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Date: 04/29/11 11:16 AM

118 Responses to Is This How To Deal With Police?

  1. Profile photo of kitteh9lives
    kitteh9lives Female 70 & Over
    8033 posts
    April 29, 2011 at 11:01 am
    Link: Is This How To Deal With Police? - Man stands his ground with this officer. Should he be arrested or is he within his rights?
  2. Profile photo of tatthi
    tatthi Male 13-17
    95 posts
    April 29, 2011 at 11:27 am
    The filmer is an ass
  3. Profile photo of mrrossh
    mrrossh Male 18-29
    74 posts
    April 29, 2011 at 11:33 am
    The guy shouldn`t have jumped the red light in the first place - Personally I would have just apologised and waited for the ticket, then again I obey the rules of the road, so this would not have happened to me.
  4. Profile photo of TeamVenture
    TeamVenture Male 18-29
    59 posts
    April 29, 2011 at 11:34 am
    within his rights. brilliant. man do I love to watch police stumble over their words and contradict themselves multiple times in a single interaction. kudos to the man for knowing his rights.
  5. Profile photo of collegebound
    collegebound Male 18-29
    3745 posts
    April 29, 2011 at 11:35 am
    now this guy is just being a douche...
  6. Profile photo of Norsak
    Norsak Male 18-29
    161 posts
    April 29, 2011 at 11:36 am
    He`s just being difficult for the sake of being an ass.
  7. Profile photo of Listypoos
    Listypoos Male 40-49
    3069 posts
    April 29, 2011 at 11:37 am
    If you are being reported for an offence then you do have to give your name or they can arrest you. If it`s just a stop and search record then you don`t and they`ll just write your description on the form.

    The copper didn`t do bad until the end when his frustration got to him. Nothing the copper said was wrong though - he didn`t have to quote verbatim the law at the time of arrest if he chose to arrest him.
  8. Profile photo of GRadde
    GRadde Male 18-29
    2556 posts
    April 29, 2011 at 11:37 am
    Beaurocracy at it`s finest. However, this would not work in Sweden, as you, as a citizen, are obliged to know the law, or so I`ve been told numerous times. It`s an interesting turning of the tables. I don`t think that would work in the `States though, there seems to be a bit to much hairpicking concerning the law there than here. Just an impression I get.
  9. Profile photo of kevin30462
    kevin30462 Male 18-29
    2 posts
    April 29, 2011 at 11:44 am
    ya he broke the law but he should have just been given a warning (if anything). kudos to this guy for being a great arguer when the po po continue to be ignorant
  10. Profile photo of Buiadh
    Buiadh Male 30-39
    6739 posts
    April 29, 2011 at 11:51 am
    What a dick.

    Its times like this that I wish British police took a leaf out of the American police force book.
  11. Profile photo of Buiadh
    Buiadh Male 30-39
    6739 posts
    April 29, 2011 at 11:53 am
    Also just had a look at the Youtube posters profile, his other 2 uploads are about ChemTrails. The guy is just an average joe nutjob that claims the world is out to get him.
  12. Profile photo of mts2457
    mts2457 Female 18-29
    535 posts
    April 29, 2011 at 12:01 pm
    Just shut up and don`t talk to him like you said you would do!!!!!! -_----
  13. Profile photo of GRadde
    GRadde Male 18-29
    2556 posts
    April 29, 2011 at 12:01 pm
    Correction to my previous comment: this cop tried to use the fact that many people don`t exactly know the law, and tried to give the ticket or arrest the dude.

    Whatevs. Sort of drunk and not really capable of taking this kind of trickery that seems typical of modern law and lawyers.
  14. Profile photo of malikymoo
    malikymoo Female 18-29
    2029 posts
    April 29, 2011 at 12:21 pm
    i`ve always wondered how police on bikes could arrest you?
  15. Profile photo of LazyMe484
    LazyMe484 Male 18-29
    10443 posts
    April 29, 2011 at 12:27 pm
    Two things:

    One - a police officer should know the law and the exact extents of his or her authority so that such confrontation does not happen.
    Two - the "laws" regarding cycling are grossly unnecessary. If a cyclist speeds through an intersection or doesn`t stop at a stop sign they are a danger to no one aside from themselves. The penalty for doing this should be adjusted accordingly. ie; a warning or a fine on the order of twenty bucks.

    Barring this, it looks like the cyclist is at fault here... trying to weasel his way out of a fine. I don`t blame him though. There are worse criminals out there than rude cyclists.
  16. Profile photo of LazyMe484
    LazyMe484 Male 18-29
    10443 posts
    April 29, 2011 at 12:29 pm
    Oh yeah, one more thing... this guy just got out of a fine... but he posts this video anyway which clearly shows the cop`s face. He`s very much identifiable. That`s just a jerk thing to do.
  17. Profile photo of gilmourw
    gilmourw Male 40-49
    38 posts
    April 29, 2011 at 12:33 pm
    In my opinion, he is subject to arrest IF he committed a fine-able offense and refused to co-operate. However, neither of these gentlemen needed to be so dickish about it. Could he be arrested? Yes. Should he be ticketed? No.
  18. Profile photo of Listypoos
    Listypoos Male 40-49
    3069 posts
    April 29, 2011 at 12:34 pm
    @LazyMe484 "If a cyclist speeds through an intersection or doesn`t stop at a stop sign they are a danger to no one aside from themselves."


