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It made me chuckle.
"I`m no atheist...I don`t believe in God..."You are an atheist.
We evolved to the planet`s conditions to survive... not the other way around. I can honestly look around and say THERE IS NO GOD. See?
But seriously, pretty funny.
I agree with you there. Dogma is one of my all time favorite movies. (:
Nope, I`m good as an atheist, thank you. :)
That is a genius way to present WHY god doesn`t exist! :)
and i agree with ChickenVomit
Sorry, didn`t finish.
"The Bible is a book that says that God wrote it. That is not proof that God wrote it."
"You are WAY off-base as a Christian if you don`t accept the Bible as truth from its very first words. If it says 7 days, it means 7 literal 24 hour days. not thousands of years. If you can`t accept that, you aren`t a Believer whether you think you are or not."
Correction, Christians believe that God INSPIRED writers to write the Bible. He didn`t actually sit down and write it himself.Maybe it`s because I`m Catholic and believe firmly in my faith, but that`s what we believe. Get it straight. It`s just straight down ignorance. Atheists are right in saying that yes there is science, proof, rationality. But Christians have something they won`t ever have, and that`s faith. And, contrary to popular belief, there are some Christians out there that do NOT take the Bible literally. We know enough to understand that it is IMPOSS
Whoever did this is either one idiotic christian, or one overly sarcastic athiest.
Eitherway... VERY insulting.
Just go to Kubrick. In religious terms...that guy may be doing somtghing sinful(hmm...)
"Well since God is in me, he inspired me to tell you that he doesn exist. Case closed."
is absolutely retarded. people seem to have been acting as if i was debunked by it or some bullsh*t like that. it doesn`t even make any sense. heres what i posted to warrant this response as well:
"everyone whos posted that god didnt write the bible a million times now please stop, that does not matter because god is not only in the bible but in the world. god is in everything. if man wrote the bible, obviously, then the truth was inspired through them, god spoke through them. because god was in them, as he is in everyone and everything."
not the most articulate thing i`ve ever said, but the concept is something that i believe everyone is familiar with and if i didn`t voice it perfectly because i was half asleep then at least you know what i`m talking about.
I still must put 6$ in the saddageh(sp? Charity…?)
It was hot, two times and I was walking the streets of Tehran. Basically I was hot and said a silent prayer that I’d put 3 dollars there if I became cooler and was able to make it to the mall or whatever…without getting hotter.
Could it just be a coincidence? Maybe
Self-fulfilling prophecy? Maybe
But either way I owe six bucks
*Drinks wine* What? It`s the internet! What happened to VikingGuy?
Let`s make sure Fancy can pay his rent
I also don`t think watching church on tv should count.
You can do that by clicking on the sponsored links and other adverts on any IAB page. Go on, do it now.
^^ he is serious, I mean really serious...
OMG.. we are all gonna wake up some day and read a news story about some cult in Australia that committed mass-suicide.. LOL. Holy poo!! Anyone who further engaes this guy could push his whole cult over the edge.. He as converted me from being Agnostic to "I am gonna go to Mass tomorrow."
"And he ordained TWELVE, that they should be with him, and that he might send THEM forth to preach, And to have power to heal sicknesses, and to cast out devils. And he said unto THEM, Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature. He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved"
Your "Great Commission" is a modern feelgood lie. By all means Christians should spread their faith and belief, but to pretend you do it by Royal Command is egotistical self-deception on a grand scale.
So you`ve met my boss?
(Was that right? I am forgetful. If I beleive in God, it`s only as some form of confidence booster or the finger that put the dominos in motion)
Lionheart, Jesus said to go OUT and make Disiples of all nations. He did not say you should stay at home and open the door if someone rang....
ps Im a chick. lol
(leads mob off to gather stones)
Yeah here we`ve been debating it for thousands of pages and all this time i didn`t realise I was a silly bugger. You`ve convinced me! You like arguing in a crowd do you? Like a huge crowd? You really sound like you like mass debating in public. I think you mass debate whenever you can. Keep up that mass debating sir!
