NYC Billboard Advertises Christmas As Myth [Pic]

Submitted by: fancylad 6 years ago
http://newyork.cbslocal.com/2010/11/27/atheist-groups-billboard-targets-closet-non-believers/

Who paid for the billboard? The American Atheists organization. Is this a smart protest or a wasted effort, I-A-B?
There are 217 comments:
Male 2,592
Yeah it may be a myth, and I do lean towards atheism, but I love X-mas due to the fact that it brings my family together every year and be merry! Nothing wrong with that!
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Male 6,694
I love when Santa comes with tons of presents.
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Female 105
Can I put up a KKK rally board in the middle of Harlem if they can do that?

I mean anything goes nowadays..I might be reaching out to black people who celebrate the white men secretly and are too ashamed to tell their families.
Niggas Praisin the White Man
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Male 12,365
Can`t we all stop confusing Christ Mass with the secular midwinter festival?

I`m thinking particularly of Dier`s post, as he clearly makes no distinction at all between the two and can`t understand that some other people do.
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Male 36
Can we just have fun celebrating Christmas? :/
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Male 2,868
"I`m more pissed off about the state of the world and its lack of human compassion."

This comment wins the thread.
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Male 1,341
@djer
Who cares? Its a billboard.... I realize we live in a world where people get all butt hurt when they see any form of opinion other than their own but damn.. I don`t see where this will bring down any families reasons to celebrate the holidays.

Unless....

Christian family: " Aw... Look at that billboard... I guess we should just head home pack up all the gifts, take down the tree and decorations, and call the rest of the family and tell them Christmas is off....."
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Male 842
While I personally don`t care how people celebrate the holidays, I find this billboard to be blatantly offensive. It`s true that Christmas is a celebration of the birth of Christ, but it`s evolved into so much more than that. This time of the year is all about giving to others, whether it be time, money, or items. That`s what the season`s all about, and has always been about. Just because you don`t personally believe in the story of the Nativity does not mean that it`s ok to call it a myth and bring down another person`s reason to celebrate.

tl;dr: This billboard is hypocritical. It`s saying that you need to celebrate the goodwill of mankind and be charitable to others, except Christians, because they believe something other than what we do and are obviously wrong.
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Male 586
LtFurpie - "Sorry, but I haven`t heard of any atheists killing people over their lack of an insane deity!!!"

Really? Atheists have no blood on their hands? How about 1.5 million Cambodians dead, in the Khmer Rouge effort to establish a godless marxist state?
How about the officially atheistic USSR? Stalin`s rule resulted in tens of millions of deaths.
I`m not saying all of those deaths a directly attribute to atheism but it shows that atheism doesn`t ensure peace and harmony.
BOTH the religious (Hitler had the Church`s support...) and irreligious have committed atrocities.
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Male 44
@deadcat
What kind of atheist would be ashamed of a poster supporting their views? It`s not like it`s offensive or unreasonable. It`s just a big billboard.
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Female 4
I was waiting for this link to be shared :) Thats my uncle!
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Male 1,013
"I`m an atheist and I am horrified by this poster...
The people who made this advertisement are no better than any other religious extremists..."

Are you serious? Sorry, but I haven`t heard of any atheists killing people over their lack of an insane deity!!!
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Male 38
I`m an atheist and I am horrified by this poster...
The people who made this advertisement are no better than any other religious extremists...
shame really, what our world is becoming, a cesspool of nonsense and pathetic quarrels
I am ashamed to be human
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Male 2,868
"I`m more pissed off about the state of the world and its lack of human compassion."

This comment wins the thread.
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Male 12,365
[quote]What if god (and choose any god from any religion) was truly a powerful being capable of being gathering up the universes powers and caused the bang itself then both theories are right just put in a different light.[/quote]

"God did it" is not a theory.

It is either grossly ignorant or grossly dishonest to claim a religious statement of faith and a scientific theory are the same kind of thing.

Maybe it is true that some form of higher being set up the universe. It`s internally consistent for a theist to believe that to be true and also be a scientist, even to see science as holy work - they could believe that working towards a greater understanding of the universe is what their god intended for humanity.


It may be true, but it can`t be a theory. At best, it`s a non-falsifiable hypothesis.
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Male 12,365
[quote]Why don`t we ever go after other religious holidays? If Atheists don`t believe in any of them why not equally try and disprove them? You never see a billboard posted about how Neo-Pagen Wiccan`s age old beliefs are myth.[/quote]

If Wicca and other neo-pagan religions had as much power as Christianity does in these countries, it would make sense to use the very limited resources available to advertise an alternative point of view. But they don`t, so it isn`t.
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Male 12,365
[quote]This season, celebrate reason.
I bet you`ll still be stuffing your face and opening presents, you hypocritical douchebags.[/quote]

The midwinter festival is not Christmas, so it isn`t hypocritical for people who aren`t Christians to celebrate it.

I don`t, because I think it isn`t possible to fully remove religion from it, but some other atheists think it is.
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Male 310
Damn it atheists I thought we were trying to stay above the religious fanatics and not try to publicize or pressure our beliefs.
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Male 12,365
[quote]While people are definitely inspired to good deeds by religion, all too often they have the ulterior motive of converting people. Christian groups will make homeless people listen to a sermon as a condition of receiving food or clothing. Missionaries will go abroad to build houses for people or bring medicine, but they never forget to bring plenty of bibles.[/quote]

Which reminds me of the two Christians I`ve known who really impressed me, because they weren`t like that. I worked with one, who was one of the nicest people I`ve known. It was maybe as much as a year before I knew she was a Christian. Full-on devout, churchgoing Christian. Who didn`t push it at anyone. The other was the priest/whatever at her church. Who did charitable work daily and never used it as a pulpit. The homeless people he helped probably didn`t even know he was a Christian, let alone a cleric.
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Male 336
Jesus wasn`t born in December.
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Male 25,416
In NY everyone has an opinion, nobody seems to be right most of the time!
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Male 16
Did I accidently join a debating society? Not again!
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Male 3,585
@jovian1983
w.a.r.
We Are Right
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Female 65
Atheists have every right to express themselves. Whether others agree with their opinions or not. It`s called, `Freedom of Expression/Speech.`

I`m a Christian and I`m not bothered by the sign. Why should I be? I am firm in my faith and in my beliefs. I can respect they are firm in their beliefs as well. And leave it at that.

There`s other things in this world to be more irate at than a sign.....I`m more pissed off about the state of the world and its lack of human compassion.
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Male 216
New Jersey.
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Male 3
***WALL OF TEXT SORRY***

To be honest all of these statements are rather absurd. It isn`t religion or aethism that causes wars it is one side believing they are right over the other and the two battle it out. In the pasts it was the crusades saying that christianity was right over the jewish and now it is American ideals over the middle eastern. People battle it out that god created all life and others battle it out that the universe was created by the gravitational pull of gasses and other objects then exploding and that cataclysm created the universe and unleashed natural evolution.

What if....and this is a crazy thought both are right. I am not aethiest nor do I practice any religtion but I believe in both the scientific method and I believe there is a higher power out there. Now what I am about to say isn`t exactly what I believe.

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Male 3
What if god (and choose any god from any religion) was truly a powerful being capable of being gathering up the universes powers and caused the bang itself then both theories are right just put in a different light.I look at all religious and others beliefes and how they will try and push it others. That in itself is wrong. I see even further the segrogation of the different beliefs, even between the different division of that belief system. All I see are divided people when we were all born of this earth and we all bleed. What all religion is suppose to do is unite people and to teach the proper way of treating others yet all people do is look down on others who don`t follow their beliefs. This doesn`t go for all people but many do.

