BBC`s Ray Gosling Admits Killing AIDS-Suffering BF

Submitted by: Wildcat07070 7 years ago in

A reporter for the BBC"s Inside Out program smothered his ailing lover to spare him from the suffering. Right or wrong?
There are 71 comments:
Male 28
wtf is this? its retarded,
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Male 426
@bumblebb your right lol. this is quite a pickle if you ask me.
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Male 224
He was arrested a few days after this was aired.
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Male 985
Poor guy, i can understand why
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Female 1,112
Shalantas, It doesn`t seem to me that he was likely in the capacity to do that at the point when this happened. Not to mention such a contract wouldn`t void him of repsponsibility since it is still considered illegal. In fact it would only serve as evidence that he had done it, and would help convict him.
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Male 4,680
I went past the police station where he was being held last night. Lots of reporters, satellite dishes and photographers about.

Also kimkio you are clearly bloody stupid so stop posting on something you`ll never understand.

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Female 51
i think it`s ok as long as the person dying wants to be put out of his misery. it doesn`t make any sense that it`s ok to put down animals to put them out of their misery because it`s the humane thing to do, but it`s not humane to do the same for a human who wants it and doesn`t want to suffer anymore. humans are so hypocritical. euthanasia should be legal as long as a form is signed by the person who wants to die. that would be the proof that there was consent. it`s almost like dnr (do not resusitate). just sign a form.
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Male 426
I honestly feel that he went about it the wrong way. He should have been like... can you sign this statement stating this was all your idea and you didn`t want to suffer anymore? I`m being serious so i don`t need negative "that is cruel!" comments. I`m sure he will do only a little time. if any at all. or at least i hope so.
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Male 224
He was arrested a few days after this was aired.
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Male 774
;_;
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Female 876
boooooooring
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Female 4,039
@MrsHoneydew - your comment made me well up and you`ve got my symphathy - I`ve just recently gone through the same thing and it`s just heartbreaking. Very interesting debate here on a tough subject.
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Male 3,425
Wow... He admitted this on Inside Out? I actually watch the East Midlands version of it occsasionally, the one with him in it... It`s usually about farming or buses or something. I can`t believe he admitted that on air, especially on a show of that nature.
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Male 4,593
Yes but he still looks FABULOUS!
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Male 7,378
Hey way to go dummy. Your confession led to your arrest.
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Male 1,231
I admire this mans courage. Theres nothing worse than seeing a loved one in excruciating pain and not being able to help. I found Terry Pratchet`s recent lecture on assisted dying very interesting. He shares the same view of myself and MRSHONEYDEW. Any one who fancies watching it, its in 6 parts on youtube, and can be viewed at; http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qUE3pBIuA...
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Male 156
He must have an autobiography coming out soon.
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Male 25,416
wow, that pretty intense!
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Female 387
This made me cry. I feel for him. He did it because he loved him and didn`t want to see him suffer. There is nothing more awful than watching a loved with a terminal illness wilt away in pain. You feel helpless, because there is nothing anyone can do about it. I support assisted suicide (though he didn`t mention his lover asking him to smother him) because at that point, it`s almost torture to keep a person alive when they are in that much pain. All my father asked repeatedly when he was dying of cancer was "when am I going to die?", he was in so much pain that morphine and medical strength ibuprofen had no affect on him. Having experienced such a thing, I don`t feel that what this man did was wrong regardless of the fact that it was illegal. I also give him kudos for facing something that has obviously been bothering him for a long time.
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Female 4,447
Well stated, Nido. I think we all deserve the right to choose. My life, my decision. I should be able to say to my doctor that I`m ready to stop suffering, that I`m ready to move on so that my loved ones can move on as well.
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Male 4,546
I suspect what will happen, (and in my opinion correctly), he will be arrested, tried, found guilty, and then given a suspended sentence, serving little to no jailtime.

There are several cases like this in the UK (and elsewhere) where the case must be taken to court, but usually the judges have enough common sense and decency to follow through with a verdict that takes their suffering into account.

For example this case. There was another case recently where a father smothered his 12 year old.

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Male 224
This will clear it up: http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/nottinghamshire/8519681.stm

I wouldn`t have thought they`d arrest him either, but apparently they have, on suspicion of murder.

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Male 122
@ opie, i believe it is too long ago for there to be prosecution. As well I don`t think anyone would charge him and even if he did they wouldnt be able to get any evidence he could just say he was reading a note and making it more effective by using himself as the person. Just thinking outloud here.
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Male 224
He was arrested a few days after this was aired.
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Female 15,763
That was a much more in-depth answer than I thought I`d get. Thank you, Corma.
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Male 496
@Opiebreath

There are alot of legal considerations to be made. First, this is not enough to try a case on. There actually needs to be evidence in order for him to be prosecuted. Second, the deceased closest family would have to agree to have the body dug up and examined for more evidence, which they probably wouldnt want / allow. Third, he`s old and dying himself and the law has better things to do than waste resources on a case that is years and years old, and that also has a massive chance of falling short in the courtroom.