OK, lemme try:
"And Mod looked upon his creation, and he saw that it was Food."
Could work... meh, I think I`ll stick to Christianity, at least until Mod can fry a sausage at 1,000 paces with his little finger.
I find it funny, tabbing through 13 pages or so of comments on doctrine, and theory and all... But someone calling themselves a Christian, fails to meet the admontion of "The Greatest Commandment" (not my words BTW). The Pharosees of Jesus` time knew the Law (like a lot of Christians who can quote Scripture, Chapter and Verse). It was (and is) written in their mind, but not in their hearts...
Davymidens however, disagree. They claim that Dav Yeh Mid is the king of the gods. Dav fathered many other gods.
Two of these gods were Gun Dhi the god of strength, facial hair and splendid nudity and Red One the god of envy.
Dav Yeh Mid ordered them to have sex to create the First Man. This man would be stronng and filled with desire.
It is in their belief that the Bored Face is the face of all the gods combined in one image. Which is why it as asexual an was enable to create a child."
... strong stuff, eh?
The IABoredians believe in only the Bored Face tht had an orgy with the first man and thus populated the Earth.
Dav Yeh Mid ordered them to have sex to create the First Man. This man would be stronng and filled with desire.
It is in their belief that the Bored Face is the face of all the gods combined in one image. Which is why it as asexual an was enable to create a child.
Tis true Gandhi. Tis true.
"For I am the Lord thy Mod, and thou shalt have no other Mods before me"
Also, is it just me or have the not-so good creationists gone bye-bye?
"Oh that`s easy, all you do is go up to a disabled person, tell them you`re a famous doctor/scientist and that you`ve finally come up with a permanent cure for what they have which only takes 5 minutes and can be done right here, now... then look at your watch and say "Oh, is that the time??" and hurry away."
Good way to spread the Gospel.I guess he could said "Dump them out of their wheel chair."
The Pharosees didn`t fool Jesus.
You darned Christians, always with the laying down the Guilt. Thanks Lionhart. Thanks a bunch.
Silly Davy, Creationist-Me can only see 3 posts! You must be mistaken. Get a lot of work done today, Davy? :-)
"This is my 3000th post, bitches!"
Now all of you, go and gibber in the corner while your puny mind futiley attempts to digest the enormity of that statement.
However, if this is true...it propbably is, but Jesus was DEFINETLY not one of them. Just putting it in the field.
But catastrophism COULD work. Think aboyt it, we don`;t TRULY know how other species` died
Out of left-field, a GOAL for being 100% on-topic! I never saw it coming!
There have been thousands of religions since man asked `why?`
I`m just saying that if you don`t beleive in science, then you might not beleive in mutations
Oh and, there`s still no North Americans in it
Where the heck do you get that? The OT is full of people of different skin colours, heights, builds, and languages - from the Tower of Babel on especially, but even before that.
Silly Chronic, don`t you know no-one religious thinks that THEY are the sinner going to hell, its everyone else! :-) For me its simple, if there IS a God (which I am convinced there is), then by definition, God is all-powerful. Since He is all-powerful, only He can decide who goes to Heaven or Hell - if it were not so, then He would have limits on His power, and therefore NOT be God. Modern religions fail at the point where they say "Just let Jesus into your heart and you`ll be saved, He can make the offer but YOU have to accept Him in" - so what they are really saying is "Jesus is not all-powerful, in fact, YOU are more powerful than Him because YOU can do something He can`t". To me that is total blasphemy.
Just trying to understand a guy who calls himself a hardcore Christian who makes fun the the disabled, that is all.
What was it? That there are no blacks in the Bible of any other ethnicity other than those of the Old World.
Therefore, since man was created in God’s image, then all deformed people and people who are not white are spawns of the devil.
This was realized when I was reminiscing about some book I partly read. I forget the name and all that, but basically they killed deformed people and animals.
Oh and, since you don’t believe in science, then you don’t believe in genetic mutation and all that.
