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Category: Games
Date: 05/25/11 07:46 AM

65 Responses to Video Games As Art: The Great Debate

  1. Profile photo of cobrakiller
    cobrakiller Male 18-29
    7470 posts
    May 24, 2011 at 4:12 pm
    Link: Video Games As Art: The Great Debate - The NEA has decided to give grants to independent game developers in the name of art. What do you guys think?
  2. Profile photo of Angelmassb
    Angelmassb Male 18-29
    15511 posts
    May 25, 2011 at 7:55 am
    W...T....F!
  3. Profile photo of Ripper398
    Ripper398 Male 18-29
    1310 posts
    May 25, 2011 at 8:04 am
    I would gladly pay the 40 extra cents for video games, seeing my taxes are already wasted on stupid programs and other crap I don`t want to pay for or don`t agree with.
  4. Profile photo of Cajun247
    Cajun247 Male 18-29
    10732 posts
    May 25, 2011 at 8:14 am
    Should be given federal money

    NO!

    Seriously it was private investments that made that game great.
  5. Profile photo of spultra13
    spultra13 Male 18-29
    174 posts
    May 25, 2011 at 8:14 am
    So great how they just continue to play distracting, loud clips of COD while the guy is talking and trying to explain that games like COD and GTA will NOT be receiving funding.
  6. Profile photo of Twospike
    Twospike Male 30-39
    5 posts
    May 25, 2011 at 8:17 am
    I don`t see why they shouldn`t. Games nowadays are very cinematic and have an indepth plot like films and a progressive story line, not only that, a lot of the time they also have a massive musical score. It`s just another form of art in my opinion. Just take a look at the new Elder Scrolls game, it`s been in developement for years just as a new album or film would be.
  7. Profile photo of Cajun247
    Cajun247 Male 18-29
    10732 posts
    May 25, 2011 at 8:18 am
    Wait a minute...

    Aren`t we already doing this?
    I used to play games like the Oregon Trail when I went to school.

    The NEA however was talking strictly about educational video games such as the above mentioned. Bringing up CoD: Black Ops brings the whole discussion out of context.
  8. Profile photo of Cajun247
    Cajun247 Male 18-29
    10732 posts
    May 25, 2011 at 8:22 am
    Before we all go spending MORE money, research must be done first. Video games can definitely grab and hold attention, the question is which ones can really educate.

    Answer that question first and then we can make investments.
  9. Profile photo of Webz
    Webz Male 18-29
    542 posts
    May 25, 2011 at 8:31 am
    If movies are allowed art status I think video games should be as well.

    Just like movies, there are plenty of big mindless, blow-em-up`s which carry no real value in terms of content other than pure entertainment, but then, just like movies, there are tons of overlooked jems which show real creativity and innovation.

    Video games have the potentiality to carry strong political and social commitments, educational value, and can be used as a form of self-expression on the developers part (as evidenced by the "Colour my..." series of online flash games), just like movies and even literature. On top of that, video games can be used to develop more physical skills as users actively participate in the experience, which in a way transcends the experience of film. There is no doubt that video games should be considered `art`....
  10. Profile photo of Ant0n
    Ant0n Male 18-29
    761 posts
    May 25, 2011 at 8:31 am
    Educational games? Really? Whatever happened to books?
  11. Profile photo of Webz
    Webz Male 18-29
    542 posts
    May 25, 2011 at 8:33 am
    ....the debate then is whether video games should receive funding as an art.