    So cyclists can`t hit a car causing it to veer and hit something else, can`t go through someone`s windscreen and hit them? Of course they can be a danger to other road users, don`t be silly.
  19. Profile photo of kralmir
    kralmir Male 18-29
    351 posts
    April 29, 2011 at 12:42 pm
    the cop is allowed to arrest him if he refuses to identify himself when the cop has a reason to request it(aka the guy did something that caused the cop to give him a fine)

    and not knowing the exact wording word for word is not the same as not knowing a law.


    and that running at the end is yet another dumbass move. if you ask me there should be a law that allows people like this faggot to lose their children before they grow up to be pooheads like him.
  20. Profile photo of kralmir
    kralmir Male 18-29
    351 posts
    April 29, 2011 at 12:45 pm
    "Two - the "laws" regarding cycling are grossly unnecessary. If a cyclist speeds through an intersection or doesn`t stop at a stop sign they are a danger to no one aside from themselves. The penalty for doing this should be adjusted accordingly. ie; a warning or a fine on the order of twenty bucks. "

    great, except that a cyclist drating up and ending through my windshield alone can kill me and everyone in the area in a million different way(first one being the cyclist knocking me out from the impact, causing my car to run into a group of people and leave me and 4 others dead.)
  21. Profile photo of alliknow
    alliknow Female 18-29
    155 posts
    April 29, 2011 at 12:46 pm
    Wow, that cyclist was a dick, so was the police man, but not as much at the cyclist. Shoulda called for back up and arrested the f*cker for just being a pain in the arse
  22. Profile photo of MajicWalrus
    MajicWalrus Male 18-29
    13 posts
    April 29, 2011 at 12:46 pm
    If this had been in the US some cyclist would be walking to pick his kid up with a huffy up his ass. I don`t know what the UK law his but in the US the cop would have been justified in arresting him and calling him a twat too. Not to mention that he evaded arrest.

    Cops can`t be required to quote every damn law they have to enforce no one can. It`s why every judge and lawyer has a library of law books.

    In any case brits have to be the most polite people in the world.
  23. Profile photo of kralmir
    kralmir Male 18-29
    351 posts
    April 29, 2011 at 12:47 pm
    "within his rights. brilliant. man do I love to watch police stumble over their words and contradict themselves multiple times in a single interaction. kudos to the man for knowing his rights."


    neither you nor he knows the right or law. go die in a ant-filled pit.
  24. Profile photo of Cartunze
    Cartunze Male 60-69
    841 posts
    April 29, 2011 at 12:54 pm
    If this were in the USA, the guy would have been arrested and the film ended at 30 seconds. I am not condoning that, but just observing the cultural difference.
  25. Profile photo of Fuego
    Fuego Male 40-49
    1287 posts
    April 29, 2011 at 12:55 pm
    the guy rode through a red traffic light. As a bicyclist, he`s obligated to follow the same traffic rules as motorists. The officer was sadly a bit dim in his knowledge of the relevant codes and regulations, but that doesn`t excuse the cyclist from his offense.

    Take the damn ticket or give your information so a summons can be sent. If you don`t give your information expect to be arrested.
  26. Profile photo of Fuego
    Fuego Male 40-49
    1287 posts
    April 29, 2011 at 1:03 pm
    and as others have stated, being a bit dim on the wording of the laws doesn`t mean you don`t know the law. I only wish the UK had plenty of large pickups and SUVs with aftermarket cow-killer pipe grills and bumpers. That bicyclunt needs a big sloppy kiss from one or two.
  27. Profile photo of Jaellot
    Jaellot Male 18-29
    95 posts
    April 29, 2011 at 1:03 pm
    Malikymoo- I have seen bike officers race up along side a car, block it off from the front, and then begin to issue a ticket for running the previous redlight in the downtown area. They are also good for getting around such areas quickly that get clogged with auto traffic and the lights. As for this clip, I`m torn between pulling for the cop to give this a-hole cyclist (aren`t they all?) a ticket for running the light, and for the a-hole cyclist for rather effortlessly and in a rather passive-aggressive manner fluster the cop so thoroughly.
  28. Profile photo of IceDragon77
    IceDragon77 Male 18-29
    490 posts
    April 29, 2011 at 1:05 pm
    That man should be glad he doesnt live in the US, that video wouldnt have lasted more than 20-30 seconds.
  29. Profile photo of BoredFrank
    BoredFrank Male 40-49
    2197 posts
    April 29, 2011 at 1:20 pm
    Yep, in the US, that would have been a tasing, if not a full-on beatdown followed by charges of `resisting` and possibly `evading.`

  30. Profile photo of Mr_Pedo_Bear
    Mr_Pedo_Bear Male 70 & Over
    997 posts
    April 29, 2011 at 1:24 pm
    He`s an idiot who looking at his profile has been arrested before, only to be released once the regulations of PACE have happened. He purposely challenges cops to waste there time, only hope more cops could make the effort to arrest him and maybe he`d stop trolling them.
  31. Profile photo of Mr_Pedo_Bear
    Mr_Pedo_Bear Male 70 & Over
    997 posts
    April 29, 2011 at 1:26 pm
    @Lazyme484 what about the psychological damage of severely injuring/killing a cyclist. Being in accidents even when they`re not your fault can mess with youwhen you get behind a wheel again.
  32. Profile photo of Rick_S
    Rick_S Male 40-49
    3275 posts
    April 29, 2011 at 1:34 pm
    I can`t say about the UK, but here in the US you are not obligated to know the exact wording or exact section of the law to arrest someone under it. I`m pretty sure that the police have the right to arrest you if you don`t produce documentation in a situation like this, but I could be wrong, and this could vary. Also, some places have instituted laws which do not allow you to video tape police officers in the line of duty. And, no matter what, you run from the police here, and you will be hunted down. No way he would have gotten away with that last bit in the US.
  33. Profile photo of flexus
    flexus Male 30-39
    50 posts
    April 29, 2011 at 1:35 pm
    i could be wrong, but i always thought (especially in London after the tube bombings)if the police ask for your name and/or identification and you refuse or unable the are more than within the boundries of UK law to detain you till your identy is verified.
    i think it was in the prevention of terrorism act of course i`m not a lawyer and like i said at the beginning i could be wrong
  34. Profile photo of koffymasheen
    koffymasheen Female 18-29
    97 posts
    April 29, 2011 at 2:07 pm
    The word of the day is `obliged`.
  35. Profile photo of greenbasterd
    greenbasterd Male 18-29
    2377 posts
    April 29, 2011 at 2:18 pm
    oh man that guy is good.. we have to stand up to the nazis.. that made my frigin day!!!!
  36. Profile photo of Oscola
    Oscola Male 18-29
    349 posts
    April 29, 2011 at 2:20 pm
    Does that mean that if a policeman catches me in the act of sodomizing a shetland pony, but they don`t know the exact phrasing of the laws which prevent it, I can continue without disturbance? Awesome, Come here Honeydrop!
  37. Profile photo of ruy-guy
    ruy-guy Male 18-29
    230 posts
    April 29, 2011 at 2:31 pm
    He didnt chase after him because he was a pain in the ass, he couldnt take it anymore!
  38. Profile photo of SlothOfDoom
    SlothOfDoom Male 30-39
    2033 posts
    April 29, 2011 at 2:37 pm
    Ok....unlike some recent posts, this the case of a citizen being a douche, and the cop just trying to do his job by ticketing someone asswipe armchair lawyer who doesn`t obey traffic laws.