Silly lion, we don`t have mantras, we have Hymms
There it is
(Puts blindfold back on and returns to chanting stoopid Catholic mantras)
You know, the one where the fossils resulted from numerous creations?
But it`s good to see people that say "Love Jesus or go to hell,"but are not hypothetical. No offense
Oh that`s easy, all you do is go up to a disabled person, tell them you`re a famous doctor/scientist and that you`ve finally come up with a permanent cure for what they have which only takes 5 minutes and can be done right here, now... then look at your watch and say "Oh, is that the time??" and hurry away.
Lion- nyou`re religious? then better get off mate, we`re all going to hell. jkjk
But in religious terms, I`m probab;ly going 2 all hells.
Drug resistance is evolution.So is sticking a needle in yourself. The skin gets resistent after a while.
Oh and, that `training` they did in Russi where they punch you constantly...ould you use this as an example?
> sixclaws13> Lionhart How did you get into Calvinism?
I was raised in a Christian family but pretty much rejected all of it. As I aged I discovered for myself examples of what I saw as proof of God`s existence; logically since I now believed He existed, the Bible must be read as truth, every word of it. I saw corruption of that message in almost every Christian I met, to some extent or other - people who said they were saved because "Jesus loves them" but still lived lives of unrepented sin, taking their "salvation" as a license to live however they wanted. I discovered all Baptist doctrine is a watered-down version of the original, which is labelled these days as "Calvinism", to get bums on seats.
But science does not contradict religion, or viceversa! Seriously, if you dismiss science due to your religion, you`re failing to understand the Bible. As Pope John Paul II once said: the Bible is not a science paper, it`s a book about religion and morals.
I is very happy now.
I suspected it...just didn`t truel know.
I wondered for a moment if he were stupider than venomfangx
Welcome back Lion! Nah, no further along on that one... most of the thread to date was spent between me and Amaq, specifically on whether or not my personal disbelief in any gods equated me to a genocidal ethnic-cleansing racial supremacist. I`ll give you the highlights reel:
1. Davymid didn`t attack Christianity one single bloody time (cookie?) but spent most of the time defending atheism (still trying to figure out why it needs defending being the default position and all that, but anyway...)
2. Amaq managed to make at least one disabled person cry.
3. Jury`s still out as to the origins of morality.
4. Benjaphar won the internet by responding to Amaq`s comment "god is in everything" with the following zinger "Well since God is in me, he inspired me to tell you that he doesn`t exist."
I think that about covers it so far...
OF COURSE NOT!
I was waiting fo this guy to announce he was joking.
But I beleive he may have been?
PLESAE tell me he was joking
Yeah but he`s a TIMMY!!! midget in a wheelchair who can calculate how many neutrino quark warp strings are in your farts, but hasn`t discovered that speech synthesisers have got a lot better since Macintalk back in the 80`s?? C`mon, that poo is funny. Doesn`t Steven Hawking just strike you as a bit "unlikely", like he was scripted as a character on "Cheers" or something?
Sorry Gothic, I`m a Reformed Calvinist Christian which is about as hardcore as you can get, and I found it hilarious too. The guy`s ignorance of the subject he was piss-taking was evident from first point, where he misquotes scripture (God made the heaven*S*, ie the sky, not the Heaven place) to the last point (there are 3 aspects of God, not 2 - Father, Son and Holy Spirit - that`s why "they" are called The Holy Trinity). I wasn`t the least bit offended, because statements like "science and reason have no place in religion" are so laughable they jsut prove what a douchebag he is. No Christian was EVER afraid of science and reason, our Faith cannot fail any test science produces, so bring it on!"
but god did say he wrote the bible...and anyone who has views that difer from mine (or pat robertsons) is obviously wrong. Go McCain. we can still win this thing.
"My indisputable Biblical proof that atheists are deluded and stupid. (Yes, this is a SATIRE.)"
thus take it lightly! :D
1) God did not write the bible, or say he did. 2) If you ignore the bible, you have NO PROOF.3) I don`t believe in `God`, but I respect everyone`s personal choice. I don`t believe that religion will EVER be squashed, and I`m fine with that.... As long as people don`t try to shove THEIR religion down MY throat, I don`t give a damn what you believe or not.