Everyone just needs to start treating everyone as equals no matter what each individuals beliefs are and any other differences they might have.
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Male 418
"I always save the wormiest can for Christmas time." Says the media mongers that needs something to talk about besides war, poverty, and general unhappiness around the world. Because nothing says Merry Christmas with a debate about something that has to do with the holiday. Why don`t we ever go after other religious holidays? If Atheists don`t believe in any of them why not equally try and disprove them? You never see a billboard posted about how Neo-Pagen Wiccan`s age old beliefs are myth.
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Male 1,399
A sample from my post on their blog:

What believer do you think you’re going to convince when you lead with an insult? Is that how you start conversations with people you are trying to persuade? “You’re full of poo and a dupe, now, let’s talk about the truth.”

I couldn’t think of worse publicity for your organization, or for atheists in general.

Speaking for myself, I don’t like your organization. I celebrate reason every day, and don’t need someone blowing $20k on a sign to spread the word – like a church – on my behalf. I don’t need groups, meetings, or affirmation from others to be an atheist. I don’t need magazines. I don’t need TV shows. I don’t need you making asses of us all.
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Male 2,121
I have no problem with Atheists in general, believe what you want to believe. I can`t expect people to respect my beliefs if I don`t respect theirs. But when Atheists start evangelising their views it`s just not right. You can`t complain about people forcing their religion on you and your children when you do the same.
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Male 1,505
Why would atheists need a support group? There`s a lot of poo I don`t believe in but I don`t need a social circle that revolves around mutual disbelief.
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Male 684
the difference between atheist and those following a religion is simply this. Atheists don`t try to pass laws to make you do what they believe GOD told them is right. Religious folk seem to be either incapable or unwilling to employ logic and reason in their understanding of the universe at large, and my personal experience is that if you do not have the same deluded understanding as them, you are considered wrong and ignorant.
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Male 1,016
“I don’t think that’s right. We don’t go around telling them what we think about [atheists], so why should they put up something like that,” another man said.

That is the funniest statement I have heard in a very very long time ...christians not calling out anyone who doesn`t believe like they do .....obviously this person doesn`t leave their house very often !!!
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Male 705
This season, celebrate reason.
I bet you`ll still be stuffing your face and opening presents, you hypocritical douchebags.
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Male 742
"Santa Claus isn`t real either."

You shut the your goddamn mouth right now.
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Male 1,399
Atheists like this make atheists like me look bad.

We don`t need groups, or meetings, or billboards, or people speaking on our behalf. Who do they think they`re convincing with this insult?
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Male 1,623
""This billboard demonstrates that atheism is a prejudice, just like homophobia"


Wait wait wait...lmao

Someone is equating Atheism with homophobia?

Being an Atheist is somehow a form of prejudice?

I have the biggest shiite eating grin on my face right now...because that has to be one of the most ludicrous statements I have heard/read.

I don`t believe in the existence of "God" therefore I am prejudiced? Against whom? God?

Man...whoever wrote that..thanks so much, and Angilion, thank you for commenting on it because I would not have seen it otherwise.

That will just have me snickering all dang day."

Yes.
It is usually prejudice that is the cause of religion. Reason is what turns one away from it.
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Male 395
Santa Claus isn`t real either.
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Male 38,035
St. Nicholas is the patron saint of whores.

And he has what, exactly, to do with the birth of Jesus which (if it did happen) had to have happened in late summer early autumn a thousand years earlier and on a differant contenant?
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Male 2,868
I do not believe that the forces which created and which continue to shape our Universe care a lick about the fate of human beings any more than they care about the fate of anything else- all things that come into being are ultimately destroyed. That is at THE CORE of my belief in the importance of human beings choosing to love one another and care for one another selflessly. It is why I give money to charitable organizations, why I worked for four years caring for the elderly, and why I`m studying now to become a nurse.

While people are definitely inspired to good deeds by religion, all too often they have the ulterior motive of converting people. Christian groups will make homeless people listen to a sermon as a condition of receiving food or clothing. Missionaries will go abroad to build houses for people or bring medicine, but they never forget to bring plenty of bibles.

I`ve never heard of an atheist spreading atheism while giving food to the hungry.
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Male 108
egh, cry me a river Atheist
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Male 886
"This billboard demonstrates that atheism is a prejudice, just like homophobia"


Wait wait wait...lmao

Someone is equating Atheism with homophobia?

Being an Atheist is somehow a form of prejudice?

I have the biggest shiite eating grin on my face right now...because that has to be one of the most ludicrous statements I have heard/read.

I don`t believe in the existence of "God" therefore I am prejudiced? Against whom? God?

Man...whoever wrote that..thanks so much, and Angilion, thank you for commenting on it because I would not have seen it otherwise.

That will just have me snickering all dang day.
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Male 2,229
rather ballsy to put that in a fundamentalist nation
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Male 812
This is the most atheist christian celebration there is. Just blind greed and materialism.
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Male 2,220
Assumption is the mother of all religions.
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Male 3,285
gorgack2000
Male, 13-17, Europe
4237 Posts Tuesday, November 30, 2010 4:19:56 AM
I hate people who refuse to accept any other theory on the creation of the universe other than the one they believe, people who go out into the street and attack people who don`t follow their beliefs, brainwash their children into thinking their way then claiming that all other beliefs are wrong and should be exterminated.
-------------------

So you hate everyone then
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Male 4,680
I hate people who refuse to accept any other theory on the creation of the universe other than the one they believe, people who go out into the street and attack people who don`t follow their beliefs, brainwash their children into thinking their way then claiming that all other beliefs are wrong and should be exterminated.
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Male 18
tiss the season to consume
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Male 2,841
Some people are no better than those they despise.
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Female 412
Also, what if a kid sees it and thinks it`s about santa?! Poor kid.
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Female 412
Oh for goodness sake, best thing to do is not react to muppets who do things like that (on both sides of the scale).
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Male 10
"...2000 years of love, peace and promise..." Yeh right xD
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Male 2,050
Atheism is to religion like bald is to hair color.
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Male 725
I`m an atheist, but now it`s just getting ridiculous. I hate people who are preachy about their religion.
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Male 58
Atheists have become what they despised. They are using Christian tactics to fight Christianity, tactics they once criticized. Atheism is nothing special, its just another `religion` using religion tactics to get followers.
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Male 5,609
"What atheists rarely do is tie good deeds to atheism, and that`s what you`re asking for. We do good deeds because they`re good, not because they help spread atheism."

It is true: I give to charity because I DO NOT believe there is any great guiding power in the world. I never considered a direct correlation of the words "charity" and "atheism" until a moment ago when I read you.
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Male 54
Christians need to realize that the world no longer dances to the beat of their drum. You cannot have it one-way.

If it`s OK for a town to place a nativity scene on the front lawn of city hall then it`s also OK for somebody to post a billboard like the one shown here.

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Female 803
I`d say wasted effort. Atheists and non-theistic religions already know that it`s a myth. If someone doesn`t know this already, then chances are it will only offend if they care at all, and then the atheists are looked at as the bad guys.
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Male 12,365
[quote]This billboard demonstrates that atheism is a prejudice, just like homophobia.[/quote]

I`m just quoting this to laugh at your ridiculous irrational bigotry again. You`re as ludicrously raving against atheism as some people are against homosexuality. It`s you who`s like those people.
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Male 12,365
[quote]However, I have yet to see a good deed performed by any atheist organization. If you can bring me evidence of that, I may change my opinion of them.[/quote]

Numerous atheists do good deeds. If you think about it, it makes much more sense for atheists to do it than for Christians to do it. Christians believe this life is a tiny little part of their whole life, so they can`t really consider it that important. What does it matter if people die in war or famine if this life is only a miniscule fraction of their whole life? On the other hand, hardly any atheists believe in an afterlife. So this life is all we have, which makes it far more important than it would be if it`s only a trifling speck of a whole life.