    Douchebags like this cyclist are part of the problem, not the solution.
  39. Profile photo of Fantom2993
    Fantom2993 Male 18-29
    342 posts
    April 29, 2011 at 2:40 pm
    Would this video have even been 1/10 as long if this were in America? When he said "I`m not taking any paperwork today" *slam* "STOP RESISTING"
  40. Profile photo of SlothOfDoom
    SlothOfDoom Male 30-39
    2033 posts
    April 29, 2011 at 2:41 pm
    @LazyMe484

    "the "laws" regarding cycling are grossly unnecessary. If a cyclist speeds through an intersection or doesn`t stop at a stop sign they are a danger to no one aside from themselves. The penalty for doing this should be adjusted accordingly. ie; a warning or a fine on the order of twenty bucks. "


    Are you KIDDING? So if some ass on a bike speeds in front of my car and I hit the brakes or swerve to avoid killing him (or damaging my car, if I were some sort of murderer) any damage caused by me swerving out of my lane or causing a pileup behind me doesn`t matter? Is that what you are saying?
  41. Profile photo of sbeelz
    sbeelz Male 30-39
    2868 posts
    April 29, 2011 at 2:42 pm
    @Oscola- Considering police officers are responsible for enforcing the law, they damn well better understand the exact laws they`re enforcing. They absolutely CAN NOT just tell people what to do without being given the legal authority to do so. Citizens are well within their rights to ask cops about the laws they are attempting to enforce, and cops need to be able to answer those questions.
  42. Profile photo of sbeelz
    sbeelz Male 30-39
    2868 posts
    April 29, 2011 at 2:44 pm
    "If a cyclist speeds through an intersection or doesn`t stop at a stop sign they are a danger to no one aside from themselves"

    I`m a cyclist, and this is absolute nonsense. Most drivers who see a cyclist plowing through an intersection are going to try to avoid hitting them, which puts pretty much EVERYBODY in the vicinity at risk.
  43. Profile photo of illios
    illios Male 18-29
    181 posts
    April 29, 2011 at 3:01 pm
    Yet another douche of a citizen, "student of the law myself" well then you should know what a stop sign is shouldnt you?
  44. Profile photo of Samsquanch
    Samsquanch Male 30-39
    792 posts
    April 29, 2011 at 3:09 pm
    I don`t know about the UK, but in Canada, the officers are in charge of enforcing the laws, it`s the lawyers who are in charge of interpreting the law. Officers don`t need to know the wording, that`s the lawyer`s responsibility...and as a "law student" he should be aware of this.
    And, bicycles operate the same as motor vehicles, and must abide by the same laws.
    And, a person must provide valid identification to an officer upon request.
  45. Profile photo of illios
    illios Male 18-29
    181 posts
    April 29, 2011 at 3:14 pm
    Samsquanch

    Thank you

    It`s easier when the officer knows them but yes, thank you
  46. Profile photo of LazyMe484
    LazyMe484 Male 18-29
    10443 posts
    April 29, 2011 at 3:15 pm
    So cyclists can`t hit a car causing it to veer A car weighs 10 times as much and moves twice as fast. That means it has 40 times the kinetic energy. No matter what the incident, the cyclist will always loose. Granted, they can still pose a danger to pedestrians, albeit a very minor one.

    @kralmir same deal. If you run over a cyclist the worst that will happen to you is a dinged bumper. It`s the cyclist that might die.

    @Mr_Pedo_Bear I don`t see how something that is clearly not your fault could "physiologically damage you". Even if it could, it is not enough to levy fines against potential psychological damage.

    @SlothOfDoom If he speeds in front, he`d be passing you, why would you need to hit the brakes?

