislike the army, but now and again it serves a good cuase. etc etc.

the world is full of poo, if someone wipes that poo i say: please sire, may i have some more?
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Male 2,419
@soberguy, thanks for proving a point i made earlier. never at any time did i say that dolphins are human or that they should be. we all know that dolphins are the smartest species on earth, and that they thank us for all the fish.

@Gerry1of1,
What, you didn`t read my profile? Before ppl go and call me an animal lover, let me point out that i just really really really hate vegetables.

@SCfan uhmm, i was actualy expressing an opinion, and providing as logical arguments (to me)as i could to try and suport that.
you just called me stupid or trolling.. which makes you what? ...
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Male 7,378
[quote]They aren`t claims, look up the statistics on PETA, look up the indictments, it`s all in black and white.[/quote] ------------
I don`t need to look anything up for I`m not the one making the accusations. I know what they do. I`m a member. I appreciate their actions. I can`t say that I`m fond of them euthanizing dogs but I understand the why`s. All the information you have on PETA is what you`ve absorbed from anti-PETA groups and the people who are unable to defend their actions. That`s not me.
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Male 835
Some topics bring out the preachers.
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Male 1,239
I think the conditions in which the orcas and dolphins is insufficient and in that way cruel. If this passes though, then donkeys, horses, and all other labor animals go free. Kiss cows goodbye, probably emus and any other livestock. Only a small step to say pets because we keep them enclosed against their will.
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Male 71
MrLill: "If peta sues for slavery, I want them convicted of murder for all the animals they put down."
I agree completely.. the animals are in a controlled safe environment and every aspect of their life is monitored and maintained.. if anything they are safer and better off at sea world.. PETA is one of the most hypocritical organizations in the world they are a joke
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Male 1,239
"The bottom line is that people don`t have the right to manipulate or to breed dogs and cats... If people want toys, they should buy inanimate objects. If they want companionship, they should seek it with their own kind."
"We do not advocate "right to life" for animals."
Wow, animals can be slaves but have no rights to live?
"Euthanasia is the kindest gift to a dog or cat unwanted and unloved."
-At a press conference in 2005, after two PETA employees were arrested for animal cruelty after dumping hundreds of dead animals in a dumpster.
Great organization there!! Send them money right away!!
The fact is PETA or anyone can blow a whistle it`s us as a whole who change laws as we grow as beings and realize we were wrong.
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Male 1,239
PETA was there in the beginning of the movement and had a loud voice and I won`t say that they didn`t make great headway but they aren`t alone and there are many great organizations such as the SCPA who will continue to fight but have no shady end goals, and don`t support terroristic methods.
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Male 1,239
Madest that`s laughable. They aren`t claims, look up the statistics on PETA, look up the indictments, it`s all in black and white. There`s a large gap between Animal Rights Activists and Animal Welfare Supporters. Instead of calling them `claims` as if made up try looking into some. I believe I addressed your "PETAs not against pets claim" but if not I can continue, there is more.
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Male 1,239
And now for the part on pets...
"In the end, I think it would be lovely if we stopped this whole notion of pets altogether."
"Pet ownership is an absolutely abysmal situation brought about by human manipulation."
"I don’t use the word `pet.` I think it’s speciesist language. I prefer `companion animal.` For one thing, we would no longer allow breeding. People could not create different breeds. There would be no pet shops. If people had companion animals in their homes, those animals would have to be refugees from the animal shelters and the streets. You would have a protective relationship with them just as you would with an orphaned child. But as the surplus of cats and dogs (artificially engineered by centuries of forced breeding) declined, eventually companion animals would be phased out, and we would return to a more symbiotic relationship — enjoyment at a distance."
I dunno Madest, seems like they are pretty against p
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Male 7,378
I love all these ridiculous claims about the awfulness of PETA and their sinister deeds. PETA has made America a better place. They have brought animal abuse to the fore and our legal system has adjusted to accommodate these changes. Before PETA animal atrocities were merely frowned upon. Now they are against the law.
PETA`s not stealing peoples pets to burn in their secret animal smelter, they are exposing the abuse humans are capable of.
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Male 1,239
"I wish we all would get up and go into the labs and take the animals out or burn them down."
If we can`t free them, burn them. Sounds legit!
"Well, it’s not like this is anything we are trying to hide. About three times in our 21-year history we have thought it was a good idea — and still do — to defend some very good activists who have done some decent things for animals and who have happened to get into trouble. One of those people is Rodney Coronado, who is a very committed Native American animal rights activist and a decent person. He did something [firebombed a research facility at Michigan State University] that put him in prison for three-and-a-half years and I think that if we hadn’t provided him with a good legal defence he wouldn’t be back out doing productive things in the community again — like the good person that he is. We are very happy to have done that."
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Male 1,239
"We are opposed to all cruelty, so as advocates of non-violence, opponents of oppression, people who abhor the cruelty inherent in slaughtering we say the only ethical way to consume flesh is to pick up the carcass of an animal who has died naturally or been killed accidentally, say by being hit by a car, and eat that."
"There is no hidden agenda. If anybody wonders about — what’s this with all these reforms — you can hear us clearly. Our goal is total animal liberation."
That sure sounds like no pets to me Madest?
"I am not a morose person, but I would rather not be here. I don’t have any reverence for life, only for the entities themselves. I would rather see a blank space where I am. This will sound like fruitcake stuff again but at least I wouldn’t be harming anything"
"I’m not only uninterested in having children. I am opposed to having children. Having a purebred human baby is like having a pur
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Male 1,239
I`m all for animal welfare but PETA are terrorists, liars, and animal destroyers. Here in Norfolk near there HQ they got caught friving an unmarked black panel van and telling local shelters that were full that they had room for the animals and then put them down en route to the next shelter where they`d dump the bodies into various dumpsters. One of the most funded groups to fight "For" animals and they save what, 3%? Their leader has said flat out that PETAs end goal is NO pets, NO meat eating, NO intentional human interactions with animals. Psychos not deserving of a penny.
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Female 674
Power to PETA. Orcas, dolphins, etc. literally get shanghai`d into these awful institutions while their families back home get murdered and eaten.
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Male 371
If peta sues for slavery, I want them convicted of murder for all the animals they put down.
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Female 195
In many cases in history where great change in attitudes towards certain groups of society happen (women`s rights and black slavery for example) there are four stages - denial, mockery, anger and acceptance. I see a healthy spread of all four stages in the posts of this thread.