What atheists rarely do is tie good deeds to atheism, and that`s what you`re asking for. We do good deeds because they`re good, not because they help spread atheism.

Many charities are themselves atheist in that they`re not religious.
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Male 12,365
[quote]Hate to break it to you Nubblins, but you`re an atheist, an agnostic atheist to be precise.

Because you see, gnosis and theism are not mutually exclusive ideas yet are true dichotomies. [/quote]

Thank goodness for someone who knows what the words actually mean and who can explain it succinctly. Saves me having to do it for the billionth time.
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Female 7,842
Ok- over here, nobody much cares if you believe in god. If you try and bring your faith into conversation you are considered a bit weird. But- small children at school are still taught that the birth of christ as portrayed in the gospels actually happened. Nobody seriously thinks those accounts are historical fact- but somehow we neglect to get that one past our children. Usually they grow out of it- just like Father Christmas- but both are fables and should be presentented as such. An Adult who honestly believed in Father Christmas is plain odd.
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Male 2,868
Also, Mandingo, Batmanners pointed it out in another thread, but I`ll reinforce it here- please use punctuation. PLEASE. I mean you don`t use any comas, or even periods, but then you drop one of these: "???" Really???
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Male 145
I`m not against Christianity, or any organized religion for that matter. Actually, I read an awesome article in a progressive Christian magazine (Relevant) that compared bars to churches. It said something very important, "People go to bars and churches for the same reason. Neither is better than the other, and hypocrites and drunks both look awful in the daylight."

I believe that organized religion can offer some great lessons to those who listen, but when the message moves from love and tolerance to hate and prejudice (as a good number of denominations have these days), it becomes counterproductive.

Like a great bumper sticker once said: "I have nothing against Jesus, but his fan club scares the poo out of me"
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Male 2,868
@mandingo3519
While I think this billboard is silly, I can answer your question: Because a world in which people base what they believe on reason is preferable to a world where people base what they believe on faith. A person can have faith in anything if it resonates with them, even if it doesn`t stand up to a logical analysis. This is benign when a person has faith that God said we should be kind to one another (although I believe the same thing without believing in the Bible or any other religious text). But people use faith to justify atrocity all the time. Tell me the last time someone justified murdering a bunch of innocent people without relying on some kind of faith-based ideology. (Keep in mind that faith doesn`t necessarily imply religion. Nationalism can be just as irrational and dangerous as religious fanaticism, and relies on some measure of faith in the idea that a person`s country is inherently right or superior to others).
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Male 192
i am a christian never denied that but i do want to point out one little thing i find funny to all the agnostic atheist antitheses and any other non christian trolls ( there are those who dont spread their opinions kinda like me) why is it you bitch about Christians shoving out believes down your thoughts but its ok to shove yours down ours??? just a little question if any of you dare to answer
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Male 1,548
Why are these atheist organizations so stupid? That`s the best they can come up with? This is a horrible attempt at trolling. All that will happen is the Fox News pundits will complain about it for an hour, then forget it. Get some F*cking writers to do this kind of thing for you.
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Male 1,557
Judeo-Christian Mythology always amuses me.
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Male 483
NottaSpy,

Should I admit that I`ve made mistakes?
should I remind you I`ve done this before?
Wanna see my...shiny new shoes?

What should I do?

Seriously though, I agree completely.
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Male 881
[quote]Why do they care?[/quote]
Maybe they care for the same reason most of the world doesn`t want to see nukes in the hands of radical Muslim nation like Iran. The coming technologies will make nuke look like tinker toys. I would hate to see those technologies in the hands of people who can`t even accept Evolution.

Maybe they can`t stand to see the hate filled messages coming out of the church that destroys lives.

Maybe they are tired of politicians who hide behind their religion while leading immoral lives and all while crafting public policy.

Maybe they are sick of the powerful church protecting child molesters.

Maybe they just want people to have better lives and know that you don`t need an angry, vengeful God or an ancient fairy tale to lead a moral and ethical life.
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Male 2,868
Everybody just needs to shut the drat up and eat mushrooms together.
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Male 15,832
Why do they care?
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Male 936
[quote]
This billboard demonstrates that atheism is a prejudice, just like homophobia.
[/quote]

a few things

first...most homophobes are Christians, lol

second...this billboard isnt any more "prejudice" than one saying "merry christmas" or "god bless everyone"


the bill board is just saying what a large number of people are already thinking. I am agnostic, I see xmas as more of a national holiday than a religious one...and i wish athiests did too. xmas is about giving, sharing, and love. you dont need a god for that, but you dont need to rain on someones parade if they feel they do.
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Male 1,834
LOLZ
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Male 1,292
I`m an athiest, I celebrate christmas not for the religious aspects, but for the tradition, for the time with family and friends, and for the kick-ass turkey.

That being said my mother is a christian minister, and neither of my parents have a problem with my stance.

Coexistence is a relatively new concept in society, one that people are still learning, and some just need a little bit longer to learn.

Until then though, I like to fill pipes with green stuff that has red and/or orange strands of decorations all over it and is usually dusted with some white crystal like substance... very christmas-y.

I do find it odd that there is not a sign saying `You know its a myth` depicting a Jewish, Islamic, etc depiction, come on atheists of america, get on top of that poo
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Male 12,138
[quote]davymid`s dream of a world without religion is comparable to any homophobe`s dream of a world without GLBTQ people. [/quote]
Just because I personally think the world would be better without religion doesn`t mean that this would ever happen, nor should I strive for it to happen. And to compare atheists` distaste for religion to homophobes` distaste for GLBTQ is a gross distortion of reality. Religion (at its worst) convinces people to fly planes into building. GLBTQ people harm no-one, the only possibly way people can find it offensive is that they personally find it kind of icky, and that their personal Holy Book calls it an abomination.
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Male 12,138
[quote]Atheism is a prejudice, and nothing more. [/quote]
Actually, atheism by its very definition, is a lack of belief in any gods. Christians are atheist too, in that they (presumably) don`t believe in Odin, Thor, Apollo, Zeus, the FSM. Atheists like me just believe in one less god than Christians do. It`s not that different, really.
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Male 179
i`m jewish. but do i believe jesus was born in bethleham? yeah i do. it`s not a question of whether it happened or not, it`s whether he was G-d incarnate or not. to say that he didn`t exist is pretty retarded. history supports the existence of the man jesus.

atheists really need to mind their own business and let everyone believe what they want to believe, instead of proselytizing just like the religion they claim to be different from. why are they bothering jews? judaism doesn`t even try to spread the religion.
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Male 1,054
This billboard demonstrates that atheism is a prejudice, just like homophobia.

Homophobes routinely routinely say to gays and lesbians "you know what you are doing is sick" - lying about our knowledge of our lives to our faces. This is exactly what the atheist billboard does.

Atheism is a prejudice, and nothing more. davymid`s dream of a world without religion is comparable to any homophobe`s dream of a world without GLBTQ people.

Like homophobes, atheists use distorted or cherry-picked data to support their claims, as kougaiji has aptly demonstrated.
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Male 2,402
@Crucible
That`s a generalized statement. The fact that your viewing this site via your monitor is due to Philo Farnsworth.
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Male 1,054
"Athiests are jerks just like Christians. They`re just better educated."

No.

Here`s the thing, atheists and Christians, and religious people in general, are all fallible, inperfect beings who make mistakes and get things right, who help and harm others, who are selfish and generous, etc.

But, Christians and religious people in general realize that they are imperfect, flawed, in need of improvement.