    @sbeelz I`ll admit that I was exaggerating. The cyclist, of course, does pose a risk. But the fact remains that the impact between a cyclist and a vehicle and between a vehicle and a vehicle are fundamentally different.
  47. Profile photo of LazyMe484
    LazyMe484 Male 18-29
    10443 posts
    April 29, 2011 at 3:15 pm
    Anyway the reality is that most cyclists aren`t going to speed through busy intersections with cross traffic causing cars to swerve anyway, simply because that is suicide. I`m simply saying that fines and such should be adjusted to reflect the fact that a cyclist is far more vulnerable.
    Think of it like this... if tanks were street legal and you were in a collision with one, should the driver of the tank not be held more liable?
  48. Profile photo of Samsquanch
    Samsquanch Male 30-39
    792 posts
    April 29, 2011 at 3:15 pm
    sbeelz...are you serious? Officers aren`t paid to know the precise wording of the law. They are only expected to know the basics of a law, and how it pertains to the world.
    An officer doesn`t need to know all the wherefors and hithertos of why it`s illegal to stop at a stop sign. That`s the lawyers` responsibility. All the officer needs to know is that it`s an offence that carries a fine of $x. If the person wishes to contest the offence, they can take it to a judge, who will interpret the wording of the law, based on the evidence provided. The lawyers` responsibility is to interpret and debate the meaning of the law.
  49. Profile photo of Samsquanch
    Samsquanch Male 30-39
    792 posts
    April 29, 2011 at 3:19 pm
    should be adjusted to reflect the fact that a cyclist is far more vulnerable
    Exactly...they should be stiffer, not more lenient. It`s not just man vs. machine, it`s man vs. man in a big machine. There is still the psychological factor to account for.
    A motorist isn`t going to see a cyclist and think, "Jack-off just cut me off, but that`s ok, he`s dead meat."
    On the contrary...people do tend to care about other people, and will do what they can to avoid injuring another person...and a motorist will think, "poo! I could kill that guy!" and will swerve to avoid the accident, and will likely cause another accident as a result.
  50. Profile photo of Ska_Machine
    Ska_Machine Male 13-17
    153 posts
    April 29, 2011 at 3:21 pm
    Why can`t police be nice? :P I swaer I feel like becoming one of these guys just so I can be nice lol, they`re all so confrontational
  51. Profile photo of Samsquanch
    Samsquanch Male 30-39
    792 posts
    April 29, 2011 at 3:22 pm
    ...and no, cyclists don`t pose a small risk to pedestrians. Pedestrians are killed regularly by cyclists. Some cyclists can reach speeds upwards of 40 or 50 km/h. And because of the fact that they`re much smaller, they`re much harder to see, and pedestrians often miss them, or misjudge speeds, and step out in front of a speeding cyclist, and get killed or seriously injured as a result.
    Likewise, speeding cyclists often zip very closely to parked cars, and parked motorists don`t often notice them till it`s too late, when they open the door (wham! dead cyclist or person getting out of the car or both), or they pull out (wham! dead cyclist or person pulling out as the cyclist is launched into the vehicle.
  52. Profile photo of SlothOfDoom
    SlothOfDoom Male 30-39
    2033 posts
    April 29, 2011 at 3:24 pm
    @LazyMe484

    Are you intentionally being an idiot? you don;t think cyclists can cause two vehicles to get into an accident?

    Get the drat off your computer once and a while.
  53. Profile photo of LazyMe484
    LazyMe484 Male 18-29
    10443 posts
    April 29, 2011 at 3:24 pm
    @Samsquanch you are assuming that motorists make bad decisions by default.
  54. Profile photo of Samsquanch
    Samsquanch Male 30-39
    792 posts
    April 29, 2011 at 3:25 pm
    Why can`t police be nice?

    Maybe because of 90% of the non-nice individuals they deal with who think they`re better or above the law, or watch videos like this and think that all cops are non-nice individuals.
    Treat a cop with respect and dignity, and he will do in kind. If he`s not, clam up, take the fine, and contest it in a court of law. If he`s a right non-nice individual, the courts will recognize him as such, and dismiss the case on principle alone.
  55. Profile photo of LazyMe484
    LazyMe484 Male 18-29
    10443 posts
    April 29, 2011 at 3:26 pm
    And because of the fact that they`re much smaller, they`re much harder to see,
    And they also have a much shorter stopping distance.
  56. Profile photo of 5Cats
    5Cats Male 50-59
    31766 posts
    April 29, 2011 at 3:27 pm
    What a rooster! That cop was more than polite & patient with him. Should have pepper-sprayed him!

    Operating a bicycle is the same as a car. If you violate traffic law, you can & should get ticketed.
  57. Profile photo of Samsquanch
    Samsquanch Male 30-39
    792 posts
    April 29, 2011 at 3:29 pm
    Seriously, Lazy? You don`t drive too much do you? Most motorists DO make bad decisions...all the freaking time. Why do you think accident rates are so high? Why do you think fatalities are so high? Why even have insurance if most motorists are good drivers?
    On the contrary, about 90% of the drivers out there are horrible drivers, who drive by the skin of their teeth.
    Ever take the 401 near Toronto? People ride bumper-to-bumper at 140+km/h on that road. Try leaving a space, and some jack-off jumps in front to "close the gap".
    I needed to come to an emergency stop once, and 5 cars piled into my rear. I had (and always do) left enough space between me and the car in front of me that the chain reaction ended with me.
    A guy I used to work with was killed when a tow truck blew through a stop sign, thinking no one would be there.
    My sister was nearly killed when a car ran a red light at 6am, figuring no one was there.
  58. Profile photo of the_windy
    the_windy Female 18-29
    1589 posts
    April 29, 2011 at 3:30 pm
    The guy filming is a jerk.
    Let the guy do his job. Shut, up, take the ticket, if you don`t agree with it, take it court.
    It costs nothing here if you don`t want to pay a ticket, as long as you call in to the office and tell them. They give you a court date (usually a few months after), you go, and if the officer doesn`t show up it`s dismissed. And even if they do show up, it`s very hard for the officer to prove their case. They have to prove you are guilty, and if they can`t prove what they saw, then they lose.
  59. Profile photo of LazyMe484
    LazyMe484 Male 18-29
    10443 posts
    April 29, 2011 at 3:30 pm
    you don;t think cyclists can cause two vehicles to get into an accident?
    I never said that. If a cyclist gets into an accident with two cars, the cyclist is probably dead, whereas the drivers very likely survive.
  60. Profile photo of Samsquanch
    Samsquanch Male 30-39
    792 posts
    April 29, 2011 at 3:35 pm
    My dad was nearly killed in his patrol car when some idiot made a hasty left turn into the liquor store, hoping to get in before it closed.

