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Date: 07/05/10 09:00 AM

58 Responses to Immigrant Farm Workers` Challenge: Take Our Jobs

  1. Profile photo of Shnard-dog
    Shnard-dog Male 30-39
    229 posts
    July 5, 2010 at 7:57 am
    Link: Immigrant Farm Workers` Challenge: Take Our Jobs - How many unemployed people in the U.S. will actually take them up on this?
  2. Profile photo of buxco215
    buxco215 Male 18-29
    977 posts
    July 5, 2010 at 9:21 am
    They took our JERBS!!
  3. Profile photo of ElSombrero
    ElSombrero Male 13-17
    716 posts
    July 5, 2010 at 9:31 am
    Hm, if the Pay is good enough I might apply.
  4. Profile photo of Tay-Dor
    Tay-Dor Male 40-49
    265 posts
    July 5, 2010 at 9:57 am
    Who cares if immigrants do the farm labor. If they want it, they can have it. Just make sure your a legal immigrant.

    Congrats to Colbert for completely missing the point.
  5. Profile photo of Luniz82
    Luniz82 Male 18-29
    588 posts
    July 5, 2010 at 9:58 am
    Even if you did apply I doubt they would hire you. I am sure they would get a lot less hassle about working conditions from illegals so that is who they will hire regardless of who applies. They whole thing just seems like a publicity stunt I mean evertyone knows farmers do not wanna pay a fair wage to the people doing the work for them, therefore they will hire the people who will take the below min wage and not complain. I think we should Heavily fine these companies. If that does not work SHUT THEM DOWN! First step do immigration control is taking the jobs from the people that do not belong here.
  6. Profile photo of srj206
    srj206 Male 18-29
    8 posts
    July 5, 2010 at 10:06 am
    So let`s change the law. If the government got rid of welfare/unemployment, and subsidized these jobs with the money that it pays people who are on welfare/unemployment, people would take these jobs.
  7. Profile photo of VaJayJay
    VaJayJay Female 30-39
    56 posts
    July 5, 2010 at 10:11 am
    The pay is not as bad as everyone puts off. It`s just really hard work and they get paid under the table. The farmers don`t have to pay any employer taxes or benefits. And a bonus for the illegals is that they have no income showing so they get to collect foodstamps, welfare, and medicaid. How nice for them.
  8. Profile photo of defiythelie
    defiythelie Male 18-29
    230 posts
    July 5, 2010 at 10:16 am
    If they had this in my state I sure the hell would do it, there are no jobs any where here.
  9. Profile photo of hobbledehoy
    hobbledehoy Male 18-29
    11 posts
    July 5, 2010 at 10:20 am
    vajayjay, they can`t collect any of the things you just listed off. they would have to go to government offices and apply for them, and they`d need papers that say they`re here legally to actually get any of it. in short, you`re an extremely ignorant person about the policies of your own country.
  10. Profile photo of defiythelie
    defiythelie Male 18-29
    230 posts
    July 5, 2010 at 10:24 am
    @VaJayJay

    you are right I worked on a cranberry marsh for 2 years makinjg $16 an hour it was al under the table and very hard work, but $16 an hour is not bad for a high school drop out.
  11. Profile photo of 5Cats
    5Cats Male 50-59
    32794 posts
    July 5, 2010 at 10:28 am
    They get it bass-ackwards, as usual. BECAUSE there`s a large pool of illegal & underpaid workers, the agri-industry doesn`t have to give things like good pay & decent working conditions. IF there were NO illegals, they`d have to pay more for workers, simple! Of course your FOOD would cost more as a result...
  12. Profile photo of SuperSmash
    SuperSmash Male 18-29
    3758 posts
    July 5, 2010 at 10:56 am
    I would do it for the decent pay that would result with the loss of migrant workers willing to do it for less. I have a choice, they don`t.
  13. Profile photo of Billy62
    Billy62 Male 18-29
    159 posts
    July 5, 2010 at 11:02 am
    So far I`ve seen a few "I WOULD do it" and "I might do it", but shockingly no "I WILL do it"...
  14. Profile photo of Salted_Eggs
    Salted_Eggs Male 18-29
    774 posts
    July 5, 2010 at 11:12 am
    I`m gonna sign up.