    I think if you disagree with funding video games because it is not an urgent priority in our current economic condition, in order to keep your argument consistent and logical, you should also be against funding film, music and many other forms of entertainment arts.
  12. Profile photo of chickiesue86
    chickiesue86 Male 70 & Over
    273 posts
    May 25, 2011 at 8:39 am
    of course they should not get tax payer dollars, they make their money by selling the games. if these games are going to be free for every tax payer that would maybe be a different story, but i doubt it would play out that way.
  13. Profile photo of AngryYouth
    AngryYouth Male 18-29
    734 posts
    May 25, 2011 at 8:44 am
    Videogames are art and they can be educational. Enough said!
  14. Profile photo of TwoEyezBlind
    TwoEyezBlind Male 18-29
    483 posts
    May 25, 2011 at 8:52 am
    I believe taxes should be arranged differently. When you`re 18 you should be given a pretty long mandatory checklist as "insurance". Do you ever plan on buying a video game? Yes. Then taxes are taken and you get a game at 50% off. If you pick no, you pay the $60 every time. Do you ever plan on having children and sending them to a piblic school? Yes. Taxes are taken, your kids go for free. Pick no, you pay a tuition. Pay $1,000 at any time, you can rearrange your checklist with the cost of a credit hit. How would this not be perfect? Instead of having communistic rules on taxes, everything is your choice.
  15. Profile photo of LazyMe484
    LazyMe484 Male 18-29
    10441 posts
    May 25, 2011 at 8:59 am
    Wow. How utterly stupid is this.

    But then it`s Fox News so it`s expected. Then again, usually I feel the need to call them out it.

    Not this time. Ridiculing this video is just too easy.. it should be self evident. Someone else do it.
  16. Profile photo of Justin9235
    Justin9235 Male 18-29
    1582 posts
    May 25, 2011 at 9:11 am
    The condescending guy was pretty much saying "look at what a flamboyant, animated dick I am" .. the debate wasn`t how much wasteful spending is going on.. just whether of not video games deserve funding.. and I agree that small indie game-makers should. I`ll tell you this right now, I`ve played video games my whole life, and have maybe read 2 books.. and I have a far superior vocabulary and intellect compared to my peers who just read. And I know I`m not the only person like this.
  17. Profile photo of ZsaZsaGoar
    ZsaZsaGoar Female 18-29
    144 posts
    May 25, 2011 at 9:55 am
    CoD is not an independent or educational game...
    but it`s okay, I prefer to make my decisions based on fear with the influence of flamboyant propaganda anyhow.
  18. Profile photo of human_exile
    human_exile Male 13-17
    875 posts
    May 25, 2011 at 10:16 am
    you can tell the bald guy rehearsed his speech
  19. Profile photo of SvampeBob
    SvampeBob Male 18-29
    3076 posts
    May 25, 2011 at 10:20 am
    hardcore gamer here, I love video games, but no games shouldn`t receive any government money. Gameing industry is a private industry, the dude in the suit knows what he is talking about.

    you are really pathetic America, stop listening to lazy, greedy and uneducated people! get your lazy ass out of MacDonalds and vote for a REAL president and not corrupt politicians, they are driving your country to bankrupcy.
  20. Profile photo of EntrE
    EntrE Male 18-29
    535 posts
    May 25, 2011 at 10:46 am
    bla bla bla bla bla bla bla......
  21. Profile photo of vVvBrock
    vVvBrock Male 18-29
    177 posts
    May 25, 2011 at 11:09 am
    Braid, Okami, and the Myst series. Anyone who does not think video games can be considered art should play these games and then let me know what you think.
  22. Profile photo of evanbartlett
    evanbartlett Male 30-39
    559 posts
    May 25, 2011 at 11:22 am
    "The NEA however was talking strictly about educational video games such as the above mentioned. Bringing up CoD: Black Ops brings the whole discussion out of context."

    You hit the nail on the head. That is what we call "manufactured outrage." Funding programs like Oregon Trail has nothing to do with CoD. But sure enough, it is CoD playing in the background of the entire video.

    A conversation about whether or not the arts should be funded would be a debate worth having, but the way the debate was structured wasn`t even misleading--it was inflammatory to the point of being simply factually inaccurate.
  23. Profile photo of cobrakiller
    cobrakiller Male 18-29
    7470 posts
    May 25, 2011 at 11:32 am
    Svampebob, you probably only play the kind of games that they say will not be supported by this if you think that games cannot be considered art. If money can go to teaching music, theater, and filmaking; than it should also go to other art forms such as video games. If they were not art, than the smithsonian should not have its "The Art of Video Games". just to be clear, here are a list of games that are or aren`t art.