Atheists think they are not just flawless and exempt from any moral/ethical standard, but better than everyone else as well.
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Male 12,138
Ah, IrishJesus beat me to it while I was typing. Yeah, what he said.
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Male 12,138
Meh, I think it`s kinda lame. As I`ve said before, I`m not just atheist, I`m openly anti-theist. I genuinely DO think the world would be better off without religion in it. But I know that`s never going to happen.

If Christian people want to celebrate Christmas as a Christian holiday, then who the hell is anyone to tell them different? I for one woulndn`t be putting up billboards denouncing groups of people, even if I personally think their beliefs are wrong. Live and let live, man.

As long as religion stays out of human rights (e.g. gay rights in America, women`s rights in the Islamic world), and stays the f*ck out of the science classroom, then I have no beef if people worship a giant celestial potato.

Christmas is Christmas - to me, it means time with family, merriment and gift-giving. It`s my favourite time of year. I say roll with it, whatever it means to you personally.

Maybe I`m just not a very good atheist...

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Male 483
I think it`s funny when Christians say they "don`t push their beliefs on Atheists, so why do they?" I`m agnostic Atheist, and when I`m asked what my religion is, I`m always ready to hear the backlash.

In my experience, only one Christian has nodded and accepted that I came to my own conclusion and left it there. My WASP family was not part of that accepting group (of 1) and instead pretend I`m still Christian. I say only discuss your religion if asked to and accept everyone else`s choice. I`m so tired of being told I`m going to hell, I`m an anarchist blasphemer, or that I`m immoral just because of my religious view.

Christians, stop pretending Atheists are attacking you without provocation. Atheists, stop pretending that this billboard and behavior like it are is the right idea. Just show respect, people.
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Male 2,868
@Kougaiji
Yeah, you`ve got a point- there is definitely a lot of negative spin put on stories about atheists in the news. But seriously, Fred Phelps getting news coverage does a lot more harm to the image of Christians than a story about atheists calling the story of Christmas a Myth, or trying to remove "God" from the pledge of allegiance. He`s a straight-up hate-monger. I don`t think I`ve ever seen a story about an atheist using atheism as justification for hating anyone. I have to admit, my own perception of Christians has largely been shaped by people like Phelps, Pat Robertson, Jerry Falwell, and their ilk- it`s taken me a long time to come to terms with the fact that they only represent a small fraction of Christians.
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Male 1,815
Athiests are jerks just like Christians. They`re just better educated.
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Male 4
I don`t get it, why does it make it a flame war, or in fact any kind of war when people give their opinions?

I`ve found this comment thread quite interesting so far and it seems to be much more civilised than most discussions of this type I`ve seen, so kudos to all!
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Male 154
hahaha thats really funny. i am forced to look at a ridiculous amount of christian billboards that basically say believe or burn, so this is fair game to.
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Male 541
Stelly: Not necessarily so. Anti-theists OPPOSE the notion of a God/supreme being. It has nothing to do with "preaching".

For teh record, Christmas is not only a myth, it is a corporate holiday. Jesus was not born in December...
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Male 236
Nothing wrong with this, plenty of religious billboards out there. But Atheists aren`t allowed to say they`re tired of christians imposing their beliefs anymore.
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Male 496
Ah damn, I don`t know why I get involved on these wars. I really don`t care what people have to say, I just like putting my two cents in. Oh well. I`m sure that I`m just wrong and whoever responds (if anyone) to my comment is right. You win. Goodnight.
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Male 496
@nubblins
I`ve always said that atheism is as much a belief system as anything else.
The fact of the matter is that if you choose to believe that things must be proven in order to be real, then that is your gravy, not mine. So please don`t put it on my potatoes unless I ask for it. Even though I wouldn`t put any money on any major religions being correct, I`m not such a theolitist (hehe, you know like elitist?) to think I have any clue what is true. Either way, things of a spiritual nature are not falsifiable, so comparing to science is a bit like apples and oranges, people.

Really the thing that gets me is this overwhelming desire to prove religion wrong. We get it, someone yelled at you once and told you that you were going to hell and that really hurt your feelings. Here`s a band-aid and some yogurt, now get over it. And I know there are some Bible thumpers much worse but that doesn`t really make it ok, does it?
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Female 4,447
What I want to know is why this is newsworthy. You don`t see articles about the latest pro-religion billboards, of which there is an insanely disproportionate number. So, on the one hand I applaud this group for exercising their relatively unpopular belief, but, again, I question why it is such a big deal.
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Male 604
xKiesix

UNICEF is secular
Amnesty International
Doctors without borders
Donors Choose
Oxfam
Kiva
Treatment Action Campaign

pretty much any charity that is not "religious"

There is not atheist church xKiesix, there is no "united atheist organization" that spreads atheist-only money to children in africa. Atheists donate to a variety of causes and fit into a variety of demographics. You can`t categorize and lump everything together and compare absolutely everything.
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Female 448
Hm. Well, I`ll admit you proved me wrong. Still, I don`t believe this billboard accomplishes anything but causing anger. Provoking those who don`t believe in the same thing will not help your cause. You shouldn`t bash another`s beliefs. Especially because these are very personal matters. Public displays like this annoy me because it`s doing absolutely nothing helpful.
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Male 7,599
yay, another holy war in the forums of IAB. dont mind me, please continue.
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Female 448
@Nexus
Actually, I live in a swing-state. This campus is about equal parts liberal and conservative. I think what it more comes down to is that the Christians tend to be older people who will be escorted off campus if they start trouble whereas the young student protesters cannot be escorted off the property and they feel a sense of entitlement.

I got approached by a pro-choicer the other day to donate to the clinic. I told her politely, no thanks, I`m pro-life. She in turn kept trying to convince me to donate, following me down the street.

Personally, I think group donations tend to be better than individual acts. Especially because it leads to higher amounts of money, food, and clothes given to those in need. Individual acts are good, I am in no way denying that, but group donations bring in more. If Atheists can pool together money for a giant billboard, surely they can pull money together for the needy, cures for diseases, etc.
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Male 604
5Cats
You read no other comments
state no facts
and constantly insult


You are a troll and I respond to no content you post.
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Male 604
sbeelz
I`m not saying they get NO coverage. What I`m saying is that atheists get proportionally far more critical and negative coverage than extremist religious folk. Atheists make up a tiny proportion of the American population (not so in most of the West) and pretty much every new atheist organization opening, every new billboard, gets a ton of coverage. Drive down I-35 in texas and you`ll get plenty of "REPENT NOW" billboards that were never in the news.
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Male 37,033
The Church Of Atheism - at it again!
"I believe I don`t believe in anything" (their motto)
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Male 2,868
@xKiesix-
Actually, most of the time when I see Athiests in the news, they`re trying to prevent Christians from teaching the Book of Genesis as Science in Schools, or trying to prevent public funding from being used for non-secular purposes. They`re usually playing defense, not offense.

@Kougaiji- I don`t know what you`re talking about- I see religious fanatics get coverage on the news pretty regularly. Also, I`ve never had a Christian scream at me that I`m going to hell. Usually they tell me that with a smile. That`s when I tell them that if that`s the game God really wants to play, I`m not playing, and then I walk away.
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Male 586
If Atheism is a religion, not collecting stamps is a hobby.
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Male 317
Why doesn`t anyone know the difference between being Atheist, Agnostic, or Anti-Theist. Ahhhh...

I`ll clarify for you:
Atheist: Don`t believe in god.
Agnostic: You don`t know if god is real or not.
Anti-theist: You preach atheism and try to convert.

Now continue the flame war correctly....
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Male 604
@xKiesix
Come to texas and you`ll get plenty of bible thumpers. Especially at UT and most large liberal campuses

On Atheist contributions:
http://www.kiva.org/community
the atheist community group has donated more to microloans than any other group, religious or otherwise.

Bill Gates is atheist and gives more than any man, and most nations, in the world.