Lol, amaq I find it funny how you have nothing else to say to that because you know he made you look like a complete idiot. And while I`m at it, since "God" is in me and everyone else, how come the majority of people here realize that you`re a pile of bullpoo. Actually most people have something called "Reason", most people have it but too bad you dont. cya
I would like to rule in the notion of many gods for many worlds. Yes that would mean that there is life outside this earth as well, but limited to one per world.These gods are having contests with each other, manipulating worlds to make the inhabitants better. And in the end we shall invade another`s homeworld, or another shall invade ours. And whoever wins, our manipulator wins.
Since you`re not smart enough to figure it out yourself, he`s obviously just trying to send the message that the christians arguements against fundamental sciences are actually pretty ridiculous. For example, the part where he sais "Obviously God created the light from those Galaxies so that when he gave us telescopes we would have more stuff to look at". Obvious enough for you?
Because historically, every time science has contradicted religion the fanatics have dismissed, opposed, or attacked the new findings that dare contradict their faith.
I hate atheists who believe all Christians are foundamentalist morons who think to Earth is 6000 years old and do not believe in evolution. I also hate it when this atheists try to sell your believes to you. You`re not doing anybody a favor pal, you might as well shut up.I hate foundamentalist Christians who take the Bible way too literally, and think God literally did create us in 6 days. I don`t understand why some people think it has to be either Science or Religion.
No they haven`t. They actually thought less about it.
I thought this was hilarious.
if you think what is socially expected from people is morality then i don`t know what to say. social expectations are a bane on true morality.
Well since God is in me, he inspired me to tell you that he doesn exist. Case closed.
when religion is just a staple of a society and people just go through the motions that is not religion and god is not in it. ive said this a million times now this thread, something pure is easily tainted.
wrong stop trying to act more intelligent then everyone. we can only define pure reason, there are things beyond that which are divine such as our conscious, its a spiritual thing. our morality comes from this spiritual side that is not attainable through reason, this spirit is god.
Moral ethics are beneficial to our survival, so they are passed on to future generations as favorable characteristics. The simple fact that we have a civilization requires that we have these shared moral behaviors - otherwise we`d go live alone in caves where nobody would kill us, steal our food or our women. These moral characteristics are exhibited by animals as well. Once again, the answer is evolution and Natural Selection- not "magic man done it".
pure reason is all that exists without god thats just a factual statement.
So even if mankind abandoned the thought of god completely, we would likely still have morality, because god created everything and instilled morality into us at creation.
On the athiests side god never existed in the first place. Mankind lives morally through their own will to do so without having been givin this sense.
Clearly this is a stalemate."
we are instilled with a potential to go either way. a true belief in god will lead you to morality. people who do good are believing in god in some way even if they deny it. god is goodness so to do good is to worship god. but to not acknowledge goodness as god and instead praise ourselves is where we get into trouble and often lose our way.
On a completely separate and unrelated note, I happen to be an atheist. Once again, all that means is I don`t believe that god exists. One has nothing to do with the other.
For context by the way (not that it has anything to do with the discussion at hand, but may be of interest), I was once a hardcore born-again Christian for many years. I`m talking Bible camps, weekend retreats, Christian music concerts, the works. Then many different things happened in my life as I grew older (don`t ask, cause I`m not going to talk about it) that made me come to the conclusion that god probably doesn`t exist.
Clearly this is a stalemate.
Very sad and very true. That`s why I contribute charitably whenever I can to thrid world relief. In fact, my wife and I are currently "sponsoring" a young orphan girl in Haiti (in a Catholic convent school) all the way through her education, so that she might have a better chance at happiness in the future.
And I know anyone can say any old thing over the internet, but I promise that`s 100% true. Is your phantom of the big bad immoral atheist starting to break down any Amaq, now that you`re actually talking to one?
