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Date: 05/26/10 02:04 PM

150 Responses to White Supremacists Find A Home In Arizona

  1. Profile photo of LittleMissQT
    LittleMissQT Female 18-29
    1273 posts
    May 26, 2010 at 12:42 pm
    Link: White Supremacists Find A Home In Arizona - Well, you sorta asked for this, Arizona.
  2. Profile photo of lostinkorea
    lostinkorea Female 30-39
    3727 posts
    May 26, 2010 at 2:13 pm
    They`re terrorist...

    Are we going to do something about them?

    I say let`s just put barbed wire around the whole state and lock the non-nice individuals in since they want to stay in their little bubble anyway!
  3. Profile photo of LazyMe484
    LazyMe484 Male 18-29
    10441 posts
    May 26, 2010 at 2:25 pm
    Well, you sorta asked for this, Arizona.

    Finally a caption that doesn`t suck. Yes, they asked for it.
  4. Profile photo of llefflar
    llefflar Female 18-29
    43 posts
    May 26, 2010 at 2:29 pm
    I wonder how AZ`s law compares to the US federal law, Mexico`s immigration law, Canada`s immigration law, or most of Europe?....maybe someone here will know.
  5. Profile photo of vilem
    vilem Male 18-29
    372 posts
    May 26, 2010 at 2:30 pm
    Thought these were the guys that made the law in the first place...
  6. Profile photo of healbadbad
    healbadbad Male 13-17
    7 posts
    May 26, 2010 at 2:32 pm
    These are the kind of people that just inspire more hate towards us, instead of truly justifying or explaining the law. They make the rest of us look terrible and make it that much harder to win an argument. It makes me sick.
  7. Profile photo of skypirate
    skypirate Male 18-29
    2415 posts
    May 26, 2010 at 2:52 pm
    im from az and i had no idea we had hate groups!
  8. Profile photo of username3415
    username3415 Male 18-29
    362 posts
    May 26, 2010 at 3:06 pm
    I love hate groups
  9. Profile photo of Brian 61316
    Brian 61316 Male 18-29
    741 posts
    May 26, 2010 at 3:14 pm
    I remember that not so long ago there where a few of us here in i-am-bored discussing the whole law thing. At the end we said that time would tell and see who was right and if the law would stay or not... well... Seems like the law is about to go kaput.
  10. Profile photo of CrakrJak
    CrakrJak Male 40-49
    17514 posts
    May 26, 2010 at 3:19 pm
    Yeah, Looks like maybe 20 people... That`s a real `invasion` there, It`s likely they live in the area not `moving in`. What a douchbag trying to `make news` out of bullcrap. Didn`t even bother to show the immigrants signs saying vile things against `whites` like `Go back to Europe` or `H****es stole my land` or these.

  11. Profile photo of JNAtheDUDE
    JNAtheDUDE Male 13-17
    203 posts
    May 26, 2010 at 3:21 pm
    FFFFFFFFFFFFUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUU-

    I`m Mexican and half my family lives in Phoenix.

    We visit at least once a year. :(
  12. Profile photo of WeePee
    WeePee Male 18-29
    612 posts
    May 26, 2010 at 3:23 pm
    Arizona asked for it by enforcing an already present federal law? Why is it that people have decided that illegal immigration is not law that needs to be enforced?
  13. Profile photo of TheNameless
    TheNameless Male 13-17
    55 posts
    May 26, 2010 at 3:26 pm
    What the hell!! the guy said skinheads i happen to be a skinhead and a member of SHARP (skin heads against racial prejudice) if hes talking about bald neo-nazis he shoul friggin say bonehead considering thats what they generally call themselves and if they dont call themselves that they dont know what the hell they are! KNOW WHAT YOUR TALKING ABOUT BEFORE YOU SAY IT!!!
  14. Profile photo of emrsncptv
    emrsncptv Female 18-29
    52 posts
    May 26, 2010 at 3:32 pm
    The fact that Arizona now has an infestation of hate groups is something that affects the Arizona citizens as well as our government. It`s worth noting that we did not get to vote on this Bill 1070 AT ALL in any way. If you`re going to blame anyone, blame our governor for siding with the crazies because none of the citizens had a say in whether or not this bill was passed
  15. Profile photo of whipsmart
    whipsmart Female 18-29
    665 posts
    May 26, 2010 at 3:33 pm
    CrakrJak, I think you`re reading into that image a bit wrong.
  16. Profile photo of 2and2equals5
    2and2equals5 Male 18-29
    33 posts
    May 26, 2010 at 3:40 pm
    @CrakrJak
    I`ve been reading your comments for quite some time now and I must say that you are one of the members of the site I dislike the most. Your fundamental christian extremist and ultra-conservative views are really disgusting. And now this. Closing your eyes when there is a rise in hatecrimes and racist movements is really questionable. But on top of this you post a pic of indigenous people saying "white racists go home" and you call it "immigrants saying vile things against whites" not losing one word about racist parading through the streets with Hitler salutes and obvious inhuman statements against jews and all "non white übermenschen"... I wish there was an ignore button so wouldn`t have to read your humbug comments.
  17. Profile photo of
    bdr127
    47 posts
    May 26, 2010 at 3:41 pm
    So Bill Strauss is getting interviewed by the local news... and he doesn`t bother to maybe clean up his desk?! The thing is a freaking mess.
  18. Profile photo of CrakrJak
    CrakrJak Male 40-49
    17514 posts
    May 26, 2010 at 3:42 pm
    whipsmart: Want to see more ? It`s a lot more than just one image. Why is it not considered `racism` when it`s a minority group perpetrating it ?
  19. Profile photo of CrakrJak
    CrakrJak Male 40-49
    17514 posts
    May 26, 2010 at 3:48 pm
    2and2equals5: The only `rise` in hate crimes and racist organizations are from minority groups. Nazis and KKK have been on the decline for decades.
    Have you seen the rate of increase in `mexican` related crime in Arizona ? It`s now the kidnapping capital of America.
    The US Justice Department issued a report:
    In a population study of a sample of 55,322 illegal aliens, researchers found that they were arrested at least a total of 459,614 times, averaging about 8 arrests per illegal alien. Nearly all had more than 1 arrest. Thirty-eight percent (about 21,000) had between 2 and 5 arrests, 32 percent (about 18,000) had between 6 and 10 arrests, and 26 percent (about 15,000) had 11 or more arrests. Most of the arrests occurred after 1990.
  20. Profile photo of CrakrJak
    CrakrJak Male 40-49
    17514 posts
    May 26, 2010 at 3:57 pm
    2and2equals5: I think Nazis and White supremacists are vile, and I`m against anyone that preaches antisemitism (including muslims). But this is still a bullcrap `news report` about (maybe) 20 people, He`s (falsely) trying to tie racism to sb1070. The Arizona immigration bill is not `attracting` white supremacists to move into Arizona, This reporter is being a douchbag plain and simple.
  21. Profile photo of Zerocyde
    Zerocyde Male 18-29
    3256 posts
    May 26, 2010 at 3:58 pm
    @TheNameless

    Rofl, sharp is still a thing? Hahaha, I thought that kid I shared a jail cell with some 10 years ago was just pulling my chain!

    Wow, the scenes kids flock to these days, lol.
  22. Profile photo of 2and2equals5
    2and2equals5 Male 18-29
    33 posts
    May 26, 2010 at 4:02 pm
    @CrakrJak
    So basically you`re telling me that you`re buying the racist propaganda? Your view on immigrants and indigenous people is vile and hatefilled. I really don`t like you.

    "Based on 2000 Census information, the study concludes that the problem of crime in the United States is not caused or aggravated by immigrants, regardless of their legal status. The study was released by the Immigration Policy Center, a research organization that focuses on the contributions immigrants make the country.

    The policy center is a division of the American Immigration Law Foundation, a Washington, D.C.-based nonprofit focusing on immigration.