Short answer: Yes he can do this, no there probably won`t be any ramifications. However, if you were 20 and admitted to doing this like, last week, then expect to be doing time soon.

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Female 330
i`d of done it if the friend had wanted me to do it.
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Female 15,763
So... can he admit that on camera and not like, be prosecuted and stuff?
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Female 728
"he probably would have died long before he did without medical intervention."

The purpose of medicine is to improve the odds in favor of a patient surviving. I don`t mean to belittle what you`re saying, but comparing the potential results of a lack of medical care to the act of helping someone commit suicide is comparing apples to oranges. One is in the purview of the medical profession, one is not.

And the purpose of a philosophy is to approach decision making from a logical point of view. Just because it is a Kantian point of view, doesn`t mean that it doesn`t have merit. The universal laws that Kant talks about are aimed primarily at non-contradiction. It takes a rational mind to make a choice, so the choice to destroy the very thing that gives you choice is a logical contradiction.

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Female 471
So sad! My uncle died of AIDS, and the complications were so bad that he would have awful convulsions from the tumors and whatnot. It`s simply heartbreaking, and I can`t even imagine watching your lover go through something like that.
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Male 3,431
I second what Nidonemo said.
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Female 1,112
Nidonemo couldn`t have said it better.
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Female 1,112
"This was a case in which the person would have continued living ....... is still able to live on their own."

My point is that the lines are blurred. I mean if you want to put it that way, he probably would have died long before he did without medical intervention. Even if you discount those on life support. An individual who signs a DNR might very well continue to live beyond resuscitation, so should we force these individuals to continue to live?

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Male 9,305
...if he was in pain, set him free. However I do hope he consented to it.

The tragic truth is this.

When a dog suffers, and there is nothing more to do, you put him to sleep, and release them.

When a person suffers, and there`s nothing more to do, people do everything they can to keep them alive.

If they`re in pain, and want to leave, it is selfish to lock them in the house.

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Female 1,112
"Further, if pain can`t make a person irrational, as you claim, then there is no acceptable way for a person to commit assisted suicide, as it would be destroying a rational mind."

I didn`t say it can`t I said not necessarily. And your assertion of whether or not it is wrong to "destroy a rational mind" is only from your Kantian view. It seems illogical to me to torture a rational mind in order to appease our own values and not put the patient first.

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Female 728
bumbleBB: The difference between the cases you mention and the case presented here is that you mention cases where simply removing someone from life support is enough for them to die. This was a case in which the person would have continued living (albeit for a shortened period of time) without life support. That is generally where the line is drawn. It becomes the choice of the family (or the patient if they are still rational) if life support is necessary for the person to go on, but it is against the Hippocratic Oath and against the law if the person is still able to live on their own.

Further, if pain can`t make a person irrational, as you claim, then there is no acceptable way for a person to commit assisted suicide, as it would be destroying a rational mind.

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Male 321
jesus christ this was depressing.
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Female 1,112
The hypocratic oath also has exceptions like removing someone from life support, or upholding DNR orders. Doing nothing like in a DNR situation would normally be considered negligence, and conflict with the oath. Doctors can also support a position like euthanasia without actually participating in it.
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Female 1,112
I disagree. Being in pain does not necessarily make you irrational or not of sound mind. Besides we already blur the lines. Look at Terry Schiavo. She was capable of being "alive" but did not have the mental capacity to make any decisions. So one was made. The lines are blurred. We hold the right to choose above all else in almost every capacity, but we won`t allow someone to die even if there is no hope of them continuing on with a productive happy life. Even if they aren`t of sound mind, their pain (in the situations I`m referring to) isn`t going anywhere and neither is their desire to have it end.
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Female 728
From the physician`s point of view, assisted suicide is impermissible. The Hippocratic Oath says "never do harm." Even if it is to relieve pain, taking a life is harm, so a physician is ethically unable to do so.

I can`t say I agree with assisted suicide in general, because life is precious. To argue from a Kantian point of view, suicide of any stripe is robbing someone of their rationality. Pain is not of the mind, but of the body, and the mind holds precedence over the body. If someone was in so much pain that they were completely irrational, it is more of a grey area, but the catch-22 of the law is that, in places where assisted suicide is legal, it is only legal if the person wanting to die is judged rational. So between universal law and human law, there is no right way to do assisted suicide.

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Female 1,112
sutra I get where you`re coming from, but actually there is a lot of support from nursing staff for euthanasia. I recently did a bit of research on the matter, and it`s typically the Doctors who are opposed. It makes sense to some degree since it their job to keep people alive and well, while it`s a nurses job to provide care. Also there`s no reason they couldn`t regulate euthanasia for individuals who are terminally ill and have exhausted all of their medical options. The right to choose.
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Female 1,682
Also. I guess this is wrong AND right. Since it was so long ago, there wouldnt have been much to do, he would have died slowly and painfully. No one wants that :/ But at the same time, it shouldn`t have been this mans choice. So really there can be two sides to it...
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Female 2,549
Assisted suicide is illegal mainly because it does not have support from medical staff. For a good reason. They see how the situation can be manipulated to just do off with some one under the excuse of ‘end of suffering’. i.e. old peoples money.
And then there is a question of ability to make decisions, both physical and mental.
We know people who are suicidal one day, if talked off the ledge, go on to live happy lives. So a temporary pain, however horrific cannot be a barometer.
Once the law is passed you can go by case-to-case basis, it’s broad spectrum. It’s a difficult situation.
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Male 364
What gets me is that in the papers he`s saying that he won`t be telling the police anything because, as far as he`s concerned, it`s a private matter and would remain that. Not quite private enough to admit to it on a television programme watched by millions though it seems.
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Male 8,300
> Molehouse
> Why is everyone on TV nowerdays gay?