    Ico: art
    CoD: not art
    Okami: art
    GTA: not art
    Braid: art
    Mortal Kombat: not art
    Legend of Zelda series: art
    Street Fighter: not art
    Shadow of the Collosus: art
    Halo: not art

    If you disagree with any of these, play them and then plead your case. If "black swan" can be art than so can "legend of zelda: ocarina of time", that is all i am say
  24. Profile photo of NitroJunkie
    NitroJunkie Male 70 & Over
    758 posts
    May 25, 2011 at 11:40 am
    It`s not how it looks, it`s how the game and game play match the story being told.
    And art is open to interpretation, so those smooth-brains that are trying to label this as art or that as art, don`t know art.
  25. Profile photo of nnotdead
    nnotdead Male 18-29
    139 posts
    May 25, 2011 at 11:50 am
    1.video game are art
    2.no money should be wasted on this
    3.the small amount of money being wasted on this is so small it`s almost not even worth bringing up. we need to come up with hundreds of billions of dollars in cuts and extra revenue, not a few million.
  26. Profile photo of Malakamike
    Malakamike Male 18-29
    52 posts
    May 25, 2011 at 11:53 am
    Svampebob, as an indie developer myself I can tell you it takes a lot of work to make a game. And maybe if you could actually spell gaming (not gameing) you could understand what it means to do something in life. And just maybe you got off your fat ass and stop using and playing American products then you could get the hardcore dick out you mouth to achieve something in life, and cobrakiller gta is art. All games are art, it takes years and 100s of hours to make a single game, a pong game I made uses over 2500 lines of code in directX, and what`s that saying "it`s not art if it doesn`t offend anyone." and this goes for everyone who is in a different country besides America and hates on us, just remember your president could of been hitler, your welcome for saving you and just remember that America leads in technology,science, and military so everything you use like your computer and the Internet was made by us "sitting on our lazy asses" go play WoW Svampebob becaus
  27. Profile photo of NitroJunkie
    NitroJunkie Male 70 & Over
    758 posts
    May 25, 2011 at 11:54 am
    Oh, wait- FEDERAL money? Now that I`ve watched the video, NO! Video games should NEVER, EVER receive federal money! I love games, and think they`re a great distraction, and they are certainly an art, but never should they ever receive federal monies. When that happens, the government will take over the game industry and stifle creativity.
  28. Profile photo of Webz
    Webz Male 18-29
    542 posts
    May 25, 2011 at 12:12 pm
    @Malakamike

    Shhhh...

    You`re making us Americans look very, very stupid.
  29. Profile photo of Cajun247
    Cajun247 Male 18-29
    10732 posts
    May 25, 2011 at 12:33 pm
    Halo: not art

    Why not? It`s epicness was on par with Star Wars for crying out loud.
  30. Profile photo of MrYouKnow
    MrYouKnow Male 13-17
    1081 posts
    May 25, 2011 at 12:49 pm
    Oh, Fox News. XD

    >Comparing a sport with a video game to justify it isn`t art.

    WTF. You need more artists than programmers to make most modern games.

    Seriously, some of my favorite games are brilliant masterpieces of art.

    Also, the kind of games that the dude is talking about to receive federal money is never explicitly described. If you`re disagreeing with him, then you don`t fully know what you`re disagreeing with.
  31. Profile photo of xiquiripat
    xiquiripat Male 18-29
    2422 posts
    May 25, 2011 at 1:21 pm
    Brought to you by the same idiots that confused Mass Effect with pornography. Seriously, the old people on fox shouldn`t even be allowed to talk about video games especially if they`ve never even played a video game.
  32. Profile photo of DuckBoy87
    DuckBoy87 Male 18-29
    3243 posts
    May 25, 2011 at 1:46 pm
    I would agree that certain video games are art. And I would agree to my taxes going to video games that are art. But there would have to be a criteria.
    Live soundtrack, eg live recording of real musician with acoustic instruments
    Independent developers, eg not Microsoft, Sony, Nintendo, Capcom unless...
    The games are free, which is possible as downloads now.
    Certain genres. FPSs are more about gameplay rather than gameplay, whereas RPGs are more about storytelling.
    Have some educational value. The perfect example to this is the Assassin`s Creed series. Though most of it is fictional, it`s set in real place during real events.
  33. Profile photo of Fatninja01
    Fatninja01 Male 30-39
    25420 posts
    May 25, 2011 at 1:48 pm
    wtf? whys should they get money, thats just a silly arguement
  34. Profile photo of cobrakiller
    cobrakiller Male 18-29
    7470 posts
    May 25, 2011 at 1:57 pm
    malakamike, GTA is art like "Transformers: Revenge of the Fallen" is an art. Art is really a matter of opinion, so we can argue this all day.