    And they also have a much shorter stopping distance.
    Yes...especially when they`re listening to their ipods, and off in their own little worlds, thinking of nothing but themselves.

    You really do need to get off the computer. Cyclists are killed because of bad decisions they and motorists make:
    >http://www.bhsi.org/stats.htm

    Guy I worked with was lamenting that the police charged his father with riding a bicycle through a crosswalk, and wound up getting hit by a car and injured. He was complaining, "If my dad had been walking, he would have been killed!"
    If your dad was using the lanes properly, as a cyclist, stopping behind the vehicle in front, and allowing the vehicle to safely make the turn, he
  61. Profile photo of Musuko42
    Musuko42 Male 18-29
    2850 posts
    April 29, 2011 at 3:36 pm
    Cyclist should not have ran the red light (if he did it).

    I believe that the cyclist WAS required to provide name and address (and those details only). But the officer was providing conflicting information about whether he was required to do so, or whether it was a request he could refuse.

    And if the police officer is unable to clearly state what your rights are and obligations are, then you as a member of public are quite justified in refusing to comply until your rights and obligations are clarified.

    If a police officer hands you a gun and tells you to put it to your head and pull the trigger, would you obey, or question?

    An extreme example, of course, but the point is there; if you aren`t required to do something, then you`re within your rights to refuse. And it is ALWAYS your right to question.

    And the snatch for the camera...VERY illegal.
  62. Profile photo of LazyMe484
    LazyMe484 Male 18-29
    10443 posts
    April 29, 2011 at 3:37 pm
    @Samsquanch I didn`t say divers don`t make bad decisions, I said you are making the assumption that drivers will make the wrong decision by default.

    If a cyclist is in a collision with a car that is the cyclists fault, the driver of the car will only get hurt if they make a bad decision. ie; by doing nothing at all, they are fine.

    If a cyclist is in a collision with a car that is the car`s fault, the cyclist is dead regardless of if their decision making or riding ability.
  63. Profile photo of Musuko42
    Musuko42 Male 18-29
    2850 posts
    April 29, 2011 at 3:39 pm
    @the_windy

    "The guy filming is a jerk."

    Yes he`s a jerk, but there`s no law against that.
  64. Profile photo of Samsquanch
    Samsquanch Male 30-39
    792 posts
    April 29, 2011 at 3:41 pm
    If a cyclist gets into an accident with two cars, the cyclist is probably dead, whereas the drivers very likely survive.

    And neither of the drivers experience any emotional distress from having killed a person...
    Whether they were in the right or wrong, being the cause of someone else`s death is often emotionally devastating for most people, and will do what they can to avoid that situation...and collide with another vehicle...
  65. Profile photo of Musuko42
    Musuko42 Male 18-29
    2850 posts
    April 29, 2011 at 3:44 pm
    Also, to all those debating cars vs bikes and stating that car drivers won`t get killed if there is an accident, I would like to remind you of the following fact:

    There are other road users.

    The ones I specifically reference are motorcyclists and pedestrians; both of whom are just as vulnerable as cyclists on the roads, and can both be hurt and killed by collisions involving cyclists.

    So let`s not talk about cyclists being the only possible injured party in any accident they might be involved with, alright?

    Accidents involving cyclists don`t always just involve the cyclist as the victim.

    (please note I have made very careful use avoid laying blame, and have said accidents INVOLVING cyclists, not accidents CAUSED by cyclists: I have no fully-formed opinion about them).
  66. Profile photo of LazyMe484
    LazyMe484 Male 18-29
    10443 posts
    April 29, 2011 at 3:45 pm
    Yes...especially when they`re listening to their ipods, and off in their own little worlds, thinking of nothing but themselves.
    As opposed to drivers who are on the phone or texting...

    but I`m not going to dispute accident statistics.

    The only thing I am saying is that fines should be adjusted to account for relative vulnerability.
  67. Profile photo of lacishay
    lacishay Female 18-29
    120 posts
    April 29, 2011 at 3:46 pm
    The bottom line is, it`s the courts job to interpret the letter of the law. Not the officers. It`s the officer`s job to enforce the letter of the law. If the officer thinks he`s within his rights to arrest and charge someone, he will, and the courts will interpret whether or not he was correct in his judgement. If so, the arrested will be charged and released, or just released. It`s a system. On video or not.
  68. Profile photo of LazyMe484
    LazyMe484 Male 18-29
    10443 posts
    April 29, 2011 at 3:48 pm
    And neither of the drivers experience any emotional distress from having killed a person...
    Can you not see the difference between death and emotional distress? If you had to pick one which would it be?

    What if that collision was the fault of the drivers?
  69. Profile photo of LazyMe484
    LazyMe484 Male 18-29
    10443 posts
    April 29, 2011 at 3:53 pm
    So let`s not talk about cyclists being the only possible injured party in any accident they might be involved with, alright?

    I will admit that. That`s fine. There are other road users, but they occur in lesser number. If a cyclist gets into a collision with anyone as a result of running a stop sign, it is *most likely* going to be a car.
  70. Profile photo of Shelworth
    Shelworth Male 50-59
    384 posts
    April 29, 2011 at 3:54 pm
    That`s why police have to carry firearms, so they can shoot people like that and make the world a better place for the rest of us.
  71. Profile photo of LazyMe484
    LazyMe484 Male 18-29
    10443 posts
    April 29, 2011 at 4:00 pm
    On another note... I also think that traffic fines should be weighted according to one`s personal income.