    One of the key findings the study cites is that U.S.-born men, ages 18-39, are five times more likely to be incarcerated than foreign-born men in the same age group."
  23. Profile photo of kummi90
    kummi90 Male 18-29
    541 posts
    May 26, 2010 at 4:03 pm
    Theres a difference by skinheads and boneheads.. Learn the difference kids!
  24. Profile photo of jak22
    jak22 Male 18-29
    154 posts
    May 26, 2010 at 4:04 pm
    what a bunch of filthy racist maggots. true skinheads arent racists. racist skinheads are called boneheads.
  25. Profile photo of mervviscious
    mervviscious Male 40-49
    1793 posts
    May 26, 2010 at 4:17 pm
    nazi`s are funny...
  26. Profile photo of sheaton319
    sheaton319 Male 18-29
    560 posts
    May 26, 2010 at 4:22 pm
    I support this.
  27. Profile photo of necrobitch
    necrobitch Female 18-29
    467 posts
    May 26, 2010 at 4:23 pm
    woah, your country is still living in the old days.
    its drated up.
    wel our country are kinda that way now with the polish.. :/
  28. Profile photo of dax2009
    dax2009 Female 50-59
    322 posts
    May 26, 2010 at 4:27 pm
    Well, the AZ law seems to have at least a part of the effect it was hoping for - Obama is sending troops to help guard the border. I am all for raising by the millions the amount of work visa`s we hand out to Mexican citizens. AND securing our borders. I have always liked Mexicans; never personally had a bad experience with one - they WANT America to prosper - they share our values and love our freedoms - but who else is coming across our porous borders who mean us nothing but harm? My mind was set on this several years ago, when I read a report that Mexicans who were caught crossing the border are sent right back to Mexico on a bus, because Mexico accepts them. But people from other countries who cross and are caught at the same time are given a piece of paper that tells them to report to court on a certain day, then set loose, because Mexico WILL NOT take them back, understandably because they are not their citizens. Who the are THESE people, and what are THEIR intentions?
  29. Profile photo of dax2009
    dax2009 Female 50-59
    322 posts
    May 26, 2010 at 4:28 pm
    It`s post 9/11, people, we need to be realistic about guarding our nation.
  30. Profile photo of dax2009
    dax2009 Female 50-59
    322 posts
    May 26, 2010 at 4:30 pm
    And how many do you think show up for court?
  31. Profile photo of DuckBoy87
    DuckBoy87 Male 18-29
    3243 posts
    May 26, 2010 at 4:34 pm
    Fill in the blank: ______ law also states that law enforcement officials are "required to demand that foreigners prove their legal presence in the country before attending to any issues."

    Answer: Mexican

    Now, doesn`t that sound familiar? Why yes, yes it does. It`s the same as Arizona`s "new" law! Of course Arizona gets criticized for it, yet Mexico doesn`t.

    Now I have no qualms with immigrants as long as they go through the proper channels like everyone else.
  32. Profile photo of Lionhart2
    Lionhart2 Male 40-49
    8306 posts
    May 26, 2010 at 4:41 pm


    "They moved to Arizona now??"
  33. Profile photo of xXamwxxXx
    xXamwxxXx Male 18-29
    285 posts
    May 26, 2010 at 4:58 pm
    yea, the Mexican laws are messed up too, but thats part of why people want to come here. Its not the corrupt government of Mexico trying to cross the borders, its the oppressed people. Dont act like thats not why people have always come to the USA.
  34. Profile photo of NOFX14
    NOFX14 Male 18-29
    1141 posts
    May 26, 2010 at 5:04 pm
    Hooray greedy xenophobic racist people!
  35. Profile photo of moefreak
    moefreak Female 18-29
    1963 posts
    May 26, 2010 at 5:44 pm
    DuckBoy, Mexico gets criticised constantly. Perhaps the point is that we want the US government to be better than the Mexican government, and thus we hold them to a higher standard.
  36. Profile photo of 5Cats
    5Cats Male 50-59
    32823 posts
    May 26, 2010 at 5:46 pm
    Zomg! This really is a new low for IAB.
  37. Profile photo of MrsPoods
    MrsPoods Female 18-29
    547 posts
    May 26, 2010 at 6:11 pm
    @ Lionheart: love it! But on a down note, this is really f*cking embarrassing for Arizonans, like myself. If this is what we`re gonna be known for, sh*t.
  38. Profile photo of keith2
    keith2 Male 30-39
    2588 posts
    May 26, 2010 at 6:43 pm
    i`m going to run to arizona only to escape michigan`s judicial system. i don`t believe they`ll send a trooper down there to come get me for a few misdemeanor warrants. F--K COPS n JUDGES BURN IN HELL
  39. Profile photo of HunterKiller
    HunterKiller Male 18-29
    363 posts
    May 26, 2010 at 6:52 pm
    Kill all Nazis.
  40. Profile photo of mickeym19
    mickeym19 Male 13-17
    625 posts
    May 26, 2010 at 7:01 pm
    You go Keith.

    Run, Keith, Run!
  41. Profile photo of Nidonemo
    Nidonemo Male 18-29
    9308 posts
    May 26, 2010 at 7:09 pm
    Oh god damn it...
  42. Profile photo of Genocyde
    Genocyde Male 30-39
    712 posts
    May 26, 2010 at 7:12 pm
    I`ll say this. I don`t have a problem with anyone coming in to this country, seeking work. As far as I`m concerned, that`s another taxpayer. I just have a few requirements.

    1. When I accept an invitation into your home, I won`t ask you to change your customs for me. I`ll gladly adhere to yours. When I go into Mexico, I`ll learn Spanish so I can deal with you, you must have a basic working knowledge of the English language.

    2. If you decide to do some border jumping, expect to get sent back. Simple as that.

    3. People who employ those who enter into this country illegally should also reap the consequences.

    4. If you lose your citizenship because you decided to lead a life of crime, don`t expect to get the citizenship back.

    I`m pretty sure that it`s not hard criteria with which to live. I do it all the time. That`s the custom of the U.S. which means, if you want to live here, you get to abide by the same laws and customs. Simply Put: You E
  43. Profile photo of hi2pi
    hi2pi Male 30-39
    736 posts
    May 26, 2010 at 7:30 pm
    Your economy has relied on slave/illegal labour for a long time. Either get used to not being able to afford your current lifestyle or continue on living a lie.
    Physician, heal thyself.
  44. Profile photo of Lionhart2
    Lionhart2 Male 40-49
    8306 posts
    May 26, 2010 at 7:34 pm
    > Genocyde
    > Simply Put: You E

    Yep, that explains perfectly, I understand now!

    lolz at IAB`s 1000-char guesstimator.
  45. Profile photo of madest
    madest Male 40-49
    7378 posts
    May 26, 2010 at 7:41 pm
    When I go into Mexico, I`ll learn Spanish so I can deal with you...
    ------
    You`re being ridiculous. You`ll no more learn Spanish or Portugese than you would German or French when visiting those countries.

    I agree that if you come here to commit crimes then you need to pay a price, going home would be good. However to claim that they shouldn`t be allowed to work you`re creating a criminal. How are they supposed to support themselves?

    Americans love paying $2.00lb for tomatoes but no desire to pick those tomatoes for a benefit-less minimum wage.
    Who`s gonna clean your suburban home at slave rates and no dental?
    You ever pluck a chicken or debone a raw one? Imagine $12.00lb chicken...

    Blaming our problems on people who want to live even when the ecomomy sucks says more about their desire to be American than it does ours.
  46. Profile photo of Loxen
    Loxen Female 30-39
    1387 posts
    May 26, 2010 at 7:47 pm
    Meh superior genes my butt. I see obese people in that hate-group parade.
    The only way to eradicate racial hatred is to blend it out of existence, imo. Maybe if we all work hard enough, the future generations will be a mix of every race out there. Get fornicating people! That`s an order. Blend that melting pot! :P
  47. Profile photo of moefreak
    moefreak Female 18-29
    1963 posts
    May 26, 2010 at 7:51 pm
    I guess now Arizona gets to see which side they`ve chosen. Racial profiling is just a hop and a skip from full on racism.
  48. Profile photo of themonorail
    themonorail Male 18-29
    215 posts
    May 26, 2010 at 7:57 pm
    morgan`s a girl`s name.
  49. Profile photo of fknloser
    fknloser Male 30-39
    418 posts
    May 26, 2010 at 8:03 pm
    i am very FOR the Arizona Law (which is nothing new, because its actually just an enforcement of laws that ALREADY EXISTS in Federal laws) None of the Arizona law is new, or different than what our whole country already goes by........ But i really hate the f-ing Nazi`s almost more than muslims
  50. Profile photo of Gerry1of1
    Gerry1of1 Male 50-59
    36689 posts
    May 26, 2010 at 8:14 pm
    Speaking as one who has lost his job `cause an illegal alien is doing it for less than minimum wage I say

    Y E A H A R I Z O N A ! ! !
  51. Profile photo of Cajun247
    Cajun247 Male 18-29
    10732 posts
    May 26, 2010 at 8:16 pm
    What about the years in between?
    What about the number of groups there?
  52. Profile photo of inaria
    inaria Female 18-29
    1515 posts
    May 26, 2010 at 8:28 pm
    "I agree that if you come here to commit crimes then you need to pay a price, going home would be good. However to claim that they shouldn`t be allowed to work you`re creating a criminal. How are they supposed to support themselves?"