    :Thumbs:
  15. Profile photo of oceanbeast
    oceanbeast Male 18-29
    549 posts
    July 5, 2010 at 11:35 am
    "Who cares if immigrants do the farm labor. If they want it, they can have it. Just make sure your a legal immigrant."

    you miss the point, they do the jobs NO ONE else wants to do because they HAVE to not because they WANT to. America wants to refuse them the equality that we offer to everyone else, they are the lowest common denominator, they keep your food prices down, they move the agricultural industry. You could not feed your children without them. they want to be legal but to the system it is easier to deport them than to process them, and to you its easier to deny them than to support them and understand why they are here in the first place.

    if you make them legal you will have to pay them fairly, provide healthcare plans, and treat them with the same respect you show everyone else.
    this is a human rights issue, this is a racial issue, a lot of you refuse to look past your self interests, wasn`t America founded by illegal immigrants anyway?
  16. Profile photo of Gerry1of1
    Gerry1of1 Male 50-59
    36660 posts
    July 5, 2010 at 11:44 am
    Been There Done That ...

    Picking crops was a common summer job for us in school. It was an incentive to stay in school and got better jobs.

    I`m tired of the bleeding heart liberals "plight of the down trodden". Their kids went to the same school I did. If they are still pickin` crops it`s their own fault.
  17. Profile photo of gorgack2000
    gorgack2000 Male 13-17
    4682 posts
    July 5, 2010 at 12:02 pm
    @buxco215- DEY TUK UR JERRBS!!
  18. Profile photo of BluffMaster
    BluffMaster Male 18-29
    10 posts
    July 5, 2010 at 12:58 pm
    The problem isnt them working its what they do with the money they send it back home and the money is in america thats the problem keep m working but spend your money here
  19. Profile photo of oceanbeast
    oceanbeast Male 18-29
    549 posts
    July 5, 2010 at 1:23 pm
    "I would do it for the decent pay that would result with the loss of migrant workers willing to do it for less. I have a choice, they don`t"

    supersmash - you know you are too intelligent for this to be taken seriously. pickers will never earn a decent salary, the industry would find a way to automate more process, therefore eliminating more jobs anyway. no one grows up with dreams of being a picker, its something that is done exactly because they have no choice.
  20. Profile photo of oceanbeast
    oceanbeast Male 18-29
    549 posts
    July 5, 2010 at 1:29 pm
    "The problem isnt them working its what they do with the money they send it back home and the money is in america thats the problem keep m working but spend your money here"

    you are getting close to what im talking about. American corporations spend billions outside the united states, why aren`t you blaming them for the bad economy? i doubt the "illegals" are sending back home more money than nike,exxonmobil, gap, starbucks, or any other super corp. those are the same companies that exploit the same people in their own homelands, thus causing them to migrate here. you see its a cycle. eliminate the cause, tax companies heavier who will export jobs until they are forced to come back to America. buy American, support local business. the "illegals" are here partly because America has had its hands in so many other nations economies, creating inflation, gentrification.
  21. Profile photo of Angilion
    Angilion Male 40-49
    12387 posts
    July 5, 2010 at 1:31 pm
    So...the "taking American jobs" talk only applies to jobs harvesting crops? I think not.

    I`ve done it in the past, when I was at school. Runner beans were the worst because they grow from pretty much ground level to a considerable height. Squat, bend, stretch. Squat, bend, stretch. Squat, bend, stretch.

    I had an advantage with the weather, though. It`s quite a bit cooler in England.

    As I was under age, I didn`t really have any rights. If I recall correctly, I was paid £1.10 an hour. Granted, this was the early 1980s and things were much cheaper, but it was still nowhere near a wage anyone could live on. They used adolescents for cheap labour.