Plenty of good deeds are done by atheist scientists every day.

Atheists don`t give a lot to "christian" charities that benifit missions and churches, but to secular ones they do. UNICEF, for example.

I`ll continue listing but here`s the first reply before your post scrolls too far down
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Female 136
@xKiesix
I get told I`m going to hell daily. You must live in a conservative region if you don`t get told that, I live in a liberal region and I never hear stuff from pro-choicers, etc, but that`s because each side targets the audience/region they want to convert.

And to be honest, atheists tend to act as individuals, not as a group when it comes to good deeds. Probably because most groups are more about discussions than actually getting things done. Whereas most religious groups mostly have individuals that do good deeds because they feel they have to, not because they want to. It works out just fine in the end.
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Male 2,893
We all know Christmas is the day Santa Claus was born. I don`t know where all this Jesus stuff came from.
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Male 317
Nothing like a religious post to fire everyone up. Stop arguing! Humans have been fighting about religion since day 1. Do you really think your sesquipedalian posts are going to convince anyone to convert???? (yes, pun intended)
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Female 448
@Kougaiji
Actually, they don`t scream that I`m going to hell. In fact, all they do is hand out New Testaments and say "God Bless". In fact, I`ve received more screaming taunts from Socialists, Environmentalists, Pro-Choicers, and Animal-Cruelty protesters. I got screamed at the other day because some girl with multi-colored hair threw a Pro-Socialism flyer in my face (freaked me out a little) and when I threw it out she called me a "Fascist Hag".

However, I do believe there are extremist Christians, Jews, and Islams. However, I have yet to see a good deed performed by any atheist organization. If you can bring me evidence of that, I may change my opinion of them. Honestly though, it`s not about how the media portrays them. The media did not tell them to post this billboard. They did.
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Male 164
Isn`t this basically what Christians do? "If you don`t believe in the same thing as i do, you`re wrong." Atheism is the new Christianity!
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Male 2,440
Kougaiji wins. Sorry, nubblins.
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Male 604
"Why is it whenever atheists are in the media, they are always angry and trying to convert people? Why not donate to help your fellow man instead of spending so much money to piss on someone else`s beliefs?"

Because that`s the way media portrays atheists. The media doesn`t show you the bible thumpers on campus every other week screaming at everyone for going to hell. The media doesn`t display every Westboro Baptist Church field trip. The media doesn`t touch scientology. The media doesn`t touch the thousands of bible-verse billboards and pro-christian billboards all over the states. The media doesn`t challenge tax-exempt mega-churches.

But the media attacks every single attempt by an atheist organization to gain members or spread their ideology.

Stop listening to the media.
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Female 3,001
whos embarrassed to be an atheist? you never have to justify your belief (or lack of one...) as an atheist, or at least not where I live
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Male 2,868
"I don`t think that`s right. We don`t go around telling them what we think about"

Funniest. Quote. Ever.
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Female 448
Why is it whenever atheists are in the media, they are always angry and trying to convert people? Why not donate to help your fellow man instead of spending so much money to piss on someone else`s beliefs?
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Male 604
PS: Capitalism ruined the holiday a long time before atheists did.
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Male 604
(contd)
Agnostics are atheists as well. They see the same 1/91238489743 chance that any religion is right and realize there is no way possible to actually pick a right one, so you give up on these silly belief systems. You say you don`t know. Atheists also say we don`t KNOW, but in the sense that we can`t prove that there ISN`T an invisible pink unicorn hiding behind the sun. and we don`t know there ISN`T Thor, and Zeus, and Lord Xenu, but we`re gonna take a shot in the dark and go with what has empirical proof most of the time.
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Male 604
@nubblins
aka passionate im-better-than-thou agnostic

Atheism
a _ theism
a- Greek: a prefix meaning: no, absence of, without, lack of, not
theism: the doctrine or belief in the existence of a God or gods

atheism = "lack of" + "belief in existence of god or gods" = lack of belief in existence of god or gods

in other words, you fail nubblins.

Out of the billions of religions, cults, beliefs, rituals, doctrines that have existed throughout history, most are incompatible with each other; others, just plain flat out wrong; others yet say you must believe theirs or else you go to hell. Effectively, you have a 1/59542234534 chance of being born into the right place and time to "be right". By saying we are atheist, we see this number, and realize the chance is pretty much 0 anyway that the religions are correct. We prescribe, if to anything, only to that which can be empirically tested, theorized, and challenged.
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Male 886
If there is a God I am going to kick his ass if I seem him after I kick the bucket.
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Male 734
“I don’t think that’s right. We don’t go around telling them what we think about [atheists], so why should they put up something like that,” another man said.

Ummm, yes. Yes, you have. I see at least ten christian-based billboards on my way to work every day.
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Male 5,609
"Leave it to atheists to try and ruin the season for everyone."
Until we get National Porn Day, Masturbation Day, Foreplay Eve and Sexmas Day off from work,
PISS ON YOUR HOLIDAY!!!

Young Girl: "Sorry, I can`t come in. Last night was Sexmas and it was anal for 10 hour straight..."
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Male 147
Hate to break it to you Nubblins, but you`re an atheist, an agnostic atheist to be precise.

Because you see, gnosis and theism are not mutually exclusive ideas yet are true dichotomies.

In fact, most atheists including Richard Dawkins and Christopher Hitchens grant the possibility that a god or gods could exist.
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Male 881
DixxyRarr wins this one.
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Male 147
@jamie76 - "it meets all of the criteria. They strongly believe in something they cannot prove"

Wow, first point and you`re already wrong. Atheism in its most inclusive form is simply rejecting someone else`s claim. If that`s a religion than so is disbelieving in Santa Clause.
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Female 1,743
Atheism isn`t defined as `lack of belief` though.
I, being an agnostic, have a `lack of belief.`
I don`t recognize any gods, but I don`t deny the possibility.
Atheism is when you`re SURE there is no God or gods.
I`d say it`s pretty ballsy to be SURE there is or is not any God or gods with no proof, just as one could say you`re SURE there in fact IS a God and his name is Jesus and likes to listen to everyone all the time and grant your wishes and things.

Now there is proof that there is gravity and inertia. Those are the kind of things I can get behind. :P
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Female 2,674
I`ll solve this problem: Let`s get rid of billboards. Whew! That was easy. Next!
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Male 5,609
RICK!!!
[quote]
-...celebration of The birth of Jesus...
-Santa... put up a tacky reindeer...
-Put up a tree, put up some icicle lights...[/quote]
Dude! Those are symbols from 2 different religions and the legend made of the lives several different Samaritans.
You`ve been looking at them for so long that they run together and you aren`t even noticing what each means!
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Male 505
"It takes just as much blind faith to be sure that there are no divine forces ruling the universe"

That`s not true for me. I have a lack of belief in a diety. Faith requires a belief, where mine is a lack of belief.
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Male 1,195

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Female 1,743
Firstly, I am an agnostic and I trust the laws of physics more than blind faith.

Secondly, It takes just as much blind faith to be sure that there are no divine forces ruling the universe as it does to believe in any Christian myth. One could have faith in flying spaghetti monsters, Hitler, Woden, Jesus, Batman, Chtulu, or Allah.. it doesn`t matter--they`re all personal beliefs, and making a giant billboard promoting your view is like trying to be the loudest in a room of screaming lunatics.

Thirdly, science is not a religion.
Science is not a belief.
Science just tests and reaffirms what we can know from the physical world (regardless of how it got here).
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Male 881
@jamie76, thank you for demonstrating what a strawman argument looks like. You tell atheists what their beliefs are and then you attack them based on that definition.

The truth is Atheism is not a religion. Atheists do not conform to your definition and your definition of religion isn`t even right. So you have basically attacked nobody for nothing.