    Agreed madest! I`m not American, so obviously not an expert, but I heard this bill goes against the Constitution? True or False?
  53. Profile photo of CrakrJak
    CrakrJak Male 40-49
    17514 posts
    May 26, 2010 at 8:38 pm
    2and2equals5: So your stating from a 10 year old report that wasn`t even conducted by the government, Whereas I`m stating from a 2009 report from the DOJ. Nine years has made a lot of difference. Bill Clinton was still president in 2000, So don`t try and feed people old inaccurate information. I`m not racist, The facts are from the 2009 Department of Justice report. It`s not propaganda, It`s statistics from a reliable source unlike your crap that`s 10 years old now.
  54. Profile photo of skine
    skine Male 18-29
    719 posts
    May 26, 2010 at 8:40 pm
    @Gerry: For not reporting a crime when you see it, it`s your own fault. You probably could have sued for wrongful dismissal as well. The only problem I can see is if you were working under the table yourself - which means you were hurting America just as much as the illegals.

    @fknosier: Any law requiring people to carry photo IDs is illegal. Also, any law as broadly defined as this should not be allowed to be enacted. That is, anyone who doesn`t *seem* American and doesn`t have an ID can be arrested.

    @themonorail: Tell that to Morgan Freeman. (One fun thing to do is to read things in his voice - just make sure you remove the contractions)

    @MrsPoods: But you`ve kind of earned that reputation, haven`t you?

    @dax: Do we really have to worry about guarding our nation from people who voluntarily perform menial tasks for wages well below minimum wage? If anything we should be making business owners responsible for hiring legal workers, while making it easie
  55. Profile photo of inaria
    inaria Female 18-29
    1515 posts
    May 26, 2010 at 8:40 pm
    What`s with the anti-americanism hi2pi? Seriously, every comment I`ve read from you has been really insulting.
  56. Profile photo of skine
    skine Male 18-29
    719 posts
    May 26, 2010 at 8:41 pm
    ...r for immigrants to become legal workers.
  57. Profile photo of CrakrJak
    CrakrJak Male 40-49
    17514 posts
    May 26, 2010 at 8:55 pm
    inaria: ...I heard this bill goes against the Constitution? True or False?

    No it`s not against the law for an officer of the law to ask anyone for ID. That has been upheld all the way to the supreme court.

    According to the USCIS: "A green card is issued to all permanent residents as proof that they are authorized to live and work in the United States. If you are a permanent resident age 18 or older, you are required to have a valid green card in your possession at all times."
  58. Profile photo of sbeelz
    sbeelz Male 30-39
    2868 posts
    May 26, 2010 at 8:57 pm
    Sweet, hopefully some of the Skins that stink up Oregon will GTFO and head to Arizona.
  59. Profile photo of CrakrJak
    CrakrJak Male 40-49
    17514 posts
    May 26, 2010 at 9:02 pm
    moefreak: The Arizona Law is not racial profiling, In fact they put a clause specifically in the law to prevent profiling (A clause that even the federal law does NOT have).

    The only change is that it empowers the local police and sheriffs to do what the federal government is not doing, And that is enforcing the current FEDERAL immigration law.
  60. Profile photo of 2and2equals5
    2and2equals5 Male 18-29
    33 posts
    May 26, 2010 at 9:14 pm
    @CrakrJak

    You really annoy me. Ok, I answer to you one last time, I`m really fed up with your pseudo facts. So you`re tackling me for quoting a, what you consider, outdated source. Ok, fair enough but get your own facts straight. Nothing I stated changed for the worse since 2000, hell the situation even got better!

    "Crime rates have already been falling in Arizona for years despite the presence of unauthorized immigrants, and a century’s worth of research has demonstrated that immigrants are less likely to commit crimes or be behind bars than the native-born."

    Is the U.S. Bureau of Justice Statistics a good enough source for you? Get informed before you argue with me! Perhaps you`re bogus facts and numbers scare others out of the conversation.

    Source: http://myurl.in/zHyXc
  61. Profile photo of 2and2equals5
    2and2equals5 Male 18-29
    33 posts
    May 26, 2010 at 9:14 pm
    “High immigration states have the lowest crime rates. According to a 2008 report from the conservative Americas Majority Foundation, crime rates are lowest in states with the highest immigration growth rates, such as Arizona. From 1999 to 2006, the total crime rate declined 13.6 percent in the 19 highest-immigration states (including Arizona), compared to a 7.1 percent decline in the other 32 states."

    That`s it from me, you have nothing but your narrow-minded, biased, christian-consrvative and simply wrong views on a world as you like to see it. I`ll start ignoring your full-of-poo posts from now on. kthxbai
  62. Profile photo of izzy_meow
    izzy_meow Female 13-17
    63 posts
    May 26, 2010 at 9:16 pm
    I think it`s freakin scary to have Nazis marching around the streets like that!
  63. Profile photo of moefreak
    moefreak Female 18-29
    1963 posts
    May 26, 2010 at 9:20 pm
    CrakrJak, I believe we`ve had this conversation before, and as I recall you were not in the slightest persuaded by any evidence I gave you.

    All I can say is that the law absolutely allows for racial profiling, and as such is wrong. Alas, I have now come to accept that you will never agree with or believe anything I say.
  64. Profile photo of tridirk
    tridirk Male 50-59
    313 posts
    May 26, 2010 at 10:02 pm
    For all of you that don`t get what Arizona is facing, open your minds for a moment and watch these.

    Click Here for an Atlanta TV Station Report

    and another

    Video 2
  65. Profile photo of FoSchizle
    FoSchizle Male 18-29
    330 posts
    May 26, 2010 at 10:09 pm
    The law doesn`t provide for racial profiling -.- They have to have a legitimate reason for pulling the person over/detaining them. The law just makes it so they can ask for papers when they do detain them.

    In other words, they can`t just walk up to a mexican and ask for papers. The person would have had to have been stopped for another reason (i.e. speeding/traffic stops would be the most common.)
  66. Profile photo of sbeelz
    sbeelz Male 30-39
    2868 posts
    May 26, 2010 at 10:25 pm
    "In other words, they can`t just walk up to a mexican and ask for papers. The person would have had to have been stopped for another reason (i.e. speeding/traffic stops would be the most common.)"

    Yeah, but but here`s where racial profiling comes into play. Say you`re a white person- you get pulled over for speeding. You`re NEVER EVER going to have to prove that you`re a legal citizen of the US. But then say you`re a person of Mexican heritage who was born in the US to parents who immigrated here legally. You`re gonna have to prove your citizenship every drating time you get pulled over in AZ. You could potentially get hassled every time you interact with a cop for the most minor infractions FOR NO REASON OTHER THAN YOUR RACE. I understand that illegal immigration causes problems in the Southwest- that doesn`t justify tossing the right to equal protection under the law of an entire ethnic group.
  67. Profile photo of sbeelz
    sbeelz Male 30-39
    2868 posts
    May 26, 2010 at 10:30 pm
    If Arizona wanted an anti-illegal immigration law that didn`t give cops licence to be racist, they would have passed a law that requires cops to ask EVERY person they stop to show proof of citizenship.
  68. Profile photo of CrakrJak
    CrakrJak Male 40-49
    17514 posts
    May 26, 2010 at 10:43 pm
    Yeah, but but here`s where racial profiling comes into play. Say you`re a white person- you get pulled over for speeding. You`re NEVER EVER going to have to prove that you`re a legal citizen of the US.

    THE LEGAL PROOF is the Driver`s License, Which you must have to drive. Cops check the status of every driver through driver`s license database, That includes wants, warrants, previous tickets, citizenship, previous addresses, and arrest record. By merely giving the police officer your driver`s license they can check much more than just citizenship.