Were like ants believing humans are god, when it`s just the next level, just keeps going.
and by the way how can you have an ultimate goal for life that is completely unattainable for some. when i talk about joy that is a very different thing, it`s an inner peace. but happiness i`m sure is almost nonexistent to starving children in a third world country.
Then they serve time in jail and hopefully reform, and rejoin society to make a contribution. How about most countries/states that have capital punishment for criminals are deeply religious, such as the Islamic theocracies of teh Middle East or the Southern US states? Where`s the compassion there?
I`m an atheist, and I`m totally against anarchy, nihilism, racial engineering, and everything else you`ve tried to accuse me of.
Note by the way that I havn`t attacked Christianity in all your ranting (as easy as it is to do), but have sat here and taken misguided strawman argument attack after attack?
Please stop attacking ideals that have nothing to do with atheism.
why, these criminals have a negative effect on society and lower your happiness.
lets redirect this more precisely."
youre logic is so flawed right now, i dont think anything exists without god, do you know what i mean when i say i believe in god? its not just something that i think is in my head to make me be nice.
that doesn`t even make sense, this was a philosophical conversation where i was making conjectures based off of assumptions, and i was clearly using absurdist arguments
Definitely. I think capital punishment is abhorrent in the extreme.
Yup. For the last 4 pages now.
lets redirect this more precisely.
However, to be completely honest, I would choose to adopt over having children myself if I had a major affliction depending on what it was and what the chances are of passing it on. I`d actually like to be tested for any recessive genes that could produce sickly children to avoid it. Not because I don`t think they have the right to be born, but because in my eyes it would be selfish to bring a child into the world if you knew they weren`t going to be well. For example those children who were born with the disease that their skin could kill them... the parents knew after the first child that if they were to have another there was something like an 80% chance and they had a second anyway. I just think that`s unbelievably selfish.
Not in the slightest for even a second shortsagitar. That`s just the words that Amaq has been trying to ram into our mouths for the last 3 pages.
are you saying i should be dead and not have to have kids?
i have neurofibromatosis which has caused pseudoarthrosis in my arm and scoliosis...
thats right im deformed.... are you saying that because my genes are not perfect i shouldnt have kids? that because there is a 50% chance of me passing it onto my childern i shouldnt have the right to even HAVE kids?
Trying to set-up for the old tired "Why don`t you just go and rape and pillage then" headshot Amaq?
I can talk about social altruism all day, but it`s not going to sink in, is it?
oh sh*t i wasn`t even thinking that deep into it. to be honest thought that wouldnt even cross my mind. if i loved someone and they got cancer every time someone sneezed near them id still have kids with them.
I`m afraid you join us at a bad time, there`s a bit of a flame-war going on... Or maybe it`s a good time, I dunno.
im agnostic.. im not so bold as to say there is or isnt a god... i have no proof either way.
I think if there IS a god that as long as you are generaly a good person and you dont lie or cheat or kill then you will go to heaven.
i ALSO think that while the bible may not have been written by god its a good way to live... the ten comandments tell you how to be a good person...
and my other big thing is gay marridge.
If you live in america you have the right to persuit happyness... it says so right in the consitutuion..give me one good reason why the american government shouldnt let gays get married...
and no that DOESNT mean the bible says so... its called seperation of church and state.
OK last word on the matter. Wrong. The ultimate goal is happiness, nothing at all about species or racial promotion.
but you know what? there are not only two beliefs in this world! there isn`t christians v. atheist. perhaps in america there is, but what about the rest of the world? what about buddhism? like really, how can we even be debating this. the bible doesn`t apply to every single religion. a religion is a BELIEF, not a FACT.
i dont like that website, it`s very poorly written. but who cares about that, what i`m saying is that without a god the ultimate goal is to promote the species right. so therefore it doesn`t matter what traits we adopted in the past, using pure reason lets remove undesirable traits and promote the species. i think we`re having a bit of a backwards debate on free will here too.
first of all schecter i think you are saved just like me and are as deserving of god`s grace as anyone. and secondly i brought up killing people because that would be how you got rid of undesirable traits. and thirdly yeah actually i think our conscious is one of the most compelling testaments to the existence of a higher power.