    So...the real question is more like "who`s going to do the undesirable jobs for low pay that underpin society?"
  22. Profile photo of LightShaded
    LightShaded Male 18-29
    423 posts
    July 5, 2010 at 2:04 pm
    Great f*cking idea colbert.
  23. Profile photo of oceanbeast
    oceanbeast Male 18-29
    549 posts
    July 5, 2010 at 2:04 pm
    angilion - yes sir you are right, but see the illegals where not a problem until they started asking for rights, for the right to be here, live here and better themselves. it was all cool when they did their jobs and knew their place.
  24. Profile photo of Cajun247
    Cajun247 Male 18-29
    10731 posts
    July 5, 2010 at 2:10 pm
    As I`ve said in a previous post, no one is entitled their job or their wages/salary. They keep and earn them (respectively) because they work hard. They don`t have minimum wage laws in China or India, which allows companies to keep labor costs low. This is why I believe we should abolish the minimum wage. Low-income Americans won`t be able to earn as much money, at least they`d be able to earn it.
  25. Profile photo of oceanbeast
    oceanbeast Male 18-29
    549 posts
    July 5, 2010 at 2:22 pm
    cajun247 - no one is entitled to anything, but we have systems in place to raise a standard of living. i doubt you think indian and chinese labor laws are something America should look up to. thats actually really stupid that you would say something like that. companies would gladly drop the minimum wage standard but only to raise their profits, they wont charge you less because they pay their workers less that`s counter productive and not likely. chinese and indian workers have jobs because our American corporations supply inhuman conditions for them, working 14+ hour shifts in a sweatshop thats what happens when you completely abolish minimum wage and other systems put in place to protect human rights. people can barely barely make it by on minimum wage as it is. you really have no clue what you are talking about.
  26. Profile photo of Fatninja01
    Fatninja01 Male 30-39
    25420 posts
    July 5, 2010 at 2:55 pm
    They took er jobs!
  27. Profile photo of TypicalJerk
    TypicalJerk Male 18-29
    533 posts
    July 5, 2010 at 3:01 pm
    K. now where is the one where I sign up to wrk at the job doing apt maintenance or framing? cause I know they are there too =/
  28. Profile photo of Cajun247
    Cajun247 Male 18-29
    10731 posts
    July 5, 2010 at 3:22 pm
    @oceanbeast
    That`s what unions are for. Workers can come together and haggle corporations for better wages and working conditions. We don`t need to lean on the government all the time to solve our problems. China, sadly, has laws making unions illegal and those are the kind of laws we don`t need.
  29. Profile photo of Cajun247
    Cajun247 Male 18-29
    10731 posts
    July 5, 2010 at 3:40 pm
    I am talking about a law that puts low-skilled workers out of work and on the streets. Since they`re not earning money how are they going to support themselves?
  30. Profile photo of Cajun247
    Cajun247 Male 18-29
    10731 posts
    July 5, 2010 at 3:46 pm
    Now the United States and the States themselves should only enforce a standard of working conditions as part of their compelling interest to protect human life.
  31. Profile photo of NotTHATbored
    NotTHATbored Female 18-29
    1101 posts
    July 5, 2010 at 4:05 pm
    They list low pay as one of the reasons Americans wouldn`t want their farming jobs...

    but wouldn`t the pay be higher if farmers couldn`t hire illegal immigrants?
  32. Profile photo of NotTHATbored
    NotTHATbored Female 18-29
    1101 posts
    July 5, 2010 at 4:16 pm
    They list low pay as one of the reasons Americans wouldn`t want their farming jobs...

    but wouldn`t the pay be higher if farmers couldn`t hire illegal immigrants?
  33. Profile photo of skullgrin
    skullgrin Male 18-29
    937 posts
    July 5, 2010 at 4:50 pm
    you are correct notthatbored. If us legal citizens did the work the illegal immigrants did we would get paid proper wages with benefits.


    The funny part is that if all the illegal imigrants refused to work for such low pay those same farmers would raise their rates to accomodate just the same.
  34. Profile photo of oceanbeast
    oceanbeast Male 18-29
    549 posts
    July 5, 2010 at 4:58 pm
    they obviously cant leverage any pay increase since all the farmer`s have to do is turn them in and they are gone.
  35. Profile photo of DickenMcHunt
    DickenMcHunt Male 18-29
    1299 posts
    July 5, 2010 at 4:58 pm
    Not neccesarily. If the pay was higher tat would mean that fewer people would be employed in order to maintain profitability, which would mean these people would have to work more and harder and ultimately production would go down, driving the cost of produce up- forcing manufacturers and grocers to mark-up prices even further, which would mean the end of the "Dollar Menu" and the entire concept behind the American Industrial Farming system.

    America relies on cheap illegals in order to produce food at the volume and prices that we want.
  36. Profile photo of handys003
    handys003 Male 50-59
    2402 posts
    July 5, 2010 at 5:39 pm
    No poo. Grapes of Wrath part dos!
  37. Profile photo of skullgrin
    skullgrin Male 18-29
    937 posts
    July 5, 2010 at 6:12 pm
    "America relies on cheap illegals in order to produce food at the volume and prices that we want."

    um no
  38. Profile photo of 5Cats
    5Cats Male 50-59
    32794 posts
    July 5, 2010 at 6:26 pm
    "America relies on cheap illegals in order to produce food at the volume and prices that we want."
    "um no"

    Um, yes, exactly right.
    I think mass agriculture is ONE thing that cannot be `sent overseas` like industry, manufacturing, assembly...
    The point is, if costs went up (paying living wages, for one example) then WE would end up paying for it sooner or later.
  39. Profile photo of DiegoDeFuego
    DiegoDeFuego Male 18-29
    239 posts
    July 5, 2010 at 6:56 pm
    "America relies on cheap illegals in order to produce food at the volume and prices that we want."