    So, EVERY PERSON white, red, black, brown, yellow, green, blue or whatever is checked. Quit spouting off crap you know nothing about.
  69. Profile photo of sender02
    sender02 Male 18-29
    189 posts
    May 26, 2010 at 10:46 pm
    They can`t afford to use up resources checking every single person. It`s going to be tough enough enforcing it as it is with all of you people complaining. Even if it is racial profiling, I`m not convinced that the benefits of the law aren`t worth hurting a few peoples feelings.
  70. Profile photo of sender02
    sender02 Male 18-29
    189 posts
    May 26, 2010 at 11:00 pm
    They can`t afford to use up resources checking every single person. It`s going to be tough enough enforcing it as it is with all of you people complaining. Even if it is racial profiling, I`m not convinced that the benefits of the law aren`t worth hurting a few peoples feelings.
  71. Profile photo of Heureux
    Heureux Male 40-49
    1054 posts
    May 26, 2010 at 11:01 pm
    A driver`s license is not proof of U.S. citizenship.

    "In other words, they can`t just walk up to a mexican and ask for papers. The person would have had to have been stopped for another reason "

    No, they, the police in Arizona can `just walk up` because all they need is `reasonable suspicion` - which could be their own "expert" opinion as an officer of the law, a tip from a disgruntled neighbor, employer, employee, coworker, etc.

    The answer to this law is for people who oppose it to begin tipping the police about people at random, or people with republican supportive bumper stickers, or poor manners at the grocery store.

    When everyone has to carry their birth certificate with them at all times, just in case, the law will be revoked.
  72. Profile photo of CrakrJak
    CrakrJak Male 40-49
    17514 posts
    May 26, 2010 at 11:05 pm
    2and2equals5: Your links (again) are from the IPC (an organization that is the research and policy arm of the American Immigration Council - a mass immigration and amnesty advocacy organization).

    Not the hard facts I quoted from the DOJ.

    Crime has skyrocketed in Arizona and I`ve already stated the statistics that back that up. The `stats` you dug up end at 2008 (and for a very good reason) The last 2 years have seen murder, kidnapping, drug, dui, and other crime arrests in Arizona has been at or near the top of the FBI`s national crime index every year since 2000.

    Also, The IPC reports states `immigrants` not `illegal aliens` which is a bait and switch tactic, That changes the population being analyzed dramatically. Immigrants are screened to keep out anyone with a criminal past - unlike illegal aliens who have sneaked into the country.

    Nice try at obfuscation, But you fail.
  73. Profile photo of CrakrJak
    CrakrJak Male 40-49
    17514 posts
    May 26, 2010 at 11:18 pm
    Heureux: Your ignorance is astounding. When everyone has to carry their birth certificate with them at all times, just in case, the law will be revoked.

    That right there is the biggest load of cow dung I`ve read all night. LEGAL immigrants have to have their green card with them at all times, Per FEDERAL LAW. Driver`s must have their driver`s license on them when they drive, Period. If you have no way to prove who you are to the police, No matter who you are, You`re likely going to take a ride to the police station so they can ID you. It doesn`t matter what color you are. I`ve seen a lot of white people taken in for not having any ID on them, Or refusing to state who they are, But the police have to have a valid reason to stop and question someone to begin with (Such as not wearing a seat belt, Running from the scene of a crime, etc...)
  74. Profile photo of CrakrJak
    CrakrJak Male 40-49
    17514 posts
    May 26, 2010 at 11:29 pm
    Heureux: This is what is required to get a driver`s license. A: Written Signature, B: Proof of date of birth, C: Social Security Number, D: Proof of Residency. Link

    To even get a Social Security Number you have to show A,B,& D.

    So Yes, A legal US driver`s license is proof of citizenship or LEGAL immigrant status.
  75. Profile photo of mdg
    mdg Male 30-39
    44 posts
    May 26, 2010 at 11:31 pm
    This kind of news coverage is ridiculously typical. Infestation of hate groups? Really? From a single rally?

    It`s just like the constant coverage of the mass immigration rallies. I live in Tucson (70 miles north of the Mexico border) and have yet to come across one. Fact is, most people here are glad something is finally being done, whether or not is does any good.

    Not surprisingly, our "superior" friend from Europe are here to tell us from 2500 miles away how we should be running things.
  76. Profile photo of PHXbunny
    PHXbunny Female 18-29
    58 posts
    May 27, 2010 at 12:10 am
    Seriously IAB? This again? Thanks for only showing one side like always. Are you guys going to mention the cop that was killed today or the 19 illegals found in 2 traffic stops on the I-17? No. You never do. Be fair and show all sides. I`m getting really sick of seeing this [email protected] that make my state look bad just because some people are racist idiots. We aren`t all like that but sb1070 is badly needed.

    And yes, all you need is a state ID. It`s that easy. We have to have our state issued id on us anyway because it`s a crime not to have it on you if you are over 15(or so).

    Try going around in Mexico without your passport and see how long you last before you get beat and thrown in jail.

    Here is the link to the actual bill as it was introduced. It has your answers. SB1070 PDF link.

    I.A.B, please drop this subject. Your
  77. Profile photo of HunterKiller
    HunterKiller Male 18-29
    363 posts
    May 27, 2010 at 12:50 am
    A nazi`s a nazi lady. There`s nothing else to it. There`s no other side of "the story." They are fookin nazis. That`s it. Shut yer trap.
  78. Profile photo of RyanF701
    RyanF701 Male 18-29
    2486 posts
    May 27, 2010 at 1:34 am
    I do not see how anyone is opposed to this bill due to the fact IT CHANGES ABSOLUTELY NOTHING.

    Now police can ask "Are you a legal citizen of the United States?" if they pull you over and you can`t provide any ID.. which is a crime to not have your driver`s license with you while driving.

    " Any law requiring people to carry photo IDs is illegal. Also, any law as broadly defined as this should not be allowed to be enacted. That is, anyone who doesn`t *seem* American and doesn`t have an ID can be arrested. "

    Guys, it`s illegal for them to ask you for your driver`s license when you get pulled over. Fail.
  79. Profile photo of cuthere2
    cuthere2 Male 30-39
    317 posts
    May 27, 2010 at 2:22 am
    I found it funny how the entire news report attempted to pin a "rise in neo-nazi" groups etc due to the anti-immigration law.

    Yet all the statistics they quoted showing a 200 - 300% increase started in 2000, and ended in 2008, AND ONE IN 2009.

    Newsflash CBS!!!! The law hasn`t even gone into effect yet, and was not even in the works during the years you quoted stats for!

    Guess that blows their theory out of the water!

    Now, I wonder why they haven`t been showing the Mexican and Latino hate RACIST rallies on CBS hmmmm? You know, the ones where they call America an evil empire, while lowering the American flag, and replacing it with a Mexican flag, whilst promising to "take over" America?

    Those vids are all over Youtube for the past month, yet for some reason CBS, NBC, CNN, ABC all avoid showing any of them. Thought they wanted to be honest? Guess not...
  80. Profile photo of EricWRN
    EricWRN Male 30-39
    590 posts
    May 27, 2010 at 2:22 am
    aaaaaaand I`m in love with PHXbunny
  81. Profile photo of aseirinn
    aseirinn Male 70 & Over
    877 posts
    May 27, 2010 at 3:04 am
    ask a palistineine to name a `hate group` ,he tell you `israel`
    then ask an iraqi the same question....
  82. Profile photo of KRAYZEEGIRL
    KRAYZEEGIRL Female 30-39
    447 posts
    May 27, 2010 at 3:13 am
    Once again brainless idiots following a coward because of information taught through fear.
    Practice Looooooooove! :)
  83. Profile photo of madest
    madest Male 40-49
    7378 posts
    May 27, 2010 at 3:20 am
    You are required to have a drivers license to DRIVE. Driving is not a right it`s a priviledge. American citizens are NOT required to WALK around with ID. The AZ law revokes all AZ state citizens 4th amendment right against illegal searches.
  84. Profile photo of stonker
    stonker Male 40-49
    88 posts
    May 27, 2010 at 3:32 am
    seen Kyle?
  85. Profile photo of GuardinGnome
    GuardinGnome Male 18-29
    2893 posts
    May 27, 2010 at 4:55 am
    YeAH!!!
    ARIZONA RULES BITCHES!!!
  86. Profile photo of GuardinGnome
    GuardinGnome Male 18-29
    2893 posts
    May 27, 2010 at 4:56 am
    (even though i don`t live in Arizona)
  87. Profile photo of duffytoler
    duffytoler Male 40-49
    5195 posts
    May 27, 2010 at 5:22 am
    Same as any of the other conservative religious nutjobs, just not making a pretense of hiding their true feelings.
  88. Profile photo of magoo22
    magoo22 Male 30-39
    660 posts
    May 27, 2010 at 5:31 am
    In my country these thugs belong to the Liberal Party
  89. Profile photo of cuthere2
    cuthere2 Male 30-39
    317 posts
    May 27, 2010 at 6:26 am
    "You are required to have a drivers license to DRIVE. Driving is not a right it`s a priviledge. American citizens are NOT required to WALK around with ID. The AZ law revokes all AZ state citizens 4th amendment right against illegal searches."