It is pleasing to see these emotions because it means change is happening for the better.
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Female 412
As much as PETA are a little extreme, I, having spent a lot of time doing an assignment on the topic of whales and dolphins in captivity during my zoology degree, have actually come to the conclusion that sea world is an abysmal place for the cetartiodactyla. They get their animals from illegal fishermen in places such as Japan, and their "Shamu" lasts a year or two before it dies and is replaced by a new "Shamu", among other atrocities. Before I had done that assignment I would have gone and enjoyed the trip, now I will never go to somewhere like seaworld.
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Male 2,085
P.S. Mr. Orange is either trolling or he is dumbazz! Take your pick.
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Male 2,085
Repeating a comment I read elsewhere, if the whales are to given the same legal rights as humans, then the orca in Orlando that killed its trainer should be tried for murder.
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Male 39,921

MrOrange - would you like a lozenge?

The Constition was written by people and for people. Clearly stated in the preamble. "We the PEOPLE .... to OURSELVES and our POSTERITY" not to ourselves and our farm animals.

They are called "Inalienable HUMAN rights" for a reason, but if you personally want to extend them to animals, then you better go Vegan or your are benefiting from slavery.
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Male 347
so.... Mr.Orange is saying that eventually we will all agree that dolphins are human. is that it?
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Male 146
PETA= People Eating Tasty Animals
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Male 238
Peta just wants attention
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Male 7,378
[quote]PETA thinks even having house pets is wrong.[/quote] -----------
No they don`t. Perhaps they are against non-domesticated animals as house pets but not dogs and cats.
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Male 2,419
*cough* *cough* Oh and Gerry sweety,
selling slaves was condoned by the church based on the argument that black people had no soul and therefore where not human.. *cough*
the extermination of jews was legal becuase the nazi german law didn`t class that as humans.
*cough* women were/are seen as less then a man and thefore had less rights..
i could go on and on.. but hey, have some of this peace pipe man....
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Male 2,419
@gerry1of1

Yess it can! (does bob the builder voice)
“ Section 1. Neither slavery nor involuntary servitude, except as a punishment for crime whereof the party shall have been duly convicted, shall exist within the United States, or any place subject to their jurisdiction.
Section 2. Congress shall have power to enforce this article by appropriate legislation.” (13th amendment)

if you think it can`t then that`s your personal opinion, which gives me the freedom to say that in my personal opinion it is.
Now i Am going to smoke that green stuff..
Peace out...