    Anyone care to debate this? ;-)
  72. Profile photo of Musuko42
    Musuko42 Male 18-29
    2850 posts
    April 29, 2011 at 4:36 pm
    @LazyMe484

    "On another note... I also think that traffic fines should be weighted according to one`s personal income."

    In Finland, they are.
  73. Profile photo of TopSmurff
    TopSmurff Male 18-29
    51 posts
    April 29, 2011 at 4:43 pm
    He outsmarted a cop. That`s not hard to do...
  74. Profile photo of sbeelz
    sbeelz Male 30-39
    2868 posts
    April 29, 2011 at 4:56 pm
    @LazyMe484- I think that should apply to all fines. For someone with very little income, getting a $100 traffic fine can be an enormous hardship. For a corporate executive, it`s chump change. Since the principle behind traffic fines at least SHOULD be to deter people from behaving in unsafe or inconsiderate ways, then we should make sure to deter everyone equally- which means that the fines should have the same impact on your life whether you make minimum wage or a six figure income. I also favor community service as an alternative to paying the fine- the same number of hours for anyone regardless of income.
  75. Profile photo of RecycleElf
    RecycleElf Male 18-29
    3622 posts
    April 29, 2011 at 5:26 pm
    For once, the citizen was more annoying than the lawman
  76. Profile photo of duffytoler
    duffytoler Male 40-49
    5196 posts
    April 29, 2011 at 5:29 pm
    Guy`s being a dick, but why is the cop stopping him for ANYTHING on a friggin` BICYCLE?
  77. Profile photo of An-egg
    An-egg Male 30-39
    885 posts
    April 29, 2011 at 5:30 pm
    A few things

    *defending your God given rights doesn`t make you `people like that` you may not like his demeanor but he was right and the cop should have been properly trained/in possession of a high enough IQ to do his job.
    * Not weighted to ones income but to ones worth. That would really make them work. Bill Gates, for example should be fined 25% of his net worth, unless that`s less than an agreed minimum
    *and topsmurf, I guess you never got a ticket. Before you respond, I haven`t.

    Finally, in Japan it`s about $5000 a pop for driving over the (0) limit. All passengers have to pay half as well. What do you think about that.
    (I don`t know the current rate as the dollar is in freefall, but it was about that when I was there)
  78. Profile photo of Bountykat
    Bountykat Female 18-29
    399 posts
    April 29, 2011 at 5:47 pm
    He pulled him over on a bike because bicycles are traffic, too. We are "obliged(lol)" to follow all the exact same rules as cars.
  79. Profile photo of fivezones
    fivezones Male 40-49
    1021 posts
    April 29, 2011 at 5:47 pm
    I just accept my tickets and then contest them in court via mail. I never lost yet. the cops don`t get paid overtime to do mail court paperwork (but they do get paid for in person court appearances)

    As a result, they normally don`t bother to fill out the paperwork and I win by default.
  80. Profile photo of DingDingDong
    DingDingDong Male 30-39
    1511 posts
    April 29, 2011 at 6:17 pm
    In most countries you must provide your ID to an officer or you can be arrested. And an officer doesn`t need to know the exact wording to enforce a law. But I`m glad he got away =)
  81. Profile photo of BFLH
    BFLH Male 18-29
    55 posts
    April 29, 2011 at 7:36 pm
    "Being a dick" is precisely how we ensure the police do not overstep their bounds. They need to understand that their authority has limits and that they ultimately need to understand those limits in order to do their jobs.
  82. Profile photo of Enjin
    Enjin Male 30-39
    802 posts
    April 29, 2011 at 8:32 pm
    One of the worst days of my life was when I hit a cyclist who was running a red light at an intersection. Swear to god I thought the guy had died. He flew right over my car, landed in the street and didn`t move. I was physically ill from grief. Every time I See one of those non-nice individuals breaking the law and speeding through traffic at intersection it just pisses me off. I would love nothing more than to have seen that cop beat the hell out of the inconsiderate mean person.
  83. Profile photo of Enjin
    Enjin Male 30-39
    802 posts
    April 29, 2011 at 8:34 pm
    Would love to see a follow up since the guy posted the video I assume they can track him down. Did he ever get his ticket? Any further charges for fleeing from the police?
  84. Profile photo of robosnitz
    robosnitz Male 40-49
    2737 posts
    April 29, 2011 at 9:27 pm
    BRAAAAAAAVO! That english guy is my hero. When a cop gets rude with me, I always ask if there`s an Internal Affairs Department at his or her precinct.That usually shuts them the hell up.
  85. Profile photo of wake_n_bake
    wake_n_bake Male 18-29
    663 posts
    April 29, 2011 at 9:33 pm
    Was the guy being a dick? Yes. Does he have some serious stones? Yes sir. If the cop had happened to be a hardass this would have ended badly though
  86. Profile photo of stagefreak
    stagefreak Male 18-29
    379 posts
    April 29, 2011 at 10:32 pm
    what a jerk. keep riding through those red lights there bud. one day your luck will run out.
  87. Profile photo of scarfie
    scarfie Male 30-39
    35 posts
    April 29, 2011 at 10:35 pm
    Cyclists ignoring traffic rules are a pain (I cycle and think a lot more people should as well). Assuming the guy did run the red light, this video demonstrates that those rules should be more effectively enforced, either by improved legislation or better police training. The officer should have been better equipped to clearly deal with that situation. His apparent loss of temper at the end (when he lunges at the camera) is the absolute worst way to deal with the situation.