    Ah, Madest at it again? I see you still were unable to answer my question 3 weeks ago asking you to prove the law is unconstitutional... lol Still peddling lies I see?

    Also, people need to quit lying about the law. It DOES NOT allow police to demand proof of status randomly. This is a lie that needs to stop. Typical LIBS.
  90. Profile photo of moefreak
    moefreak Female 18-29
    1963 posts
    May 27, 2010 at 7:11 am
    Cuthere, how is it a lie? It is completely the truth.

    Fox News: "new state misdemeanor crime for failing to carry alien registration documents; allow officers to arrest immigrants unable to show documents proving their legal residence"

    Reuters: "The law requires state and local police to determine the status of people if there is "reasonable suspicion" that they are illegal immigrants and to arrest people who are unable to provide documentation proving they are in the country legally."
  91. Profile photo of meepmaker
    meepmaker Male 30-39
    6694 posts
    May 27, 2010 at 7:13 am
    It must be the heat. ( Its a dry heat ) lol
  92. Profile photo of madest
    madest Male 40-49
    7378 posts
    May 27, 2010 at 7:46 am
    @ cuthere2,
    At the heart of the law is this provision: "For any lawful contact made by a law enforcement official or a law enforcement agency… where reasonable suspicion exists that the person is an alien who is unlawfully present in the United States, a reasonable attempt shall be made, when practicable, to determine the immigration status of the person…"

    The "reasonable suspicion" part of the law opens a door to racial profiling. Once that happens, every American of Spanish descent is expected to carry documentation. Which is un-constitutional. Of course white Arizonans don`t care about that provision and they need to be reminded that there is such a thing as true blue Americans who aren`t white. I suggest you read the Constitution and re-read the AZ law.
  93. Profile photo of GRadde
    GRadde Male 18-29
    2556 posts
    May 27, 2010 at 7:48 am
    I will not get into the argument about a certain Arizona law, but I will comment one thing: I find it extremely humorous to find American neo-nazis, or American racists of any kind.
  94. Profile photo of Slmmhmmr161
    Slmmhmmr161 Male 18-29
    606 posts
    May 27, 2010 at 7:54 am
    I vote that an addition be placed into the US and Canadian Constitutions, banning socialist/Nazi groups. We won the goddamn war to stop this sh*t from spreading.
  95. Profile photo of cuthere2
    cuthere2 Male 30-39
    317 posts
    May 27, 2010 at 7:56 am
    MOEFREAK -

    The answer to your question is simple. The liberal media keeps claiming that this law allows police to demand "papers" from anyone they suspect.

    Heck, Obama was caught on tape claiming that a grandma and her children could be enjoying ice cream, and suddenly be rushed by harassing cops demanding proof.

    So is Obama stupid, or deliberately being deceptive? The law EXPLICITLY states that

    1. Race CANNOT be used
    2. Questions can ONLY be asked about status if you`ve already been pulled over, or stopped by the police for another violation.

    So which is it? Is the liberal media lying, or just stupid and don`t understand the very clear amendments?

    Obama`s scenario above could happen only if that grandma were stealing the ice cream.... lol

  96. Profile photo of cuthere2
    cuthere2 Male 30-39
    317 posts
    May 27, 2010 at 8:06 am
    MADEST:


    I believe it is you who need to re-read the AZ law:

    "These changes specifically answer legal questions raised by some who expressed fears that the original law would somehow allow or lead to racial profiling," Brewer said. "These new amendments make it crystal clear and undeniable that racial profiling is illegal and will not be tolerated in Arizona."

    One of the changes made Friday to the immigration law was that police officers can only stop suspected illegal immigrants while enforcing some other law…and not just because they suspect the person to be in the state of Arizona illegally."

    Apparently you were unaware of this, which brings to question everything else you`ve stated.
  97. Profile photo of PaganMomBlog
    PaganMomBlog Female 30-39
    48 posts
    May 27, 2010 at 8:10 am
    @cuthere2

    Just because the law SAYS you cannot use race does not mean that a cop, whom is human, will NOT use race. Do you really think that a white person with red hair whom just got pulled over for speeding is going to be asked for papers? Nope, probably not.

    Fact of the matter is racial profiling happens every day whether it`s a cop or an employer....people can find ways around a law. Let`s take an employer who hates asians. He has an asian and a person of any number of other races out there. He really doesn`t want to hire the asian based on his own bigotry. Want to know what will happen? He will find some other reason for hiring one of his other candidates and not once actually say "the asian was refused the job based on race". The asian might not even KNOW that the person is bigoted and just lost a job based on race. It happens and it happens alot more than people realize.
  98. Profile photo of madest
    madest Male 40-49
    7378 posts
    May 27, 2010 at 8:15 am
    Ah, Madest at it again? I see you still were unable to answer my question 3 weeks ago asking you to prove the law is unconstitutional...
    ----------
    One of the changes made Friday to the immigration law was that police officers can only stop suspected illegal immigrants while enforcing some other law…and not just because they suspect the person to be in the state of Arizona illegally."
    Apparently you were unaware of this, which brings to question everything else you`ve stated.
    ----------
    Which is it? How informed do I need to be? There`s always room for improvement it seems.
  99. Profile photo of youngdz79
    youngdz79 Male 30-39
    268 posts
    May 27, 2010 at 8:19 am
    Well it is time for me to clean off the weapons and head to Arizona to take care of some white supremacists and long haired hippies, YES I HATE HIPPIES ALSO........

    FREAKING PEACE MONGERS
  100. Profile photo of moefreak
    moefreak Female 18-29
    1963 posts
    May 27, 2010 at 8:37 am
    Cuthere, what do you think constitutes reasonable suspicion? What could that possibly be, other than race or perhaps accent?
  101. Profile photo of cuthere2
    cuthere2 Male 30-39
    317 posts
    May 27, 2010 at 8:49 am
    MOEFREAK - "Cuthere, what do you think constitutes reasonable suspicion? What could that possibly be, other than race or perhaps accent?"


    Again I refer you to the fact that you CANNOT be asked to produce documents proving status unless you`ve already been stopped for breaking another law.

    Knowing this, why are you asking such a question?

  102. Profile photo of cuthere2
    cuthere2 Male 30-39
    317 posts
    May 27, 2010 at 8:53 am
    PAGAN: "@cuthere2

    Just because the law SAYS you cannot use race does not mean that a cop, whom is human, will NOT use race. Do you really think that a white person with red hair whom just got pulled over for speeding is going to be asked for papers? Nope, probably not."

    You make my point for me. If racial profiling happens all the time (I`ve been profiled by black officers before, who told me "no white man should be in this neighborhood unless he`s selling something.") - Then are you really telling me that we should abolish all laws, and get rid of all cops?

    Are you faulting a LAW, for the tiny percentage of officers who abuse it? Are you really under the impression that officers who would abuse their power with ANY law, give a flying crap about the law or not?

    The racial profiling is JUST as illegal now as it was prior to the law. So what`s your point?

    Not to mention, a person CANNOT be asked to prove status unless de
  103. Profile photo of cuthere2
    cuthere2 Male 30-39
    317 posts
    May 27, 2010 at 8:54 am
    MADEST: "Which is it? How informed do I need to be? There`s always room for improvement it seems."

    To what specifically are you referring Madest? Perhaps I`m missing something here?
  104. Profile photo of cuthere2
    cuthere2 Male 30-39
    317 posts
    May 27, 2010 at 8:55 am
    I believe I already replied to you MOEFREAK.
  105. Profile photo of moefreak
    moefreak Female 18-29
    1963 posts
    May 27, 2010 at 8:59 am
    Cuthere, sorry I don`t know why that last comment posted more than once.