TV, movies, theatre, dance... these have always been high in percentage of gays because they are more `emotional` careers and less `big strong tough guy` ones. How often do you see a gay Builder or Truckie? Sure, there are probably some, but not in the same proportion as other trades.

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Female 1,112
Also there are limits to what pain management can do short of putting someone in a coma. For some it is also a matter of dieing with dignity. some people who know they will die anyway, would rather die on their own terms then with someone bathing and cleaning up after them.
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Female 1,112
"Euthanasia is wrong. What if a cure for AIDS is found tomorrow ?

Pain is no excuse, Pain can be managed. My mother died of cancer and even-though I knew she was in pain, I don`t regret those last days she was alive."

Firstly he was terminal, it was 50 years ago and there was nothing that could be done.

Secondly, I certainly don`t want to take away from the fact that watching your mother die was horrible. I`m sorry you went through that. But your statement is about you, which is typical to the anti-euthanasia argument. People don`t want to let go of their loved ones, so killing them even to end suffering is often thought to be wrong, but backed by the emotion of not wanting to let go or say goodbye. Like I said though, I don`t judge you. I`m sorry about your mother.

Clayboy, the first case of AIDS was diagnosed in 1959.

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Female 2,549
He implicated the doctor as well. If this goes to court & I think the law now have has to, the doctor is going to be in big trouble.
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Male 12,138
[quote]This is between him and God. But in a court of law, he would be found guilty.[/quote]

You mean in a US court of law. Assisted suicide is quite legal in some countries, such as Switzerland. And Crakr, I`m sure even if a cure for AIDS was found tomorrow, the guy`s internal organs would have pretty much liquefied by that stage of the disease. Wouldn`t have been much help to him.

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Male 606
Crakr, pain can only be managed with money. No money = pain.

I`d bet a whole lot of money that cures for things like AIDS and cancer have already been found, but pharmaceutical companies are keeping them a secret.

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Male 17,511
Euthanasia is wrong. What if a cure for AIDS is found tomorrow ?

Pain is no excuse, Pain can be managed. My mother died of cancer and even-though I knew she was in pain, I don`t regret those last days she was alive.

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Female 30
If I was in that much pain, I`d want someone to do it for me. His lover must`ve been really miserable.
It must`ve been really hard for him to do, though.
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Male 302
Why is everyone on TV nowerdays gay?
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Female 465
This is between him and God. But in a court of law, he would be found guilty. Look, he admitted to killing someone. And as far as I know, murder, for whatever reason, is murder.
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Male 395
1. right to do it

2. probably wrong to admit to it

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Male 762
This is wrong, this is horribly wrong and Ray Gosling is not at fault. The government is to blame when people who are in horrible incurable pain wish to die have to turn to being suffocated to death.
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Male 370
wow!
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Male 50
well he doesnt say his lover wanted it but well assume he did and i believe he did a decent thing and im sure everyone in the world would agree on an individual basis but in front of a court a jurry would find him guilty of murder which he is technically
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Female 2,289
this made my heart cry. i cant imagine his pain.
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Female 864
If my quality of life was severely compromised I would want someone to do this for me ,Assisted suicide is not murder!Who would want a loved one to suffer 24 hours a day knowing that they were going to die anyway ?
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Male 650
50 years later? huh. AIDS hasn`t been around that long.
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Male 419
im sorry thats awful but wtf?
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Male 2,056
i saw this yesterday on the news! lol
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Female 1,112
Not wrong.
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Male 1,297
it was only right if the guy wanted to go
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Male 772
Jesus, that`s incredibly brave to do that for someone and to admit it on TV (albeit about 50 years later). If his lover wanted it, I have no problem with it. Assisted suicide is something very different from homicide.
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Male 76
this guy is a winner
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Male 250
if the person wanted to die because of the suffering and nothing else could be done then yes i think it was the right thing to do.

if i was in a similar sort of position i`d expect anyone with the balls to end my life if i was in a state of impossible repair and excruciating pain

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Male 3,332
WOW!
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Male 346
holy poo.... IAB is not the place I go for this type of thing, but damn it all if it ain`t important.
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Female 2,035
Link: BBC`s Ray Gosling Admits Killing AIDS-Suffering BF [Rate Link] - A reporter for the BBC`s Inside Out program smothered his ailing lover to spare him from the suffering. Right or wrong?
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