^-_-^
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Male 2,419
@LillianDulci

Do you think that putting a fishy which swims (as i read) up to 100 miles a day, that has social skills, lives in a pack, communicates with those pack members and relatives and seems to have an "identity" in a small (relative) concrete pool, to perfom tricks for costumers so that a company can make money is slavery or not?
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Male 525
Stupid lawsuit. If the first judge they encounter doesn`t throw it out of the courtroom a nanosecond into it, I lose faith in humanity.

EVERY animal species survives by consuming life before it; humans are no exception. We need to exploit animals to eat and to run experiments on to improve medicine. Rights make sure that rational beings (humans) can coexist peacefully; they exist so that we can live and trade without morally killing each other. To say that animals have rights would be to abridge the rights of humans.

Keep in mind that the animals rights people aren`t against unnecessary torture of animals per se; they think humans should not be allowed to use animals to make their lives better.

This is a group that doesn`t love animals, but hates humanity.
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Male 39,921

[quote]"it CAN BE viewed as slavery" [/quote]
No, it can`t. "Slavery" is the purchase and sale of human being.
Utilizing animals, for labor on a farm, for transportation, or for entertainment is not the same thing. They are property, not people.

How far do you take that silly idea? You can`t own them? Okay, no whales. How about dogs? They`re intelligent and we use them for service and entertainment all the time. Would let all the dogs roam free too?
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Male 2,419
Madduck, from the arguments you use i assume you read Peter Singer?

as for "ignoring the issue" by someone
it`s a neat trick to avoid having to think about and answer a point.
you diffuse and obscure the point swing the argument over to something else, and you can get away with not saying anything. (politicians are great at it) formulate a yes no question, if that is followed with a "but.." and they swing away again then you basicly made your point.
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Female 8,055
Well- it can easily be taken as slavery- and in many case it actually is- BUT the degree of sentience must dictate how cruel such treatment actually is. Dogs evolved alongside us so they are probably fine with it, cats are highly bred to be our companions and do not suffer. Chickens mostly DO suffer a lot.....
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Female 8,055
There is a body of evidence to suggest that whales in captivity are hugely stressed- deliberate mistreatment is not necessary. Keeping your wife and child in a cupboard believind they are ok and at least they are safe and you love them does not make it okay- like wise whales.
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Female 2,674
Some of the responders seem to be taking my posts as if I hold that opinion. I`m stating that it CAN BE viewed as slavery, not that I view it as such. PETA is insane and wants no one to have house pets, so I would not be surprised if THEY think of having house pets as slavery. Or riding a horse as slavery. Or using chickens for their eggs as slavery. etc
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Male 2,419
@Kain1

Great point man, but really.. how long have we know that people are dying of famine, disease and war and what has been done about that? how long have we know about sweatshops and other non nice workplaces? or acsess to health, education, etc etc? it`s easy to point out that there may be other priorities, but when are you going to get of your ass and do something about them? until you do.. stop calling people stupid.
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Male 1,231
As far as this law suit goes; can PETA prove that the Orcas are unhappy in their environment at sea world? Is there evidence of mistreatment/poor conditions? I think relating it to slavery is a gimmic to get publicity for PETA, and maybe to get people back on their side after it emerged that PETA killed 95% of adoptable pets in its care in 2008...
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Male 1,231
@Apexs; the pyramids weren`t build by slaves, they were built by skilled craftsman. As Commentator said, educate yourself then come back.

@LillianDulci; Dogs are put on a lead for their own safety. My dog is treated like a member of the family, and to keep her safe, she goes on a lead (sometimes) As for `doing tricks`, she enjoys it and sees it as a game and valuable interaction between two friends.
As for chickens; there is nothing wrong with keeping an animal comfortable, free from predators and free from disease whilst collecting something they naturally produce. Then killing them for food, as the food chain dictates. Aside from anything else, chickens develop a whole host of diseases/ailements once they stop laying eggs. For the record I only buy organic eggs and am against battery farming/caged hens.
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Male 2,419
@LillianDulci