As for their motives for putting up the sign, I can only guess. But my guess would be that religion fosters hate and ignorance when the success of the human race is quickly becoming dependent upon respect and reason.
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Male 1,081
Am I still an Atheist if I don`t follow science blindly?
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Male 505
"that is the definition of a religion. "

Erm no

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Male 505
"Yeah, the laws of physics."

Damn atheists enforcing gravity on us righteous folk! Making our children believe that we`re made out of loadsa iddy biddy things.
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Male 38,035
Samsquanch, "We have been told for centuries that gravity pulls down because of a fundamental universal force. The fact of the matter is, we don`t know for sure."

Maybe you are right. Perhaps gravity really does not exist at all. Why don`t you go jump off a cliff and find out.

Let us know how that works out for you.
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Male 2,345
Atheism is a religion.

it meets all of the criteria. They strongly believe in something they cannot prove, they denounce other groups with strong beliefs, they hold meetings to discuss their beliefs and recruit others into their cause.

that is the definition of a religion.

what i dont get is why they care if other people have a religious belief? serious case of Douchebaggery trying to turn believers into non-believers...
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Female 275
@Rick
Santa is secular, Jesus is non-secular.
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Male 3,315
Christmas is a two faced holiday. On the one hand, there is the Christian celebration of The birth of Jesus. On the other hand is the non-secular Santa based celebration. I`ve always believed that ANYONE and EVERYONE can celebrate Santa`s Christmas. Put up a tree, put up some icicle lights, put up a tacky reindeer in the front yard. Have a ball. It doesn`t matter if you`re Christian, Atheist, Agnostic, Jewish, Muslim, Hindu, Native American, or whatever! Everyone can celebrate the love and caring and sharing of Santa`s Christmas.
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Male 121
The point of science is to CONSTANTLY doubt what you are taught and seek the truth through investigations and experiments. When new information is found is it used to modify and change existing theories, providing us with a better understanding of our world. Scientists aren`t pushing any agendas or forcing ideas down our throats. Rather, they are simply telling the world what they know and what they don`t know.
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Female 1,743
Billboard is such a waste of money. Clearly rubber band bracelets are where it`s at. Wouldn`t you rather indoctrinate children into blindly believing what you tell them with colorful, trendy, rubber jewelry? owait.
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Male 542
Myth: a traditional story accepted as history; serves to explain the world view of a people -Princeton Online Dictionary

We`ve been over this.. I attend a religious school, English teachers openly proclaim the Bible as a culmination of our mythos. Never does it mean that none of it`s true, though it always seem to be implied..
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Male 2,440
[quote]Anything that can be proven by personal experience is a scientific fact. That`s the exact definition of science.[/quote]
Hate to nitpick, SarahofBorg, but that ain`t science.
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Male 17,512
Leave it to atheists to try and ruin the season for everyone.
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Female 3,562
No Samsquanch, because I haven`t bothered to read the whole 3 pages of commentary. I`m not following your links anyway.
And simply because science doesn`t fully explain every detail of a theory doesn`t make it unscientific. Sure, we don`t understand why the laws of physics exist, or even exactly what gravity is, but that doesn`t mean it DOESN`T EXIST AT ALL. Unless you think we live in the matrix and reality is a lie, in which case for all you know YOU`RE God. Any damn thing is possible if you have no faith in empirical evidence. Anything that can be proven by personal experience is a scientific fact. That`s the exact definition of science. Whereas faith claims to explain the universe based on nothing that any single person can experience. I can`t talk to God, therefore I don`t have any scientific proof he exists. But I can choose to believe he exists anyway because I believe there are things that exist beyond what I can personally experience myself. That`s faith.
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Male 118
Well if there can be Christmas billboards, don`t go and tell me there can`t be anti-Christmas ones..
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Female 1,743
Yey, IAB flame wars.
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Male 721
Meh, I`m atheist but this was just kinda stupid. I say just let people believe what they want to believe as long as it`s not directly affecting someone else negatively. Some of these "closet" atheists don`t directly believe in god or a god but they are a part of a religion because they want to know or just think that there is something after death.
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Male 12,365
[quote]You do realize, Angilion, that it`s possible that Einstein may have been wrong? [/quote]

Yes, of course. In fact, he was wrong. More than once, but most famously with the cosmological constant.

You`re mistaking me for yourself. I`m not arguing that Einstein should be automatically believed and treated as infallible. Quite the opposite - I`m arguing *against* belief. You`re assuming that I think the same way you do. I don`t. I do not treat science as religion.
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Male 792
You do realize, Angilion, that it`s possible that Einstein may have been wrong?

Take a look at the links I`ve posted. The universe you were taught in school isn`t necessarily the only possibility out there. Yet, it`s continued to be rammed down the masses` throats because it`s more convenient to teach it that way.

Through out my education, I was taught the Bohr model of the atom. It wasn`t until high school that I was introduced to the possibility that that model was wrong. And even the quantum model that we were proposed in high school may even be wrong.
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Male 12,365
[quote] [quote">It`s reality that`s forcing the laws of physics on you. Science simply describes them.[/quote">

Not necessarily true.[/quote]

Yes, necessarily true. You quote one article hypothesising a solution to the incompatibilities between quantum theory and relatavistic theory and one hypothesis that a constant might vary by a millionth over vast distances.

Neither of which in any way supports your belief that scientists create the laws of physics and force them on people.

Do you realise that you`re arguing that scientists are your god, the creator of the universe?
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Male 7,599
i see no problem with this at all. they are just voicing their opinion. who here has not run into one of those "blah blah blah -God" billboards?
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Male 2,561
let them alienate them self`s. if they think that was a good move their group wont go very far.
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Male 792
[quote]electricity, gravity, inertia, and other such purely scientific concepts is completely provable to any person who has faith in empirical evidence[/quote]

No, what you`re doing is following a set of instructions someone else decided was "easy enough for the masses to understand".

Did you even look at the links I posted? There is a growing community of scientists (yes, scientists) out there who question the fact that our universe is a lonely little three-dimensional object flowing through one temporal plane on a fixed path.

We have been told for centuries that gravity pulls down because of a fundamental universal force. The fact of the matter is, we don`t know for sure. Yet teachers, and professors continue to teach people to believe this way.
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Male 2,440
Way to make atheists look like a bunch of Scrooges, American Atheists (of NJ? Whatever). D*ck move. A real d*ck move.
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Male 12,365
[quote]You do realize that every scientific theory out there is just speculation[/quote]

Thank you for so eloquently demonstrated that you don`t have the slightest idea what you`re talking about and are totally ignorant of science. Your criticism of science is obviously as ridiculous and meaningless as a dog`s criticism of Shakespeare`s plays.

To say that an explanation that could be proven wrong if it is wrong and that has been tested in various ways by numerous people trying to prove it wrong and failing and which correctly predicts what will happen in specific circumstances is "just speculation" is truly ridiculous.
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Male 176
<i>"Even though I`m an atheist, I get pissed off by atheists pushing their non-religion in others faces as just as much as christians pushing their beliefs.


Exactly. Atheists pushing their beliefs on others is just as deplorable as Christians doing the same."</i>

Totally agree.
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Male 12,365
[quote]You believe everything scientists have ever told you?[/quote]

Science doesn`t require belief. In fact, it discourages it. The first thing that happens to any piece of science is repeated attempts to prove it wrong.

I recall a lecture from my childhood in which a team of young scientists attempted to prove c doesn`t exist and in doing so prove the theories of relativity wrong. If science was about belief, they would have been derided by other scientists for challenging such a fundamental part of physics. Instead, they were applauded. They were right to challenge it scientifically - that is what science is all about.