    But don`t you think it`s unfair that if a person gets pulled over for, lets say speeding, only the one who looks like he could be Mexican will be asked to produce proof of residence? Why should they be punished for the way they look?
  106. Profile photo of cuthere2
    cuthere2 Male 30-39
    317 posts
    May 27, 2010 at 9:13 am
    MOEFREAK -

    I understand where you`re coming from, but here`s where I see it as making sense. Let`s say you had some foreknowledge that your home and family was going to be attacked by violent criminals tonight.

    What if I also told you that 100 other homes had been attacked in the exact same manner the past 2 months, and 97% of the people attacked stated it was a Asian man who could barely speak english, and he found some way to "engage" the family prior to breaking in.

    Would you not be on the lookout for an Asian man who could barely speak english? Would you be concerned about it being "fair" as to whether or not you were being cautious of a particular profile of man, or would you be more concerned about the safety of your family.

    Call it fair or not, I call it using our brains.
    So is being politically correct more important than the lives of your family?
  107. Profile photo of moefreak
    moefreak Female 18-29
    1963 posts
    May 27, 2010 at 10:08 am
    In that situation, would I say that the police should be able to require that all Asian people who didn`t speak English well should be required to carry around proof that they didn`t commit the crime? Would I be ok with them not questioning non Asian suspects who spoke English well?

    Of course not.
  108. Profile photo of cuthere2
    cuthere2 Male 30-39
    317 posts
    May 27, 2010 at 10:22 am
    "In that situation, would I say that the police should be able to require that all Asian people who didn`t speak English should be required to carry around proof that they didn`t commit the crime?"

    But MoeFreak, you didn`t answer. Who would you be looking for in this situation?

    Of course you couldn`t just require an entire state to carry ID etc... You`re a single individual, and not an entire state with tens of thousands of criminals running your border.

    But now you must bear in mind, that millions of people have fallen victim to illegals each year... Not one person, but millions.

    Nearly 200,000 rapes each year
    More than 2,500 brutal murders each year
    An estimated 1 million+ child molestations
    Enough illegals (Non tax paying) using our welfare system to cost us 70 BILLION each year!

    In this situation, wouldn`t it be the illegals to blame for WHY we have to require cards?
  109. Profile photo of cuthere2
    cuthere2 Male 30-39
    317 posts
    May 27, 2010 at 10:28 am
    Think of it this way - The bad people spoil it for the rest of us. None of this would be required if immigrants would just respect the process!

    See, another thing many of the liberal are ignoring is infectious diseases. Part of the reason for the border, and immigration process is because it`s easy for diseases to be carried from one country to another. Oftentimes without the carrier knowing it.

    When our borders ar run illegally, we`re ALL put at risk. We`ve already seen what just ONE outbreak can do, and screening for diseases, flu`s etc. cannot happen with all these border runners.

    Does this inconvenience the Latino community? Well, sorry for that... Funny how they have no sympathy for the RAPES, MURDERS, THEFTS, MOLESTATIONS, GANG VIOLENCE that are far, far, far worse than a mere "inconvenience."

    But instead, their own government teach their people how to cross our borders illegally, then preach to us about "rights?" Hmmm..
  110. Profile photo of moefreak
    moefreak Female 18-29
    1963 posts
    May 27, 2010 at 10:35 am
    Cuthere, I would primarily be looking for an asian man, but I would still be very much open to the possibility that the eye witnesses were mistaken. I wouldn`t go blindly interrogating everyone who looks like they could be the perpetrator, but rather those who have motive, opportunity AND fit the profile.

    This situation isn`t comparable in any case. I`m not trying to argue that most illegal immigrants aren`t of Hispanic origin. The point is that the right way to go about finding them isn`t to make things more difficult for thousands of legal immigrants and citizens who just so happen to look Hispanic.
  111. Profile photo of moefreak
    moefreak Female 18-29
    1963 posts
    May 27, 2010 at 10:37 am
    So, you`re saying that they deserve to be harassed for being Hispanic?

    Even if I knew that the population of a certain country were 99% criminals, I still wouldn`t hold that against the 1% who aren`t.
  112. Profile photo of kilroy5555
    kilroy5555 Male 30-39
    496 posts
    May 27, 2010 at 10:41 am
    One example people keep bringing up is that it`s unjust to require proof of residence when someone gets pulled over for speeding.

    Let`s go to the bill!

    "A PERSON IS PRESUMED TO NOT BE AN ALIEN WHO IS
    UNLAWFULLY PRESENT IN THE UNITED STATES IF THE PERSON PROVIDES TO THE LAW ENFORCEMENT OFFICER OR AGENCY ANY OF THE FOLLOWING:

    1. A VALID ARIZONA DRIVER LICENSE."

    Looks to me like if the person DRIVING A CAR presents a valid driver`s license when pulled over for a lawful traffic stop, the police must presume the person to be legally present in the US.

    I hardly think asking to see a driver`s license from someone who is driving a car is unreasonable...
  113. Profile photo of cuthere2
    cuthere2 Male 30-39
    317 posts
    May 27, 2010 at 11:01 am
    "Cuthere, I would primarily be looking for an asian man, but I would still be very much open to the possibility that the eye witnesses were mistaken. I wouldn`t go blindly interrogating everyone who looks like they could be the perpetrator, but rather those who have motive, opportunity AND fit the profile.

    This situation isn`t comparable in any case. I`m not trying to argue that most illegal immigrants aren`t of Hispanic origin. The point is that the right way to go about finding them isn`t to make things more difficult for thousands of legal immigrants and citizens who just so happen to look Hispanic."


    You`re mis-representing this again. You claim "I wouldn`t go blindly interrogating everyone who looks like..."

    Uhhhh... Where in the AZ law is it promoting blindly interrogating everyone? Just as you described YOU would do, you`d use your brain to figure out the most likely perps... This is EXACTLY what AZ is now doing.
  114. Profile photo of kitka_1994
    kitka_1994 Male 13-17
    85 posts
    May 27, 2010 at 11:02 am
    Im sorry but any one how is anti imergration in America who isnt a native American is a rascist. Its that simple your not complaining about your not compalaing about the white pepole comming here it the brown pepole be honest. And the native americans are only ecused becuse of what the first imergrents (americans) did to them. mexicans dont whant to whipe out ammerica they whant to clean toiletts.
  115. Profile photo of cuthere2
    cuthere2 Male 30-39
    317 posts
    May 27, 2010 at 11:05 am
    "So, you`re saying that they deserve to be harassed for being Hispanic?"

    Is that what you got out of my words? Don`t know how you drew that conclusion.

    "Even if I knew that the population of a certain country were 99% criminals, I still wouldn`t hold that against the 1% who aren`t."

    No one is "holding anything" against the percentage of Latinos who are here legally. It`s amazing how the simple act of producing your drivers license is considered SO TERRIBLE, when it`s for a good cause.

    Since when did our society become so darn wimpy, spineless, and selfish to whine about being asked to burn 1/25th of 1 calorie to hand over a license?

    I mean, you are willing to do it when pulled over in traffic, but if it`s to help save 1 million plus children from molestation, 2,500+ lives, hundreds of thousands from rape.... Noooo way... That`s not right! That`s racist! That`s holding something against these people.

  116. Profile photo of cuthere2
    cuthere2 Male 30-39
    317 posts
    May 27, 2010 at 11:09 am
    Economists estimate that the average American is responsible for $11,000 per year in taxes that are thrust upon us due to illegal immigrants.

    I`d imagine if each person on this forum were sent a bill to pay due in 24 hours for $11,000, there`d be an uproar. Amazing how quickly sentiments change when you`re faced with reality instead of being insulated from the problem behind a computer screen.
  117. Profile photo of kilroy5555
    kilroy5555 Male 30-39
    496 posts
    May 27, 2010 at 11:26 am
    @kitka- Unfortunately, the situation in the United States is more nuanced than simply being "for" or "against" immigration. Many supporters of this law are "for" legal immigration, when immigrants follow the rules and obtain visas to enter the US. What you are seeing in Arizona is actually a failure of our federal government to properly control illegal immigration across our southern border. Among the people that cross the border seeking employment are criminals and drug traffickers (who are responsible for exponentially more crime than the fringe wacko white supremacists this news story discusses) who are wrecking havoc in Arizona. Because the Federal response is lacking, Arizona chose to take matters into their own hands.