    It also illustrates a general problem; that police need to accept that they`re going to be filmed by the public, and they need to be trained to deal with that. They are acting in a public capacity and their actions should therefore be open to public scrutiny. If you let yourself get annoyed or defensive because of someone filming you (which clearly happens here) you are immediately losing control of the situation.
  88. Profile photo of BRKNVLTR
    BRKNVLTR Male 40-49
    377 posts
    April 29, 2011 at 10:44 pm
    Don`t provide ID, argue with a Police Officer and refuse to comply with orders creates this funny thing called REASONABLE SUSPICION and that take to the next level. The level where your smart ass mouth just gets you in more trouble. The cop looked like a rookie. He should have radioed for a FTO or other shift leader and had them explain the law. Noncompliance regardless of the situation WILL get you into trouble. Oh and the douche` with the camera is a little, limp wrist prick.
  89. Profile photo of jamesuyt
    jamesuyt Male 13-17
    680 posts
    April 29, 2011 at 11:51 pm
    I`m not sure if it`s the same case in England, but I would assume it is since Australia`s legal system is heavily based on the British legal sysem. That said, I`m pretty sure that, because that laws are freely accessible to anyone, it is YOUR responsibility to learn the laws and how to obey them.
    The police officer needed to say "You ran through a red light and therefore broke the law, I am now going to give you a ticket." and when he declined it, he had the grounds to arrest him for failure to privide details (as the cop stated in the video). Then, if the bikerider further refused, he would be resisting arrest and physical action would need to be taken in order to arrest the man.
  90. Profile photo of flexus
    flexus Male 30-39
    50 posts
    April 30, 2011 at 12:30 am
    The cyclist stated he was on the Edgeware road,that is in london so covered by the Metropolitan Police i found this on there website. www.met.police.uk/stopandsearch there is a section on what a police officer can ask you and it states "The police officer will ask for your name and address and date of birth". You do not have to give this information if you don’t want to, unless the police officer says they are reporting you for an offence" now considering that the guy had run a red light, if true this is clearly an offence, the policeman would have been well within his powers to arrest the cyclist.last time i checked here in London anyway not sure about the rest of the UK these stop and search powers are in force and have been since the tube bombings.what i`m trying to say the cyclist was in the wrong however as posted earlier i`m not a lawyer
  91. Profile photo of Untouchable1
    Untouchable1 Male 18-29
    31 posts
    April 30, 2011 at 12:31 am
    In the states he would probably have gotten tased
  92. Profile photo of flexus
    flexus Male 30-39
    50 posts
    April 30, 2011 at 12:53 am
    also, if this guy was as stated "a student of law myself" he would have known that it is up to the individial to inform themselves with the law, besides he ran a red light everybody knows that is wrong, you don`t need to quote a specific law to know that.i`m not a fan of heavy handed policing but in this case the cyclist should have been arrested and from what i saw up until the he tried to get the camera(not a smart move) i don`t think in a court the video would have had any bearing on a wrongful arrest claim
  93. Profile photo of Student_Law
    Student_Law Male 30-39
    1010 posts
    April 30, 2011 at 2:36 am
    Hah :-) I felt a little sorry for the cop for a while.. he did make a fool of himself, not knowing the legal codes for the authority that he practices. @nexus i don`t know how english law works in these cases, but i`d assume that it`s the same as here: yes a mistake of the law is not a mitigating circumstane.

    Personally i think that legal knowledge should not be used to bug every store owner, car seller or police authority you come across. He should`ve just identified, recieved the fine and moved on.

    On the other hand, this videotape does serve as an evidence that the officer`s knowledge of the very laws they are put to enforce are very poor. If the police officer had "done his homework" this wouldn`t have been so embarassing for him.
  94. Profile photo of Enjin
    Enjin Male 30-39
    802 posts
    April 30, 2011 at 3:29 am
    Here is a link to the guys blog.
    http://tinyurl.com/3p46l2d

    It`s funny he starts of apologizing to the officer. Then admits he was acting like a rebellious child. A good start but he then goes on to defend his actions and kind of ignore all that stuff about him breaking the law (allegedly). Would still like to hear if he ever got a ticket, but I didn`t see any info about that. Dangerous cyclists that potentially ruin innocent peoples lives are a pet peeve of mine. Anyway I guess if you want to follow this case check his blog.
  95. Profile photo of Suicism
    Suicism Male 18-29
    3625 posts
    April 30, 2011 at 3:49 am
    I think the lesson to be learned here is that (aside from all the learned and intelligent contributions thus far), it`s sometimes worth a shot just to test the endurance and perseverance of any given individual law-enforcement officer.. sometimes, they`re just as easily led onto the path of least-resistance as the rest of us.
  96. Profile photo of Kureigu
    Kureigu Male 18-29
    37 posts
    April 30, 2011 at 4:24 am
    weirdly enough i got pulled over in a bike for breaking the speed limit. I had to attend a "speed awareness course" and i didn`t have a drivers licence to have points put on.
  97. Profile photo of MildCorma
    MildCorma Male 18-29
    496 posts
    April 30, 2011 at 4:42 am
    You ran a red light: Pay the price or stop wasting police time you fat headed mong
  98. Profile photo of Student_Law
    Student_Law Male 30-39
    1010 posts
    April 30, 2011 at 6:10 am
    I am an experienced driver, as well as an active cyclist.

    On the radio and in the newspapers drivers and cyclists are always at each other`s throats. "They do that, you did this, bla bla bla.