    cajun, see the argument above. It`s really all a matter of opinion. I don`t believe the storytelling within the halo games puts it in "art" territory. this is my opinion, and this is from somebody who has put quite a few hours into each of those games.
  35. Profile photo of Baelzar
    Baelzar Male 40-49
    1399 posts
    May 25, 2011 at 2:07 pm
    No. Not their money to give.
  36. Profile photo of korahn
    korahn Male 30-39
    1301 posts
    May 25, 2011 at 2:10 pm
    Remember, Fox News twists EVERYTHING. This is not to provide funds to ALL game (Call of Duty won`t be getting any) but games that are truly artistic.
  37. Profile photo of korahn
    korahn Male 30-39
    1301 posts
    May 25, 2011 at 2:11 pm
    besides, if film and television can be considered art, so can video games.
  38. Profile photo of madest
    madest Male 40-49
    7378 posts
    May 25, 2011 at 3:00 pm
    Wow. Any guy who can compare a form of art with ping pong has no credibility. The expert has no idea wtf he`s talking about. Way to go Fox.
  39. Profile photo of green_batman
    green_batman Female 18-29
    728 posts
    May 25, 2011 at 3:10 pm
    Video games can be art, but the NEA is a terrible idea and should be abolished. It encourages inferior art because anyone can get access to the funds, when only those who can make high quality art or art that is in-demand should be successful as artists. The same goes for video games, which is why the market should be the deciding factor in the success of a video game, not the government.
  40. Profile photo of GasMaskKid
    GasMaskKid Male 18-29
    694 posts
    May 25, 2011 at 3:24 pm
    Why is federal money being given to any form of art? Art doesn`t need money. You know what needs money? drating anything besides this. Buuuuuuuuut there`s no chance in hell this was ever a possibility, so screw it, let the bald guy rant if he has to.
  41. Profile photo of Kodyo
    Kodyo Male 18-29
    226 posts
    May 25, 2011 at 4:13 pm
    "Hey, I was a music major in college..."
    Yeah, that`s all i needed to hear for him to lose all credibility.
  42. Profile photo of Altaru
    Altaru Male 18-29
    3483 posts
    May 25, 2011 at 5:24 pm
    Honestly, while I do believe that video games are art, I don`t think any art should be funded by the government.

    Seriously, if you`re an "artist" and people aren`t purchasing your work, you suck as an artist, no matter how much you want to blame the audience (which is just a sign of being a terrible artist, by the way).

    If you`re a good artist, then someone will appreciate your skills and you will receive your funding the good old fashioned way: someone will pay you to use them.

    If not, well... I don`t see why we should all be forced to support you.

    BTW: F*CK IAB AND THIS F*CKING TOOLBAR. Jeez, I can`t even hit the pause/play button without the f*cking "Drag to share" things popping up.
  43. Profile photo of gyro231995
    gyro231995 Male 13-17
    35 posts
    May 25, 2011 at 5:33 pm
    14.3 trillion in debt and the government wants to give grants to people who make games like The Impossible Game? No thanks.
  44. Profile photo of Altaru
    Altaru Male 18-29
    3483 posts
    May 25, 2011 at 5:38 pm
    Ico: art
    CoD: not art
    Okami: art
    GTA: not art
    Braid: art
    Mortal Kombat: not art
    Legend of Zelda series: art
    Street Fighter: not art
    Shadow of the Collosus: art
    Halo: not art

    Unfortunately, Cobra, I`m going to have to disagree with your "not" judgements.