    You should know that Europe routinely deports Africans caught entering the EU illegally, especially before making blanket statements about American racism.
  118. Profile photo of cuthere2
    cuthere2 Male 30-39
    317 posts
    May 27, 2010 at 11:28 am
    Everyone`s talking about "fair" and "singling out."

    I don`t think it`s fair that:

    - Our nation is saddled with an additional 70 billion dollars in debt each year due to illegals

    - That in many states, tax paying citizens have to live their lives in fear of being robbed, raped, attacked

    - Millions of pounds of drugs are smuggled across the border each year

    - That the Latino community rarely cooperated with police, and often hides criminals guilty of murder and violent crime in the name of "national pride" - Talk to any police officer and they`ll tell you about the stone walling they run into... It`s sad.

    So why is everyone ok with all of this, and silent about these travesties, but up in arms over the "hassle" and "dreadful" task of pulling out a plastic card that you`re willing to carry for the priveledge of driving, but NOT willing to carry to help save lives.

    Talk about
  119. Profile photo of moefreak
    moefreak Female 18-29
    1963 posts
    May 27, 2010 at 11:31 am
    What economists, cuthere? And does that count in how much illegal immigrants contribute to the economy? You should provide links for such outrageous claims.

    Furthermore, you can`t seem to get through your skull that almost none of us are saying "Yes, let in a whole bunch of illegal immigrants. They`re great!". We`re saying that this law infringes on the rights of CITIZENS and LEGAL IMMIGRANTS.
  120. Profile photo of madest
    madest Male 40-49
    7378 posts
    May 27, 2010 at 11:35 am
    "Economists estimate that the average American is responsible for $11,000 per year in taxes that are thrust upon us due to illegal immigrants."
    ----------
    Where`s your source? Nobody in America can avoid taxes.
  121. Profile photo of kilroy5555
    kilroy5555 Male 30-39
    496 posts
    May 27, 2010 at 11:41 am
    RE: Reasonable suspicion.

    Reasonable suspicion is a constitutional standard. In this case, it is: discounting race/national origin, and in the course of an otherwise lawful stop, does the officer have reason to suspect that the person in question is in the US unlawfully.

    What rises to the level of reasonable suspicion? That`s what courts have to decide, and I doubt we`ll have any problem finding pro bono representation for anyone being prosecuted under this statute.

    Off the top of my head, I would classify these things as satisfying the req:

    1) Legal stop of a van and discovering 10 people crammed into the back, none of whom have any identification.

    2) People grouped together loitering in a place where it`s commonly known that day laborers gather.

    3) Being called to investigate a domestic disturbance and finding 30 people living in a two bedroom house, none of whom has identification of any kind.
  122. Profile photo of GRadde
    GRadde Male 18-29
    2556 posts
    May 27, 2010 at 11:49 am
    >Kilroy
    Yes, Africans are deported from the EU. But in difference to the US, the EU consists of a number of different countries. I know what you mean, but for an accurate comparison, for your argument`s sake, you need to be more specific.
  123. Profile photo of K3vin
    K3vin Male 18-29
    487 posts
    May 27, 2010 at 11:50 am
    kitka_1994 overlooking your abomination of the English language... There`s a difference between the people that go through the process of immigration and the people who just hop the border. There are so many of the latter in AZ that locals can`t find work. It doesn`t matter that they want to `clean toilets`... If i was out of the job and had to i would do that job, but wouldn`t be able to because an illegal already is. Native born, and legal immigrants shouldn`t have to suffer because it`s not PQ to kick illegals out on their arse.
  124. Profile photo of darkgear6
    darkgear6 Male 70 & Over
    1378 posts
    May 27, 2010 at 11:56 am
    <wall of text wall of text wall of text wall of text wall of text wall of text wall of text wall of text wall of text wall of text wall of text wall of text wall of text wall of text wall of text wall of text wall of text wall of text wall of text>
  125. Profile photo of cuthere2
    cuthere2 Male 30-39
    317 posts
    May 27, 2010 at 11:57 am
    MADEST - I have tons of sources, Just getting started:

    "The prestigious Wall Street investment firm Bear Stearns recently published a report, The Underground Labor Force is Rising to the Surface, which claims that the illegal alien population is double the official government estimates and that the Government vastly underestimates the cost of illegal immigration. According to Bear Stearns:

    * The illegal alien population of the U.S. is about 20 million - roughly the population of New York State.
    * Between 4 and 6 million jobs have shifted to the underground economy since 1990. These are not "jobs Americans won`t do, but rather jobs Americans used to do.
    * On the revenue side, the United States may be foregoing $35 billion a year in income tax collections because of the number of jobs that are now off the books.
    * There are approximately 5 million illegal workers who are collecting wages on a cash basis and are avoiding both income
  126. Profile photo of cuthere2
    cuthere2 Male 30-39
    317 posts
    May 27, 2010 at 12:02 pm
    MADEST - Here`s the rest of my sources. Now where`s YOUR source for the wild claim that "nobody can avoid taxes." Because it seems as if all these well known sources disagree with you... lol

    Victor Davis Hanson: "Rethinking illegal immigration"

    Frosty Wooldridge: "Our Country Coming Undone"

    October 16, 2006 article in Boston Globe - Andrew M. Sum and Paul E. Harrington

    The National Academy of Science: Dropping Out - Immigrant Entry and Native Exit from the Labor Market, 2000-2005
  127. Profile photo of kilroy5555
    kilroy5555 Male 30-39
    496 posts
    May 27, 2010 at 12:04 pm
    @GRadde: actually, the US is technically a federation of sovereign states which ceded certain powers to the the national government via the Constitution (ie. war powers, foreign policy, external economic policy, etc...). Unfortunately (IMO at least), people don`t think about the US that way anymore or even realize that`s how we`re structured. I think that this is important to keep in mind, especially when discussing internal US politics involving state vs. federal rights.

    At its most basic level, the EU is the same thing: European states ceding certain aspects of their own sovereignty to a federal European body in the EU, though to a much lesser degree than the US. The process isn`t an easy one, and as you can see, still provokes passionate debate today, more than 225 years after our founding.

  128. Profile photo of GRadde
    GRadde Male 18-29
    2556 posts
    May 27, 2010 at 12:26 pm
    >Kilroy
    The EU has never proclaimed to be a country. It has a uniting currency, but not all members have it. The EU was made as a trade union to promote diplomacy and understanding in economical questions, as this was a large factor in both WWI and WWII. The patriotism present is that for your own country and not for the EU, in general. I find this not to be the case with the US.
    The US fought for independency and succeeded as a country. There are loads of differences, however, I can`t bring myself to remember them all now though, but I hope you see what I mean.
  129. Profile photo of kilroy5555
    kilroy5555 Male 30-39
    496 posts
    May 27, 2010 at 12:54 pm
    Don`t get me wrong- there`s a HUGE difference between the US fed gov`t and the EU. My point was at a very, very basic level, there are similarities- US States and European States surrendered portions of their sovereignty to federal bodies. The US took it much further and in a different direction (there is no United States of Europe) but the premise of ceding national power to a European body is very real and a subject of controversy in Europe. One area of particular similarity is regulation of interstate commerce in the US and EU... two parallel bodies of law that have remarkable similarities, except many of the European cases seem to have to do with beer and wine (which is great!).

    My original statement was responding to a statement calling Americans racist for wanting to control immigration. My point was that we all face these issues to one degree or another.
  130. Profile photo of SPrinkZ
    SPrinkZ Male 18-29
    2279 posts
    May 27, 2010 at 1:21 pm
    @Cuthere2

    The population of New York CITY is more than 20 million. I am skeptical of the rest of your information.
  131. Profile photo of SPrinkZ
    SPrinkZ Male 18-29
    2279 posts
    May 27, 2010 at 1:21 pm
    Hell, Long Island has almost 20 million by itself. What are you talking about?
  132. Profile photo of SPrinkZ
    SPrinkZ Male 18-29
    2279 posts
    May 27, 2010 at 1:24 pm
    " That in many states, tax paying citizens have to live their lives in fear of being robbed, raped, attacked "

    I don`t get this point. Is there a difference between non-tax payers? I always get this feeling that nonamericans aren`t humans, and americans are people. it`s kind of silly really. And, in any event, most rapes, murders, etc. happen within our own racial communities. Go check out the statistics.
  133. Profile photo of GRadde
    GRadde Male 18-29
    2556 posts
    May 27, 2010 at 1:27 pm
    >Kilroy
    OK, now I understand, I didn`t quite get the context.