I alreasy answered you Amaq, it`s called social atruism, it`s genetic, and can be explained in evolutionary terms. Again, that link:
you can`t just believe something about the very nature of existence without it affecting how you live you`re life, and i`m not talking about historic genocide, i`m asking you if there is any reason why we should not remove undesirable traits if we are relying on pure reason.
Oh hush Amaq. What you`re describing is genocide. Social altruism (which can be explained in evolutionary terms, if you read my previous linky) will not allow it.
Historically, the vast majority of instances of genocide/ethnic cleansing have been in the name of religion, or at least had a religious component.
Stop putting words in the mouths of atheists that atheism is somehow advocational of racial supremacy. I say again: Atheism is lack of belief in a god, nothing more, nothing less.
oh and as for the the face averaging thing i found a link. its pretty cool and a fun way to waste some time.http://www.faceresearch.org/demos/averag...
and actually that`s kind of a way of actually living an atheist`s ideology so i respect that. wait you are an atheist right, it seems like everyone else is right now.
alright but why wait man, lets just make our species perfect right now? i`m a little scared about how you guys are tip toeing around this subject. is this idea appealing to you? i really hope not.
I know you were being sardonic, but actually.. I do that.
you mean like opposites attract. your at the oldest a seventeen year old kid whos never been in love.
Dude, what Hitler embarked on was a campaign of Ethnic Cleansing. I don`t believe he read The Origin of Species and suddenly decided to kill 6 million Jews.
Anyways, ethnic cleansing has been going on for millenia, long before Darwin`s time. A pretty good place to start for some particularly horrific examples is in the Good Book, usually sanctioned by God, but I won`t go there.
Thin ice, Amaq. Very thin ice.
"Oh yeah, if you look heeeeeeeeeere *writes in pencil in the book* it says He also made that life as well..."
(I kid, I kid =))
i`m not saying you are, but if you lived according to your ideology, and yes atheism has inherent ideology, then you would be.
that`s an interesting concept too, if the big bang was just a series of pulsations that is existence, expanding into the universe, contracting to a particle, expanding... etc. still think that this has nothing to do with whether or not god exists though
what the hell are you talking about? hitler was a direct reaction to neitzche and darwin. thats completely logical. without god you are left with pure reason which is a scary f*cking thing
i think that all religions are talking about the same thing actually. theres just one god and its been interpreted a lot of different ways.
wow amaqdrinker. please, if you will, paint a picture of your "absolute" atheist that you seem to grasp onto. describe your archetype of godlessness and put it out in the open. because so far, your discussion hasn`t been much of a discussion but rather talking at a wall. there is no point in peoples postings if the refuse to behave and respond in a reasonable, fashionable manner and are open to new ideas. i mean hell, we could even LEARN something O_O. blasphemy.after all this is the internet. all its good for is porn and conspiracy theories.
To pull out an old adage which you`ve probably heard before. I`m going to presume that you don`t believe in Apollo, Zeus, Thor, Odin, Allah, Vishnu, the Buddha, Cthulhu, Jupiter etc etc etc. Therefore we are both atheists, I just believe in one less god than you do. And when you understand why you don`t believe in all the other potential gods, then you`ll understand why I don`t believe in yours.
To throw it on its head: if the only reason you care about other people, love other people, and show compassion for people, is because the bible tells you so and/or you are afraid to go to hell if you don`t, that says very bad things about you."
love and compassion are irrational, tolstoy said that. and your logic on your second comment is flawed. i believe god exists because i believe god exists not because the bible told me so. the bible guides a believer, but god is in the world.
I`m a PhD Geologist (seriously). I`ve spent a lifetime looking at the earth`s structure; it`s my profession. Fail to see where God somes into it. And stop with the Darwin deathbed conversion myth, it makes it harder to take Christians seriously when they keep regurgitating long-debunked myths.