    But, like with most things in the media, when you put down the newspaper - and go out in REALITY people are always smiling, letting each other pass, waving and so on.
  99. Profile photo of bombaytech
    bombaytech Male 18-29
    151 posts
    April 30, 2011 at 6:44 am
    I`m not a violent man, but I would take the misdemeanor and small fine to uppercut this annoying cyclist.
  100. Profile photo of paperduck
    paperduck Male 18-29
    1745 posts
    April 30, 2011 at 7:23 am
    Under US law, you are obligated to provide your legal name and address to a law enforcement officer, even if you`re just *walking* around doing nothing wrong. Refusing is sufficient to get you arrested.
  101. Profile photo of Ripper398
    Ripper398 Male 18-29
    1310 posts
    April 30, 2011 at 7:25 am
    The cyclist, like most cyclists, is a twat
  102. Profile photo of Samsquanch
    Samsquanch Male 30-39
    792 posts
    April 30, 2011 at 9:21 am
    You can contest that a fine will cause a personal hardship on you and your family. Generally...and again, if you`re polite, and not arrogant, the court will either dismiss the case, or reduce the sentence.
    I was fined for driving with expired plates. I nodded at the officer, and didn`t make any indication that I knew the plates were expired. "I`m giving you a ticket for expired plates."
    "Ok. Thank-you for the notification. I will ensure that the plates will be renewed in the immediate future."
    Then, I contested it, plead guilty with an excuse (how could I plead innocent? I had expired plates. It was evident.)
    Told the JP I was guilty with an excuse, then told him about the hardships my family faced with my grandmother who had cancer.
    He found me guilty, but suspended the sentence. I paid nothing. I was calm with the officer, and the JP, and stated my case to the appropriate level.
  103. Profile photo of Samsquanch
    Samsquanch Male 30-39
    792 posts
    April 30, 2011 at 9:23 am
    I was stopped in Louisiana for doing 95mph in a 55 zone, because I was courteous to the officer, I never admitted guilt (he asked why I was stopped, and I said, "I guess I was going a little fast, eh?"). I chatted with him, and remained calm, and collected in the situation, and he remained very polite with me, and let me go with a warning.
  104. Profile photo of Kimrn89
    Kimrn89 Male 18-29
    67 posts
    April 30, 2011 at 1:57 pm
    @Samsquanch: Your arguments are a welcomed contradiction to the main view on policing and handlers of law, but are invalid as you live in Canada. Canada rules.
  105. Profile photo of jib
    jib Male 18-29
    314 posts
    April 30, 2011 at 3:22 pm
    cyclist should be punched in the mouth
  106. Profile photo of GasMaskKid
    GasMaskKid Male 18-29
    694 posts
    April 30, 2011 at 4:39 pm
    What a douche!
  107. Profile photo of morrach
    morrach Male 30-39
    22 posts
    April 30, 2011 at 5:20 pm
    Little Officer Dangle there is going to ticket the HOLY HELL out of the next old woman that doesn`t properly signal.
  108. Profile photo of BFLH
    BFLH Male 18-29
    55 posts
    April 30, 2011 at 6:23 pm
    @ Paperduck:

    No, that is untrue. Some states have different rules, but generally the police cannot force you to ID yourself.
  109. Profile photo of hi2pi
    hi2pi Male 30-39
    736 posts
    April 30, 2011 at 8:23 pm
    lol. if he`s right about the law then he`s right about the law. being a cop does NOT mean you are allowed to break the law. unless you`re in the States where your cops are becoming fascists and american citizens seem to be ok with that.
  110. Profile photo of dognose82
    dognose82 Male 18-29
    153 posts
    April 30, 2011 at 10:55 pm
    I guess I come from the old school where this dick would have gotten his ass arrested. Sorry, but in the States, remember you can be detained for anything.
  111. Profile photo of rogue_knight
    rogue_knight Male 40-49
    868 posts
    May 1, 2011 at 10:44 am
    Ah Brits... Over hear that guy woulda had a gud @ss whupin!
  112. Profile photo of Route49
    Route49 Male 50-59
    12 posts
    May 1, 2011 at 11:04 am
    Flaming cyclists are a pain in the arse. They don`t pay road tax and assume they have every right on the road. Copper was a wanker but the guy with camera even more of a wanker. I would gladly run all of them over.
  113. Profile photo of Yap71
    Yap71 Male 30-39
    150 posts
    May 1, 2011 at 4:36 pm
    OK someone has to learn the difference between standing up for your rights and being difficult with the authorities. sure, the officer was somewhat in the wrong, but that guy didnt make the situation any better, and just tried to start something, knowing he could get some footage.
  114. Profile photo of PoopNoodle
    PoopNoodle Male 40-49
    400 posts
    May 1, 2011 at 5:37 pm
    @Yap71
    Male, 30-39, Canada

    I couldn`t possibly disagree more. This man was well within his rights to question the constable. Maybe the cop should actually read and understand the laws he is supposed to be enforcing.
  115. Profile photo of rockinclimb
    rockinclimb Male 18-29
    81 posts
    May 1, 2011 at 7:30 pm
    awesome, but everything is more laid back in when said in that accent. i`d be less likely to react also if i talked in such a way
  116. Profile photo of Fatninja01
    Fatninja01 Male 30-39
    25406 posts
    May 2, 2011 at 2:13 am
    He was being a tool
  117. Profile photo of BigWaFuu
    BigWaFuu Male 18-29
    1163 posts
    May 2, 2011 at 9:05 am
    >>I couldn`t possibly disagree more. This man was well within his rights to question the constable. Maybe the cop should actually read and understand the laws he is supposed to be enforcing.<<

    Why dont you go and try to remember the thousands of laws out there, then recite them perfectly from memory. Oh that`s right, not everyone can be Jesus like this rider expects the cop to be.

    Also, how was the cop in the wrong at all? He simply told the guy "I saw you run a red light". 90% of the video was him being given a difficult time by the rider.
  118. Profile photo of Red_Fear
    Red_Fear Male 18-29
    68 posts
    May 2, 2011 at 5:56 pm
    I think, as PC Stout seems to be a traffic officer he really should know what laws he is arresting/fining somebody under. Admittedly this guy was just being a d**k to annoy the officer, but how the officer reacted was out of order, that could be classed as assault, its probably why the officer didn`t pursue.

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