[quote]Even if we`re not even one sliver of an atom closer to understanding how the universe works than we did when we were throwing poo at each other?[/quote]

You might not be, but that`s only because you are so desperate to remain ignorant. Other people have learned.

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Female 3,562
Samsquanch, the majority of at least BASIC science that is the basis of our lives, such as electricity, gravity, inertia, and other such purely scientific concepts is completely provable to any person who has faith in empirical evidence. Just because you don`t believe in the theory gravity doesn`t mean that if you jump off a building you will fly. Although you COULD believe that the reason you fall to the earth is because God just didn`t want people to fly, and that`s all the explanation you need. You`d never build an airplane because you`d never question HOW to fly because you assume God simply doesn`t want you to.
Anyway, I`m not an athiest, because science has never set out to prove or disprove God. It literally has nothing to do with God. Why can`t both science and God co-exist?
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Male 792
[quote">It`s reality that`s forcing the laws of physics on you. Science simply describes them.[/quote">

Not necessarily true.
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Male 792
[quote]Even though I`m an atheist, I get pissed off by atheists pushing their non-religion in others faces as just as much as christians pushing their beliefs.[/quote]

Exactly. Atheists pushing their beliefs on others is just as deplorable as Christians doing the same.
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Male 12,365
[quote]"Can you think of one law that science is forcing down your christian throat?"

Yeah, the laws of physics.[/quote]

You canna break the laws of physics!

It`s reality that`s forcing the laws of physics on you. Science simply describes them.
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Male 12,365
[quote]my family doesn`t even celebrate what "Christmas" really is about. We just get together as a family and give each other presents :D no celebration of the rebirth of christ or w/e it is.[/quote]

You could argue that is what it`s really about. Saturnalia was always celebrated with family, goodwill to all, exchanges of gifts, drinking, feasting, partying, etc. Which is why Romans extended it to 7 days from the original one, even in the face of direct Imperial orders to shorten it. It was religious in origin - the original day was primarily to worship Saturn in his aspect as the god of farming - but the extra 6 days were largely secular. Riotous fun - class and social restrictions were ignored or reversed, so even consuls would discard their togas and dance in the streets, the youngest child or a slave would be head of the family, etc.
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Male 792
[quote]Can you think of one law that science is forcing down your christian throat?[/quote]

I`m not a Christian fundamentalist, if that`s what you`re getting at. I`m a liberal panentheist, who has a skeptical mind that believes that we can`t know the answers unless we answer them ourselves.

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Female 3,562
"Can you think of one law that science is forcing down your christian throat?"

Yeah, the laws of physics.
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Male 15,510
Myth or not, I say lets party just the same
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Female 74
Even though I`m an atheist, I get pissed off by atheists pushing their non-religion in others faces as just as much as christians pushing their beliefs.
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Male 792
...so, no scientist has ever pulled the wool over society`s eyes for personal gain? All the scientists at the pharmaceutical companies are doing what they`re doing for the good of mankind, and not the big-fat paycheque?
No one has ever hoodwinked people in order for a bite at the "Nobel apple"? You believe everything scientists have ever told you? Even if we`re not even one sliver of an atom closer to understanding how the universe works than we did when we were throwing poo at each other?
You do realize that every scientific theory out there is just speculation, and we really don`t understand how the universe works? We could be a holographic one or 10 dimensional.
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Male 244
@broizfam

I respect you greatly for that, unfortunately I see a lot of atheist people that are just as bad as those religious fanatics. Constantly telling people they are wrong, and to believe their beliefs.
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Male 38,035
Samsquanch - let`s not get stuck in stupid.

You can`t compare science and religion.
Science is backed up with fact and religion is what peple really really hope is real.

It`s not their faith that is bashed... it`s the way religious people expect everyone else to live by their standard. Legislation based on religious perspective that not everyone shares. Same-Sex marriage is only one example. Religion says "no" so the law says "no".

sooooo many other examples.

Can you think of one law that science is forcing down your christian throat?
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Male 2,436
Huh... so atheists are organised in their "beliefs"? This seems a contradiction to me. I was raised Catholic, went through 12 years of Catholic schools and I`m probably an atheist. But, whatever... I really don`t care. I had religion shoved down my throat and it didn`t work. Can I still have the day off for Christmas?
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Female 798
How do pooty billboards like that get approved? I hate religion-related billboards.
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Male 12,365
[quote]Oh, and Gerry1of1...this is exactly what I`m talking about. Look at all the people here bashing Christians for following the beliefs of another...but, for someone to post a "scientific" video, all hail Science![/quote]

It`s only religious anti-scientists who think of science in religious terms. Probably because they can`t think any other way.

Science earns its status by providing reliable answers and practical results. Religion just requires obedience. They`re not even similar things and it`s silly to pretend they are.
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Male 553
lol it`s funny cause it`s true.

my family doesn`t even celebrate what "Christmas" really is about. We just get together as a family and give each other presents :D no celebration of the rebirth of christ or w/e it is.
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Male 12,365
[quote]but there are written Roman records of His birth.[/quote]

No, there aren`t. Later in the 1st century, there are Roman records of the existence of Christianity. Not the same thing at all.

[quote]Granted no one knows the exact date of His birth, December 25th was convient, so they chose it as the day to celebrate His birth.[/quote]

Their own bible says it wasn`t any time during winter, so they knew it was the wrong date. Wrong if it was actually about his birth, which it wasn`t. It was about gaining power by usurping the existing major religions in Rome. The 25th of December was chosen because it was the date of the Sol Invictus, the midwinter celebration for Mithraism, and the general festivity and exchanging of gifts, plus the build-up to Christmas, was taken from Saturnalia, the traditional festival of ancient Roman religion, which ran from the 17th of December and more or less ran into Sol Invictus.

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Male 792
Oh, and Gerry1of1...this is exactly what I`m talking about. Look at all the people here bashing Christians for following the beliefs of another...but, for someone to post a "scientific" video, all hail Science!
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Female 277
That billboard is silly, let people believe in what they want
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Male 792
The so-called liberal community is more hypocritical than the Christians. The so-called liberals demand to be tolerant of races, creeds, and sexuality, but if someone has an opinion different than theirs, they suck and they`re stupid.

Am I a fundamentalist Christian? No. I`m liberally minded, who believes that everyone should have their voice, and make up their own decisions. Pushing your beliefs in someone`s face without an invititation (whether religious, or atheistic) is wrong.
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Male 422
@Nucleartoast @ChickoDee

There is a difference between the religious communtity and ultra-fundamentalist, foot washing baptists. I also know there is a difference between quiet and obedient atheists and obnoxious "You`re wrong" atheists. Jusst making sure you can see the difference between the two.
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Male 422
Ok, there are multiple things bothering me with this whole pic/comments.

1)Jesus Christ actually was born. There is no question about that. Not to that name obviously, but there are written Roman records of His birth. Granted no one knows the exact date of His birth, December 25th was convient, so they chose it as the day to celebrate His birth.
2)@Ru1n
What happened during the Crusades was not abnormal during that time period. Even though not everyone went on crusade just for religious reasons, an attack to regain a sacred religious city would have seemed ok for anyone in the Middle Ages. Now raping and pillaging was obviously frowned upon by the heirarchy of the church, but in reality they could not do much to prevent it.
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Female 3,562
Although come to think of it, why would an atheist even care? Being an atheist doesn`t automatically mean you HATE Christians. Why do atheists care that Christians are wrong? What does it matter to them? This sign is like an advertisement for atheism, but why does it even need advertising? Let people believe whatever the heck they want. Being rational is sometimes a miserable way to live.
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Female 3,562
HEY, if Christians can had billboards telling you that you`re going to hell if you don`t become like them, than Atheists have every right to say what they think too. This is nothing in comparison to the insane crap I`ve seen on Christian billboards.
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Male 541
:O
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Female 258
I`m with ChickODee, the religious community tends to be really hypocritical about these kinds of things
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Male 5,635
I am also an atheist. As an atheist I still disapprove of this sign. I have no problem with people of faith except with those few who try to push their faith onto me. It would be just as inappropriate for me to push my lack of faith onto others so I don`t, nor can I advocate this behavior by others.
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Male 136
well, i refuse to argue if the nativity story is myth or not, but celebration Christmas(as in the birth of Jesus and Christianity)in december is certainly `mythical` in nature.