    CoD and Halo are like movies you interact with. CoD shows war through the eyes of the soldiers, like Band of Brothers or Saving Private Ryan.

    Halo has an epic narrative and story to unfold as you`re playing. Have you actually checked out the whole canon story-line? Not to mention, the music and visuals are gorgeous.

    Of course, like with movies, there are people who watch/play for the "pretty graphics and shooting things," but that doesn`t mean it`s not art.

    (cont.)
  45. Profile photo of Altaru
    Altaru Male 18-29
    3483 posts
    May 25, 2011 at 5:45 pm
    GTA is (and this might be a little confusing) like a painting, in a way.

    It`s a massive canvas city just set out for you to explore and observe. Sure, you can coat the walls and streets with blood, but part of paintings is how you interpret what`s going on and what your own imagination does with it. Like looking at the Mona Lisa and wondering why she`s smiling (you know, aside from "because you`re supposed to smile when you`re modeling, unless the artist says otherwise").

    The only difference is, in GTA, you get to take what you`re imagining, and put it directly on the canvas.

    It`s also a parody of movies and pop culture these days, so I guess I could mention that too.

    As for Mortal Kombat and Street Fighter... Well, I guess you could say I see fighting games as more of a lazy man`s sport than art, kind of like racing games. So I guess you`re right on with those two.
  46. Profile photo of cobrakiller
    cobrakiller Male 18-29
    7470 posts
    May 25, 2011 at 5:53 pm
    altaru, thats why i said it is all opinion. I personally found the halo story pretty weak and lacking, but many people love it. I never went outside the game for any of the story though, which is probably why it never really grew on me. I do see what you are saying with GTA though, but good luck finding somebody outside of the gaming community to agree with GTA being art.

    as for the toolbar, have you tried to hide it? all the way on the right of the bar, you can hit the double arrow down to hide it. It never bothered me after i did this.
  47. Profile photo of cobrakiller
    cobrakiller Male 18-29
    7470 posts
    May 25, 2011 at 5:59 pm
    I just realized I should probably elaborate more on what I said about art being an "opinion". what is an artform is not an opinion; music, theatre, painting, sculpting, performance, film, video games, etc. These are all art forms. But within each artform are pieces that people will have their opinion on whether or not that piece in particular is truly art.
    I for one am not a fan of most "modern art" and think that most of it is just a mess that people decide to call art, and honestly I believe most of the "artists" know it. but, each of these pieces that I dont necessarily consider art are within the realm of these listed artforms.

    so, in conclusion: although video games are an artform, i dont believe all video games are art. Just like drawing/painting is an artform, but every scribble is not necessarily a piece worthy of an exhibit.

    does this get my point across better?
  48. Profile photo of Altaru
    Altaru Male 18-29
    3483 posts
    May 25, 2011 at 6:02 pm
    I do see what you are saying with GTA though, but good luck finding somebody outside of the gaming community to agree with GTA being art.
    Yeah, you have a point there. Everyone outside the gaming community sees it as "THAT HORRIBLE MURDER SIMULATOR!"

    as for the toolbar, have you tried to hide it?
    Yeah, I hid the main bar at the bottom, but still over-top of the actual video, this little black bar that says "drag to share" comes right across the pause/play button and time bar. It makes it a pain in the ass to replay something I missed or pause so I can do something else.
  49. Profile photo of Altaru
    Altaru Male 18-29
    3483 posts
    May 25, 2011 at 6:06 pm
    so, in conclusion: although video games are an artform, i dont believe all video games are art. Just like drawing/painting is an artform, but every scribble is not necessarily a piece worthy of an exhibit.

    does this get my point across better?
    Yeah, I see your point there.