Why yess it does open a can of worm doesn`t it?
i think that it the most valua gained from this excersize by peta. it brings back the arguments from the abolishment of slavery, suffragettes and some others..
in regards to dogs being on a leash, if that is for the safety of the dog (walking through traffic)then it is not slavery, retards are guided through traffic as wel and this is not considerd to be cruel.
tying your dog to a leash in the yard with no shade is, the same goes for tying up a retard when at home. do you see the differnce?
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Female 8,055
Ok- so you ignore the issue about Whales and focus on what you dislike about PETA? That is not a decent way to make any case at all.
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Female 2,674
madest, CAN BE viewed. PETA thinks even having house pets is wrong. Also, not just dogs. What about cats? House cats that stay inside are restricted from going outside even if they want to [unlike dogs, who are able to go out, but are most often restricted by a fence/leash]. Cats that are allowed to roam outside have a much shorter life expectancy [I remember hearing "5 years" on average]. Let them run free and they could die sooner, keep them inside and it CAN BE viewed as slavery. A house can be viewed as a large cage if creatures aren`t allowed to leave. How about birds? They usually stay in small cages but are occasionally let out. What about fishes and turtles and snakes? Usually in tiny containers, not able to roam free.
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Male 1,216
I do not like PeTA. But I do agree that SeaWorld should learn to treat it`s animals.
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Female 8,055
The objection to chickens laying eggs is a) the conditions they are kept in and b) the fact they are slaughtered after two years as their productivity goes down. Not painlessly either- often they are just fed into a wood chipper. Do now get me started on agribusiness and animal welfare...
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Male 7,378
[quote]Also, I`d bring up how nearly every human interaction with animals can be viewed as slavery.[/quote]
---------------
Well that`s a nonsense argument if I ever heard one. Dogs are mans creation. They desire to be by man`s side. They are not bred in captivity to live a life in a cage. They are for the most part free.
Of course some dog owners are better than others and some people abuse their authority over dogs and when that happens law enforcement can step in to make things right.
That cannot be done with an Orca.

Logic Fail.
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Female 8,055
cost benefit analysis is attempting to put a monetary worth on things in an attempt to `weigh them up. It has problems with its efficacity in any case- but even if I take you to mean that you are weighing this on strictly utilitarian grounds there are faults. Whales are very likely, as are many other species, higher functioning than many humans. So- what is the `thing` that we use to give rights? what is it about retarded or vegative humans that allows them freedoms we will not allow to say- apes?
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Female 2,674
Also, I`d bring up how nearly every human interaction with animals can be viewed as slavery. Teaching a dog to do tricks and not letting it roam freely without a leash. Riding a horse or a camel. Having chickens lay eggs for you, etc. But then I remember that PETA is pretty much against all of that.
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Female 2,674
Why does PETA hate orcas so much? "Stupid tricks"? Those are talented orcas! If they could understand English, you would have hurt their feelings. Shame on you PETA!
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Male 25,416
ha lame...
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Male 3,646
SpongeBob is entertaining! I demand that he be freed because he has near human intelligence. I would also move that he be granted the right to vote.
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Male 2,419
@gerry1of1

whoops, just posted the second lot before i read your reply, could have saved me some typing!)

well.. i always take you seriously? (thats not gonna hold up is it)

probably because i have been witness/ took part in debates of this nature quite a lot so i already went ahead and took you serious.. sorry about that, i`ll try not to do that again!
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Male 2,419
.. shouldn`t and this created quite a backlash of outrage.
which leads to a question proposed by a few animal liberationist (and a few other professions)
name one quality that _all_ humans have which non-humans do not. if you find one that you feel pretty sure about that can`t be counterd, let me know!

3: "We need to keep things in their natural order with HUMANS at the top of the food chain!"
the use of the term natural is tricky. i can hop on a plane, does that mean i am bird? but i can fly right? with only the use of our body and mind. then no, we are not the top of the foodchain. if you beg to differ then demonstrate so being going to the kenyian bush with nothin but some clothes and see how long you last.. i could name a few other places too.

Happy reality hunting!
(btw i`n not gunning for a debate here, or a slinging match, just pointing out a few things)
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Male 303
Animals have no rights. And they shouldn`t. That`s not to say that it is morally ok to purposefully injure or hurt an animal. But slavery is a go!
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Male 39,921

@ MrOrange - It`s not an arguement, it`s satire.

satire (n): trenchant wit, irony, or sarcasm used to expose and discredit vice or folly

Orange, my man, how could you take a phrase like "wet-back humpback" seriously?
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Male 2,841
Remember when PETA was a respectable organization that actually stood for something? Yeah, me neither.
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Male 2,419
I`d say Peta is making clever use of the law, most likely to create a public debat over what "rights"
sentience beings have. finaly an action from peta i can get behind.

@gerry1of1, dude we need to stop meeting like this! you basicly shot your own argument down:
"Being given the rights of a human but not having the full intelligence of humans, whales would have to be treated as retards"

1: they don`t mention that they should get the same rights as humans. just that their "condition" is akin to slavery and that they should be returned to their natural habitat.