If the story were to be true, Jesus was born near the middle of the year to early spring(may or june) and hence celebrating it in December is wrong.

The Catholic church intentionally started the celebration in December to coincide with the pagan festivals in Rome centring around the solstice to make it easier for people to feel comfortable when converting as their lives and routines wouldn`t change.
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Male 12,365
[quote]Uk nothing religous about christmas here anymore. I took my grandmother to the midnight mass. There was 16 of us.[/quote]

I think we should stop calling the midwinter festival "christmas". Leave that name for the Christians and keep the secular celebrations secular. Christians who want to celebrate Christ`s Mass can do so without having it confused with the midwinter festival, other theists can observe their midwinter rituals without them being confused with the midwinter festival or Christ`s Mass and everyone can celebrate the midwinter festival without confusing it with religion. Everyone wins. Maybe Christians will then try to celebrate Christ`s Mass on Christ`s birthday, if they can agree on when it was. Their own bible says it wasn`t during the winter, so they should be going with that.
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Male 44
@IchBinErica: Last I checked, Christianity didn`t really have the need to `advertise`. People pretty must just started going along with it after the Crusades and members of the Christian faith started killing and torturing people in record numbers for reasons they`re still attempting to justify, even to this day.
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Male 12,365
[quote]It`s a nice wholesome family holiday, and even though i am a none believer, it saddens me that the whole religious meaning is being lost over the years.[/quote]

I agree. Nobody celebrates the feast of the invincible sun properly any more.

You did know that`s the true religious meaning behind the 25th of December, right? The one that was lost by being usurped by an organised, well-advertised group dedicated to ending its original religious meaning.
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Female 152
If the religious people can have their "Jesus is watching you" and all those other religious sayings on billboards and have their little signs in front of their churches, why can`t atheists have a freaking billboard. I don`t mind religious people, but religious people who complain about sh*t like that need to shove a pineapple up their @$$
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Male 5,609
[quote] “I don’t think that’s right. We don’t go around telling them what we think about [atheists], so why should they put up something like that,” another man said. [/quote]
This is the point in an anime where there is a jet flying over the head of the person that made this statement.

"Atheists are organizing... Only difference is tax status."
That has been taken care of already.
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Male 4,014
Well, it is. It falls on the date it does because it corresponds with early pagan holidays - Christians would have an easier time converting pagans if you could tell them they your religion wasn`t really different at all.

I mean, Orthodox Christians celebrate Christmas on a different day, so the date is arbitrary.
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Male 150
wow. these douchbags are giving atheism a bad name.
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Female 200
Fine, but don`t complain when another church group puts up a pro-Christianity billboard somewhere. If you get to practice atheism, we should get to practice our religions. Where the drat is the religious tolerance in this world?
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Female 98
/like
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Male 425
Uk nothing religous about christmas here anymore. I took my grandmother to the midnight mass. There was 16 of us.
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Female 857
Blind and excessive faith in anything is to be avoided, whether in science or religion.
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Male 5,194
>>Maybe I`m generalising but it seems that Americans have an obsession with making other people believe what they believe.

We just can`t ever win with you guys. You criticize us for being too religious, then you criticize us when atheists show an alternate view.
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Male 533
It is a myth. And I don`t celebrate Christmas, I celebrate Yule. All the fun of Christmas without the stupid Christian Mythology behind it.
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Male 1,341
Hah, i liked someones comment on that.

"As soon as you understand WHY you dismiss all the other possible gods, you will understand why I dismiss yours."

That is a good way to put it.
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Male 4,547
In other words, if you change your opinion on the basis of a billboard saying you should (minus any backing statements), you are not reasonable.
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Male 1,081
@Museike
Isn`t that all organized religions?

That billboard if just as annoying as all the other religious advertisements, if not, a bit more.
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Male 4,547
You know the billboard is bullpoo right?
Reason is not achieved by a statement of position without reasoning being given.

Reason is not found in the conclusions, but in the methodology by which you reach those conclusions.

The billboard, therefore, (and this is demonstrable), has no reason. It doesn`t say why.

This idea that as long as you agree with them, you are reasonable, no matter if you`ve reached that conclusion from a lifetime of study, 10 seconds of brainwashing, or because a horde of flying monkeys told you so before you invented rainbows, is the absolute antithesis of what reason is.
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Male 886

77 Posts Monday, November 29, 2010 3:17:26 PM
"Maybe I`m generalising but it seems that Americans have an obsession with making other people believe what they believe. Why?

Live and let live."

Yeah, Europe and the rest of the world don`t do that do they?

I mean, the whole crusades thing was really just a bunch of christians handing out pamphlets and saying Bless You when people sneezed.

Then there was that party filled decade in the 1940`s hosted by that funny little guy with the tiny mustache.

Yeah...that billboard is really over the top pushing atheism down everyone`s collective throats.

Or you were generalizing ;P
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Female 1,148
as much as I don`t believe in God, I still celebrate Christmas...because I like giving! :D
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Male 1,013
are you serious museike? It says you`re from Europe. That`s a lot closer to where they kill you for not believing in their god. Also home of the catholic church... How did you come to "Americans are the believe as I do or else people"? Live and let live? Uhm, ok, but there is a thing called jihad that makes me think that religion might be bad. Heck, Europeans jailed Galileo for proving that the Earth was not the center of everything. I say live and let live so long as you don`t try to kill me in the name of your ficticious murderous narcicisstic megolomaniacal deity!
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Male 13
As atheists, we should improve our image some before we attack beloved holidays. If you want to go about doing that, do it in a different way... don`t make some tacky billboard.

Last thing I need is -more- poo for being an atheist. Thanks, non-nice individuals.
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Female 32
i think there is a better way they could have gone about doing what they did.
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Male 740
I`m more offended, as a New Yorker, that you call this an NYC billboard even though its in New Jersey
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Female 839
well i am not religious, therefore am of the opinion that the nativity story IS a myth. BUT, what harm are people who do believe it doing? It`s a nice wholesome family holiday, and even though i am a none believer, it saddens me that the whole religious meaning is being lost over the years. I will make sure my daughter knows the nativity story when she is older, as they are probably no longer allowed to perform it in schools B-|
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Male 84
Maybe I`m generalising but it seems that Americans have an obsession with making other people believe what they believe. Why?

Live and let live.
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Male 757
wow
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Male 1,013
I`m all for bringing reason to the world. I love how one of the protesters said that it ruins it for the kids... Uhm, doesn`t celebrating Satan Claus ruin the message more? haha! I can`t wait till that group creates a similar billboard for ramadan.
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Male 904
I do think that atheists get crapped on a lot. Called immoral and doomed to hell - maybe atheists and gays should form a coalition.
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Male 2,033
Well it -is- a holiday, so calling it a myth is rather retarded. I understand the sentiment, but that is really poor implementation.
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Male 2,402
Wasted effort.
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Male 886
Chrismyth?
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Male 2,034
Atheists are organizing. They`re essentially becoming their own religion. Only difference is tax status.
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Male 19,981
Link: NYC Billboard Advertises Christmas As Myth [Pic] [Rate Link] - Who paid for the billboard? The American Atheists organization. Is this a smart protest or a wasted effort, I-A-B?
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