    Which is why (coming in a very roundabout way back to the original topic at hand) I don`t like the idea of government funding for art PERIOD.
  50. Profile photo of ledzeppeloyd
    ledzeppeloyd Male 18-29
    2385 posts
    May 25, 2011 at 6:06 pm
    the government wants to support it because its pretty much propaganda. the day i got modern warfare two, an army recruiter sent me an e-mail. coincidence? no drating way.
  51. Profile photo of cobrakiller
    cobrakiller Male 18-29
    7470 posts
    May 25, 2011 at 7:10 pm
    altaru, im sorry about your issue with the "drag to share" thing. I noticed when i checked, but it is always above the window and out of my way. Im not sure on how to fix that problem.

    ledzeppeloyd, i think you may be reading a little too much into that. besides, modern warfare wont be seeing a dime of that money.
  52. Profile photo of cobrakiller
    cobrakiller Male 18-29
    7470 posts
    May 25, 2011 at 7:12 pm
    oh, and i just realized that this video doesnt really get the message across very well. the NEA is planning on funding independent developers making educational games. The money may also be used in programs to teach people the trade. Its not just going to companies to make games, but to make games for the specific cause of teaching.
  53. Profile photo of Batmanners
    Batmanners Male 18-29
    4006 posts
    May 25, 2011 at 8:55 pm
    Yes they are artful, no they are not art. Art is not to be sold in large quantities. Art is self-expression. If you`re making an artsy movie, you go to indy film festivals. You don`t go to Hollywood. If you make artsy music, you play very select gigs, you don`t move to Los Angeles to work with a famous agent who will make you rich. If you want to make ANYTHING ARTFUL, don`t sell-out, ever.

    Video games are:
    1. An industry
    2. Entertainement

    Yes they may have the artful values within them, characters with blahblahblah and a desolate battlefield on a distant planet with music blahbnlahblah... It`s produced en masse for the sole purpose of making somebody rich, the only reason it looks, sounds and feels good is because it helps sales.

    I don`t care if Bioware (Mass Effect, Dragon Age) makes a nice game because they care for the art, I don`t care if Valve (Half-Life, Team Fortress, Portal) is the nicest blahblahblah... My point stands that art shoul
  54. Profile photo of varietyweasl
    varietyweasl Male 18-29
    35 posts
    May 25, 2011 at 9:00 pm
    The education industry has a plethora of competitors producing a range of software, all the big players have invested already, and there is a vibrant cottage industry too. Governments already pay a fortune for schools` ICT and thats only going to continue, so why waste money on this?
  55. Profile photo of Batmanners
    Batmanners Male 18-29
    4006 posts
    May 25, 2011 at 9:02 pm
    My point stands that art should not be exploited for profit.

    I do agree that some games are truly made as artful pieces. Like Limbo and Lucidity. To allow any video game company to receive a grant would allow all games to receive a grant, because who is to say what is artul in a game and what is not. Modern Warfare games aren`t pieces of art to me, they are realistic, but not artful as far as the medium of video gaming goes.

    If truly artsy games get grants then so do every yearly sports games and that is bullpoo and I would rather see a starving artist than to see the sports industry profit from my favorite medium even more.

    I hate sports and I don`t care who knows.
  56. Profile photo of OldOllie
    OldOllie Male 60-69
    15841 posts
    May 25, 2011 at 9:05 pm
    All taxpayer-funded subsidies for art should be abolished. Good art doesn`t need it; bad art doesn`t deserve it.
  57. Profile photo of i-am-ninja
    i-am-ninja Male 18-29
    142 posts
    May 25, 2011 at 10:49 pm
    @Batmanners

    That just makes you a hipster
  58. Profile photo of lyonartime
    lyonartime Male 18-29
    260 posts
    May 25, 2011 at 11:07 pm
    I have mixed feelings about this, as I`m sure many of you do. Games mix Art with economics since they`re so costly to produce, and often the pendulum will swing toward one side or another based on the intent of the developer. I find it analogous to architecture, in a sense. They both can contain great beauty, but both are made for a specific purpose. Every building is not art, but buildings CAN be art, and the exact moment it crosses the line is hard to discern.