  134. Profile photo of madest
    madest Male 40-49
    7378 posts
    May 27, 2010 at 1:41 pm
    @ cuthere2,
    I`m not interested in reading War and Peace in the comments. I was interested specifically in the $11,000 claim. Nothing you said referred to that. Why? I did notice the reknowned Andrew Sum, I read his rantings years ago and recalled his research was shot down almost as fast as he came up with it.
    I don`t need to cite sources for taxes, I live in America and know that with every purchase you`re paying taxes.
  135. Profile photo of missPWNAGE
    missPWNAGE Female 18-29
    298 posts
    May 27, 2010 at 2:40 pm
    this crap makes me sick... I wish i could grab one of those people and shake the hell outta him/her while screaming, "what in the f^ck is wrong with you?!" ...not that it would do anything to wake these f^ckers up, but atleast I`d get some frustration out...
  136. Profile photo of cuthere2
    cuthere2 Male 30-39
    317 posts
    May 27, 2010 at 4:04 pm
    "I don`t get this point. Is there a difference between non-tax payers? I always get this feeling that nonamericans aren`t humans, and americans are people. it`s kind of silly really. And, in any event, most rapes, murders, etc. happen within our own racial communities. Go check out the statistics."


    Uh, how could you not understand this? I think it`s pretty clear, and your attempt to spin what was said is quite transparent. I`ll spell it out:

    "No one stated non-Americans are not human. Rather, illegals are NOT supposed to be here! They are the ones breaking the law, and a large percentage of these people are intent on harming those who are here legally, and/or escaping justice.

    So please stop trying to spin what was said. It reminds me of a criminal getting hurt trying to break into someones home, then turning around and suing the home owner. Lunacy...
  137. Profile photo of cuthere2
    cuthere2 Male 30-39
    317 posts
    May 27, 2010 at 4:06 pm
    "most rapes, murders, etc. happen within our own racial communities. Go check out the statistics."

    Actually, I`ve posted the statistics over and over again. So you`re honestly telling me you don`t see the difference? That over 1,000,000 child molestations, 200,000 rapes, 2,500+ murders and more could be prevented merely by reigning in those who are not supposed to be here in the first place?

    Wow...
  138. Profile photo of cuthere2
    cuthere2 Male 30-39
    317 posts
    May 27, 2010 at 4:08 pm
    MADEST - So what you`re telling me then is that you don`t understand the difference between income taxes, and excise taxes? Why does this not surprise me in the least?

    Oh yea, STILL waiting for you to back up your claims about the AZ law being unconstitutional... What`s wrong? Why can`t you cite line item?

    I mean, if the Justice Department has to bring in 30 guys to study this issue, and still have not come up with anything just yet, you must be their resident expert huh? lol
  139. Profile photo of kikroxz
    kikroxz Female 18-29
    4 posts
    May 27, 2010 at 4:10 pm
    The title is correct this hate groups feel welcomed to be in arizona for this new stupid law. I feel so ashamed that my fellow americans approve of this racist law. Its not about illegal immigration if it were we would be targeting jobs. I find it unfair to ask anyone that looks suspicious of being illegal for papers. How does one look illegal? is it their english, or the skin color either way legal citizens will be discriminate. Those who feel police will only harass those who break the law clearly dont remeber that there is police brutality and who is going to be able to argue that the people apprehended were doing something unlawful there is a grat grap for racial profiling
  140. Profile photo of cuthere2
    cuthere2 Male 30-39
    317 posts
    May 27, 2010 at 4:11 pm
    SP -

    @Cuthere2

    "The population of New York CITY is more than 20 million. I am skeptical of the rest of your information."

    Uh, did you bother checking the dates on some of those studies? Please read ALL the info before commenting. Some of these statements date back several decades as the studies lasted for 20 - 30 years., and quoted earlier studies. (Sad I have to point out the obvious)
  141. Profile photo of Fatninja01
    Fatninja01 Male 30-39
    25420 posts
    May 27, 2010 at 4:46 pm
    meh!
  142. Profile photo of JUGGALETTEx0
    JUGGALETTEx0 Female 18-29
    1380 posts
    May 27, 2010 at 9:04 pm
    BAHAHAHAHAH nice spelling kakita...lol
    "Im sorry but any one how is anti imergration in America who isnt a native American is a rascist"

    What about people who are for LEGAL immigration but against ILLEGAL immigration? does that make us "rascist" according to you?

    "Its that simple your not complaining about your not compalaing about the white pepole comming here it the brown pepole be honest."

    Brown people? and we`re "rascist"? How about, it`s the people crossing the border from Mexico illegally

    "And the native americans are only ecused becuse of what the first imergrents (americans) did to them."

    What does that have to do with sb1070 AT ALL?

    "mexicans dont whant to whipe out ammerica they whant to clean toiletts."

    No, they want a free ride. BTW, you spelt America wrong--wtg.

    This bill was made with good intentions to protect the people. Something has a
  143. Profile photo of JUGGALETTEx0
    JUGGALETTEx0 Female 18-29
    1380 posts
    May 27, 2010 at 9:06 pm
    is all up in arms about it. If you immigrated here legally and are paying taxes, would you think it`s fair that someone just hops the border and gets basically a free ride off the government that you`re paying taxes to? I don`t think so. You should be carrying identification on you at all times anyways so it`s quite drating ridiculious. (ksorryimdone)
  144. Profile photo of hatface
    hatface Male 18-29
    605 posts
    May 27, 2010 at 11:49 pm
    "Guys, our new immigration laws aren`t racist! WE`re not racist, we just.. Ah poo, here come the skinheads, never mind..."
  145. Profile photo of turbopuppy
    turbopuppy Male 30-39
    158 posts
    May 28, 2010 at 2:41 am
    They ate my dingo!
  146. Profile photo of PierreJeanFR
    PierreJeanFR Male 40-49
    1360 posts
    May 28, 2010 at 5:43 am
    Ach! Arizona, Zo bewtifful
  147. Profile photo of Asspenny
    Asspenny Male 18-29
    1348 posts
    May 28, 2010 at 9:30 am
    yo jug, you do realise that most immigrants, legal and illegal, tend to pay in far more taxes than they take out in government services. If they have an SS number, fake or real, they`re paying into the revenue pool, which is in addition to the taxes paid by the companies that they work for.
  148. Profile photo of moefreak
    moefreak Female 18-29
    1963 posts
    May 28, 2010 at 11:26 am
    Juggalette, they don`t want a free ride, and they`re not getting a free ride. Illegal immigrants do not benefit from government programs. They cannot be on welfare. What do you think would happen to them if they applied for welfare? They would be deported.

    LEGAL immigrants can benefit from welfare and collect unemployment. ILLEGAL immigrants cannot.

    However, as always, I am obviously still against illegal immigration. It`s just that this whole "They`re costing us so much money!" argument is bull.

    They do, however, pay taxes each time they buy something.
  149. Profile photo of CrakrJak
    CrakrJak Male 40-49
    17514 posts
    May 28, 2010 at 5:49 pm
    moefreak: Wrong, Illegals get free health care, Free housing, Free schooling for their kids, Free Food stamps, Free utility assistance, and much more.

    Washington Post
  150. Profile photo of Erichsgurl2
    Erichsgurl2 Female 18-29
    18 posts
    May 29, 2010 at 3:38 pm
    @Asspenny...do you realize that when an illegal ALIEN steals someone`s SSN it is the true owner that has to pay? If they pay taxes using that SSN and another person is also paying taxes using that SSN, it`s asking for a HUGE load of problems from the IRS at taxtime, and from the state for assistance if the true owner actually needs it? TRUST me I know, it happened to me...and guess what? I`M PAYING FOR IT PERSONALLY NOW! @ I-A-B, shame on you for your comment under the video. The video you posted is a broadcast from a news station in Arizona, so obviously they are doing some good by letting people know what is going on in their state. Ugh, I hate it when people don`t do their research and fall for propaganda.

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