2: your argument about human intelligence leaves you wide open for the counter argument: at what level of intellegence do you need to be to be considerd human? and what if you do not meet that level? you basicly answered that by mentioning retards. do we give them the same rights as "humans" or not? there are plenty of examples where ppl thought they shoul
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Male 2,424
Peta-
"I wuz tolld by wayl it wunt go bak to spase!"


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Male 809
There is nothing ethical about peta. They kill over 90% of the animals they "save".
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Male 355
@ Commentator: wow i didn`t know you where there to manage to work force of all the Egyptian people back in 2530bc. Granted it has been found that JEWISH slaves did not build the Pyramids. It never said that the pyramids where not built by a slave force. It is well know that the Pharaoh`s at the time did in fact have slaves. Learn to "Educate" yourself before making half shot comments.
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Male 1,471
@Madduck - I don`t really see the ethical dilemma here?.. (i take dilemma as meaning a choice where it is nearly impossible to figure out which option is best) There is a fixed and limited amount of resources available for doing good things.. I think we can agree that the goal is to do as much good as possible with these resources?.. How do we find out how to do that ?.. Cost-benefit analysis.. Freeing orcas, although a noble goal, has a pretty low cost benefit ratio, where as providing clean drinking water for all human beings, and condoms for AIDS-prevention have very high cost-benefit ratios.. I`m not saying that one shouldn`t free the orcas.. i`m just saying that, purely rationally, it should be a low priority..
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Male 39,921
If whales have the same rights as people, can they vote? Obviously the answer is "no" because the whales were not born in US waters! They are illegal aliens taking jobs from American dolphins! No doubt PeTA wants them granted amnesty but I say we need an underwater fence to keep these `wet-back` humpbacks out.

Being given the rights of a human but not having the full intelligence of humans, whales would have to be treated as retards. The next thing you know PeTA will have entered orcas in the swim events at the Special Olympics and get them jobs stocking shelves at WalMart.

In our compassion for animals let`s not lose sight of reality. Here in America whales are wonderful, smart animals. And in Japan they are a tasty treat served with rice. We need to keep things in their natural order with HUMANS at the top of the food chain!


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Male 270
Peta is a great organization, I particularly love their nude posters and consciousness raising campaigns.
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Male 270
The pyramids were NOT built by slaves, educate yourself and then come back.
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Female 8,055
Kain1- cost benefit analysis has real problems in solving ethical problems..... this is just a case of speciesism.
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Male 2,694
Does this mean I`m facing a murder charge every time I go fishing?
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Male 2,440
PETA is for goddamn idiots.
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Male 1,471
Stupid people are stupid.. There may be some truth to their claim `cause lets face it, orcas are clever bastards.. But as with most things, one should really make a cost-benefit analysis.. Spend years and millions on freeing 5 whales that are living comfortably, although confined lives.. Or spend the same amount of time and money bringing clean water and other necessities to millions upon millions of human beings living on the brink of existance.. Once we`ve fixed that, THEN they can free as many whales as they want..
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Female 8,055
Perfectly reasonable, there is ample evidence that whale have a high intelligence and form social bonds- to deny them rights we accord to humans with less intelligence or abilty to from such bonds is illogical. Perhaps this will not work ( although it should ) at least it opens discussion.
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Male 355
This popped in to my head as soon as i read the head line.

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Male 39,921

I`m not taking sides, just posing a question for thought...

If whales cannot be taught to do trick, what about your dog? Is your dog endentured? Is a service dog for the blind a slave?

I`m gonna get some kugel, talk amongst yourselves.
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Male 1,292
PeTA the for profit organization that will do what it takes to constantly keep in the public eye, capitalism at its most basic. Even bad publicity is publicity. Waffles.
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Male 39,921

here is what STEPHEN COLBERT had to say about this.
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Male 7,378
Nothing "stupid" about fighting for rights of those incapable of fighting for themselves. We are well aware that whales are evolved. PETA`s actions may seem extreme but they need to be to make a point. Dogs were once considered merely property and now courts see them as much more thanks to PETA`s actions.
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Male 5,811
I dislike PeTA. They are quite extremist, some of their goals are noble enough, but they take things too far.
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Male 39,921
Link: PeTA Sues Seaworld For What? Slavery? [Rate Link] - Is PeTA waging a stupid law suit or are they Orca Emancipators? Let the debate begin!
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