    As long as these subsidies are given to the right people, (struggling indie developers) I have no problem with it. Offsetting the massive costs of making a game can allow developers to focus less on sales and more on their intended message. Just keep the money out of the hands of EA and the like.

    Honestly, the most beneficial element to all of this news exposure is the slow movement of games toward the "Art" title, not just in the eyes of critics, but in the eyes of the common man as well. Only the
  59. Profile photo of Altaru
    Altaru Male 18-29
    3483 posts
    May 26, 2011 at 12:02 am
    If you`re making an artsy movie, you go to indy film festivals. You don`t go to Hollywood. If you make artsy music, you play very select gigs, you don`t move to Los Angeles to work with a famous agent who will make you rich. If you want to make ANYTHING ARTFUL, don`t sell-out, ever.
    So, what? Just because you make something people enjoy and enjoy some modicum of success and popularity for it, it can`t be art and you can`t be an artist?

    Your definition basically means that the woman who paints with her vomit is an artist, because she`s "expressing herself" all over the canvas, while Michelangelo isn`t, since he was successful and made some of his works on commission.

    Stop talking out of your ass.
  60. Profile photo of Batmanners
    Batmanners Male 18-29
    4006 posts
    May 26, 2011 at 5:10 am
    I don`t understand the hipster comment...

    Artists can make art for a living as Michaelangelo did when he was comissionned to make a piece. What the video game companies are doing is not art, it`s business, completely different.

    If Michaelangelo made 60,000 identical pieces of art to sell to the masses for pure profit, I`m sure your idea of what is and what isn`t art would suit my perspective. Yes he`s selling 60,000 pieces of art, but what is the point of giving someone money so he can make money?

    Indy game devs should be the only ones who can receive the grant, as many of them make an effort to make a good artful game. The rest of them are in it for money, especially true for Activision who simply copy+paste their receipe for money into video games.

    The CEO of Activision businessman, not a gamer, and it shows in the way they have handled every major title in their inventory in the past 5 years. No major improvements, no risk, no love, no soul.
  61. Profile photo of Batmanners
    Batmanners Male 18-29
    4006 posts
    May 26, 2011 at 5:13 am
    "So, what? Just because you make something people enjoy and enjoy some modicum of success and popularity for it, it can`t be art and you can`t be an artist? "

    No, I`m saying that if you want to be artful, you don`t sell out to become successful. The Beatles made it rich and famous by believing in what they do and doing it well. Backstreet Boys were created in a marketing meeting.
  62. Profile photo of cobrakiller
    cobrakiller Male 18-29
    7470 posts
    May 26, 2011 at 6:07 am
    batmanners, you dont seem to get how this really works. the money would go to indie developers. developers are the artists. when it comes to the business aspect, that would be the publisher, the ones who put the money into the game being mass produced.

    to use altaru`s reasoning, the developer would be michelangelo (the artist), while the publisher would be the person who commissions them to make the art.

    it is only after the art is originally produced that the publisher takes the developers work and mass produces it. there are thousands of re-creations of masterful artworks (stary night, the screamer, david, mona lisa, etc.) all around the world. just because they become mass produced doesnt mean the original work isnt art.
  63. Profile photo of taelmx
    taelmx Female 18-29
    247 posts
    May 26, 2011 at 6:08 am
    $200,000 is NOTHING compared to what major commercial game developers spend on a single release. Besides that, any games that are getting funding are not going to be designed around a business strategy or trying to pull a profit, but rather independent developers that have a project that will more than likely be for educational or artistic value. The debate isn`t about whether games are art or not, they are.
  64. Profile photo of sbeelz
    sbeelz Male 30-39
    2868 posts
    May 26, 2011 at 3:33 pm
    If video games are art, then A Link to the Past is a Masterpiece!
  65. Profile photo of Morbidius
    Morbidius Male 18-29
    56 posts
    May 26, 2011 at 3:45 pm
    Fair and balanced my ass. F*ck you Fox news. Obviously trying to skew the issue by opening up with `should tax-payer dollars pay for call of duty?` while showing scenes of violence from the game.

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