    I`m guessing you`ve never worked in agriculture and have no idea what you`re talking about. The farmers i work for farm 20,000 acres of land and employ less than 200 hundred people. The cost of employees is just a drop in the bucket compared to pesticides, fertilizer and fuel. Fertlizer is cheap compared to pesticides, and it still costs $500 a ton. You put on 200+ pounds to the acre twice a year at the very least. If you doubled or tripled the wages of the people working on a farm it would affect next to nothing except the farmers might make just a tiny bit less money.

    There are plenty of people who would work these jobs, yet farms hire illegal immigrants, not because they need to, but because like almost everyone with money, they want more and more money.
  40. Profile photo of yanging
    yanging Male 18-29
    172 posts
    July 5, 2010 at 6:58 pm
    "wasn`t America founded by illegal immigrants anyway?"

    This argument is invalid for a few reasons:

    1) You assume that because something has been done some way before that it was done correctly. Wrong.

    2) The immigrants that founded America were not illegal, as there was no formal government established that was equipped with rules regarding the immigration of different peoples.

    3) It is an Ad Hominen argument.
  41. Profile photo of kitkat84
    kitkat84 Female 18-29
    12 posts
    July 5, 2010 at 7:15 pm
    DiegodeFuego is right on the money LOL no pun intended.
  42. Profile photo of kitkat84
    kitkat84 Female 18-29
    12 posts
    July 5, 2010 at 7:19 pm
    Also my mom works for a chicken farm as the office manager. she takes care of the finances too. She told me her boss who owns the company employs illegals because they are so cheap and have no rights. meanwhile he`s literally got millions in his personal savings account pure profit from illegal cash transactions. So don`t tell me he can`t afford legal workers, He just enjoys the money too much to care who he employs.
  43. Profile photo of shappy
    shappy Male 18-29
    757 posts
    July 5, 2010 at 7:36 pm
    @yangying it was a joke, im guessing
  44. Profile photo of skullgrin
    skullgrin Male 18-29
    937 posts
    July 5, 2010 at 9:29 pm
    "Um, yes, exactly right."

    um, no, exactly wrong. like already stated the only difference would be in the farmers personal profits. It`s not like these farmers cant afford to pay a proper wage, they just choose not to. Think walmart. If they paid their employees above minimum wage and gave them full medical coveage along with a matched 401k plan the products in the store would not go up.
  45. Profile photo of thebandit
    thebandit Male 18-29
    362 posts
    July 5, 2010 at 9:48 pm
    i worked hard to be born in america
  46. Profile photo of oceanbeast
    oceanbeast Male 18-29
    549 posts
    July 5, 2010 at 9:56 pm
    yanging - 1. makes no sense. has no bearing in the argument.

    2. really? because im pretty sure the Iroquois league was already around, and the founding fathers took their idea of seperate states united under one nation to form our own government. if there was no law against murder would it still be wrong? yes.

    the early settlers came here escaping oppression, looking for a new world where they had better opportunities, sound familiar?

    3.that`s not even anywhere near an ad hominem fallacy. kinda feel like you just wanted to use a "big word" without actually knowing its meaning.

  47. Profile photo of oceanbeast
    oceanbeast Male 18-29
    549 posts
    July 5, 2010 at 9:59 pm
    "um, no, exactly wrong. like already stated the only difference would be in the farmers personal profits."

    this is a scenario that applies in an all good, all honest, ideal world. clearly no corporation is going to cut their own profits to provide their workers better conditions AND keep their prices at the same markup. they wont lose, the consumer or the worker has to lose. a corporation stays in business by watching their bottom line above pretty much anything. you are naive to think they would be willing to take a loss at their own expense.
  48. Profile photo of OldOllie
    OldOllie Male 60-69
    15841 posts
    July 5, 2010 at 10:27 pm
    This is a silly argument. Farm workers are only a tiny fraction of illegal immigrants, and they aren`t the problem. They can have those jobs. Give them legal guest-worker status with reasonable work rules to protect them from being exploited (illegals have no protection whatsoever).

    When ICE raided Swift meatpacking plants in 2006, Swift lost more than 9% of its workforce. They were almost immediately replaced by Americans, although they had to raise the hourly wage from $9.55 to $11.50.
    Ref.

    Here`s a simple solution to illegal immigration. Penalize employers for hiring illegals: 1st offense, $25,000 per worker; 2nd offense, $50,000 per worker; 3rd offense $100,000 per worker, and we force the company into Chapter 7 liquidation. Same deal for individuals hiring illegal maids or gardeners except for a 3rd offense, you lose your house.
  • Profile photo of Jnic815
    Jnic815 Male 18-29
    71 posts
    July 5, 2010 at 10:42 pm
    Their jobs really aren`t that hard i grew up in the country and spent most of my time on our land and my families farms working.. its just part of life down here can I get a hell yeah from some more country boys?
  • Profile photo of skullgrin
    skullgrin Male 18-29
    937 posts
    July 6, 2010 at 7:40 am
    oceanbeast, i understand what you are saying but it would not happen in america
  • Profile photo of DiegoDeFuego
    DiegoDeFuego Male 18-29
    239 posts
    July 6, 2010 at 7:57 am
    @Oceanbeast

    Even if they did raise prices to compensate for raising wages the difference in prices would be nearly unnoticeable. As i said earlier, employees wages are just a tiny piece of a farms expenses.
  • Profile photo of meepmaker
    meepmaker Male 30-39
    6694 posts
    July 6, 2010 at 12:10 pm
    I have a job.
  • Profile photo of SoundlesHero
    SoundlesHero Male 18-29
    62 posts
    July 7, 2010 at 5:27 pm
    My uncle has 100+ acres in Caruthers (near Fresno). Just got back from his farm for fourth of July. There was about 50 of us there to celebrate and some of my cousins and I went out in the fields to pick grapes. Saturday was hot, about 106, so we only lasted about an hour before we gave up, started a bonfire and got drunk sitting around it.

    Farm work is hard. Terribly difficult. You can do it, but you have to get used to the conditions. That could take a really long time depending on how out of shape you are. We used to spend summers there as kids and we got used to it. We tried again Sunday, it was cooler, around 101. Lasted about 2 hours, then my uncle told us to start drinking and set of fireworks. He said he wasn`t going to pay us since we were trying to work on a national holiday =]
  • Profile photo of Cajun247
    Cajun247 Male 18-29
    10731 posts
    July 7, 2010 at 8:18 pm
    @oceanbeast
    In regards to the "illegals in America" assertion #2, take this with a grain of salt.
    By the time the pilgrims or other settlers landed they came from societies where the governments new that world was round and had different entities governing the various portions of land they mapped out. Whereas the natives were only aware what was happening in and around the regions they occupied let alone the entire continent. After some time commerce was established between the natives and the settlers, and not too long after war broke out. Even so, I would find it hard to for the natives to call the settlers "illegal immigrants" even though they were their enemies.
  • Profile photo of Cajun247
    Cajun247 Male 18-29
    10731 posts
    July 7, 2010 at 8:27 pm
    Now that I think about the term "invaders" (harsher yes I know) would be more accurate.
  • Profile photo of oceanbeast
    oceanbeast Male 18-29
    549 posts
    July 7, 2010 at 10:05 pm
    cajun - are you serious? the iroquis league helped found the very government we use today, they already had states and unions, it`s well documented

    here`s a quick article

    they showed the pilgrims (invaders in all right) hospitality and even helped them in many ways become the nation we are today.

    that is really an argument that means nothing to our current situation though. whats wrong with providing a timeframe where they must register for temporary status, all those who do not apply or are detained will be automatically deported. that gives everyone a fair chance.
  • Profile photo of Cajun247
    Cajun247 Male 18-29
    10731 posts
    July 8, 2010 at 12:10 am
    I`m not denying the existence of the Iroquois confederacy. All I`m saying is that the term `illegal immigrant` in this context is totally misleading at best. Even you pointed out that the natives didn`t treat them as illegals (maybe not as we do today) and didn`t consider them an enemy until it was too late.


    To your second point, yes, such a debate is a waste of time. But the problem with the legal route is that it is such a complex bureaucracy that seems to be more of an iron curtain to keep poor people out who want to better themselves, or on rarer occasions escape the oppressive governments of the nations they come from. Unfortunately a significant portion of Americans see these people as invaders when in reality they aren`t. For most of these people the only law they`ve broken is immigration. They haven`t stolen anything, they haven`t killed anyone, they simply entered the country illegally.
  • Profile photo of oceanbeast
    oceanbeast Male 18-29
    549 posts
    July 8, 2010 at 12:40 am

    here is an interesting video where a real police chief clearly states that "illegal" is incorrect as a term in general.

    immigration is not a criminal issue, its a civil issue. police chief
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